Synthetic Mescaline

[Ismene]

Read some bios of Hunter Thompson some time and you'll see how the real thing lingered in certain select circles for years after scheduling.

How seriously do you take Hunter Thompson tho? Do you really believe him when he says he saw "bats" flying around his car after dropping mescaline?

Havn't you ever thought he said "mescaline" because all the kids were taking LSD and he wanted to sound more hip?

But above 400mg of hcl or 200mcg of LSD I start to talk to the goddess for spells during the peak and such and I wouldn't recommend as much to a neophyte in a public setting.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one then, everyone I've ever known try it has said it was nowhere near as psychedelic as a high dose of LSD.

If you read "The secret cheif" - about a guy who did psychedelic therapy with hundreds of people in the 70's he says "Most people don't even turn on until 500mg". In his experience 500mg of mescaline equated to about 3.75g of mushrooms.

One could buy it legally from chemical supply houses in the United States.

Could you buy psychedelics in the states? Didn't Huxley and Osmond have to send off to Switzerland for the mescaline? Leary had to send off for his psilocybin to Sandoz at Switzerland - and even that was becoming more and more difficult by the early-mid 60's which was part of the reason why he switched to LSD. If it was that easy to buy mescaline you'd think he would've been using that too.

there were many ways of ordering it and it was plentiful FOR CONNECTED HEADS.

Strange you never hear about Leary ever using it at Millbrook tho. Only ever heard of him using psilocybin ordered from Sandoz and LSD from Hollingsworth.

 

[Ismene]

I guess a san pedro trip is different than pure mesc but personally i would not claim it to be any gentler than dmt or mushrooms, but that could be because i have alot more experience with these drugs...

Lsd for me is like candy, i can behave better on acid than on weed.

That's very strange tho - most people don't find high dose LSD easier than marijuana.

 

[Ismene]

It's different for everyone.

Nah, most people are going to find high dose LSD more psychedelic. Just like most people will find oral DMT more psychedelic than mushrooms.

 

[sekio]

There are few individuals that seem to respond extrordinarily bad to cannabinoids and repeated use only seems to reinforce the paranoia about bad trips. Full agonists like JWH-xxx especially. I would surmise that not all of these people would be as "against" LSD - it's a totally different experience.

Back on topic, synthetic mescaline is a thing, but it's pretty much the Baked Alaska of psychedelics, you need to know a well-connected chemist. It's 10x easier to get mescaline out of cactus tea.

I do recall someone who has their shit posted all over Rhodium - Eleusis(?) was it who got fucked over with a MDMA lab and essentially openly admitted he was making mescaline as well. And it's not like the synthesis is totally uknown, either, it's in PiHKAL and it starts from fucking vanillin.

Most mescaline these days will be natural product extracted from cactus or fools trying to sell you 2c-x.

 

[atara]

The synthesis of mescaline has definitely been achieved clandestinely. It just isn't very potent and thus isn't preferred among dealers because of the large quantities you'd have to deal with for less profit.

Though, a simple test -- if you're getting powder from anyone who is at all honest, just ask "how much should I take?" Mescaline doses are way larger than those of any other popular psychedelic except DPT, and DPT can sell itself.

 

[Help?!?!]

Nah, most people are going to find high dose LSD more psychedelic. Just like most people will find oral DMT more psychedelic than mushrooms.

Why do you always make such hefty claims(maybe you don't but its all to often I see things like this from you it seems...)? I too am counted among the people who would say that mescaline is every bit as heavy duty a psychedelic as LSD. I hate claiming one is stronger than the other because it becomes a jumbled mess like this thread is becoming(how can you even really compare their strengths when most psychedelics have strengths that lay in corners opposite of the other? Doesn't sound like to great a comparison to me...) but don't hold your breath when everyone tells you mescaline's character is truly/totally easy going. While it stands alone in nearly all compartments, high doses of it are very wacky and even lower doses are odd but then the soft nature of mescaline wins over at that stage IMO. I will say this as well, my ++++ experience with mescaline was wilder than my ++++ experience on LSD by an alright margin. Once again its a hard thing to really discern but its just how it felt to me and I can't describe much further but that was one of my first thoughts on comparisons with other trips, that in certain portions or pockets, it contained more intensity then the LSD experience at a ++++. You would only be able to understand if you chose to venture on with mescaline and happened to be struck with luck(it only seems a portion of the people who touch mescaline ever get to take it for real rides as mescaline can also be pretty messy/all over the place even more so than others in terms of dosing and what you receive from a perceived dose). I guess I too would have to say if given 1,000 mgs of pure mescaline vs 500ugs of LSD(how in the world do you even gauge this though? In fairness I mean because I see no real way to equate a perfectly matching dose for each where one wouldn't have a bit of an unfair advantage especially since whats high dose to one may be threshold to another)that most persons would probably also find the LSD more psychedelically intense but really that sort of thinking is hard to equate once again. I as well would definitely say 4-HO-DMT is wayyy more psychedelic than oral DMT. I may have stronger/deeper spiritual type thoughts on oral DMT but 4-HO-DMT is just so much stronger in nearly all aspects to me(i've made aya with around 30+gs of M.H. bark before and that specific batch of bark gave about one gram or more per 100g's...). For one though i'm pretty sensitive to 4-subs as well as the fact that overall I am very strange so maybe thats all the explanation but as a psychedelic user you should probably not view certain things as being so set in stone...you should know better than that. To also be fair I did always dose mescaline pretty wildly but I never really did absolutely astronomic doses or anything. The way i've always seen it too, was anyone who choose to dose high enough or got lucky would always defend mescaline when people would claim to be weak or just laugh and tell them to wait for it. In the end I would never even really compare mescaline to LSD in a classical sense as LSD is much more intense but mescaline has every bit of potential to hop right up there with it, its just that it does so rarely more often than not.

