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Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v3; 2010 - 2022

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Stacianica said:
Ok, after a mere two weeks of being on Subutex, I'm finding it may not be for me. I was on Nucynta 50mg up to 6xs per day for chronic pain. It sucked. So, after a long story that isn't relevant to this question, I was put on the Tex. yay, no pain for that time. Less, the agony of an intestinal blockage. So, for the first time since being Rx this, yesterday the pain was back. I was rx'd 4mg twice daily. Admittedly, this chippie only took about .5-1mg twice a day.

Now, I want to kick it. I have Nucynta left over and some hydrocodone. What might be the best way to do this with the bupe being a partial antagonist? Any ideas?

Also, apart from Methadone what might be best for chronic pain as well as acute breakthrough pain for Trigeminal Neuralgia? I've already tried gabapentin, tramadol, tricyclics, lyrica, hydrocodone, tapentadol, etc.
Click to expand...

You've been smart to stay at 1mg or less with the buprenorphine. It will make kicking a lot easier especially since you've only been on it for two weeks, and have some weak-moderate short acting opiates on hand.

I would honestly maybe taper down with the subutex and try and kick it without the aid of additional opiates. I'd start by taking .5mg consistantly for four or five days, then dropping down to .25 for another few days, and then trying to skip days between dosing. The problem here is going to be your pain, which will be more noticeable as you will be detoxing from a narcotic.

Also, are you planning on getting back on opiates for the treatment of your pain? If that's the case, then there is no real reason to kick the subutex, just switch back to an equal dosage of oxycodone or another full agonist.
 
suboxone, and heroin question

Hello, have been using heroin for a long while now with no downtime. keep suboxone just incase. Well today was one of those days. took 8mg of suboxone film this this afternoon when woke up. Then tonight scored some H(wish didnt use the suboxone now.) So how how long before the H can be felt? It was just the single 8mg.. Really hope it is not 2-3 days dear god :?
 
honestly, it's gonna be like 3 days before you can feel heroin fully. that doesnt doesnt mean it will be 100% blocked now, especially if you are currently feeling sick on the suboxone taking the heroin on top could certainly make you feel better but you wont experience anywhere near the full heroin effect for two days at least, most likely 3.
 
^thats not necessarily true. The best bet is of course to wait 24 hours, as that will probably be a sure thing. However, I've found that suboxone really only blocks with chronic high dosing (4mg and above, though some will experience diminished effects still at 2mg). The truth is that a single dose of 8mg is not going to occupy 100% of your opiate receptors, and it's going to disassociate from them at a much more rapid rate than when suboxone is taken daily. This is due to the fact that buprenorphine has a long half life (~36 hours), and each dose builds upon each other. So if you're taking 8mg a day, the accumulated ammount of bupe in your system is closer to 20mg (check out this Suboxone Half-Life Chart), which Is saturating your opiate receptors.

All that being said, there is no way to tell you whether you'll waste your gear or not. Check out the Suboxone Megathread for more information.

Actually I'm going to merge this into that thread.
 
Hello. I looked through version 14 of this megathread but didnt come across the information im looking for. If someone knows which specific megathread I need to be looking through let me know. I know this forum doesnt like repeat questions. I have seen the information in the past but cant remember the specifics.

Im iving 8-12mgs of generic Subutex a day. I split it up sometimes into 2 shots throughout the day. I worked my way up to it. What is the ceiling dose on subutex? (24-32mgs*) I remember seeing members say that the feeling/high is the same on lower doses. Even the .1-.5mg doses that some take seems to work for them like my 12mg dose does for me. Im aware of the dangers, and I take all the precautions. Im just looking to get the most out of my experience. Using my medicine the most efficent way without losing the effectiveness. Thanks.
sections
UPDATE:
*Well I found it. Staring at me on the first post in every megathread. I have looked at the ROA and the BA sections so many times I assumed I knew all that was on it.
**I would still like to know what anyone here has to say in regards to how much I take and if a lower dose will provide the same effects. If so what is the best way to get down to that level? Any other advice besides the usual that goes along with the ROA that I use? Thanks
 
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Znegative said:
You've been smart to stay at 1mg or less with the buprenorphine. It will make kicking a lot easier especially since you've only been on it for two weeks, and have some weak-moderate short acting opiates on hand.

I would honestly maybe taper down with the subutex and try and kick it without the aid of additional opiates. I'd start by taking .5mg consistantly for four or five days, then dropping down to .25 for another few days, and then trying to skip days between dosing. The problem here is going to be your pain, which will be more noticeable as you will be detoxing from a narcotic.

