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Nootropics The Big & Dandy Nootropics Thread (Stack 2)

Solipsis said:
@Electrodevo: I have EGCG(s) but have not given that a lot of attention because I was under the impression that the proposed health effects would not be noticeable. Can you provide information that these compounds are actually known to work noticeably, and more specifically: as nootropic?
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Green tea shows considerable synergy with all the racetams in my experience. In a pinch I value green tea higher than all of them. I'm able to withstand stressful phases without noopept or piracetam, but without green tea I struggle considerably harder to keep up. Tea provides a funny mixture of alertness and calmness I haven't been able to mimic with any chemical (modafinil is not unsimilar though). But capped extract isn't really appealing for me. I just drink loads of _good_ (i.e. superb quality and freshly harvested) green tea. I brew and drink between 1-2 litres a day, and don't mind spending a few minutes preparing the stuff and filling a thermos (I even enjoy the ritual to some extent). If you spend some time looking around you can get high quality tea without spending a fortune (or significantly more than those caps cost). The taste is sublime and every cup I pour and drink gives me five minutes respite from the onslaught, especially on really hard and intense days at work. No stomach problems, no disturbance of my sleep cycle no significant side effects at all. Why would I chug capped extract and deny myself the pleasure of drinking this delicous beverage? Dropping capped extracts doesn't fit in my definition of 'convenience'. :)

Edit: Just a small remark Not all the racetams are working for me, Piracetam has considerable effect on me, as does Noopept (albeit only at rather high doses) the rest just shows no perceptible effect. Green tea potentiates the subjective effect of both. After much experimenting with a lot of different supplements I found that, for me, high doses of Piracetam, Noopept and strong batches of green tea and vitamin C (capped or fresh fruit) are the most effective agents for recovering from strenuous/exhausting drug experiments.
 
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interesting about the whole semax selank thing. any difference between them (other than price of course)... i see them both relatively rare online so am wondering...

any other viable ROAs that dont involve needles?
 
Toucan said:
Peptides are pretty limited when it comes to ROAs because they're broken down so readily, but insufflation in a nasal spray apparently works - similar to oxytocin. The dose required is much higher however, so considering the price it's probably not an option for most.
Subq injections are incredibly easy to do though, it's really not so bad at all - I mean diabetics do this everyday...
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I don't think peptides are entirely limited, with something like Noopept there seems to be quite a high bio-availability when administered orally, however, sublingual is always better. What do you think of Noopept? It is a very small peptide so maybe it does not get lysed bi stomach peptidases?
 
What?

Selank (Russian: Cеланк) is a nootropic, anxiolytic peptide based drug developed by the Institute of Molecular Genetics of the Russian academy of sciences. Selank is a heptapeptide with the sequence Thr-Lys-Pro-Arg-Pro-Gly-Pro. It is a synthetic analogue of a human tetrapeptide tuftsin. as such, it mimics many of its effects. It has been shown to modulate the expression of Interleukin-6 (IL-6) and affect the balance of T helper cell cytokines. It has been shown to influence the concentration of monoamine neurotransmitters and induce metabolism of serotonin. There is evidence that it may also modulate the expression of Brain-derived neurotropic factor (BDNF) in rats
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Sublingual administration of Validol produces a sedative effect, and has moderate reflex and vascular dilative action caused by stimulation of sensory nerve receptors of the oral mucosa followed by the release of endorphins. Validol is typically administered as needed for symptom relief.[11][12][13]
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I think you're posting in the wrong sub-forum, and you need a bit more substance to the original post too.
 
Has anyone had experience with these?

And, what forum should I pist in?
I saw a Big n Dandy RC thread around here somewhere...



Wanted a little bit more than the two wiki articles you've found.
Thanks for the reply though. :)
 
Check the announcement in the OP: healthy living forum is for supplements, but to tidy up I merged your thread into this one. We have had the occasional remark about Selank and Semax but not Veridol (sp?), use the search engine for within the thread on those queries.
 
I did, didn't see anything. Which is why I'm asking here, I guess, or there.
But likely it'll just get ignored and I'll remain in the dark about what exactly
this does.
 
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OK, well Validol is not a nootropic anyway AFAIK and not even a 'supplement' - I know I was the one that moved your thread and mentioned the HL forum but you might be better off anyway asking about Validol's pharmacology (and maybe safety as well) in the ADD forum.

This thread still stands as home for discussion on those russian nootropic and adaptogenic peptides. Information is scarce, but like I said it has been mentioned briefly.

And please refrain from linking to places where drugs, medication or supplements may be bought. It is against the rules.

edit:

It appears that the wikipedia entry for validol is wrong, it seems it is not the methyl but menthyl ester of isovaleric acid a.k.a. 3-methylbutanoic acid. So it is menthol conjoined with isovaleric acid, the menthol does nothing but probably increasing bioavailability.
Isovaleric acid itself is proposed to be the anticonvulsive agent in valerian root.
More on this:

Validol tablets are widely used in cardiology as a complex pharmaceutical preparation. The main effect of validol is calming
(sedative). Simultaneously, it reflexively slightly dilates blood vessels by stimulation of sensory receptors of the oral mucosa. It removes the headache with stress and after ingestion of nitroglycerin for angina. When validol is taken under the tongue (sublingually), its effect occurs in about 5 minutes
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http://www.ajpcr.com/Vol5Suppl3/1112.pdf

I imagine validol to have a smell of menthol mixed with sweaty cheese. Hmm nice.

