its got almost no side effects. really. it was all mental, no physical. honestly i didnt even have jaw tension. and shulgin is known to dose to just until he can feel effects. if i do this stuff again it will be ~50mg all at once, maybe with a bit of 2c-i for visuals and energy. probably in the snow.
Phenethylamines The Big & Dandy Allylescaline Thread
- Thread starter Hallucinogenius
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sn23
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The classic (extreme/very shocking) counter-example is thalidomide. Two "versions" of this substance exist. They are made up of exactly the same numbers and types of atoms and all atoms are connected in a very similar way, so that one version is the same as the mirror image of the other version (just like a right hand and a left hand). This is called chirality. They are almost identical, that is, much closer than mescaline and allylescaline. One version of thalidomide is a teratogen and causes severe adverse effects when ingested during pregnancy. The other is a sedative and antiemetic.
I'm certainly not implying anything like these side effects for allylescaline! My point is, that structural similarity is an indicator for similar biological effects but it is not always strictly complied with. Unforeseen effects could possibly occur!
Higher potency can certainly lead to narrower 'safe dosage window'. This is just not known at the moment for allylescaline. It seems unreasonable to just rely on this assumption, it is your health at risk.
Don't want to sound rude or offend anybody. Just wanted to throw in a bit of harm reduction resp. risk awareness.
I'm all for unlocking this interesting substance's full potential, as you say DylanG204, but this is best done in small steps beginning from small doses and not relying on assumptions that rest on unknown variables.
Stay safe
MrDiamondFDC
Bluelighter
Today is my 29th birthday so I'm thinking about taking 100 milligrams of Ally and the last of my MXE this evening and hitting the water for some early morning fishing on the comedown.
The classic (extreme/very shocking) counter-example is thalidomide. Two "versions" of this substance exist. They are made up of exactly the same numbers and types of atoms and all atoms are connected in a very similar way, so that one version is the same as the mirror image of the other version (just like a right hand and a left hand). This is called chirality. They are almost identical, that is, much closer than mescaline and allylescaline. One version of thalidomide is a teratogen and causes severe adverse effects when ingested during pregnancy. The other is a sedative and antiemetic.
I'm certainly not implying anything like these side effects for allylescaline! My point is, that structural similarity is an indicator for similar biological effects but it is not always strictly complied with. Unforeseen effects could possibly occur!
Higher potency can certainly lead to narrower 'safe dosage window'. This is just not known at the moment for allylescaline. It seems unreasonable to just rely on this assumption, it is your health at risk.
Don't want to sound rude or offend anybody. Just wanted to throw in a bit of harm reduction resp. risk awareness.
I'm all for unlocking this interesting substance's full potential, as you say DylanG204, but this is best done in small steps beginning from small doses and not relying on assumptions that rest on unknown variables.
Stay safe
The story of thalidomide is always tragic but fascinating to tell, so nice one on that. But I think you are confusing people here talking about isomers. Because that is what thalidomide's issue was about and somehow it was not seen in trials and became a disaster. One of those things that takes a long-term observation or study to become apparent.
Allylescaline is not so new, but not widely used either. It may cause birth defects at doses even lower at psychedelic doses, and it might be both existing isomers that do it. The topic is irrelevant.
As a reminder to non-chemists: if nothing is defined about a compound, like S and R ketamine or dextro vs. levo amphetamine... then chiral compounds are a mix of 50%/50% isomers. ((There are also chiral compounds with more than one point of chirality, their stereo-isomerism would make a normally occuring, racemic (evenly mixed isomers) compound 25%/25%/25%/25% is 4 isomers exist.)) But just remembering the 50-50 part, is enough.
Now about mescaline toxicity: I think this is basically because the doses are so high and it is just too much too handle for the liver. I don't know why exactly, for example a compound like phenibut or piracetam is consumed in multiple gram quantities by people, etc. I just heard it is.
Allylescaline being so similar to mescaline but more potent in the brain because of it's actions on receptors... based on limited information I would say it would not be expected to show analogous toxicity as mescaline to the liver. So how potent in action it is, is here irrelevant to how the liver handles it.
Remember NBOMe compounds: they are not free of toxicity, but what is nice about them is that in the brain they are so selective for receptors... but if a liver is mostly concerned with either chemicals that are toxic because of their poisonous structure or degradation products or because of the sheer amount of it overwhelming and flooding it, then NBOMe's having such a low dose is in all probability a good thing as far as the liver goes (and kidneys as well).