OP, in my experience it rarely ever took more than two and a half hours for things to really be going and occasionally I would start to peak around then or closer to about three hours in. I would also take any MDMA about an hour and a half after ingesting the mescaline as I find that the best timing for any flips coinciding the peaks! No need to worry about tolerance then either.

 

[Incunabula]

I've never heard of synthetic mescaline to be honest, it just doesn't exist. According to J.OTT it never has existed on the street. Anyone telling me he had it for sale I'd be very suspicious of. You'd save it for yourself and your friends.

That's simply not true 8) and that's a FACT!

......... I believe I also recall some availability in the very beginning of the Chinese synth to order years but won't swear to it now.

Yup, true. It was available from china. Golden color, needle like structure

But there have been, and still is, other sources for it aswell.

 

[sockpuppet]

edt

 

[Incunabula]

 

[sockpuppet]

edt

 

[Incunabula]

I believe you know what you'r talking about. I'm just waiting for Ismene to try and counter argue everything you've said :D

......and that even in today's global era and world of abundant and diverse psychedelics the odds of someone not very well connected getting synthetic mescaline are quite low. Anyone who DOESN'T know the chemist or who isn't an established member of a long existing psychedelic tribe or otherwise certain that what they have is real would be very wise to be cautious - and even if one DOES know it's real it's still smart to dose low for one's first psychedelic experience - especially if that experience will be at a public event.

quoted for truth

I've had green DOM blotters sold to me as Mescaline, they came from Switzerland. Or so the story went.

 

[Ismene]

Nice one fagott :D

 

[Ismene]

Ismene - this is silly. You are chasing a foolish and arrogant proposition to the ground without having any basis to do so.

I wouldn't go that far sock, I do know quite a bit about psychedelics if I say so myself. And there's no need to make it personal man - you don't agree with my opinions on mescaline - that's all. There's nothing "foolish" about what I'm saying. I've read pretty much everything there is to read about psychedelics and taken an awful lot too - my opinion is based on knowledge. I could say the only foolish and ignorant thing is getting so upset when we're swapping messages on a drug board. If you met me we'd get on great, take some mescaline and have a great time. Y'follow?


However he first took mescaline sulphate in the very early 60s - just like my relatives - just like about a million goatee wearing, modern jazz listening graduate students and would be artists.

I don't believe mescaline was that popular in the 60s. I think it's been far more popular since around 1995-2000 when the internet started getting big and people could buy cacti without writing off to a shack in Texas for it.

He absolutely knew real mescaline

So you believe Hunter when he said after taking mescaline he could see bats flying around his car? Do you think mescaline is the kind of drug that creates open eye visuals of bats flying around your car? Once again - I don't. I'm pretty sure I could give mescaline to 100 people and not one of them would see open eyed visuals of bats flying around them.

Leary's path was psilly mushrooms in Mexico to newly synthesized drug psilocybin from Sandoz to L.

Yep, but if you're talking about "CONNECTED HEADS" I'd say Tim Leary was about as connected as you are ever going to get. And when the LSD started running out in the mid-60s he didn't say "Lets just order some mescaline" he was so desperate he was reduced to ordering morning glory seeds.

Now I ask you, if Tim Leary couldn't get mescaline in the 60's who could?

