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Megathread The OFFICAL Anime Appreciation Megathread! vers Moshi Moshi

Mmmmm...I don't know about that. There were some really flashy scenes in Innocence. I found the extensive CGI that they integrated into the animated environments to be visually pleasing, but then again, I consider CGI to be perfectly suitable for such media. Some don't.

And what about the voice acting? I thought that the quality was greatly improved from the first to the second.
 
yup, just don't have the same opinion about the CGI as you. and i like the blue tint more than the sepia one. i think it's important to watch it with subtitles at least a few times because the dialogue is much better than in the english dubbing. but i still like english voice acting in the original. i don't really remember the voice acting in 2.0 so i can't compare. your comment has me curious though.
 
i think it's important to watch it with subtitles at least a few times because the dialogue is much better than in the english dubbing
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I do this with most animes as a rule, but the dubbed version of GitS happens to be the one that I watched first and is, therefore, the one that evokes the most nostalgia. For whatever reason, I can't see myself watching any Japanese-language GitS after subsequently watching every single film and episode in English; it would feel so...unnatural or something. However, I'm aware that this trait is highly idiosyncratic.

That said, I consider the dubbed dialog of Innocence to be top-notch among animes of any language.
 
i'm yet to see Innocence. i've gotten the impression it's not for me.

and yeah, i didn't find out that there was a subtitle option for Ghost in the Shell until after about a decade of owning it. an awkward transition, but i had to make it.
 
i'm yet to see Innocence. i've gotten the impression it's not for me.
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Wait...what? Then what shared experience have we been talking about? I thought you explicitly un-recommended GitS 2.0 only 4 or 5 posts upthread...? If you haven't even seen it, why knock it so casually? You might be pleasantly surprised.

Have you been referring to the TV spinoff movie, perhaps? It was called something like 'Solid State Society.'
 
i was afraid that might be happening. i'm talking about a movie just called Ghost in the Shell 2.0. it's Ghost in the Shell with a sepia tint and a bunch of CGI. i've read the changes were to make it look more like Innocence. i don't think i would like Innocence. could be wrong, but i doubt i'll ever find out.
 
Ah. Well never mind then.

The apposite Wikipedia article has informed me that Ghost in the Shell 2.0 is 'not to be confused with Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence.' :? 8( :!
 
Spirited Away , Howl's Castle , Castle in the Sky , Ponyo on a cliff , Bleach , Elfen Lied , Nabari Ou Ni , Soul Eater , My Neighbor Totoro
 
P A said:
Mmmmm...I don't know about that. There were some really flashy scenes in Innocence. I found the extensive CGI that they integrated into the animated environments to be visually pleasing, but then again, I consider CGI to be perfectly suitable for such media. Some don't.
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I was so disappointed with the style of CGI in Innocence that it distracted me from enjoying its other virtues. The most affecting and distinct aspect of the first film for me was its musical quality. I'm forced to borrow terms from music I don't know that well and wield them clumsily to describe what I mean any further, but there are scenes in the original that achieve a "contrapuntal" relationship between the film's audio-visual elements.

For instance, during the intro credit sequence, right about at the moment pictured here:

images


... the rhythm of the sounds of the brain case assemblage, right at the pause in the Kenji Kawai score, and the kinetics of the animation, all come together to strum one synesthetic "riff" down my spine. People who are on my same trip will discern similar in the way the animators chose to time the striking of the rain drops in the shot of the puddle that sets off a later segment employing the same score, or in the rhythm of streetlight reflections off the windshield of a police car as it speeds through a tunnel later yet in the film.

Then, in Innocence, they went and aborted the aesthetic soul of the thing by entrusting the production of what could have been beautiful "synesthetic harmonies" to fucking computers -- smooth and plastic and devoid of visceral inertia in their animation as they tend to be. The CGI in Innocence slides around in these simplified Euclidean trajectories that disengage me with the sheer force of their sterility (this style is used in the original GITS, too, but only for animating what is specifically meant to be perceived by the viewer as computer graphics or holograms within the animated environment, but not as physical elements of the environment).

And the thing is I know CGI is used all the time in animation to perfectly good effect. It's just that one style of CGI that seems to involve making one click on a screen indicating where you want something to move then hitting space bar and letting an algorithm actually carry all the pieces over there. Use 3D models to help with drawing still frames or whatever, but leave the art of depicting motion to people.