Also, are you planning on getting back on opiates for the treatment of your pain? If that's the case, then there is no real reason to kick the subutex, just switch back to an equal dosage of oxycodone or another full agonist.
Click to expand...


Thank you, Zneg! You've never steered me off course in the short time I've been on this forum. That said, you rock!

So, OxyContin is a full agonist with the lovely euphoric effects, right? Methadone is full agonist with not such a euphoric effect, yes? Or no? What else is comparable to Tapentadol (Nucynta) or Bupe (sans naloxone) for both pain management and euphoria? Might as well shoot for both, right? Also, which opiates are best for chronic vs breakthrough pain that are full agonists and also generate euphoria? Oh, and cheap, lol. Or cheap-ish.

Actually, I'm not even aware of the legalities of a Sub Doctor being able to Rx any other opiates in lieu of the Subutex. I'm assuming it to be out of his realm of services. ?
He's an MD, his specialty lies in psychiatry, but I went to him for his Subutex services while I transition from one pain clinic to another, pending insurance. (with no answer in sight from Medicaid). Hense, this limbo of my Primary Dr not wanting to Rx anything more than Vicodan and then having services terminated at Pain Clinic abruptly without lining up a new pain center first. I didn't want to deal with withdrawals on top of chronic pain so Sub Dr it was. Anyway, I digress...

Is it unheard of that Suboxone/Subutex Drs could/would ever Rx for any other opiates? Even if their specialty is psych and not pain management? Just wondering if you or anyone else might have had experience with this.

Also, wondering what the general concensus for euphoria producing full agonist opiates for breakthrough and maintenance pain might be, apart from Oxycodone. Is that more of a maintenance Rx or breakthrough or both?
 
Suboxone Strips vs. Subutex for W/D, and Dosage Questions?

Herro..

Like every month I run out of money and am going through hell withdrawing from opiates, mainly 30's and heroin. I have used the OLD Suboxone before for withdrawal and it didn't work. So I usually end up buying Subutex so I can snort it and take it under the tongue, whichever I prefer. But I barely made it through the 3 day bump last time with 6 Subutex (8mg).. :o

I've heard that Suboxone strips are a lot better than the orange Suboxone pills were. Is there any truth to this?? How are the Suboxone strips compared to the Subutex now? For some reason the orange pill Suboxone didn't work for me and I'm pretty sure it was something in it. And what's a good dose to take daily or whatever for 3 days or a good regime?

Help please!
 
Ive gotten to about 0.25mg a day, taking 0.125mg in the morning and at night.

The only problem I have is excessive sweating. It looks terrible in class. I am literally soaked.

38 strips left and no other problems though. It was very easy to get down to this dose. Unfortunately, I have to take a little extra just to stop the sweating. I only do this for class though, I feel good after I sweat a ton and drink water. I go through 2 or 3 sets of clothes a day though which is annoying running back home then back to campus 3 or 4 times a day. Ive read a few people have this problem for up to 6 months or even more.

Perhaps I am dropping a little too fast? Can this problem be minimized somehow?

I know people recommend clonodine and I will look into that. Antihistamines make me feel very groggy.

I've never felt so good being on this low dose. I remember how angry I would be taking that shit every day (8mg+), making sure wherever you go you have the strips with you, being a prisoner in you're own body. Freedom is around the corner.
 
Ok guys. I'm very sure this question had been answered. But I want some advice.

My dr took me off soma, cut down my norco by 30, and gave me gabapentin.

I had bad results from the gabapentin and I called in and they wanted to see me.

I got a tens unit. I love it<3 it's working nicely.

I talked to him about a round the clock med for my pain.
He was reluctant but said It's buprenorphine patch. But no other opiates.

I did some research on it. It seems ok. I do want my pain relieved. Norco doesn't touch the pain much anymore.
I have taken it for over a year.

Is it worth trying? You guys have the expierence I don't with this. I know it's subjective. Will it be good for chronic pain?
Will it jack up my tolerance when it will never be the same again? What were yalls side effects? We're they bad? I have a month to decide. Also do you think the dr thinks I'm a drug addict now? I'm doing everything he says. Shots, tens unit, advice ect. Idk.

What do y'all think? I probably sound silly but I'm in a lot of pain all the time and I just want relief.
 
doesn't sound silly at all Zoeylynn.