Eating too much salt, using too much GHB (and the sodium ingestion that comes along with it)... that's an example of how everything can be a disturbance (toxic) to the body as long as the amounts are high enough to have effects of certain bodily functions. So as a rule of thumb: lower doses of things are better for the organs.
But for NBOMe's problems can come from their still being active and the causal consequences of the activation of receptors which is why they are still to be considered with much care.
So back to allylescaline and mescaline: if mescaline toxicity has little to do with what happens in the brain after taking it but more with the amount of milligrams that have to be metabolized and we have no reason to think that allylescaline is any differently, then it does not bear the same type of risks. However for all we know, the action of allylescaline on receptors can have quite different toxic consequences for the body... or the presence of that allyloxy group might be a problem, coming from metabolism of the group to a toxic breakdown product.
In other words toxicity of AL is a question mark but I did not mention mescaline toxicity to warn you about going to 150 mg with AL.
What I am just wondering about is how fantastic mescaline can get before it becomes a liver issue. Well 750 mg would be more than double than my 330 mg, but no idea what that means. It all depends on the dose-response curvature. Which is what I was asking about... does it feel linear like with LSD or steep like with 2C-E? Anyone with high dose mescaline experience is still welcome to fill that in for me.
Anyway sn23: sorry if I stepped on your point, I see I repeated some things you already explained or mentioned.
What have been your previous dosage trials with Allylescaline and what does you want to make your dose 100 mg other than it being your birthday? Happy birthday to you, in advance.
But if you are in fact tripling your dose without there being information about the results, I just want to warn you that this is an irresponsible plan, ranging from potentially unneccessary to potentially dangerous.Of course the entire 'range' of potential does include positive results, if it turns out that way: enjoy it.
But:
![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
Then again, around 50 mg seems to be okay and it does sound gentle so may I am overreacting.
I'd just rather see this community taking steps of +15 or +20 mg instead of doubling. Act responsible.
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Incunabula
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100 mg's? That trip report I'd like to read! It does sound a bit reckless though, probably not lethal, but who know's?
I've only taken AL once, so I don't know about the dose/response curve, but I remember that I for some reason thought that I was glad I hadn't taken more than 50 mg. Then again, there's probably some people who's going to have high natural tolerance to it, like other PEA's.
As some people already mentioned, Allylescaline is all about the greens and blues and magenta. Not overly visual, but quite pretty actually.
I've only taken AL once, so I don't know about the dose/response curve, but I remember that I for some reason thought that I was glad I hadn't taken more than 50 mg. Then again, there's probably some people who's going to have high natural tolerance to it, like other PEA's.
As some people already mentioned, Allylescaline is all about the greens and blues and magenta. Not overly visual, but quite pretty actually.
ALLYLESCALINE 50mg
Not much too say about this compound , within an hour i had a mild stimulation, by 2 hours effects peaked.
I had no mood elevation , i did not feel good or any sort of euphuria though i was calm, (havent done mdma in 5 months)
very slight patterning over objects not very noticable, diolated pupils ,
Not very interesting at all. I will try it again in a higher dose, or maybe with mdma.. combining it with 2ci seemed too
increase side effects, i rate this chem 1.5 out of 5
Not much too say about this compound , within an hour i had a mild stimulation, by 2 hours effects peaked.
I had no mood elevation , i did not feel good or any sort of euphuria though i was calm, (havent done mdma in 5 months)
very slight patterning over objects not very noticable, diolated pupils ,
Not very interesting at all. I will try it again in a higher dose, or maybe with mdma.. combining it with 2ci seemed too
increase side effects, i rate this chem 1.5 out of 5
twelvesevndi
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- Jan 21, 2011
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maybe you should include, as a disclaimer, what you just posted in another thread:
6 months ago you went on a 2 month binge during wich you consumed 300 tabs of LSD and you haven't been able to get a good trip out of any substance since
6 months ago you went on a 2 month binge during wich you consumed 300 tabs of LSD and you haven't been able to get a good trip out of any substance since
imgoneblind
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TLDR; Consumed 25 mg of AL, tripped for approximately 8 hours and was able to sleep fine. My dosage may have been small, but considering the circumstances it was still a fun experience having "static" in the background. To the experienced tripper wanting to transverse dimensions, this compound may be too subtle. To anyone wishing to explore the world around them in a fun light, without anxiety, this chem might be right for you!