Steamboy, for instance, seemed to make liberal use of CGI without falling into the stylistic trap Innocence did. Never again, dammit.
 
P A said:
6. I don't think that you're being very realistic in your implicit assumption that anyone over the age of 14 and who isn't a diehard anime fan will have seen even half of the shows you've listed. That said, excluding only those of which I've seen absolutely nothing: GitS>Cowboy>Elfen>Inuyasha>Piece.(...) But seriously dood, as someone who isn't even a fan of this stuff, where are all the classics? Conspicuously absent are Dragonball and Kenshin, among many others, I'm sure.
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Well i chose those 10 at random because i thoroughly enjoyed them, i did wanna add classics but i couldn't think of any. I forgot to add in that if you hadn't seen a show to just add it to the end of your list.

@hydroazuanacaine- I did mind at first because i couldn't find the bloody thread anywhere and i knew it hadn't been closed. I was puzzled for maybe 10 minutes before i stumbled onto the merge, maybe next time put merge in the title? After i read your post you were forgiven lol, it's all good, i just had a bit of a blunder for a minute. I'll definitely look into watching GotS whenever i get some free time
 
^my bad. it's standard procedure to PM or leave an expiring link after merging. i should have. i was being presumptuous and lazy. anyway, hope it didn't cause too much frustration. and i really hope you enjoy Ghost in the Shell!
 
yay the thread got bumped!

the CGI in Innocence bugged the shit out of me too.

my favorite anime is 5 Centimeters Per Second. The story and atmosphere is rendered surreal by beautiful artwork. The plot is very human. I learn new things from each viewing.

right now i'm halfway through Electromagnetic Girlfriend, but it's only a 2 part OVA so that doesn't mean much. It's pretty good so far, curious to see what the ending brings.

6. Arrange these in order of best to worst in terms of quality: Elfen Lied, Naruto, Neon genesis, Ghosts In The Shell, Cowboy bebop, Bleach, Inspector Conen: Case Closed, Inuyasha, Hunter x Hunter (2011), Soul Eater, One Piece
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Bebop, GiTS, NGE, Elfen, and I'm really not into shonen so I haven't seen the rest.

What I'm really looking forward to is seeing the rest of the Evangelion Rebuilds. I really like the direction they took this in and the funding they threw at it this time around. The detail of the animation is absolutely incredible.

When I see comments like Beli calling anime stylistically homogeneous I can't help but wonder what kind of stuff he's thinking about. I wish I could show him something like Tatami Galaxy and ... oh wait, I totally can.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kq7O6eR12oM

What anime does that look like? It seems pretty unique to me. A bunch of divergent styles are represented in manga/anime and with them lots of peculiar, surreal plots and characters. 5 Centimeters Per Second is another great example of unique style; the whole film looks like a moving pastel painting. And great series just ended that was loaded with haunting visceral delights. So yeah, there is a lot of variety in the art and many do qualify to be called art, in contrast to American cartoons which are pretty umm... well, cartoonish.
 
Re Innocence:
I was neutral on the CGI aspect of it; I wanted impressive animation, and that's what I got. I will say this, though: watching Innocence a hundred times wouldn't equal the visceral punch of seeing the first Ghost in the Shell once. My beef with the second film has been better summed by other critics: it feels like a long, alternate SAC episode rather than a movie that can stand on its own. You watch it, you're glad you saw it, and you've forgotten it an hour later. That was not the first film, for me. Not at all.

Re "homogeneity":
I'll qualify this statement only by saying that there are exceptions in any genre. But, anime / manga is, for the most part, what it is. Big-breasted women in miniskirts. Huge eyes. Spiky hair. Tiny mouths. Neoteneous heads. Streaks and flashes and "Ha-haa!!" and "ARRRRGH!" and--it is what it is. It's perhaps unfair to call this a judgment, because animation that does not fit the style would no be longer be anime, any more than painting a bowl of fruit in a Mondrian would keep it Neo-Plasticist. I can deal with the cartoonishness of Western animation so long as it always keeps me from resting in it, experimenting with the form regardless of the intended audience. One of the reasons I cut down my viewership of Cartoon Network is that it went through a long phase where everything looked like Bruce Timm's work, even when it wasn't, and I like evolution.*

*Of course, much "Western" animation employs Japanese animation workers and companies (watch the closing credits of old "Disney Afternoon" series, sometime), while one wonders if Western animators are frequently pandering towards audiences already receptive to anime, but that's for another time.
 
