Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
I've never tried it that low. I've done it as low as 250ug and it was fully active at a low level, it actually kept me up all night and I took it in the morning.
☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy DOC Thread - Third opinion
- Thread starter Solipsis
- Start date
Doclad
Bluelighter
Good afternoon.
In my little chest I have 800mg of DOC. This summer I plan to take it for the first time. It will be my first psychedelic marathon.
I was wondering if you take Phenibut to reduce the body burden, and if 5mg of Diazepan would have a similar effect.
Is there any advantage of Phenibut over any benzo? From what I have read it also affects GABA receptors.
DocLad
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
Nice! I wouldn't actually binge on DOC but I have taken it weekly for long periods of time before which is kind of a binge, especially for most people. Anyway, yes I've taken phenibut many times with DOC, in fact these days I like to use phenibut for most trips as it's just a great thing to combine them with. It doesn't reduce the trip at all, or mask anything, it just makes you approach the trip with that phenibut confidence and smoothness. It makes me feel a lot more comfortable, but it doesn't stop body load. But honestly I find that bodyload is, for me anyway, usually a symptom of my internal state more than an actual physical effect from the drug, or an excess of energy that you're not channeling. For example, with DOC I get a lot of body energy which manifests as restlessness and an almost RLS-style need to move my limbs. So I do things when I take it, ideally I spend the day exploring nature with a good friend who also takes it. When I'm out doing things, the body energy feels good and it helps me, and I generally feel euphoric and talkative, but if I sit at home I feel very restless and kind of overwhelmed and unpleasant until the trip levels out (which takes like 6 hours or so for me, for it to fully peak).
But anyway, benzos like diazepam help more on a physical muscle tension level, but they do mute some aspects of the trip and reduce overall intensity. IMO benzos are better as a safety net to be utilized only when necessary, whereas phenibut is a great drug to combine with psychedelics. If you're experiencing a negative headspace you can't get past and it's becoming problematic, benzos can be very valuable. I tripped VERY hard at a festival a couple of weeks ago and at some point I really got the fear bad, probably the worst it's ever happened and it happened out of nowhere because I've tripped hundreds of times over the past 10 years since I've experienced the fear at all. Anyway I realized I was about to lose my shit and I took 2mg of etizolam, and it pulled me out of it and I went back to having an amazing time, although I was MUCH less high. Which, that time, I needed to be. I was actually on phenibut as well, but something still triggered that anxiety attack, which the benzo interrupted very nicely.
So I guess I'm saying they both have their place, but they're different places.
But anyway, benzos like diazepam help more on a physical muscle tension level, but they do mute some aspects of the trip and reduce overall intensity. IMO benzos are better as a safety net to be utilized only when necessary, whereas phenibut is a great drug to combine with psychedelics. If you're experiencing a negative headspace you can't get past and it's becoming problematic, benzos can be very valuable. I tripped VERY hard at a festival a couple of weeks ago and at some point I really got the fear bad, probably the worst it's ever happened and it happened out of nowhere because I've tripped hundreds of times over the past 10 years since I've experienced the fear at all. Anyway I realized I was about to lose my shit and I took 2mg of etizolam, and it pulled me out of it and I went back to having an amazing time, although I was MUCH less high. Which, that time, I needed to be. I was actually on phenibut as well, but something still triggered that anxiety attack, which the benzo interrupted very nicely.
So I guess I'm saying they both have their place, but they're different places.
Doclad
Bluelighter
I get it.
You use it because they synergize with each other, not to appease the body burden. I agree that body burden is an "exudate" that goes from the inside out in many cases and that is related to psychology.
I usually take 5mg of Dizepan when I stumble on Triptamines because I have back pain and muscle tension because I do a lot of sport. It also keeps my blood pressure at bay. I use larger doses only when I want a trip to end.
5mg of Diazepan does not make the trip less intense. Everything is the dose.
I would like to have access to Phenibut. Is it a prescription medication? OTC? RC?
DocLad
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
In America it's sold totally openly as a dietary supplement. It's a prescription drug in Russia.
Doclad
Bluelighter
Could you describe a bit how affects phenibut in your travels? and what other drugs do you mix it with?
DocLad
DocLad
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
Actually take a read of my phenibut trip report which is really just an overview/usage guide, it'll say more than I would write out in a reply here: http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads...prehensive-Long-Term-Synopsis-and-Usage-Guide
Chips
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2008
- Messages
- 122
Full day boring train wagons of orgasmic hallucinogenic flu...
There are a lot of tensions, sweating... trying to get nap from time to time to recover for all theses tensions ... during which i got some nice dreaming visuals... i find them cold... quite as dissociative ones...
Not sure i will retry ...
Now i'm trying to kill it with benzo but this stuff is tough and fight back... it deserve it's warning about duration...
There are a lot of tensions, sweating... trying to get nap from time to time to recover for all theses tensions ... during which i got some nice dreaming visuals... i find them cold... quite as dissociative ones...
