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Bupe Suboxone can ruin your life

Sweet Lady NBOMe said:
Suboxone saved my life.
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I hate when I hear this no offense. I've been on real H 20 years ago than methadone detox, than subs. Still on subs and been trying to come off. The brand name company changed the formula through the Pharma film company using nano particles in 2018. The energy I used to get is gone and I feel cloudy. My teeth are messed up from the subs. My mind is not clear like before and the addiction is worse than any other I had. The generics will put you in detox right away. The B.N. keep you stuck shackled to the strip which ruined my life in many ways. O I went on the subs clean as the doc thought it would be good for me. These lying doctors only care about the kickbacks no matter the cost on the patients. I'm going to get off and I'll tell you how: switch to subutex 54 411 generic and get my dose upped to get to the level of the strips. I'll need 2 a day to start. Take one in the mouth and sniff half of one 2x a day. Than take less by oral and more micro doses as needed up nose. This works with eating healthy, low wireless radiation environment to sleep like in a basement and something for the mental and supplements ext. It's easy to get on but hard to get off.
 
-XilE- said:
Um I've taken 32MG/day for four years eleven months 20 days and I cannot live without it or a maximum dose of methadone. I don't want to go down the methadone road again because I can't control myself with methadone, but I easily control myself with my current medications. I wake up, take 40MG Valium, 3200MG Gabapentin, 16MG Suboxone, wait 30 minutes and take another 16MG of Suboxone then put everything back in my safe under my bed because out of sight out of mind works for me. Then I run five miles on my treadmill and workout for an hour then play Path of Exile/Diablo 4/ Diablo 3/ Diablo 2 most of the day. I've been disabled just over five years because of severe anxiety, extreme insomnia and agoraphobia which started in my teens. Still, I'm doing way better than my last post many many years ago when I was abusing benadryl because I couldn't get into a sub doctor, (tried to kill myself a couple times, climbed the water tower at least 15 times and spent months in the looney bin so I could get suboxone and hide under a cover in the corner.) Then I got disability thanks to my psychiatrist and got into the best OBOT program within a hundred miles a couple months later. My doctor is the one of the most compassionate person I've ever met, like my stepfather who willed everything to me and my little brother after out mom passed from cancer a couple years ago. He's 70 though he looks like he's in his late 50s, I'm 39 and I have more grey hair than he does.

Side effects: I feel like what I think normal feels like, bad side effects, I can't drink soda or eat anything with a lot of sugar anymore, it really fucked up my taste buds, it all tastes like dogshit so I switched to tea with 1/8 cup of sugar per gallon and gave up on sweets.😭 I lost 90 pounds then started working out and gained 75 pounds of muscle.💪So yeah, overall Subs saved my life and there haven't been any other side effects. Sorry the drug did not help you, I know how hard detoxing from drugs with a long half-life is. 20 days of pure physical hell and years of mental hell that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. Hope you feel normal soon.
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I also felt great for almost 9 months. Then something strange happened. Literally overnight l collapsed mentally and physically. After a horrible first 5-6 months l am finally getting better. Was it Suboxone or just stress l will never know. Good luck mate.
 
Man67 said:
I also felt great for almost 9 months. Then something strange happened. Literally overnight l collapsed mentally and physically. After a horrible first 5-6 months l am finally getting better. Was it Suboxone or just stress l will never know. Good luck mate.
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Did you take the jab?
 
Hexenstahl said:
Because you never asked for sources lol. My reference is Dr. Christian Rätsch's book "Enzyklopädie der psychoaktiven Substanzen", but I don't know if that book was ever translated into english.


It is ludicrous for the reasons I have mentioned.


