The Big & Dandy 2C-P Thread

[Delta-9-THC]

Yea this is the first I have heard of it. I haven't noticed any of my chems becoming more clumpy or anything.

As you said, the general accuracy of everyones dosing suggests that any difference is negligible.

 

[Delsyd]

merged with The Big and Dandy 2C-P Thread

 

[PsychedelicLover]

I did 10mg 2c-p and 4 hits of LSD, I am only 120lbs and 6'2. The two mixed synergize very well together, and 10mg is a perfect dose for me. I posted my TR in the TR forum.

 

[ASquishyApple]

so i've heard that 2c-e is the closest to LSD of the 2c-x's (not that its similar to LSD just the closest) and 2c-p is supposed to be similar to 2c-e but more potent and with a longer duration. how does 2c-p compare to LSD? is it more or less similar to LSD than 2c-e?

 

[PsychedelicLover]

The visuals are different from LSD. I took my LSD 2 hours before I dosed my 10mg 2cp, and I went from the normal acid visuals to visuals I have never experienced before. Everything looked like painted art with highlights of rainbow colors everywhere. I didn't get morphing or fractals until after the peak, during the comedown.

I posted a TR if you want to check it out. I will be trying 2cp alone sometime soon and I will post another TR.

 

[psood0nym]

2C-E and 2C-P Differences

Those who have used both 2C-E and 2C-P: In your experience, is 2C-P either more cognitive or sensuously intense than 2C-E? I read through the thread and there still doesn't look to be very much consensus on this, even after Shambles asked a few pages back, so I figured I'd ask again.

Cognitive effect examples: thought loops, "big picture" thinking, strange associations between ideas, etc.

Sensual effects: body size distortions, seemingly increased awareness of body, synesthesia, etc.

I experienced 2C-P once years ago at 9 mg(I think), and was surprised to find it a warm and gentle euphoric drug with very little in the way of cognitive or visual effects--a very sunshiny and carefree day at the beach feeling like TMA-6. It was very enjoyable, but not what I expected at all. I'm tempted to write that experience off as a fluke since I get such powerful effects from the chemically similar 2C-E, though, and try a different batch. But I'm not sure from what I've read that 2C-P is different enough from 2C-E in the ways I care about to warrant it.

 

[Propyl Power]

^It's a tricky question; there's a lot of cross-over... I guess I would be inclined to say that 2C-P is more sensuously intense, but would not want that to imply that it is therefore less cognitive than 2C-E, because that certainly is not the case.

I think maybe they're roughly equal in cognitive and sensual capacity, but manifest these effects from different perspectives. For me, Ethyl seems icier, more twisted, kinky and in-your-face, always ready to crack the whip... while Propyl seems more spacious & transparent, more conducive to 'free', 'unguided' exploration, deeply erotic but not particularly kinky... much friendlier, to be blunt.

And yet I am very uncomfortable with characterizing 2C-P as a 'friendly' psychedelic because someone will probably misinterpret that and gobble 16 mg only to have their head blown off...

 

[|>R()|)!G/-\|_]

Although I don't know every vendor or chemist on the planet, when I suddenly see a prevalence of posts or TR's of (relatively) exotic/not normally widely available chems (read 2c-p/2ct7 vs 2ce/2ci) from people who are not friends of chemists it raises a red flag. It tells me that perhaps a newish rc vendor popped up with a long list of designer phens and trypts which may or may not be accurately labeled.

In my experience, many customers of those types of vendors are well-meaning, sell-intentioned but relatively inexperienced psychonauts. By inexperienced I mean although they may have eaten LSD, shrooms, DXM, 2c blah blah blah, they are unable to qualitatively tell the difference between a 2c-p and 2c-e experience or a 2ct2 and 2ct7 experience; not because they are unintelligent but simply because their limited frame of reference is based solely upon other peoples' TR's.

In short, I would love to see the current crop of 2c-p and 2ct7 *snip* be reagent-tested for authenticity. It seems strange that as potent a chemical as 2c-p would require a tester to take amounts over 10mg through any ROA just to achieve significant effect. Ironically, 15 mg of 2c-e would produce a significant effect that, when combined with a limited frame of reference, could fool somebody into paying inflated prices for an effective yet "not-as-advertised" chemical. When that happens, the potential for danger multiplies exponentially.

Has anyone reporting 2c-p experiences here tested their substance or gotten it directly out of the glass?

 

[Propyl Power]

^ Well speaking for myself, my 2C-P was acquired from *a* professional source *some time ago* I don't know anything about the quality *of other more recent sources* 2C-P.

