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The Big & Dandy Ego Death Thread

Ego death on weed?

I just wanted to ask a question of those in the know about an experience I had last year that still affects me to this day.

Just for background info, I'ver tried heaps of drugs - with psychedelic drugs, particularly 2Ci (Bermuda triangles?) being my favourite. I've smoked weed for years, having only recently stopped as a result of this experience. I have had (fairly minor) issues with anxiety in the past.

To be brief: Last year I had a buckety at my house with my girlfriend and some friends. I'd been away working in the Flinders Rangers with my girlfriend and had been driving all night to get home. Apart from being a bit tired I was in a great headspace, and having a fun time. We didn't have much weed so we thought bucketys would be the best way to make use of what we had.

Like most on these forums, I've smoked heroic amounts in my time, and this is what puzzles me about this experience.

After sucking down ONE fairly large buckety, I found myself getting ridiculously fucked. Fucked beyond just the simple magnification of the effects of weed.

I didn't start freking out as such - I'd had enough experience with drugs to be able to keep a grip, albeit a shaking and sweaty one. The battle was within my head. I was tripping harder than I have ever tripped before. This is the sort of thing that was happening to me:

<Look at arms> Arms are a box are a man running up my arms are boxes are a man running up my.... (repeats)

All i had control of was one little Morpehus-like voice amid the maelstrom, that kept trying to tell the rest of my mind that everyhting was ok - I was after all, on drugs. I tried, breathing, centering myself, detaching my desire to rationalise what was happening.... it wasn't working.

I could feel my organs squirming inside me. My breath felt like it was on fire. Everything felt horrible. This wasn't the worst bit for me, coz it was just like a bad trip. The next bit is the 'worst' bit.

Eventually I entered this state where I could feel my sense of self eroding. It started with everything i knew about social protocol evaporating. Actions stopped making sense. Memories of what to do and how to behave evaporated. All sense of the past and future began to unravel. If I was an onion, layers of my skin were being peeled slowly and painfully away. After much ripping and tearing, I was eventually reduced to a single desire - the desire to keep existing. Staying alive had no meaning anymore.... i had no idea what death was... all I knew was that I had to keep existing. At this point I was barely an "I", just a desire and a sense of terror.

Then this desire evaporated. There was just awareness. No "I", no "self". Awareness was everything. Everything was everything - if that makes any sense.

After a time (could have been microseconds, could have been eternities), there was the realisation that there was existence. This suddenly gave "I" a reference point. I know this sounds corny, but this was a state of "I am".

It is at this point I believe my 'self' began recontructing itself again, because the "I am" began identifying itself against what it was not. I felt like a baby. Layers of onion skin began to reform. At some juncture here I realised that while my sense of "I" ceased at some point, my awareness never did.

I have skimped on some points, but this is the general gist of what happened to me. In retrospect, it was an amazing (yet painful and scary) experience. I didn't not seek it or want it to happen while it was happening.
Before this experience, I had not heard about ego death occurring on weed.

What I want to know is, was this a real ego death? Is this similar in anyway to ego death? And why did it occur on a fairly tame amount of weed?

Having read these forums I understand there are people here who have truly experienced what I only think I may have...

As far as my own personal development and sense of spirituality is concerned, I need to integrate this experience.... and I need help doing that.

Whether it was real, or I just had a bad trip, it was humbling, to say the least.


Sorry for ranting on a bit, any illumination would be greatly appreciated.


Respect and peace
 
I have never experianced ego death, nor heard of it happening on weed.

But to me it sounds like thats what you experianced, but i cant comment with out experiance myself.

But i do wish you luck in your search for answers.
 
This is probably my fourth or fifth attempt at writing some kind of reply that will either make sense, be of some use to you or, at least, not diminish the experience you have so clearly described.
I too have enjoyed a multitude of 'drugs' over 35 years but, in a way like you, my experience of 'ego-death' was also ostensibly 'drug-free' - it occured while walking through the town I live the morning after I had enjoyed a single 120mg tab of MDMA.
I suppose what I'm trying to say is that while 'drugs' can take you to that state (I've 'glimpsed' it at other times when tripping but had never experienced full 'ego-death' before), ultimately it is purely a state of mind and, so, can occur at any time.
I meditate regularly and had meditated for half an hour prior to my own experience and so that could have 'helped' - but the reason for it is immaterial. What is more challenging is your statement about, ' how do I integrate this'.
You don't say whether before or after this event you had any spiritual leanings. I have been interested in Buddhism for many years but have only been what I would describe as a practicing Buddhist (that is, meditating twice a day, studying Dharma daily as well as endeavouring to live my life as mindfully as possible) since the beginning of this year. It is this which has given me some framework through which to properly comprehend what happened and through which to allow what I learnt to affect my actions in (how difficult this is to try and explain!!!) this 'reality'.
The most significant 'lesson' I learnt (something I had intellectually 'understood' but which only became true KNOWLEDGE afterwards) was that all is mind - everything we perceive is an illusion.
Integrating this understanding into my life has already had remarkable, positive effects on my own experience of 'life' and, consequently, that of others.
I don't want to cloud your thinking with my clumsy attempts at explanations of Buddhist philosophy, nor wish to 'preach', as there are undoubtedly other 'paths' to further your understanding and allow you to 'use' your new found knowledge, but should you be interested I would be pleased to recommend some books.
My deepest respect to you too - peace and love are the inevitable consequences!
 
thankyou so much Fishface.