Prenotes: 20 yo/m/average physical condition. I didn't have anything to eat 4 hours prior to dosing. I also took 25 mg of DPH approximately half an hour before the trip to ease any potential nausea.
Dose: 25 mg of Allylescaline HCL
T 00:00 (15:15) -Take one capsule containing 25 mg of AL. I feel a bit nervous about the coming trip, as it is supposedly a long lasting compound, I do not have any access to any benzos/weed, and I will be around my family. I have however been around them before in countless different states of mind. I have also read that this substance is gentle, and thus can be ignored. I am aiming for a (++) at the most.
T 00:18 -Slight hints something is happening. I have a tingling feeling that I commonly get with other PEAs during the come up. Feeling a bit chilly, but the AC is turned up very high.
T 01:00 -The AL is definitely present now, and is continuing to grow. Slight stomach discomfort and my throat is feeling like it is lined with a thick wall of mucus. I get the same feeling from 2C's as well.
T 01:18 -Visuals are there but very mild. Physical side effects noted before are still there and growing in discomfort. CEVs are colourful and include geometric/Persian carpet patterning. I believe that I am still fit to keep some degree of composure.
T 01:45 -Just had a small bit to eat, but I am still hungry. I feel as if I could be from an assembly line chain going into my mouth and continue to be satisfied with the constant food entering my mouth. yum. The mucusy sensation is still very present.
-So far I feel as if this chem can be compared to a more subtle 2C. There are a lot of striking similarities, AL is just less in your face. This may be because my dose was small however. At this point I have definitely plateaued, and I do not feel that the AL is interfering with my thought process whatsoever.
T 04:00 -Just returned from a hour and a half bike ride. Nature was simply beautiful to look at. My sense of smell was heightened, and colours stood out more. I did not have any obvious visuals. My mental state was that of reflection on some past events that I do not wish to get into detail about, but to summarize I felt most thankful to those who were least likely to help me out in my situation and I feel resentment to those whose job it is to actually help me out.
-As I stepped back inside, my visuals did become more apparent but still remained somewhat subtle. In other words, the just weren't in my face and I could ignore them if I so choose, but I could certainly see them.
T 06:50 -The effects are clearly decreasing in effect now. Overall I feel like this is a light version of 2C-E, but with none of the neutral feelings. Again the OEVs where very subtle to say the least, but the CEVs completely made up for it. I truly believe that at higher doses, this chem can become more visual to the open eye. I will have to save that experience for another day however.
T 08:45 -It is now midnight and I am calling it quite and going to bed. At this point I no longer have any real effects apart from the mucus feeling in my throat throughout the whole trip.
Next day: It didn't take me an overly long time to get some sleep. I believe the fact that my dose was so small may have had something to do with that however, but seeing as I have no hypnotics to force myself to sleep, I played it safe. Although this experience was very subtle, and for the most part truly only a plus one experience, I still look forward to exploring this compound again somewhere in the range of 35-40 mg. Finally, I did not get any hangover the next day as other have said.
Prenotes: 20 yo/m/average physical condition. I didn't have anything to eat 4 hours prior to dosing. I also took 25 mg of DPH approximately half an hour before the trip to ease any potential nausea.
Dose: 25 mg of Allylescaline HCL
T 00:00 (15:15) -Take one capsule containing 25 mg of AL. I feel a bit nervous about the coming trip, as it is supposedly a long lasting compound, I do not have any access to any benzos/weed, and I will be around my family. I have however been around them before in countless different states of mind. I have also read that this substance is gentle, and thus can be ignored. I am aiming for a (++) at the most.
T 00:18 -Slight hints something is happening. I have a tingling feeling that I commonly get with other PEAs during the come up. Feeling a bit chilly, but the AC is turned up very high.
T 01:00 -The AL is definitely present now, and is continuing to grow. Slight stomach discomfort and my throat is feeling like it is lined with a thick wall of mucus. I get the same feeling from 2C's as well.
T 01:18 -Visuals are there but very mild. Physical side effects noted before are still there and growing in discomfort. CEVs are colourful and include geometric/Persian carpet patterning. I believe that I am still fit to keep some degree of composure.
T 01:45 -Just had a small bit to eat, but I am still hungry. I feel as if I could be from an assembly line chain going into my mouth and continue to be satisfied with the constant food entering my mouth. yum. The mucusy sensation is still very present.
-So far I feel as if this chem can be compared to a more subtle 2C. There are a lot of striking similarities, AL is just less in your face. This may be because my dose was small however. At this point I have definitely plateaued, and I do not feel that the AL is interfering with my thought process whatsoever.