 

[atara]

Clandestine synthesis was not so advanced in the 60's. Owsley Stanley ordered his LSD precursors from chemical suppliers. Methamphetamine was made from commercially acquired phenylacetone. The nitroaldol synthesis of phenethylamines, which is still the best route to mescaline, had yet to become well known.

In other words, the unavailability of mescaline in the '60s is not a determinant of its availability in later years. However, it still isn't profitable or popular.

 

[mi5]

Alrighty boys, no more numbers, you could have it got around it if you tried. Though it looks like the relevant parties saw them already, so everyone should be happy. Carry on.

Agreed with vader that speculating ID is a waste. However, given the difference in dosage between mescaline and many other psychs, I'd take extra caution and titrate Shulgin style.

Agreed.

I would suggest testing just 10mg ahead of the festival. If it is real Mescaline then pretty much no effect will be felt.

If it turned out to be something else more potent like 2cb or 2cp then you'd be very glad for this precaution!

 

[huolesoh]

i doubt the opening poster has mescaline, based on the basics of supply and demand. however sometimes it is useless trying to guide people to make the decisions one's self would make, in the same situation - some people make their minds up and that's it. although the opening poster could potentially die if he overdoses and it turns out to be 2CT7 or something, so perhaps intervention and harm reduction is a good idea

i guess anything exclusive, rare is instantly more alluring, exotic

I think most people with any experience would not recommend that a newb who has never taken psychs take 4grams of mushrooms or 250mg of L

yes i WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree - no one should take 250 milligrams of LSD ! well maybe if you are an otherworldly chemist with a .. different .. tolerance

there is a good article on erowid about this, cant find it right now - a festival, i think it was named ' bliss ' - where they tested a large variety of supposedly mescaline powders and only one turned out to be mescaline. still, t'would be lucky to be that one with it

this topic has probably been ' discussed to death ' already

 

[Ismene]

You seem to be unaware of the fact that peyote and peyote tea was WIDELY available to even non-Indian heads prior to the mid-60s - people could just order boxes of buttons shipped up from Texas.

Don't confuse peyote with "mescaline" tho sock - yes, it's definately always been possible to travel to the Texas desert, spend weeks living rough searching for enough peyote buttons for one trip. But I hope you arn't seriously suggesting that a million goatee-wearing hippies did that. And yes - it was theoretically possible to send a cash transfer to some untraceable guy who had set up a PO box somewhere on the Mexican border - if you were lucky, very, very, fucking, lucky you might find the one guy who actually replied and sent anything back. As opposed to the other hundred who simply bought a Tijuana whore with your money and laughed about the goatee wearing hippy as they shot their load.

I'm talking about the kid in high school who went round in the 60s saying "I got a gram of mesc dude - just $150". I don't believe that was real mescaline, no.

 

[Jauntypeacenik]

I don't want to say too much but it wouldn't surprise me if the OP did have real mescaline, synthetic or not, from an online source. I just base this on him saying he waited 3-4 months for it and I've seen it offered by fairly popular online vendors before. With the way online vending has gone over the last two years or so, it doesn't surprise me that someone might be dropping mescaline for their first psychedelic trip if they were patient enough. Of course, I'd hate to be the guy who advocated treating it like mescaline and see the OP wind up in the hospital. No reason not to exercise caution.

Also, synthetic mescaline was definitely available from chemical suppliers in 1960. Art Kleps ordered a gram of it from Delta Chemical Company which he split with his wife:Millbrook: Chapter 2.

 

[phactor]

I remember people selling certain types of LSD blotter as "mescaline" back in the late 90s.. today you will still see RCs sold as Mescaline. Especially at festivals. That being said, certain analogues of mescaline are around right now.

I am looking into extractions and whatnot, I suck at chemistry though.

OP, please be very careful whatever you choose to do. Also, I love DnB and whatever you are going to seems right up my alley. Wish we had more of that going on over here.

 

[phactor]

I do recall someone who has their shit posted all over Rhodium - Eleusis(?) was it who got fucked over with a MDMA lab and essentially openly admitted he was making mescaline as well. And it's not like the synthesis is totally uknown, either, it's in PiHKAL and it starts from fucking vanillin.

Most mescaline these days will be natural product extracted from cactus or fools trying to sell you 2c-x.

Wasn't that "Strike" or am I getting that mixed up? Shit was a long time ago.

Also, I have very close relatives that have talked about having access to mescaline in the 70s. No reason not to believe them, Boulder/Aspen/Colorado was very active at the time. My relative would talk about dried Peyote Buttons. Synthetic? Not sure.

whoops I was wrong: http://loinen.i2p.to/rhodium/chemistry/eleusis/memoirs.html