Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v3; 2010 - 2022

[tricomb]

Hey man, I'm sorry this slipped through the cracks or somethin.

What ROA do you intend to use?

 

[rhun]

I was told by someone at the methadone clinic today that Subutex is better because it doesn't have the naloxone in it..
So basically Subutex can be abused whereas Suboxone cannot. Naloxone is an opiate blocker.

I would choose Subutex anyway just because why take any extra crap if you can avoid it.

 

[tricomb]

^Naloxone is pretty much inactive in Suboxone, that's a common myth.

They both have very high potential for abuse, and administering either of them will induce precipitated withdrawals in opioid tolerant individuals due to buprenorphine having such a high binding affinity for the opioid receptors that it rips off the previous opioid, inducing violent withdrawals.

Point being, it's the buprenorphine (active ingredient in both meds) that causes PWD, and subutex is no more abusable than suboxone, they're the same drug.

 

[Znegative]

^Exactly. Do not make the mistake that subutex is okay to dose whenever because it doesn't have naloxone in it. Buprenorphine has a higher affinity to the opiate receptor sites than naloxone does, so the naloxone in suboxone is basically an inactive ingrediant. If you don't believe this, you can read through the Suboxone/buprenorphine Megathread where countless people shoot up there suboxone every day (once maintained on it). Also, within suboxone's owne medication insert, it claims that higher than normal dosages of naloxone would be needed in the case of a buprenorphine overdose.

The Suboxone Strips and the Suboxone pills both contain the same ammount and ratio (4:1) of buprenorphine and naloxone. There are some claims that the strips are better absorbed sublingually than the tablets but IME, this isn't the case. I've also tried both Subutex AND Suboxone and I could not say that one felt any different than the other, and I've tried them through pretty much every method of administration (injection, insufflation, sublingual, and rectal).

It's hard to tell you what dose would be the most appropriate for your habit without information on how much oxycodone it takes to get you through a day, but for most people, 8mg SL is more than enough.

I'm going to merge this with the Suboxone/buprenorphine Megathread FAQ

 

[gotit4cheap]

Say I've been taking suboxone for about 6 months straight as manteinance - started at 4 mg and slowly went down to 1mg. A week ago, I started doing oxycodone. How long does it take the body to become addicted to the oxy rather than the suboxone? As in, when can I use the suboxone to come off the oxy withdrawal for the 4 days and stop?

 

[Znegative]

Your body doesn't differentiate the suboxone from the oxycodone at this point.mall it knows is that it needs X ammount of opiates to feel normal. If your goal is to use a short acting opiate (oxycodone) to get off a long one (buprenorphine) than you should oxy take the oxycodone when your withdrawals become unmanageable, and slowly taper your oxy intake down each time. It takes 12 days for buprenorphine to become elliminated from your body, and sub withdrawals tend to last 2-3 weeks depending upon the dosage that you jumped off of.

In the end this strategy has a good chance of backfiring as I'm assuming you got on suboxone in order to stop using oxycodone. It will take a tremendous ammount of willpower to taper your oxycodone, and if you're going to do it this way, I'd suggest you not get back on bupe after getting back on oxy to get off bupe (lol). Otherwise you might as well just get completely addicted to oxycodone again and then hope you can find it in yourself to do a quick detox with your suboxone.

If you want to stop using subs, I suggest you do so by tapering down even more, and then skipping days between dosages, or using kratom. People have successfully switched to full agonists to ride out the long bupe withdrawals, but it's rare, and in the end they still go through withdrawals all the same (just switching long and mild for short and intense.)

 

[down508]

curious about peoples clinics policies on alcohol. I've been on suboxone (8mg a day, prescribed 16, figure that one out) for a little over a year now. I turned 21 in mid August and have since had a drink at night a couple of times. haven't had the urge to have more then that. My sub doctor asked me yesterday, like he always does, if I had any slip ups. I haven't touched opiates (aside from my suboxone) in over a year, despite going through quadruple impacted wisdom teeth extractions. I believe in being honest with my doctors (within reason) in order to get the best care, so I told him I've had a drink here and there. I was then like "should I not do that?"

his response was "lets talk about your suboxone". so either I've got the coolest sub doctor around, or they just aren't concerned with alcohol use since I have passed every test since I started there. what are your experiences with this? I'm very curious if this is the usual response or if Dr.s are supposed to discourage drinking.