First of all, I'm pretty sure that the transdermal patches (butrans) release only a very small amount of buprenorphine every hour (just checked the Butrans website, and the maximum dosage is 20 mcg/hour, which means 480 mcg/day. The Transdermal BA is surprisingly high, around 90% I believe, (I'll find the source later, I'm about to check out so I cant do the research now), but regardless, it's not going to make your tolerance skyrocket.

From what I've heard, BuTrans is pretty effective for chronic pain as low dosages of buprenorphine act very similar to full agonist drugs, and will not block other narcotics. However, due to the fact that it is a partial agonist with a super high binding affinity, you'll want to make sure you wait 24-36 hours after your last dosage of hydrocodone before using the BuTrans.

As for your doctor thinking you are a drug addict... Well, that's a hard call to make since I don't know any more information. However, just because he wants to use buprenorphine does not mean he things you are abusing your medication. Buprenorphine, from a doctors perspective, I imagine would seem like a great choice for pain management due to its ceiling effect on resperitory depression and its lower abuse profile. It's more likely that he's very cautious when it comes to pain meds, and would like to try this out before prescribing something like oxycontin which has obviously developed a reputation as being a drug with a high risk of abuse/dependence.
 
Znegative said:
doesn't sound silly at all Zoeylynn.

First of all, I'm pretty sure that the transdermal patches (butrans) release only a very small amount of buprenorphine every hour (just checked the Butrans website, and the maximum dosage is 20 mcg/hour, which means 480 mcg/day. The Transdermal BA is surprisingly high, around 90% I believe, (I'll find the source later, I'm about to check out so I cant do the research now), but regardless, it's not going to make your tolerance skyrocket.

From what I've heard, BuTrans is pretty effective for chronic pain as low dosages of buprenorphine act very similar to full agonist drugs, and will not block other narcotics. However, due to the fact that it is a partial agonist with a super high binding affinity, you'll want to make sure you wait 24-36 hours after your last dosage of hydrocodone before using the BuTrans.

As for your doctor thinking you are a drug addict... Well, that's a hard call to make since I don't know any more information. However, just because he wants to use buprenorphine does not mean he things you are abusing your medication. Buprenorphine, from a doctors perspective, I imagine would seem like a great choice for pain management due to its ceiling effect on resperitory depression and its lower abuse profile. It's more likely that he's very cautious when it comes to pain meds, and would like to try this out before prescribing something like oxycontin which has obviously developed a reputation as being a drug with a high risk of abuse/dependence.
Click to expand...

Transdermal buprenorphine BA is low. Check out the first post in this thread. ;)
 
IV Suboxone

Hello friends... Its been quite some time since I've posted on Bluelight (Always lurking) which is probaby a good thing (no offense ladies and gents). I had been clean from heroin for a year up until about a month ago and then things went south. Luckily I have easy access to suboxone so after a month of misery I've finally went out and got myself some suboxone.

Now, my question is for the Captain mainly, but if anyone else is as experienced with Subs, please chime in.
I've been intrigued of the idea of IV bupe. My last attempt ended in a minor bout with precipitated withdrawal which wasnt all that bad, but nonetheless... is something i'd rather not experience. I did a 1mg shot about 20 minutes ago... and needless to say... felt nothing. Is this normal?

I realize that my tolerance to opiates is high.. and i have been taking bupe 4-5x a week for the past 8 months. Over the last month mainly IV heroin and some bupe. I was slightly in withdrawal today with minor symptoms (runny nose, eyes, yawning, stomach twisted, dialated pupils) when I did the shot and nothing really happened. What gives? I just put 3mg subingual.

What gives? Am i just expecting too much? I prepped it with 30ccs cold water and filtered it, applying no heat. Any ideas? I definitey feel relief from those symptoms, but no rush or anything. Pupils didnt even shrink.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
Transdermal buprenorphine BA is low. Check out the first post in this thread. ;)
Click to expand...

Yep, I stand corrected. I was confusing it with the high BA of TD fentanyl.

Thatbird,
how much suboxone are you used to taking sublingually?

1mg of buprenorphine IV is equivalent to around 3mg SL. Basically, Sublingual Administration has a 30% BA v. the 99-100% BA of IV. However, IV bupe has a shorter duration. I imagine that your tolerance is simply too high most likely that you could use buprenorphine and get anything resembling a recreational effect. If you want to get a lift out of buprenorphine, regardless of the ROA, you need to taper down. Like many others will attest, less is more with bupe. When you get to I.V dosages under .5 mg then you really start to feel the potential IMO.
 
Znegative said:
Yep, I stand corrected. I was confusing it with the high BA of TD fentanyl.