Though I do not subscribe to any particular religion, I consider myself deeply spiritual - with a sort of mash of Christianity/Buddhism/New Age/Personal Beliefs......

I suppose the reason I am having trouble with this experience is that it was an incredibly spiritual experience (let alone an absolute mind-rape) - yet it was horrible. Terror and agony are the only words that come close to describing how I felt.....

Everything I have subsequently read and heard about ego death has told me that it is a directly incredibly divine experience. The only positives I have gained from this have been retrospectively, much in the same way one can see the good in a bad trip long after it has been experienced.

Has anyone else had a horrible ego death experience?

Is it possible?
 
What exactly is ego death?
Please excuse my limted knowlege on the matter.
Is it just a bad trip where a person has a realisation of self? Like "I think therefore I am" type thing? Or is it a form of enlightenment?
 
Although difficult for some people, ego death can be thought of as a very good, enlightening experience. However, that's usually when you're expecting it and are ready for it...
 
Quoting Bludda:

'Then this desire evaporated. There was just awareness. No "I", no "self". Awareness was everything. Everything was everything - if that makes any sense.'

.....and indeed it does make sense and should, nO_iRiS, help explain what ego-death is - it is the complete destruction of ego - that is, anything that can in any way be cognised as 'I', as a separate entity - which shows Descartes' little ditty to be the pile of tosh philosophers have long argued it to be.

As for enlightenment, I would venture that only when such knowledge is fully integrated into the everyday experience of existence could one say that someone was truly enlightened. However, direct experience of such knowledge in whatever way (and there are as many ways to experience it as there are minds) is a pre-requisite and could, therefore, be described as 'a form of enligtenment'.

That Bludda had such a hard time of it I can only suggest was due to stronger than usual attempts by his ego to hold on - it's no coincidence that the Tibetan word for ego means 'that which grasps'.

As for inducing it - still the mind - in whatever way - cut 'you' out - that's what 'drugs' allow, as does meditation, as does life - it can happen at any time to any one - it cannot, however, be produced to order.
 
When I first started smoking pot I could easily achieve Out of Body experience states with a little meditation.

I wouldn't consider it "ego death" compared to mushrooms or something, but it's still pretty intense.
 
>>Then this desire evaporated. There was just awareness. No "I", no "self". Awareness was everything. Everything was everything - if that makes any sense. >>

Congrats. This, I believe, is THE point of psychedelics. Now, was it still terrifying while "you" were not?

ebola
 
Bludda, see related threads here and here

Btw, researchemist, I'm almost 100% sure that the only bermuda triangle in Australia to undergo CGMS tested positive for LSD only, as reported here
 
Ebola!, at the point "I" ceased to exist, there was no terror for there was no "me" to feel terrified. It wasn't apathy - more like the awareness of 'everything' included all the emotions combined, much in the same way all the visible colours form white when mixed.

It's hard to put the experience of annhilation into words - being "Everything/Nothing" at the same time is a crude way of putting it. In my subsequent analysis of the experience, it had occurred to me that if I had been 'feeling' any kind of emotion during when I thought my ego had melted, then it couldn't have melted - for there would have to be SOMETHING experiencing that emotion.

The terror, pain (which I felt was manifested physically in my body) were all things that bracketed the experience; though of course, the reassemblage of my "self" was much less traumatic and more relieving than the destruction.
 
Bludda, your description of this experience, a very difficult thing to put into words as it is in many ways beyond words, is exceptionally eloquent. Your description of re-entering the realm of the 'not-me' definitely struck a chord.

I am not nearly as knowledgable about tripping or psychedelic literature as the vast majority of the posters in this forum but I think it is entirely possible to experience ego-death on marijuana, unusual perhaps but certainly possible. (When I reflect on my early use of kind bud I remember often being put in a trance that was far beyond 'the known' ... but I didn't appreciate that experience at the time). With mushrooms the oncoming dissolution of ego is so florid and dramatic that it inevitably 'wakes' people up, and now there is a great deal of literature helping people to conceptualize the experience.

I think ego-loss of some kind is experienced occassionally by people in other practices but is seldom spoken of or understood ... in activities such as dance, in the performance of music, in passionate sex, and of course in contemplative prayer and meditation. In some ways the psychedelic community is very fortunate that there is so much literature available on this experience. In a culture that denies and represses the unkown, and quantifies everything this community is a weird subversive keeper-of-the-flame.

