Opioids The Opioid Withdrawal Megathread and FAQ

[CfZrx]

Hey, I have been clean for a while for dope after a five year habit. The habit was heavy and nearly killed me several times although I mainly sniffed (that doesn't mean shit in my opinion) - but I started shooting up and very quickly disposed of my bag of needles and quit. Anyways it's been over a month, I was too fucked up and wrecked and strung out to really keep track of time but it has been a damn long time and I'm doing generally awesome now.

I quit oxy's last year for a few months and it was the insomnia and extreme constant feeling of panic that led me back to dope. I'm not going back, ever, but I have very serious chronic spine pain and when I can't sleep a full 8 hours, sometimes I can't get out of bed the next day. How long does this insomnia last??? My buddy told me it was the last thing for him to go away. Never had issues sleeping before. I'm taking melatonin, and smoking a lot of weed in the evenings. I just can't fucking get some rest and I need it so much. i can't take anymore sleepless nights or 2 hour nap teases.

Hey Shroomy, I can't believe I'm hearing you say you broke on through to the sober side Congrats. Hopefully the exhaustion gets up as the year passes!

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

^ Yeah Shroomy glad to hear about the epiphanic DMT trip and resulting insight along with your current progress. Good choice on diverting the Oxycodone script this week to someone trusted.

 

[ShroomySatori]

Thanks you two. I've been struggling about what to do with my oxy script, and that was good to hear because it is my present plan to avoid a relapse but still have them. I can go get them with my (very close, cute, trusted) friend, and give them to her right away to hold onto for me. I don't really want to take any of them myself, unless my back is killing me and I really need a 5mg perc or something... like if I'm going for a hike with her, for example, and will be gone for a while I might request a pill so that I can enjoy the steep exercise instead of hurting myself. It's like, I don't really need that though you know? And it was so awful at the end. Mixing lines of H and C together, meth in withdrawal, like I was fucking myself. I could just as well never take them again.

I can't believe it myself Cf! I'm really at the prime age of my life and I have to get going, it's now or never. My friend is in a similar situation (but completely different, she's not a junkie) and she's very motivated as well. We spend a lot of time learning together, it's wonderful to have that while I'm in recovery but I'm also building a serious relationship for my future with her. I'm going through a lot more than opiate withdrawal as well. I met this girl quite a while ago who I really like a lot and it has been wonderful. At first it was completely exhausting to keep up with her, even getting out of bed and driving a short way to her place took immense effort. She has been really understanding and I've been completely honest with her.

It took around 2 weeks until my testosterone levels were back to normal, I heard it can take up to three months. Just been getting laid a lot and that definitely will whip one who is withdrawing back into shape. I smoked about a gram of DMT over the month, and it was always during sort of crisis scenarios, when I was really confused and thinking about relapsing or doubting myself. Every time I used it was really insightful, but the last time blew all my other trips away. I really did have an epiphany. It took me hours to calm myself down and I am still processing what happened and thinking about the trip every day. If one is considering Ibogaine, perhaps they could give something like DMT a try too before diving into that one (Ibogaine sounds hardcore to me - I have a gram of it, but I didn't use it at all while recovering).

I'm sleeping and have a lot more energy now, but I'm still not back to my normal self. Now, it's nausea and extreme anxiety / full blown panic attacks that are messing with me. I'm really proud of myself but I know it hasn't even been 2 months yet. I need to keep an eye out. I went through such hell that I never want to experience that ever again. I think I've been more exhausted figuring out this tricky female than the post-acute symptoms. She is far from normal or wouldn't go anywhere near me lol.

 

[FnX]

It's a funny thing, how opioid withdrawal makes you feel both weak for having to go through it in the first place and strong for managing day after day. For me at least. Gotta be strong as fuck to compensate for my weaknesses, maybe a little masochistic because it's not as if I wasn't fully aware of the consequences of my own actions. But you gotta do what you gotta do, at least I don't regret having to pay my dues this time as I managed to get a degree with the help of opioids and mind you I graduated top of the class. Just that at this very moment it feels like I don't even know what to do with the damn papers because of how I feel.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Here is a nice paper about the science of opioid addiction.