Not sure i will retry ...
Now i'm trying to kill it with benzo but this stuff is tough and fight back... it deserve it's warning about duration...
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Doclad
Bluelighter
I hope your experience ends well.
What amount have you taken? Tell us a little more please.
DocLad
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
I've said it before and I'll say it again, you really want to be doing something physical with DOC, it's not the drug to sit around the house with. Every time I take DOC and sit around, it makes me really uncomfortable. Go out and go on a hike or something, get out and socialize, do something. It channels the energy and makes the trip great.
Doclad
Bluelighter
I want to take advantage of this comment to not open a new thread.
Next weekend I plan to go with my wife (who is her birthday) to the Pyrenees. We want to trek through a mythical path surrounded by ancient stone through which incredible waterfalls descend. In summary, the place is perfect to disconnect during the day and walk through the mountain
My idea is to get up around 7 o'clock in the morning, have breakfast(we should?) and go there. I thought we could take a psychedelic to sharpen the senses and let ourselves be carried away by nature. I have never taken a psychedelic in these conditions, my experiences are limited to traveling at home or outside but always quiet in one place.
I have a good variety of substances but finally I have chosen to take 100ug of Eth-Lad or 2-3mg of DOC.
I know they have different profiles and I would like to know how I can take advantage of their differences in the best possible way.
I have some doubts that I want to expose:
1.The path is not very long, but it is uphill almost the entire journey. DOC and Eth-Lad must provide me with enough energy to face the road well? I would not like to feel defeated or fatigued as I sometimes feel with Tryptamines.
2. I worry about the summer temperature a little. We will hydrate all the time and we will go with the protected body, but between the exercise and the heat I think that leaving at 08h in the morning is a bit fair. Would you come out earlier? Any other recommendation?
3. Do you think Eth-Lad and DOC are suitable substances for this purpose? What do you think of the dose?
If you like to do Trekking when you take psychedelics, I would like you to gave me some good advice.
If you know any thread about it, link it here please.
DocLad
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Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
DOC is the best substance I know for hiking/outdoors stuff. It produces quite a bit of energy. It is, however, MUCH longer-lasting than whatever hike you're going to be doing, which I like personally, but something to be aware of. I took ETH-LAD for a hike once and it was good, but maybe less good than LSD (which is also a great hiking drug, but not as good as DOC, IMO). To me ETH-LAD is less of an energy-producer than LSD, and substantially less than DOC. But the duration is better. If you have other lysergamides, ALD-52/1p-LSD/LSD would be better for a hike, and after that, AL-LAD, before ETH-LAD. But if it were me, I'd go for the DOC. 
Doclad
Bluelighter
DOC is the best substance I know for hiking/outdoors stuff. It produces quite a bit of energy. It is, however, MUCH longer-lasting than whatever hike you're going to be doing, which I like personally, but something to be aware of. I took ETH-LAD for a hike once and it was good, but maybe less good than LSD (which is also a great hiking drug, but not as good as DOC, IMO). To me ETH-LAD is less of an energy-producer than LSD, and substantially less than DOC. But the duration is better. If you have other lysergamides, ALD-52/1p-LSD/LSD would be better for a hike, and after that, AL-LAD, before ETH-LAD. But if it were me, I'd go for the DOC.
Thanks for the response.
I am leaning slightly towards DOC, I feel that in some way it can be less demanding than Eth-Lad. I really want a long and contemplative trip, these last two months have changed many things in my life and I would like to enjoy the latest progress with a psychedelic and contact with nature.
A year ago that I dont take any psychedelic, so tolerance will be the least of the problems.
2.5mg would be a good bet right? I do not want to fall down any precipice. lol
Regarding the duration of DOC I have a couple of doubts:
1. When we reach the end of the path, there will be a lake with a beautiful lawn and flowers, some tourist shops and a Hotel. There will be people loitering nearby.
At the +4h mark in DOC (will I be at the peak?) We will have arrived at the destination. Is it difficult to interact with strangers? I guess it's something very personal, but since I've never taken psychedelics in a similar circumstance I'd like to have an opinion.
2. How stimulating is DOC towards the end? If we take DOC at 8 o'clock in the morning, will we sleep well at night?
I also have 1p-LSD and LSD if I change my mind.
DocLad
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I would dose 1.5-2mg, but I tend to be sensitive and cautious when it comes to dosing in public.
In regards to interacting with others at T+4, DOC is the only psychedelic that I can even come close to being around people in regular situations on. It will be much more comfortable on DOC than it would be on ETH-LAD.
Stimulation depends on the sensitivity of the individual, but personally I can't sleep until T+18hrs without benzos, and even with benzos, it can be tough to push through the stimulation if it's still occurring.
In regards to interacting with others at T+4, DOC is the only psychedelic that I can even come close to being around people in regular situations on. It will be much more comfortable on DOC than it would be on ETH-LAD.
Stimulation depends on the sensitivity of the individual, but personally I can't sleep until T+18hrs without benzos, and even with benzos, it can be tough to push through the stimulation if it's still occurring.