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check the YT link i posted, no big eyes or small mouths there :) That being said, those characteristics are a mainstay of anime just like the tendency to continually create new plots that are just variations on a theme. Each year there are more than two dozen unique series being produced but the majority of them can be categorized easily by a small group of archetypes; shonen, mecha, harem, school days, etc. It's necessary to be receptive towards the repetition of themes in order to get to the true heart of a series (if one exists).

For example, there's an ongoing series right now called Accel World that I remember reading the synopsis for and cringing at it. It sounded like some lame virtual mecha rehash and I'm seriously fucking bored of mecha but after catching an episode I found myself thrilled with the little details that were fleshed out just to make the plot seem entirely plausible. As a sci-fi lover, attention to detail is a big focus for me and I quickly lose focus of a fantastical plot if my brain has to keep interrupting to point out obvious inconsistencies.

Despite the fact that the show falls under an archetypal category and therefore fits into that "box", so to speak, it's always a joy to catch a series that impresses with the abilities of the writers and animators to express an immense level of creativity without resorting to thinking outside of the box. American studios seem to love doing that, and the results often look more like colouring outside of the lines than thinking outside of a box. A lot of cult cartoon series are just so random that they only work on an episodic basis. That's really where the distinction lies; American TV is all about episodic events and trying to balance it with some character development to get the audience emotionally involved, but the character development is typically few and far-between because the producers are trying to stretch the show for as long as it continues to earn money. In the anime sphere of influence, everyone is aware they have a 12-24 episode limit and need to introduce and tie up a cogent plot arc within that time frame.

I can't deny that many series piss away the time frame and the end result is a steaming pile of time-slot filler, but at least one or two series do come out annually for which the moon and the stars align to bless it with a perfect harmony of artwork, plot, characters and theme music. It would be a shame to avoid a good story told just because the characters are drawn with the familiar porcelain-doll features that anime is known for.
 
Belisarius said:
Re Innocence:
I was neutral on the CGI aspect of it; I wanted impressive animation, and that's what I got. I will say this, though: watching Innocence a hundred times wouldn't equal the visceral punch of seeing the first Ghost in the Shell once. My beef with the second film has been better summed by other critics: it feels like a long, alternate SAC episode rather than a movie that can stand on its own. You watch it, you're glad you saw it, and you've forgotten it an hour later. That was not the first film, for me. Not at all.
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I've not read any professional criticism of Innocence, but I watched Innocence before I tuned into some of the Stand Alone Complex episodes when they ran as part of Adult Swim. And, yes, the feel of the series and the feel of Innocence are much closer to each other aesthetically than either are to the original. I'm curious now what happened internally in the animation department. It kept the intellect, but lost part of the soul.
 
Bumping because the Eureka Seven AO OST arrived :) It's all short tunes which is a bit disappointing but on the other hand they're all really awesome.

I guess they're all up on YT, check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Fzclm4MjVQ

This week's episode was also great. I was watching with ambiguity until now but it finally looks like Bones is not fucking around any more. Banchou!
 
My daughter got a full 3 dvd set of happy ready go, in japanese with english subtitles, watched it start to finish rained in together in a camper van a couple summers ago, was really good.
 
@ delta_9 : Thank you for your racist and sarcastic help of 15 -6--2011, you probably figured it out I am not from US or UK. I wish I could reply to you in the same way or see you face to face when you say things.
 
Whoa! This thread is almost on 2nd page, can't let that happen :p My roomie dragged me into a used CD/DVD shop and I came across a copy of Armitage The Third which I had to have because I've heard so much about it but never seen it. Elizabeth Berkley and Keifer Sutherland do the voices lolzzz. I guess I'm watchin this bitch dubbed
 
Well, if you are OK with a show that isn't never-ending like bleach, and is disturbing/creepy, I highly recommend higurashi.
Every 4 eps or so is a new story-line with the same characters.
The very beginning shows how everybody dies, and you get to find out how it gets from normal, to what you saw along the way.
It's disturbing, but you can't help but watch.

video contains spoilers, but it should give a good idea of what it's like.
Keep in mind, all this horrible shit begins from what starts out an innocent harem sort of show.
 
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