The 5th page down or pg 17 has a nice set of diagrams of what happens if it's TL; DR.

https://archives.drugabuse.gov/pdf/Perspectives/vol1no1/03Perspectives-Neurobio.pdf

 

[ShroomySatori]

I am sitting on a degree as well and I'm all ready to contribute to society and build my future. It is extremely frustrating. I have to be patient or I will relapse because I surge with energy on oxy's or H. I would get a job in a week or two, but I'm not ready for it. I'd lose it at some point from dope sickness. When I am sick, I have no sense of responsibility.

I feel like a pussy / weak for being in this situation to begin with sometimes. Then I remind myself what a pussy I used to be. I couldn't get the fuck out of bed for weeks on end without heroin, totally controlled by scummy dealers, essentially a fucking slave. If you can break away from slavery, you gotta be strong as fuck. I remember that fucking shit kicking nightmare I went through that had me crying, screaming, panicking, restless sleepless nights, full body muscle aches, fucking shitting myself, all that nasty constipation, lack of appetite, no sex drive for years. MOTHER. FUCKING. BULLSHIT. It is SO worth it to quit, no matter how much pain you have to deal with.

The trouble is I sometimes forget that and get extreme cravings. All it takes is a little taste of any one opiate, pretty much. At least for me. Definitely reading that paper by the way.

 

[FnX]

Here is a nice paper about the science of opioid addiction.

The 5th page down or pg 17 has a nice set of diagrams of what happens if it's TL; DR.

https://archives.drugabuse.gov/pdf/Perspectives/vol1no1/03Perspectives-Neurobio.pdf

"The likely explanation for these observations is that opioids raise levels of cortisol, a hormone that plays a primary role in stress responses; and cortisol, in turn, raises the level of activity in the mesolimbic reward system"

along with "...methadone, buprenorphine, and naltrexone act on the same brain structures and processes as addictive opioids, but with protective or normalizing effects."

I don't know, there are some decent parts but honestly there is a lot of bad info too. There is a lot of research data which points that opioids tend to lower cortisol, so either the paper is worded in a very weird manner and I'm misinterpreting it or it states things which are definitely not "clinical truisms". While buprenorphine and methadone have their place, they can equally be the problem itself, so calling them protective/normalizing can be outright dangerous.

The part about noradrenaline is pretty important though, it's one of the reasons clonidine is such a godsend. The paper makes it seems though that clonidine by itself could substitute opioids and while it seems to play with the endogenous opioid system it doesn't quite cure opioid withdrawal. When we start making assumptions that more or less same factors lead to addiction/dependence in every case it's easy to start looking at things in a skewed manner. I'm pretty sure there are many others too who never took opioids for 'intense pleasure' but to self-medicate another issue, which in turn often gets exacerbated when opioids are removed from the equation. Pain being an obvious one, but there are many other reasons people end up taking opioids. They are a very convenient way of managing stress that results from various life situations, the problem being that you really don't tend to develop natural (endogenous) ways of coping with stress when you are taking them. Therefore depending on the individual, the endocrine system for example might be way more crucial to addiction compared to the mesolimbic, in my opinion at least. The HPA-axis has a diurnal rhythm and curiously cravings and withdrawal symptoms seem to vary simply with the time of day as well, independent of environmental stressors, triggers, cues etc. Not to say the latter don't play a part too.

In the end, it's all about what we actually do with the research data that counts. For me personally, pleasure, reward, motivation, it's almost irrelevant when compared to training the brain to cope with stress, step by step. For someone else it could be equally important to unlearn the reward seeking behavior associated with opioids. Quite a complex matter. For whatever reason I'm not bothered at all if there are opioids within my hands reach when I'm in acute withdrawal, or if someone else is using them in the same room and when I get cravings they tend to be for anything which isn't an opioid as long as it lowers the stress I'm experiencing (or at least I believe it would do so). Resetting withdrawal by taking opioids is a very stressful idea in itself, so I don't need to put conscious effort to avoiding it, unless the mind tricks me into believing I wouldn't be resetting or setting the withdrawal process back significantly.