Thatbird,
how much suboxone are you used to taking sublingually?

1mg of buprenorphine IV is equivalent to around 3mg SL. Basically, Sublingual Administration has a 30% BA v. the 99-100% BA of IV. However, IV bupe has a shorter duration. I imagine that your tolerance is simply too high most likely that you could use buprenorphine and get anything resembling a recreational effect. If you want to get a lift out of buprenorphine, regardless of the ROA, you need to taper down. Like many others will attest, less is more with bupe. When you get to I.V dosages under .5 mg then you really start to feel the potential IMO.
Click to expand...

Thats what I figured. I generally take between 2-4mg. Thats as of lately though. Before i relapsed between 6-8mg every day
 
thatbird said:
Now, my question is for the Captain mainly, but if anyone else is as experienced with Subs, please chime in.
I've been intrigued of the idea of IV bupe. My last attempt ended in a minor bout with precipitated withdrawal which wasnt all that bad, but nonetheless... is something i'd rather not experience. I did a 1mg shot about 20 minutes ago... and needless to say... felt nothing. Is this normal?

I realize that my tolerance to opiates is high.. and i have been taking bupe 4-5x a week for the past 8 months. Over the last month mainly IV heroin and some bupe. I was slightly in withdrawal today with minor symptoms (runny nose, eyes, yawning, stomach twisted, dialated pupils) when I did the shot and nothing really happened. What gives? I just put 3mg subingual.

What gives? Am i just expecting too much? I prepped it with 30ccs cold water and filtered it, applying no heat. Any ideas? I definitey feel relief from those symptoms, but no rush or anything. Pupils didnt even shrink.
Click to expand...

If your opiate tolerance is larger than next to nothing, IV buprenorphine won't really get you high.

If you have no opiate tolerance, IVing buprenorphine in the 150 mcg to 300 mcg range (0.15mg to 0.3mg) is going to be fairly euphoric - it varies a lot in between people, but I definitely get a rush from it.

I wouldn't advise IVing buprenorphine without acquiring ampules of buprenorphine or using micron filters.

If you are going to use micron filters or use ampules, IM use is most ideal in my opinion.
 
User X said:
Hello. I looked through version 14 of this megathread but didnt come across the information im looking for. If someone knows which specific megathread I need to be looking through let me know. I know this forum doesnt like repeat questions. I have seen the information in the past but cant remember the specifics.

Im iving 8-12mgs of generic Subutex a day. I split it up sometimes into 2 shots throughout the day. I worked my way up to it. What is the ceiling dose on subutex? (24-32mgs*) I remember seeing members say that the feeling/high is the same on lower doses. Even the .1-.5mg doses that some take seems to work for them like my 12mg dose does for me. Im aware of the dangers, and I take all the precautions. Im just looking to get the most out of my experience. Using my medicine the most efficent way without losing the effectiveness. Thanks.
sections
UPDATE:
*Well I found it. Staring at me on the first post in every megathread. I have looked at the ROA and the BA sections so many times I assumed I knew all that was on it.
**I would still like to know what anyone here has to say in regards to how much I take and if a lower dose will provide the same effects. If so what is the best way to get down to that level? Any other advice besides the usual that goes along with the ROA that I use? Thanks
Click to expand...

I've read that the ceiling dose is closer to 4mg. I would never take more than 6mg, and that's via the sublingual BA, but that's just me. The reason for this is that I really don't experience any positive effects above the 4mg dose, other than increased duration and blockade effect, but the side effects still increase which is why I don't dose that high anymore.

If withdrawals aren't really an issue then 2mg seems to be the ceiling dose for euphoria in my experience, but after dosing that for a few days straight it is very hard to feel the same level of euphoria from bupe without taking a break of at least 10 days.
 
Suboxone question

Ive wonder this for some time, but never quite got an answer when I researched suboxone. I dont have a prescription and obtain it from other sources so I cannot ask a doctor. Say your may withdrawl symptoms last only a week and you only take suboxone for a week 2mg a day without tapering off. Will withdrawal symptoms come on like you never took the suboxone? Or does the with drawal from your primary drug if choice get avoided?
 
I honestly feel like starting on bupe was the worst decision of my life. When I got on, doctors were telling people you could "painlessly taper off", now, cut to 6 years later, they're telling people "you could be making a life time decision" - I really wish I had just dealt with the 2 week withdrawal of heroin, over the brutal stretched out sub withdrawal. I suppose there isnt a point to this post, just venting I guess.
 
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