I'm also wondering why that drink hasn't caused me to spin out of control like I've always been told it would. I feel like suboxone might play a role in it. there is some scientific proof that having the opiate receptors filled causes a decrease in cravings in alcoholics (see naltrexone), is it possible that the suboxone is preventing me from having the usual tragic bender/shoveling booze down my throat 24 hours a day that they tell you will happen when you take the first drink? I have enjoyed having a cider at the end of the day, I haven't had more then one in one sitting though and have probably had a drink maybe 2 days out of the week. my parents aren't alcoholics and I'd say I drink about 1/10th of what they do. very strange in deed.

another possibility is that during this year off hard drugs I have grown up a significant amount, and since I am able to objectively look at what drugs have done to me in the past (I was real bad, have robbed vet clinics, ran clandestine cash for gold operations, stolen thousands of dollars from my own family, been in and out of detox dozens of times since I turned 18, od'd countless times). any input would be appreciated, but right now I am very happy with suboxone, and glad that I am able to live my life like a relatively normal person as a result.

thoughts?

 

[gotit4cheap]

In the end this strategy has a good chance of backfiring as I'm assuming you got on suboxone in order to stop using oxycodone. It will take a tremendous ammount of willpower to taper your oxycodone, and if you're going to do it this way, I'd suggest you not get back on bupe after getting back on oxy to get off bupe (lol). Otherwise you might as well just get completely addicted to oxycodone again and then hope you can find it in yourself to do a quick detox with your suboxone.

Thank you man I appreciate it. That part where you said otherwise you might as well just get completely addicted to oxycodone and do a quick detox with the suboxone, that was my plan lol. How long do you think I should be doing oxy before I could take the sub for the 4 days for that withdrawal? the 12 days ? or longer?

 

[AminoAcid]

curious about peoples clinics policies on alcohol.

When I was on Suboxone my doctor always used to ask every visit how much alcohol I had had to drink since last time. For me this wasn't really a problem as I'm pretty much a non-drinker, but he would always make a point of saying the reason he asks is that nearly every time he's had people OD on Suboxone it involved alcohol, people just don't realize how dangerous the combination can be.

 

[Coraline]

^ very interesting.

 

[Znegative]

Thank you man I appreciate it. That part where you said otherwise you might as well just get completely addicted to oxycodone and do a quick detox with the suboxone, that was my plan lol. How long do you think I should be doing oxy before I could take the sub for the 4 days for that withdrawal? the 12 days ? or longer?

Well, ha, I didn't mean to encourage trying it, but essentially you'd probably have to stay on the oxy for around three weeks, and then you'd be better off just kicking CT I think, but I guess you could get back on the sun for a few days and do a quick taper, 4,2,1,.5-jump. (something like that).

As for the general policy on suboxone and alchohol consumption, it's usually looked down upon, as is the administration of any other CNS depressant along with suboxone/buprenorphine. Bupe itself is almost impossible to overdose on due to its ceiling on resperitory depression, but when another depressant is added, chances of overdose increase. I'm pretty sure the few cases of buprenorphine overdose occurred when it was injected with temazepam, though by now I imagine there have been more. In short, you just need to be carefull when drinking or taking benzo's while on suboxone.

 

[gotit4cheap]

Well, ha, I didn't mean to encourage trying it, but essentially you'd probably have to stay on the oxy for around three weeks, and then you'd be better off just kicking CT I think, but I guess you could get back on the sun for a few days and do a quick taper, 4,2,1,.5-jump. (something like that).

As for the general policy on suboxone and alchohol consumption, it's usually looked down upon, as is the administration of any other CNS depressant along with suboxone/buprenorphine. Bupe itself is almost impossible to overdose on due to its ceiling on resperitory depression, but when another depressant is added, chances of overdose increase. I'm pretty sure the few cases of buprenorphine overdose occurred when it was injected with temazepam, though by now I imagine there have been more. In short, you just need to be carefull when drinking or taking benzo's while on suboxone.