Many ways to look at it, best keep an open mind I suppose.

 

[keeping]

it's literally just hit me that i haven't used in over a week
( ͡°( ͡° ͜ʖ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)ʖ ͡°) ͡°)

 

[ShroomySatori]

Congrats man. Keep going with it, you may as well right? The first month flew by for me (but I was meeting a demanding, complicated woman at just the wrong time). You are at the point where you could really keep going with it and stop rattling so often and save more money and all these benefits man. It hit me hard when I realized it was over a month dude and give yourself a pat on the back because even after a month I was still feeling like complete shit sometimes. So I was reluctant to, but I've had some great days too and I feel like I should be proud that i even made it this far.

By the way, I just went on a 24 hours coke binge. I do very little coke and being fishscale, I was righteously coked out for 24 hours with a 3 hour sleep. I had a magical night with the girl I met, but I feel like total shit today. Not withdrawal symptoms. That shouldn't hold me back right? I'm not going with it, I just feel horrible in completely different ways than opiate withdrawals today. I wouldn't do it again anytime soon. No way, but I really really like good coke. It's just if a drug fucks with me the next day I hate taking it frequently. Opiates never did that, I woke up feeling fine for months upon months, until I didn't. It's good thing I suppose, that cocaine makes one feel like shit after a first binge. At least there is a warning sign right? There was none whatsoever with opiates for me until I realized 18 months later I was completely fucking my life up.

I typically use a line or two and call it a day but I couldn't say no when she invited me to sleep over after having a deep conversation on the phone for an hour. I had already tested it throughout the day, so it kinda of just happened. I'm am righteously exhausted today man, not good for my recovery but what can I say. I had never done the disco shit with someone I really liked before and I was curious. It didn't have to do with heroin withdrawal.

 

[keeping]

Congrats man. Keep going with it, you may as well right? The first month flew by for me (but I was meeting a demanding, complicated woman at just the wrong time). You are at the point where you could really keep going with it and stop rattling so often and save more money and all these benefits man. It hit me hard when I realized it was over a month dude and give yourself a pat on the back because even after a month I was still feeling like complete shit sometimes. So I was reluctant to, but I've had some great days too and I feel like I should be proud that i even made it this far.

it's mainly down to me having so much goddamn uni work to do that i don't have the time to get high right now
that, plus i bought a new phone (with all the money i saved from not buying h) and now have no money thanks to that aha
its a nice phone though, some weird brand called a Wileyfox? i haven't had a smart phone for three years so this is cool i guess

and yeah, i should really just not do it, and being broke now i'll deff at least abstain til i get my benefits on tuesday, that's when the real struggle begins

i was quite lucky in that i've been semi-successfully chipping for about a month now - two days on, two/three days off. i actually pushed it a bit far last time (using for three days after a v. short break) and was certain i was gonna start rattling but its now been basically 9 days since my last use and i havent had any wd's so i guess i'm lucky.
still, i feel it drawing me to it. we'll see what tuesday brings, especially if i have work to do still by then...

how you been bro? sounds like a gnarly hangover, just pop a valium and chill out, i sometimes enjoyed the comedown more because i'd just get so destoyed on etizolam - that's one drug i actually can never do again. just get some rest.

 

[ShroomySatori]

Sounds like you are doing great man. Oh dude this hangover is just awful. Benzos are not touching it man, only the dope would. I'm trying to eat some healthy stuff now and get hydrated. Killer fuckin hangover but amazing night!