T 04:00 -Just returned from a hour and a half bike ride. Nature was simply beautiful to look at. My sense of smell was heightened, and colours stood out more. I did not have any obvious visuals. My mental state was that of reflection on some past events that I do not wish to get into detail about, but to summarize I felt most thankful to those who were least likely to help me out in my situation and I feel resentment to those whose job it is to actually help me out.
-As I stepped back inside, my visuals did become more apparent but still remained somewhat subtle. In other words, the just weren't in my face and I could ignore them if I so choose, but I could certainly see them.
T 06:50 -The effects are clearly decreasing in effect now. Overall I feel like this is a light version of 2C-E, but with none of the neutral feelings. Again the OEVs where very subtle to say the least, but the CEVs completely made up for it. I truly believe that at higher doses, this chem can become more visual to the open eye. I will have to save that experience for another day however.
T 08:45 -It is now midnight and I am calling it quite and going to bed. At this point I no longer have any real effects apart from the mucus feeling in my throat throughout the whole trip.
Next day: It didn't take me an overly long time to get some sleep. I believe the fact that my dose was so small may have had something to do with that however, but seeing as I have no hypnotics to force myself to sleep, I played it safe. Although this experience was very subtle, and for the most part truly only a plus one experience, I still look forward to exploring this compound again somewhere in the range of 35-40 mg. Finally, I did not get any hangover the next day as other have said.
very important info here, a few other reports on this board say ~30mg is a good amount. keep in mind this is a very gentle psych, not mind blowing like LSD
Incunabula
Bluelighter
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- Dec 10, 2010
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What's the question again? This either belongs in the Allylescaline thread or trip reports forum. Why do you insist on making more work for the mods?
Regarding all comments : 98% = novice comments regarding the chemistry of this molecule without a true knowledge about this RC + very few trip experiments about this RC who have really understood the first question --> thanks to these few people (thanks imgoneblind,...)
unfortunately this RC seems to be a true shit in terms of effects.
For sure definitely nothing to do with Mescaline and the best 2C-X or the best tryptamines
unfortunately this RC seems to be a true shit in terms of effects.
For sure definitely nothing to do with Mescaline and the best 2C-X or the best tryptamines
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any thoughts on combining a small dose of allylescaline with a san pedro tea or extract?
would this be a worthwhile experiment?
a safe experiment? wasteful?
or could there be something worthwhile in the combination? i haven't had a chance to play with AL yet, but i'm wondering what folks who have (that liked it) think it is useful for, besides a mellow glow.
would this be a worthwhile experiment?
a safe experiment? wasteful?
or could there be something worthwhile in the combination? i haven't had a chance to play with AL yet, but i'm wondering what folks who have (that liked it) think it is useful for, besides a mellow glow.
Bagseed
Bluelighter
has anyone who tried it taken more than say 45mg? i don't suggest anyone to take a huge dose of this, but is anyone "working his way up"? since mescaline's dose is very high, maybe the suggested dose from shulgin (for AL) is a bit on the low side?
IamMe90
Bluelighter
All the TRs of this sound vastly less interesting than 2c-b, though. IDK, sounds pretty shitty to me, not as if it would impossible to have good experiences on it, but doesn't seem worth pursuing/buying, especially since as I recall it's pretty expensive.
I'm suddenly wondering if there is a special quality that enhancers may have, which is subtle but unmistakable and not the same if substituted with a threshold dose of a more potent psychedelic... or instead that is a load of crock, and like IamMe90 suggested this is just not a winner.
And I'm not even saying that I know or suspect that AL is an 'enhancer'. Fck, if you'd ask me for an example of an enhancer as opposed to a psychedelic, even that is tricky... maybe it is what 2C-T-21 sounds like from reports??
And I'm not even saying that I know or suspect that AL is an 'enhancer'. Fck, if you'd ask me for an example of an enhancer as opposed to a psychedelic, even that is tricky... maybe it is what 2C-T-21 sounds like from reports??
IamMe90
Bluelighter
It is hard to draw a clear line between "enhancers" and "potent psychedelics," I think.. I mean, personally LSD has functioned as the most remarkable enhancer of all... it has served to potentiate every phen I've taken it with to an unreal degree, potentiating all of the best attributes of the drugs without adding any negatives. At the same time, it's quite a potent and psychedelic drug on its own. I assume many drugs have multiple uses like that.