The first-line treatment option for ethylene glycol poisoning is actually Fomepizole and only if that isn't available will doctors use ethanol, because the use of ethanol itself carries risks for the reasons I have mentioned. Just because something is used as a treatment option doesn't mean it's actually a "healing agent". The chemicals used in chemotherapy kill off the cancer, not because it acts as a healing agent, but rather because the patient gets acutely poisoned. Now, what the leaflet doesn't tell you is that it also kills off a whole bunch of healthy cells with it. Cancer patients who have undergone chemotherapy therefore haven't been healed, they have survived. That same principle is true with using ethanol. One poison is replaced by another poison. This is actually the reason why chemotherapy is HUGELY controversial in medicine and doctors have lost their licenses because they have spoken out against it and have shown how in most cases it is actually the chemo that kills the patient and not the cancer. That is why I will never do chemo in case I ever get cancer. I'll just use full-spectrum cannabinoid oil and that's it.


Alcohol IS objectively bad. I'm not saying this lightly btw. Few things in life are objective.


That doesn't make alcohol a "good" treatment option though. That's a bad choice of comparison. Why not compare alcohol with fomepizole, which is actually what is used in such a case and not freaking opium. Fomepizole is used as a first-line treatment for a good reason. Back when it didn't exist, alcohol was used, but not because everyone was convinced of how much of a powerful healing tool it is. It was because there was no other option around, so the doctor always takes the treatment that causes the LEAST HARM. That's the reason fomepizole was invented in the first place, because doctors wanted to get rid of the toxic effect ethanol has on the patients.

Also, as a quick side note: antifreeze poisoning is literally the ONLY area where ethanol has some kind of a marginal therapeutic "merit" and even then only as a secondary option. Now, what you are doing is taking this incredibly rare medical occurence (45K reported cases in the US in 2015, which is like what, 0.013% of the populace?), which only happens in isolated cases (suicide, homicide, lab accidents) and then take this ridiculously miniscule area of medicine where alcohol MAY be used as a treatment option and blow its role out of proportion to make it look like alcohol is this potentially great medicine that we couldn't live without because, uuuuh, look at all these numerous.....uuuuh....antifreeze poisoning...
Yeah that's where the argument starts to collapse. Alcohol isn't medically important because it can potentially save the lives of 0.013% of the US population and even then we already have a much better treatment option. Alcohol is simply redundant. Period.


...and depression, and schizophrenia, and bipolar disorder, and and and...
I suggest you read a little bit about opioids in older medical literature (like opioids in mental illness which I have referenced earlier in the thread) to see the incredibly wide array of use in medicine that opioids can be successfully used for, with minimal side effects compared to the incredibly side effect prone ADs and NLs being used today. Opioids have been reduced to only physical pain, but that doesn't mean they cannot be used in other areas of medicine too.
This substance has incredibly useful psychoactive properties that are being completely ignored by modern medicine.


I suggest you look what is actually within a human cell and what those cells do in the human body, and perhaps then you will realize how a substance being cytotoxic actually affects the whole organism upon harming those cells. Also, as I have already mentioned, alcohol is not just cytotoxic, it is also neurotoxic and hepatotoxic. The long-term implications of that are severe. What more do you want? Isn't that toxic enough for you? That is in my opinion enough to judge alcohol. It is only useful for certain chemical reactions in the lab and as a preservative (and perhaps some other uses I'm unaware of), but neither body nor the mind needs alcohol. It is therapeutical for neither of those two. Sure, it is unfortunately recreational for the majority of people, but I think that is only the case because most people in our society are unaware that we have other substances that have a better recreational value and also a much better safety profile. Admittedly, the former is subjective (some like alcohol, others prefer weed, then again some people like low dose acid, etc.), but the latter cannot be argued about.


How does alcohol have "an overall positive effect on the whole human being"?


That's not the point though. We aren't talking about what causes the greatest harm, but about harm itself. Even if you don't consciously notice it, alcohol is even in its smallest amounts toxic. The fact that it bypasses the BBB makes it even worse.