That's is a silly sounding name for a phone, nice choice. Oh and if you're chipping that's sweet. Good luck with all the school work man. See for me I would want to be high for my schoolwork, but maybe you are avoiding a physical dependency by that schedule you mentioned.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

• 
  ⬆ & ⬆⬆ Sorry for any derailing boys, but it goes without saying you are both kickin ass and takin names.
• Sorry about the brutal hangover Shroomy but at least it's temporary and you might be able to put it to your advantage by getting a back rub or other TLC from the new GF.
• keeping- When you finish swimming in books, papers & url's you will have a highly valuable framed document that brings a wealth of opportunities and pounds with it.

https://archives.drugabuse.gov/pdf/P...s-Neurobio.pdf

I don't know, there are some decent parts but honestly there is a lot of bad info too.

Many ways to look at it, best keep an open mind I suppose.

I understand what you are saying and I would like to bring Adenyl cyclase, specifics of receptor internalization and NMDA antagonism into more view for starters but it is a nice, somewhat simple article and diagram set that covers the basics for people interested in the science that want to know more than "it's hell but will pass in a few days, take a few days off work and some comfort meds".

I do somewhat agree and wouldn't drop this one in NPD- Neuroscience & Pharmacology Discussion, as you are correct about there being a few holes, but it does the job well enough at this level.

 

[ShroomySatori]

Jekyl, one of the worst hangovers of my life. I'm still hungover the 2nd day later and I am nowhere near normal yet. I just got home because I couldn't move from bed yesterday. It was not like opiate withdrawal, but today I am feeling suicidal and I know it's from that disgusting fucking garbage, and it was excellent coke too. I did too much for too long. That stuff wrecked me, I can't handle stimulants. I would never touch coke again and I have no idea how people do something that makes you feel like such fucking garbage after doing it for just 24 hours. I'd sooner shoot heroin again than ever go near even a little bump of that shit.

At least it was a warning sign right? I did get that from her, but I am furious at myself. I haven't been able to enjoy life ever since, well I have, but there is this constant feeling of complete fucking garbage permeating my body and mind. When I was just beginning to feel wonderful again, I feel utterly hopeless now. I feel like slitting my wrists to be honest, I want to pick up some scissors and slash myself for doing something so fucking stupid I think perhaps I might be prone to hard crashes right now because my body is still in recovery? I really shouldn't be doing that and learned a valiuable lesson. At least there is a warning with cocaine. There was none with heroin that I paid any attention to. So I had a really great time on coke with her but that is it for me. I can't even smoke dmt today I feel like such garbage.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Being in PAWS you're going to have to avoid anything that comes with euphoria for a good long while, especially if it has double the comedown since your brain is already pissed from not having opioids.

I'm sure sorry it's hitting you this hard and would hope that maybe you could sleep through some of it. I was always prone to doing rash amounts of alcohol & stims when I was in early PAWS and kind of know the feeling but yours sounds quite tough.

Don't do anything to hurt yourself or your new relationship as it truly is a blessing and will be waiting for you when this stim hangover passes soon. Hang in there buddy!

 

[ShroomySatori]

Thank you buddy and I know that, it's just hard to feel this shitty when I was feeling so great before. The little binge decimated me and since it was fishscale I didn't really realize how much I was doing, how high I got.

I am absolutely done with everything, including alcohol for a very long time. Probably forever. I don't think I can handle a cup of coffee right now. I didn't hurt myself but it's scary that I wanted to. I reallyy strongly agree with avoiding these other harder type drugs that come with euphoria. I was definitely extremely euphoric for around 24 hours and then felt like I had been run over by a train afterwards. I kept prolonging the comedown and doing more,

I still had a great time but I need to recover from this. Doing coke is not going to help my cause, I'm already walking on eggshells. Thanks for the encouragement this morning I was having crying spells and I guess that's the coke comedown but I'm not used to being that severely depressed that I lose track of everything going for me and want to escape by all means necessary. It was harsh as fuck for the little high I got, I'd have been better off doing heroin for 3 days in a row honestly. Really angry at myself, that shit is really stressful on the heart too. At least opiates don't damage the body outright like that stuff. I felt like I was severely damaged in 24 hours and it is day 2 from that, I slept through the morning with a little melatonin and added wild shrimp from Argentina into a massive veggie pasta this morning. I am going to keep drinking glass after glass of cold water and try to clean my system out.