Doclad
Bluelighter
+18hrs?...wow...
Without a doubt, the duration of DOC could be a handicap.
What kind of stimulation are we talking about? For example, the residual stimulation of Hex-En, Nep or Amph is not something that I like too much ... they are summarized in grinding teeth, tightening the jaw, headaches, nervousness and complete lack of euphoria ... If the DOC's residual stimulation goes down this road, bad business.
If on the other hand it is a type of stimulation that continues accompanied by psychedelic effects (even if they are minimal) with a certain euphoria and desire to continue with the trip then it would be different.
DocLad
It's extremely nice, it's just long, and you're no longer really on the same wavelength as the peak was at all.
And, it's possibly even better than the trip itself. Hour 12+ is as Xorkoth has described it, total zen. I'm not sure I've experienced a more fully content state of consciousness than during hrs 12+ of DOC. You've come down from tripping but are now in a state of perfect self-love, love and care for others, and general positivity and enthusiasm for all of life, all of it.
Again, the issue with DOC isn't the resulting state of mind ala comedowns, but the sheer length of it's duration.
And, it's possibly even better than the trip itself. Hour 12+ is as Xorkoth has described it, total zen. I'm not sure I've experienced a more fully content state of consciousness than during hrs 12+ of DOC. You've come down from tripping but are now in a state of perfect self-love, love and care for others, and general positivity and enthusiasm for all of life, all of it.
Again, the issue with DOC isn't the resulting state of mind ala comedowns, but the sheer length of it's duration.
Doclad
Bluelighter
I understand what you mean, it sounds very good to me. I suspect that the inconvenience may be the fatigue accumulated after a long walk + DOC, but we can return to the hostel by rack train if necessary.
I will take Diazepan, THC and Oxycodone for the return.
DocLad
I will take Diazepan, THC and Oxycodone for the return.
DocLad
Hilopsilo
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2016
- Messages
- 615
Seriously onto something there! Certainly thought about this before. Uncomfortable/awkward set/settings have certainly given me some reeeeaaalllyy strange body feelings when I'm tripping. Camping trip last week we took our stuff and had forgotten to pay for the campsite and register our vehicles. So on the comeup, the (very chill and kind) attendant lady came to talk with us, get license plate #'s, give us the spiel on fire and bear safety, and I remember sitting their with my shades on thinking "holy shit you are so nice and chill but I am in no state to be having this conversation". I could hardly stand still, as soon as the exchange was finally over I just took off running cause I had all this pent up anxious energy that just HAD to go somewhere.
I find it can happen the other way around as well, not go off topic from DOC, but mushrooms sometimes give me this heavy bodyload where my stomach is all achey, nauseous, and I end up couch locked sort of left to my own thoughts, immobilized almost. This definitely puts a hamper on my mental state/attitude during the trip. When I'm all stomach-sick and heavy feeling on the couch or laying down, I'm more likely to think thoughts like "ugh why'd I do this" than if my whole body feels light as a feather on LSD and I've got the dexterity to climb a tree or easily and comfortably change my perspective/setting if need be. Although, the ONE time I had a "bad" trip on LSD i remember the bodyload being incredibly unpleasant, whereas in every other situation it's orgasmic.
It almost creates a feedback loop in extreme scenarios; heavy bodyload -> mental distress over the bodyload -> exacerbates bodyload/draws my focus to it -> and so on... Chicken or the egg situation though to begin with.
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
DOC definitely lasts at least 18 hours, and at T+4 you'll be peaking. I would probably take it an hour before the hike starts. However, DOC, for me, is quite pro-social. I tend to spend the trip talking animatedly about all manner of interesting things. If I run into other people, I feel confident. It's a very mentally focused psychedelic, not disorienting, it makes me feel like I'm good at doing things. After about T+10 to T+12 it kicks into second gear, where I basically feel like I'm in the perfect flow state, very euphoric, capable, motivated. Kind of like dextro-amphetamine but so much better, and without any of the drawbacks of stimulants. It does make it impossible to sleep though, T+18 is as soon as I'd expect to be able to sleep, unless you take a benzo to knock yourself out. Alcohol also mixes very well with the second stage of DOC, truly a nice combo.
But yeah, DOC is very long-lasting... don't underestimate the duration. The peak is from like T+3 to T+6 or 7 with a slow drop-off after that.
But yeah, DOC is very long-lasting... don't underestimate the duration. The peak is from like T+3 to T+6 or 7 with a slow drop-off after that.
Doclad
Bluelighter
Thanks for the reply.
The peak does not seem very long...
By the way, DOC causes nausea of some kind? The road is long and we want to have breakfast. I have Ondansetron in case I need to avoid nausea.
What is your experience?
DocLad
The peak does not seem very long...
By the way, DOC causes nausea of some kind? The road is long and we want to have breakfast. I have Ondansetron in case I need to avoid nausea.
What is your experience?
DocLad