Correlation ≠ causation. The study doesn't take that into account, on top of it not being randomized, placebo controlled and double-blind or even peer-reviewed.
Furthermore, the study estimates the alcohol exposure across the patients' lifetimes via a self-created tool they call LACU (Lifetime Alcohol Consuming Unit). Let's ignore for a second the fact that the tool has neither been replicated in its use nor peer-reviewed to test its scientific validity. How is this obscure "Unit" even defined and measured??? This is where the study completely falls flat on its face. Is 1 Unit considered to be 2.09 x 10^3 mL/week, or is it only 0.0016 x 10^5 mL/week? How much percent alcohol per litre had been drunk on average? Questions upon questions. These are just a few reasons this study is qualitatively low.


SOME people always end up overdoing things. That doesn't negate the meritorious value of the substance. See, I was always addicted to opioids because I immediately noticed the beneficial and therapeutic effect it had on me. I had periods where I overdid it with the heroin and the positive effects started to diminish (it was around 1g a day), so I started to gradually reduce the dose to a level where the positive antidepressant effects would again shine through (around 0.5 to 0.7g/day). Yeah, some people can't do that but that's not the fault of the opioid. That was ofc all before I discovered ULDN. That stuff is such a game changer.


Ofc they have, but those downsides are only a) temporary in nature and b) can be solved either through modification of dosage or by use of modern substances like NMDA antagonists or ULDN. Also, I'm comparing these temporary downsides to the permanent health hazards of alcohol.


I am admittedly no expert in chinese history. I do not have the full picture of what exactly happened during that period and who all the big players were and what their (ulterior) motives had been. All I know is that rational reasons could not have been the cause of prohibition because China had hundreds if not thousands of years time to prohibit opium consumption, but somehow only got the idea to ban it pretty late in history. It just doesn't add up...
Also, again, I'm not saying opioids have absolutely no negative sides. I'm just saying they are not toxic substances and whatever "harm" they cause, it is completely reversible, so don't start to twist my words in such a dishonest way.


Ugh.....no...no I'm not saying that...


No they are not because everybody would immediately know who the king is and where his castle resides and the rulers would very quickly end up in a torch and pitchfork scenario. The art of successfully ruling the masses consists not of brute force (I mean it does work, but only for a short time), but of division, deception, confusion and indoctrination. If people don't know who the true ruler is, they won't know whom it is that is causing all the trouble. That is a very complex topic though and I have been accused of being a conspiracy theorist (not that I care) for implying that powerful people seeking to increase their power do exist, and since that is kind of off-topic, I don't wanna go into that direction here.


Who would have thought in the 19th century that it would be realistic to eventually end up where we are now? Never underestimate the system's inbuilt entropic tendency. History has shown us more than one time that things can turn around VERY quickly and VERY radically in relatively short periods of time.
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I’m someone who had cancer and tried every possible natural route I could before doing chemo. I will say they did help prolong the inevitable, apricot kernels and whole plant cannabis oil being the best, but didn’t cure me. The only reason I’m alive is because of chemo.

Now I do agree it’s poison no doubt, not sure I’d go through it again if my cancer came back.. But I’m here, I’m alive, I’m able to help others still because I made a calculated decision. I definitely experienced some neurotoxicity, lost the energy for life I once had, but I’m so grateful to be here it’s worth it.

Not saying people shouldn’t try the natural methods first, and/or use them in conjunction with traditional western treatments… Just don’t write them off. I did and might have died because of it, if I had just gone to the doctors straight away I could’ve likely gotten away with just a surgery and no chemo. But the natural fallacy and hatred of doctors took me down a different path.

-GC
 
@G_Chem
Hi G_Chem, I'm happy chemo helped you survive, however my grandma didn't survive. It wasn't even the cancer that killed her, it was the chemo. I wanted to fly her to canada to Rick Simpson (back when he still lived there and didn't have to fear for his life) so he could treat her with his full spectrum cannabinoid oil with which he has healed so many cancer patients, and my grandma agreed because she never trusted all that rockefeller based quackery anyway, but unfortunately the asshole doctors kept her in the hospital and refused to let her out because of some bullshit reason they put forward of why they couldn't yet release her from "care". I was actually in the process of suing the responsible chief physician of the hospital but too much time passed by and she died. I hope you understand now why I have a general hatred towards these white coats, but not everyone of course. I like individual doctors like my maintenance doc who is a wonderful human being and very educated too, but I hate and distrust the overall collective "doctorhood" if you wanna call it like that. Kind of like how a misanthrope hates humanity in general but does like some individuals. These white coat drug dealers just all too often end up complicit in the biggest crimes for me to excuse their actions and forgive them or anything.