Cheers for checking in I was honestly in a horrible place fuelled by anger and rage. Calmed down a bit from the nap.

 

[ShroomySatori]

The other problem is ever since racking up all those lines of that fucking garbage white, I have been fiending for dope. I want dope on that same mirror chopping up lines that won't make me feel like fucking DEATH the next 2 days. At least with dope it gives you a warning. I can't stop thinking about it now. That cocaine FUCKED my head up, if you are withdrawing from opiates even months later do not touch that shit. I feel like it really set me back and I wasn't expecting that because it is a completely different and far inferior drug to heroin.

 

[Takeme2theothersid]

I just wanted to share my story....

I did opiates until I just couldn't really afford it anymore to be 100% honest with you all and myself. So then I turned to suboxone and after a year of suboxone was tired of being dependent on another pill...

So I have withdrawled myself from suboxone and man was it hard!!!! BUT I EMPHASIZE I DID IT!!! I read a lot on This post and it was very helpful... but don't read too much because a lot of people feel very negative about suboxone and it can make it worse when you are on day 3-4 of feeling like crapola and all you read is how the withdrawal seems to never end!!! I am not 100% normal but I am feeling like I've made it through the worst of it I am on day 12 of no suboxone today I felt the best I have in the past week and half... and I know everyday from here will get better!!!!

If I can do it!!! Anyone else can!! I am mentally and emotionally weak! But was strong enough to go though the worst feeling in my life... which wasn't even that bad... it was bearable yet unbearable if that makes any sense.

You can kick suboxone if you want to!!!!!!! Ya you'll feel crappy for a couple to a few days!!!! But you will feel better when it's done!! I know I do!!! I feel like I have conquered my greatest weakness!

I'm still tired and lazy! But I feel comfortable in my own skin now and I'm not moaning and groaning due to the discomforting feeling associated with the suboxone leaving my body.. I know It will take me another week or two until I have more energy! But I feel decent enough I can cycle around my neighbourhood to help increase my energy levels in the morning! Sleeping at night is hard as well!! But I am happy I am doing this!!! I have lived in an opiate fog for the last 2+ years who knows how long cause it's hard to tell in the fog... but I feel free!!! Very tired lol but freeee!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Nether Animal]

Sup guys. Been a rough summer. I went into this Spring nursing a ~6 month tianeptine habit that had me doing over 5 grams a day. I slowly (and inadvertently) eased into dope to get off the tianeptine. Now I'm at the tail end of a 5 month dope binge and I've totally exhausted my resources. Went to the ER and got clonodine, a handful of gabapentin 300s, and phenobarbital. The last one I've never taken for opiate detox, thoughts on that? Doctor said it was a decent substitute for valium.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but phenobarbital is very underwhelming for a sedative. In combination with the others it will help, I just wouldn't expect too much from it. Even though it comes from a family that has some superstars (seconal, nembutal,etc.) it is verrry long acting and has very little of a peak that can be valuable when you need something for the mini panic attack type stuff that comes with W/D territory. I used it solely for a rather harsh W/D and ended up using roughly 6 grams to keep trying to break through the W/D dysphoria. Ultimately I was still sick but couldn't walk straight or function with any real motor control or dexterity for 48 hrs. Near overdoses of phenobarb like that also leave a small rash on mucous membranes a few days later that take a week to clear up which was great to discover, not that it's an issue with non supra therapeutic doses .

I would take it any day over something like a first generation antihistamine though and it should help get a few more zzz's in at night at least. It might behoove you to seek out some more gabapentin and responsible doses of loperamide also. Best of Luck N.A.!

 

[Nether Animal]

Thanks. With all three meds firing at once I'm in a comfortable enough spot to sleep, even if it is distractingly disassociating. For some reason I started to get that paradoxical restless body effect - not sure which med triggered it but I'm real sensitive to it when dope sick. I told the doctor I had an allergy to promethazine because those antihistamines can give you a fucking nasty restless reaction instead of sedating you. Getting low on neurontin already, so I'm guarding the rest of those with my life.