 

[Shambles]

Straying too close to vendor/source discussion here, fellas. I happen to have my doubts about the recent batches of 2C-P too as the doses mentioned just don't sound right at all but keep it non-specific - preferably avoiding any mention of vendors at all even "subtle" mentions.

 

[psood0nym]

^It's a tricky question; there's a lot of cross-over... I guess I would be inclined to say that 2C-P is more sensuously intense, but would not want that to imply that it is therefore less cognitive than 2C-E, because that certainly is not the case.

I think maybe they're roughly equal in cognitive and sensual capacity, but manifest these effects from different perspectives. For me, Ethyl seems icier, more twisted, kinky and in-your-face, always ready to crack the whip... while Propyl seems more spacious & transparent, more conducive to 'free', 'unguided' exploration, deeply erotic but not particularly kinky... much friendlier, to be blunt.

And yet I am very uncomfortable with characterizing 2C-P as a 'friendly' psychedelic because someone will probably misinterpret that and gobble 16 mg only to have their head blown off...

Thanks Propyl Power. That was helpful.

Hopefully there will be a few more comments, though I understand the number of people who have tried both is probably pretty small... Despite its characterization in the preponderance of reports as neutral and analytical, 2C-E is an intensely emotional and sensuous drug for me. I'm mostly interested in 2C-P because it sounds like it could potentially provide a sharper cognitive edge than 2C-E, which means it might have some unique utility for me. For you, 2C-P sounds similar to the way 2C-E is for me already, so--especially when also considering the "physical disaster" comment in PIKHAL--I'm more hesitant to pick it up.

 

[SpiralOut]

Although I don't know every vendor or chemist on the planet, when I suddenly see a prevalence of posts or TR's of (relatively) exotic/not normally widely available chems (read 2c-p/2ct7 vs 2ce/2ci) from people who are not friends of chemists it raises a red flag. It tells me that perhaps a newish rc vendor popped up with a long list of designer phens and trypts which may or may not be accurately labeled.

In my experience, many customers of those types of vendors are well-meaning, sell-intentioned but relatively inexperienced psychonauts. By inexperienced I mean although they may have eaten LSD, shrooms, DXM, 2c blah blah blah, they are unable to qualitatively tell the difference between a 2c-p and 2c-e experience or a 2ct2 and 2ct7 experience; not because they are unintelligent but simply because their limited frame of reference is based solely upon other peoples' TR's.

In short, I would love to see the current crop of 2c-p and 2ct7 *snip* be reagent-tested for authenticity. It seems strange that as potent a chemical as 2c-p would require a tester to take amounts over 10mg through any ROA just to achieve significant effect. Ironically, 15 mg of 2c-e would produce a significant effect that, when combined with a limited frame of reference, could fool somebody into paying inflated prices for an effective yet "not-as-advertised" chemical. When that happens, the potential for danger multiplies exponentially.

Has anyone reporting 2c-p experiences here tested their substance or gotten it directly out of the glass?

Obviously you have to take it with a grain of salt, but several vendors I've seen out there now actually have their stuff tested and the results posted. Personally, I couldn't make heads or tails out of what those funky graphs said, but it seems like they're actually making an attempt to verify their products now along with its purity.

I suppose the only way to really know is to cook it yourself or personally know the chemist. Unfortunately, not an option for the large majority of us.

Surprisingly enough, the vendors I've run across that have been marketing new RCs have them listed at relatively equal prices to chems that have been a staple for a long time.

 

[|>R()|)!G/-\|_]

Obviously you have to take it with a grain of salt, but several vendors I've seen out there now actually have their stuff tested and the results posted. Personally, I couldn't make heads or tails out of what those funky graphs said, but it seems like they're actually making an attempt to verify their products now along with its purity.

It is not terribly difficult to locate a GCMS in PDF for most chemicals. It is easy to post said PDF on a site and pass it off as a certificate of authenticity.

I suppose the only way to really know is to cook it yourself or personally know the chemist.

Not true. Please refer to the middle of http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/mdma/mdma_faq_testing_kits.shtml#tell for the sake of harm reduction. It will tell you test kit reactions for a large range of compounds. Also, for what it is worth, Tranzystate from http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost.php?p=2590407&postcount=17 posts

I have personally tested many many different drugs with the marquis reagent and the results are as follows:

Ampetamine/Methamphetamine - red/orange
MDA/MDMA/MDEA - purple/black
2C-T-7/2C-T-2 - salmon red
2C-I/2C-B - lime green
2C-E/2C-P - no change
4HO-DET - olive brown

Where there is a will there is a way. Please do not make haste to taste a chemical that could lay you to waste.

 

[SpiralOut]

Wow. I absolutely did not know you could test RCs with the Marquis agent. Learn something new everyday, right?