I'm genuinely glad you survived though.
 
Yep
deficiT said:
A lot of name calling and carrying on going on here. Y'all want to chill on that type of stuff please? It's not fair to other BLers, guests, or the mods that have to clean it up.
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yep, even with those I agree with. Feels like HS and adds nothing to debate
 
Hexenstahl said:
I have once shared a video where an ex lapd officer admitted how the CIA tried to recruit him into bringing crack into the country back in the 80s. Gary Webb's investigative journalism has revealed the role of the CIA behind the crack epidemic so I'm sure they have their hands in the fentanyl epidemic too. This is a problem that is beyond the stupid left right paradigm. It's a systemic issue. Doesn't matter if Sleepy Joe, Obummer, Trump the manchild or Bush the intellectually handicapped is in office. None of these people are anti-prohibition. Forget about the politicians. They aren't the ones in power. It's the corporate hand and the intel behind them that's running the show.
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You nailed it Hexenstahl, absolute truth speaker. The left/right culture wars and outrage feedback loop are all smokescreen distraction from the real corruption. Corporate, political, military industrial complex convincing half the country that a trillion per year is far too low, lest we be destroyed by our enemies. If we ever United to focus on the real scumbags raping the taxpayer, we might accomplish something. The divided bickering and infighting is by design. Right and left, both slaves to the corporate corruption that runs this country. It terrifies me how many fall for the right/left narrative, good guy/bad guy, black/white, binary mindset. hexenstahl has made a few insightful comments showing he sees through it in a way less than 10% of Americans actually do. I know, I sound like a dick, but no way to say it in a manner that doesn’t piss off both “sides.”
 
Jnowhere said:
At 6:30 eastern standard time you quoted my long rant and went on to talk about our shitty presidents, I get offended when Europeans attack our presidents even the ones I don't like, which is pretty much all of them.
Besides there has always been rogue elements in the CIA. They helped kill JFK. Have done some bad things
Like I said my phone service sucks tonight, and you quoted my post and brought up our idiot presidents and the CIA. I try not to be disrespectful to the leaders of European countries, but given the history of them, I get pissed when people from other countries talk shit about them. I am sorry, like I said you quoted me and my phone is being retarded tonight( I have a good phone and expensive phone service and I have nothing but problems with it) bad mood+ you quoting me and making unfounded allegations( about the fentanyl and CIA, the stuff about crack is true)(rougue elements, greedy bastards abusing their power) I am sorry, but I still hate the Kaiser Frederick Wilhelm and all of Queen Victoria's grand kids. There is a real reason behind it. It has to do with her and Ireland. I leave it at that.
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Is this dumbfuckery ever gonna end?
 
Man67 said:
To cut the long story short. Start Suboxone treatment ONLY if your life is in danger. For all other reasons (tolerance, pain & depression management...) don't do it. It's like getting a mosquito with the nuclear weapon. Way too strong and unpredictable. After a perfect period of 8-9 months side effects started to show?! Literally overnight. Same dose, same brand, same expire date... I'll probably never know why but that's not important anymore. After being between life and death for 3 months l finally managed to tapper down. Four weeks after l'm still weak, depressed and tired. Pain is back as well. Sometimes unbearable but I don't complain. I managed to get through this nightmare alive. Hopefully one day these symptoms will cease and I'll feel normal again? Please think twice before starting a Sub. therapy as plenty of side effects are not listed at all. Intentionally!
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Suboxone is still an addictive opiate, buprenorphine actually didn’t exist till like 2010. And that’s what was in green Loritabs.