'Integrating' these experiences is something often spoken of but harder to practice and not even necessarily always practicable. If nothing else an experience like this shows us that life and consciousness is much more than our prejudices and received stories led us to believe. You have glimpsed something profound.

Of all mystical practices, like fishface, I am most familiar with the Buddhist tradition. In my case, Zen Buddhism. Although a transcendent or plateau experience is in many ways a blessing and might teach us a lot, in Zen we are taught not to hold on to this way of seeing or to anticipate it coming again, because it is no more real than any other way of seeing and if we want it too much it will only cause us pain. There are, however, very different approaches to the transcendent in Hinduism and Sufism.

If you feel called to understand this -- which (though I may sound dramatic) is nothing less than reality, life, death, bliss, eternity -- there is a lot to be learned from the spiritual traditions. Though it is a hard path to walk as this consumer culture does not support that particular vocation into the mysterious and the free.
 
wow, what an amazing description. ive had that exact same exeperience on marijuana many times. in fact it is the reason i had to quit smoking marijuana, everytime i smoke i immediately go to a state of awareness very near ego death and and it is a horrible horrible feeling, unless i proceed into the full ego death at which point there is no me left to be afraid anymore. what makes that so difficult is that i always experience such terrible feeling in my body that i think i am actually dying and not just losing my ego. i know marijuana isnt supposed to kill you but its also not suppose to force ego loss and in my stoned state i am just not able to rationalize what is happening and almost always believe i am about to die. i believe the experience is a real ego death because it matches the description of ego death and the insights gained from it are the same insights described over and over throughout many different spiritual teachings. my only other experience of ego death was on a salvia trip and it was very similar to the marijuana experience. ive wanted to make a post about my experiences for a long time but i never have because i was never able to word it adequitely like you have done.
 
yah i agree with ego loss vs ego death. i dont think its possible to achieve ego death on cannabis, regardless of potency, strain, or dose.

extreme ego loss is possible. I always thought people conjured it up in their heads that they could even hallucinate, let alone have symptoms of ego loss from just cannabis, untill it happened to me.
 
Wow, I have to admit I'm surprised by all of this. When I first heard that Bludda experienced something akin to egolessness from cannabis, I thought it very odd. Obviously total egolessness is a state that one can reach through meditation and without the aid of psychoactives. But that stuff aside, I was always under the impression that egolessness was something that people achieved when taking 'significant' doses of hallucinogens, like 300ug+ of LSD, 4g+ of mushrooms and so on.

I personally am yet to experience total egolessness, but have reached the initial stages of the ego loss process while on LSD. It felt extremely liberating.

I wonder if anyone can shed some light on what might have caused Bludda to have this surprise experience on such a low dose of cannabis? It's obviously rare, but judging by other posts far from unheard of.
 
i thought i was the only person to achieve ego death via weed lol. but a while back i got an eighth of some good reggos and i coughed relativly hard..i thought i had collapsed and reinflated a lung (the worst pain i ever had experienced as well as the strangest feeling) thus setting the grounds for a panick attack. i was high and just underwent something really fucked up...

well, i thought i was dying for the next hour or so until i really did "die". let me make an aside here as i never really believed in anything other than myself, no god nor religon. so as im sitting on a couch i feel my heart speed up and then bam it explodes..

im already staring off into the corner and i see the preverbial white light and become immersed in it. at which time i had a conversation with god, he told me that to be immited to heaven i had to confess every sin of the seven. in the beginning i just kept mumbling i dont know, which i didnt really know my mind was so clouded at the time. so he sent me to purgatory to figure out what it was i had to figure out. it was the worst feeling ever, my insides felt like they were crawling, the tv played nothing but infomercials, the cable box said channel 666...time stood still. after a while he came back and asked if i knew what had to be done yet and i started confessing things(keep in mind there is a room full of people watching this spectical). every once and a while i would get stuck and he would ask...is that all i have to say and i would be sent back to purgatory. but after a while i got it, he just wanted me to have faith in myself and him...and to believe in him...to take better care of myself, of this eutopia he gave me. instead of accecpting me into heaven he gave me another chance at life saying that i still have accomplished what he sent me here to do.


that was the single craziest night of my life. it changed me into a better person, into the person i am today. i still dont believe in religon because i think theyve all got it wrong. ive met the man himself so i think ive an edge on all these religons.

now i realize that this experience was just ego death. it held all the classic signs (i didnt really elaborate mainly cause i didnt want to write a 5 page essay but it fits what others have described as ego death, mainly the feeling of dying and struggling to accecpt it, not just letting go and floating downstream..til it became too strong to fight) and i still believe to this day in god, but a little diffrently. i think that everyone is their own god..your god is your brain. my brain (and body maybe) was crying out to change all this...change my diet, my binge drug use, the stress all those "sins" caused, my lack of faith in god...or more so myself. and even past that, we might still be our own gods but that god is still the same god to everyone.




now if i could only figure out what it is he sent me back here to do? lol
 
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