One of the sources I used to synthesize the above claims:
http://chestofbooks.com/health/mate...Therapeutics/Valeric-Esters.html#.UYLBJ6IqywI

Conclusion: you might as well take valerian. The difference being that valerian contains a matrix of valeric acid derivates and validol contains only one. I doubt this is interesting, though valerian may have some unwanted effects like drowsiness, that are less in validol.
 
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I have not tried selank or semax much myself and wouldn't from what I see so far; the few pieces of feedback from other forums seems kind of mixed right now.

Along semax's lines, the one nootropic peptide that does seem to get some positive noise for brain boosting in other forums is cerebrolysin. Me no likey the concept of injection-only compounds, personally. But if you want an expensive peptide that seems to actually do something for many people...
 
I liked selank, as I wrote on the previous page it's a very effective anxiolytic IME. Not particularly nootropic but it does make you feel very 'clear headed.' Doses were 250-500mcg sq
 
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Selank interests me quite a bit. I would volunteer for reasonable trials if they existed.
 
Validol....hm.
Having never tasted, or really even smelled o seen, sweaty cheese, I can't speak on that.

It would seem to taste, just really mentholated. Like industrial strength menthol.
Also, a mild relaxant. But noticable.
 
hello,

I've been reading various sources on nootropics and decided to take the plunge myself with piracetam (seems it's the best way to start). I've started off with an "attack dose" of 3600 mg piracetam + 1200 mg lechitin as a choline source, it felt pretty much like a low dose of E but later in the day I'd get headaches, feel tired and experience what I suppose is called "brain fog". I realized I was taking too much piracetam and too little lechitine, so after a bit of trial and error, I found it was best to do 1200 mg piracetam + 1200 mg lechitin.

I also stopped redosing in the afternoon because I found it difficult to "shut down" at night and go to sleep. BUT today I woke up pretty tired, dosed my 1200mg of piracetam and in the afternoon I took a nap very easily! So this is getting more and more unpredictable...

Now the problem is that although I'm doing the same dose, my reactions seem to vary wildly from one day to the other. If I'm in good shape, then I don't really feel much going on, except that I find I can focus more easily and I don't feel distractions or emotions, I'm like a robot who does what has to be done. However, if I had very little sleep the night before I find that the effects are extremely energetic, like I took some E, I feel very positive, walk around with a large grin on my face and enjoy "wasting time" like walking around and listening to music. To that I should add that once I take piracetam I could just sit on a chair for more than an hour and listen to music without even feeling like I should be doing something more productive.


And that's my problem... isn't this stuff supposed to make you "smarter" and more motivated? I don't really feel that... I can feel it's doing SOMETHING to my brain but I'm not really sure I'd call it a nootropic, more like a mood enhancer. Ok, I should also mention that it's barely been 2 weeks since I've started, so I know it's a bit too early to jump to conclusions, still I'm wondering if it's really worth the effort of buying this stuff and going through a routine of daily intake if you don't really get the desired effect? Am I doing something wrong here?

I've also considered moving to something more powerful like aniracetam or noopept, but should I directly switch over or should I let a bit more time go to feel the piracetam? Or should I take something on top?

thanks for helping out a noob ;)
 
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I have bulk aniracetam in powder form and no means of getting capsules. How can I best ingest aniracetam? Can I swallow the powder itself, or should it be mixed with a drink? I plan on taking it with MCT oil/coffee. I just can't picture putting a bunch of powder directly into my mouth.
 
You can swallow aniracetam. It is one of the few racetams that doesn't taste terrible, the other being oxiracetam, and to a lesser degree phenylpiracetam. I'd recommend 000 gel capsules though.
 
Very basic question, but I can take aniracetam as long as it's swallowed? Doesn't matter if it's on food, straight down the hatch, or in Bulletproof coffee?


Basic adrafinil questions: Length that effects are felt at 300mg? I've heard around four hours, but I'd love some anecdotes. Furthermore, does anyone have extensive experience with adrafinil and aniracetam (or any racetams)?

I plan on ingesting my aniracetam with MCT Oil, Fish Oil (2-3g), and Choline. I know racetams are very user specific (and I've yet to experiment) but I was wondering if anyone else has done the same with respect to MCT Oil. Any chance that MCT oil (slow-burning fat) would help extend aniracetam?

I understand these are very basic questions - forgive me, I'm an International Relations major, this stuff isn't really in my field. I appreciate your insight and patience.
 
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I'm choosing to bump this thread because I added a few more questions to my last post. Not sure how active the nootropic thread is regularly, and I'd like to avoid having my questions overlooked before I begin my stack. I appreciate everyone's assistance.
 
Very basic question, but I can take aniracetam as long as it's swallowed? Doesn't matter if it's on food, straight down the hatch, or in Bulletproof coffee?

Yes, but you may have trouble dissolving it in coffee. It is not water-soluable. It is best absorbed with fat/oil though.

Basic adrafinil questions: Length that effects are felt at 300mg? I've heard around four hours, but I'd love some anecdotes. Furthermore, does anyone have extensive experience with adrafinil and aniracetam (or any racetams)?

Kicks in about an hour after ingestion. Very slow and pleasant comedown from modafinil (the metabolite). Probably 5-6 hours of activity, but expect a reduced need/want for sleep that night.

I plan on ingesting my aniracetam with MCT Oil, Fish Oil (2-3g), and Choline. I know racetams are very user specific (and I've yet to experiment) but I was wondering if anyone else has done the same with respect to MCT Oil. Any chance that MCT oil (slow-burning fat) would help extend aniracetam?

I doubt it will extend it, perhaps just make it more easily absorbed. I haven't done aniracetam in a while, as I'm a bigger fan of the more stimulating nootropics.
 
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