There’s mental withdrawals just like physical ones from the subs themself.

Naloxone is a pain killer just like the opiate it is a larger molecule that bounces the buprenorphine and other opiates or thc or cbd out of pain receptors. There is no cannabinoid receptors. Like you could cut your finger off and not feel any pain while on naloxone. They could have put you on subutex but for rehabilitation it’s probably supposed to contain naloxone. Otherwise it’s like using an opiate instead of street drugs like heroin, which is commonly dirty or laced with other stuff. Methadone clinics use to actually exist, opiate users were commonly hard workers so methadone clinics had to exist, they weren’t cheap. It was just like buying dope or more expensive. Like 15 bucks a day back in 2006 or before that. Methadone also had a longer half life of like 24 or 48 hours which means you won’t need another dose or go through withdrawals before you probably have money to get more and those jobs methadone patients had paid daily or every few days, by direct deposit or cash.

They commonly prescribe Xanax with suboxone.

The supplements arginine, citrulline, and agmatine eliminate withdrawals by breaking down the liver enzymes that cause drug tolerances to build. The enzymes breakdown some of the drug or insulin. It’s in peanut butter, the withdrawals and crime thats caused by drugs aren’t why they were illegal, it stopped communism straight away. All these white light haired nerds started like acting like everything can be legal but we can tell they’re all communists or conspirators.

It better not be dope fiends doing all these conspiracies.

They aren’t joking about cartels putting rat poison and road tar In crack and heroin. Or other stuff to kill the customer base of snitches and foreign invaders off. They know they will still buy poisoned drugs or diseased food. There wasn’t much down south or out east because North America was just like Mexico or Spain. When there isn’t a government it means the king pins and mafia dons are their local or big governments. You all thought everyone was on their own or did what they wanted because you all wandered into Latino or spanish gang neighborhoods.
 
Youknowwhatitis said:
Suboxone is still an addictive opiate, buprenorphine actually didn’t exist till like 2010. And that’s what was in green Loritabs.

There’s mental withdrawals just like physical ones from the subs themself.

Naloxone is a pain killer just like the opiate it is a larger molecule that bounces the buprenorphine and other opiates or thc or cbd out of pain receptors. There is no cannabinoid receptors. Like you could cut your finger off and not feel any pain while on naloxone. They could have put you on subutex but for rehabilitation it’s probably supposed to contain naloxone. Otherwise it’s like using an opiate instead of street drugs like heroin, which is commonly dirty or laced with other stuff. Methadone clinics use to actually exist, opiate users were commonly hard workers so methadone clinics had to exist, they weren’t cheap. It was just like buying dope or more expensive. Like 15 bucks a day back in 2006 or before that. Methadone also had a longer half life of like 24 or 48 hours which means you won’t need another dose or go through withdrawals before you probably have money to get more and those jobs methadone patients had paid daily or every few days, by direct deposit or cash.

They commonly prescribe Xanax with suboxone.

The supplements arginine, citrulline, and agmatine eliminate withdrawals by breaking down the liver enzymes that cause drug tolerances to build. The enzymes breakdown some of the drug or insulin. It’s in peanut butter, the withdrawals and crime thats caused by drugs aren’t why they were illegal, it stopped communism straight away. All these white light haired nerds started like acting like everything can be legal but we can tell they’re all communists or conspirators.

It better not be dope fiends doing all these conspiracies.

They aren’t joking about cartels putting rat poison and road tar In crack and heroin. Or other stuff to kill the customer base of snitches and foreign invaders off. They know they will still buy poisoned drugs or diseased food. There wasn’t much down south or out east because North America was just like Mexico or Spain. When there isn’t a government it means the king pins and mafia dons are their local or big governments. You all thought everyone was on their own or did what they wanted because you all wandered into Latino or spanish gang neighborhoods.
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This is wildly misinformed
 
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