Thank you for your help I really mean it. I couldnt stand the way suboxone was making me feel, Id rather be whacked for a couple weeks than continue taking that shit and taper down. fuck suboxone. Do you think If i did it for 2 weeks it'd work out? I have an extremely fast metabolism

 

[Tommyboy]

Thank you for your help I really mean it. I couldnt stand the way suboxone was making me feel, Id rather be whacked for a couple weeks than continue taking that shit and taper down. fuck suboxone. Do you think If i did it for 2 weeks it'd work out? I have an extremely fast metabolism

Having a fast metabolism doesn't mean much when it comes to drugs. If you use oxycodone for a few weeks then you will probably have a withdrawal more unique to oxycodone than the withdrawal unique to suboxone. They are still very similar though and mostly only differ in duration and maybe intensity depending on your dosage of each drug.

I have actually tapered using oxycodone before and it worked pretty well for a moderate heroin habit. I just tapered down to 20mg really quick and then took a day off, then 10mg, then nothing.

 

[gotit4cheap]

Having a fast metabolism doesn't mean much when it comes to drugs. If you use oxycodone for a few weeks then you will probably have a withdrawal more unique to oxycodone than the withdrawal unique to suboxone. They are still very similar though and mostly only differ in duration and maybe intensity depending on your dosage of each drug.

I have actually tapered using oxycodone before and it worked pretty well for a moderate heroin habit. I just tapered down to 20mg really quick and then took a day off, then 10mg, then nothing.

I was saying do you think 2 weeks of doing oxy every day is long enough, that if I stop and take subs for the 4 days, I'd be good? Or it isnt long enough.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I was saying do you think 2 weeks of doing oxy every day is long enough, that if I stop and take subs for the 4 days, I'd be good? Or it isnt long enough.

To avoid precipitated withdrawal from methadone to Suboxone transition?

It should be long enough, but I have never done methadone. Other Bluelighters will surely comment.

 

[gotit4cheap]

To avoid precipitated withdrawal from methadone to Suboxone transition?

It should be long enough, but I have never done methadone. Other Bluelighters will surely comment.

Nooo lol no methadone. Ive been doing like 2mg - 1 mg of sub for the past 6 months manteinance, a week ago I started doing oxycodone instead, if I continue to use oxy for another week itll be 2 weeks since I took a sub. At that point, can I take a sub for the 4 days of oxy withdrawal, and stop, will I be ok? As in I wont feel any sub withdrawals

 

[Znegative]

No one could tell you for sure, but I imagine that you would still experience some mild withdrawals upon the discontinuation of the suboxone, though they would be shorter than sub withdrawals, followed by a lengthy period of PAWS.

 

[gotit4cheap]

No one could tell you for sure, but I imagine that you would still experience some mild withdrawals upon the discontinuation of the suboxone, though they would be shorter than sub withdrawals, followed by a lengthy period of PAWS.

Ughhh, I guess I should get started on this huh? Should I even bother doing the oxy for the next week or should I just get it over with and take the sub for the next couple days im so tired of being fucking reliant on a drug. It stresses me the fuck out I just wanna be fucking sober!!! no subs nothing

 

[Znegative]

Yeah man, I would just try and get back on the suboxone and taper down to at least .5mg before jumping off. When you do make the jump, having some loperamide and gabapentin around will be helpful. The good news though is that within 14-21 days you'll be feeling a hell of a lot better. The PAWS are tough, but if you're resilient you will get through them. During that period it's important to be active and to try and engage in activity's (sober ones haha) that you usually enjoy (even though you probably won't want to do shit for a while). Eventually your hard work will be rewarded and you'll be incredibly proud of yourself for sticking it through and not giving in that it will all have been worth it.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Nooo lol no methadone. Ive been doing like 2mg - 1 mg of sub for the past 6 months manteinance, a week ago I started doing oxycodone instead, if I continue to use oxy for another week itll be 2 weeks since I took a sub. At that point, can I take a sub for the 4 days of oxy withdrawal, and stop, will I be ok? As in I wont feel any sub withdrawals

Oh, my bad. I got confused.

You'd likely still have withdrawal. I can't say how intense it would be but you would feel it.