Though I have found that having a very accurate scale, starting small, and being in the right setting with someone to keep a look-out has always worked for keeping me safe.

 

[Listening]

I have personally tested many many different drugs with the marquis reagent and the results are as follows:

...
2C-E/2C-P - no change
...

D'oh. Is it possible to distinguish between these two with either Mandelin or Mecke?

 

[BehindMind]

With Mecke:

2C-E - yellow/green.


Don't know about 2C-P though....

 

[naura]

Regarding earlier discussion on snorting 2c-p:

I recently did 12mg oral, and (at another time), 12mg snorted. The oral trip was wonderful, taking about 3 hours to come on, and then plateauing for a long, long time. The snorted trip shortened the comeup, consistent with notes in PiHkAL, and produced a shorter, more intense experience, with the peak much earlier.

Though this latter experience was more intense, and there were some physical discomforts (pain from snorting, nausea) not present with the oral route, the toxicity that shulgin reported (16mg = physical disaster) was NOT found in accordance with the statement some on here have made that 'snorting a 2c requires half the dose, so snorting 10mg = 20mg oral = you're probably dead'. The usual considerations apply: this is only one data point with an unresearched chemical, the purity of this batch could be suspect, etc.

When I first snorted 2c-p, it was after doing a good amount of research on this site, finding reports that indicated that snorting was more intense but didn't produce the physical effects of a doubled oral dose, and only then doing so. I'm not recommending that anyone EVER snort 2c-p, since it burns like a bitch and an oral experience is more rewarding anyway, but at least it doesn't seem to be the case that snorting a dose produces the physical effects of twice that dosage, orally (which you have to watch out for with 2c-p, considering that whole 'physical disaster' thing. My friend took 15mg orally (stupid IMO, since this is really 15 +/- 1mg at least, which is getting into dangerous territory) and he reported being on the verge of discomfort and physical problems, much more so than my friend who snorted 12mg.

 

[greenmeanies]

good info, thanks for your data points

while it's not good to rationalize dangerous choices, we must recall that many of the reports in pihkal are from very different people, and set/setting/stomach contents/etc are not included in the short reports. the book is filled with people who are highly sensitive right next to people who require 2x the dose. some people get physical distress, others don't. obviously it is safest to assume that you will have an allergic/adverse reaction, and gradually work your way up.

is there any other info on "16mg = physical disaster" ? i've only read the part of pihkal that's available online, is there elaboration in the other half of the book?

 

[TheAzo]

I keep seeing references to that one instance of "16mg = physical disaster" in shulgin....

Yet, no other phen generally produces that effect from a 50% overshoot of the intended dose. Many people seem to conclude that "2C-P is more dose sensitive than other 2C's", based on PiHKAL's handfull of entries, since there is so little data on it (orders of magnitude less than 2C-B/E/I/T2/T7).

Is it not possible that the "physical disaster" was a fluke? Maybe he'd eaten something that interacted (we know how much of a disaster phens are with MAOI's, and that some foods and herbs contain weak MAOIs. Weak MAOI + a high dose of a phen could have let to a bad reaction). HELL! Maybe he just had a horrible trip and freaked the fuck out and got unnamed physical symptoms (why the heck arent they listed?) due to a panic-attack from a bad trip!
Are there ANY other reports of undefined physical disasters with 2C-P?
Are there not also reports of intensely unpleasant experiences that involve the subject convinced of terrible physical effects, from other phenethylamines?

My point here is not "go ahead and start doing huge doses of 2C-P", but i think there may be an exaggerated perception of the dose-response sensitivity of 2C-P. 2C-E and 2C-I will also produce highly unpleasant physical or perceived-physical effects in some individuals at high doses or in bad set/settings. If a normal dose of 2C-P is 10-12mg, and a normal dose of 2C-E is 18-20, 16mg of 2C-P would be like 27-30 mg of 2C-E---which is fine for some people but too much for most.

Luckily, this compound is now (for who-knows-how-long) reasonably available, so reports are filtering in and we should be getting a better idea of whether it's dose response curve is particularly sensitive or not.

 

[Propyl Power]

Unfortunately, I can't recall where I read this - it may have been some forum or other - but apparently someone asked Shulgin for clarification on the 16 mg 'physical disaster' comment and I think his response was that the girl who had taken it was reliving some kind of traumatic repressed memory, and maybe struggling against it? So if that's the case it sounds like there's a significant psychosomatic component involved in that 'physical disaster'. And of course both 2C-E & 2C-P often communicate psychosomatically.

But again this is totally anecdotal, I have no idea if it's the truth or not.