Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v3; 2010 - 2022

[Znegative]

^this.

I'm going to merge this with the Suboxone/Buprenorphine Megathread and FAQ.

 

[Hybris]

Keep in mind tussionex is an extended release suspension of hydrocodone so its going to stay in your system longer. Make sure you are actually feeling the effects of w/d's (if you are addicted).

 

[pharmaco-logical]

Hi,i have a question i was wondering if someone might be able to answer for me.(Hopefully this isnt in the wrong thread or has been covered already,if so im sorry,im kinda new here) Earlier today i took 3 50mg Tramadols,All together 150mg,which is a VERY small dose compared to what im used to.I take them when im having w/d's and have nothing else.Well,about 30 min later i managed to run accross a Suboxone (Sublingual strip 8mg/2mg).I took about a quarter of it (wasnt sure how itd interact with the Tramadol) and was fine.BUT...now (about 5 hours later or so) i have the WORST freaking headache ever!!! Anyways,lol.... I was wondering if anyones had this experience before,can i contribute it to the mixing of the two,or is it most likely unrelated? I have 3 Tramadol left and about a 1/2 suboxone left for tomorrow and i really would like to avoid a bad headache again if possible.If its likely caused by mixing the 2,then i wont take the Tramadol tommorow.lol. Thanks in advanced!

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Hi,i have a question i was wondering if someone might be able to answer for me.(Hopefully this isnt in the wrong thread or has been covered already,if so im sorry,im kinda new here) Earlier today i took 3 50mg Tramadols,All together 150mg,which is a VERY small dose compared to what im used to.I take them when im having w/d's and have nothing else.Well,about 30 min later i managed to run accross a Suboxone (Sublingual strip 8mg/2mg).I took about a quarter of it (wasnt sure how itd interact with the Tramadol) and was fine.BUT...now (about 5 hours later or so) i have the WORST freaking headache ever!!! Anyways,lol.... I was wondering if anyones had this experience before,can i contribute it to the mixing of the two,or is it most likely unrelated? I have 3 Tramadol left and about a 1/2 suboxone left for tomorrow and i really would like to avoid a bad headache again if possible.If its likely caused by mixing the 2,then i wont take the Tramadol tommorow.lol. Thanks in advanced!

I'm sorry to hear you have a headache.

I think some people get headaches from Suboxone.

 

[caseface99]

^^ Its a side effect from the naloxone if i recall correctly. The first time I took subutex i was seriously pissed off at the lack off side effects since i had been on suboxone from the prior two years, with side effects. (such as headaches) By the way what's up captain!? I haven't been around in a while but still alive an well.

So I just got back from rehab, to get off of buprenorphine! Be 30 days tomorrow. :D I knew a normal week long detox wouldn't be enough. Took 21 days before i started feeling somewhat alright, even after using heroin and other opiates in low doses for a month prior to help get it out of my system. Trippy! I know, it's ironic. I used bupe to get of heroin, then heroin to get off bupe maintenance. Im so glad i did though. I'm 100% opiate free for the first time in 4 years.

Though i wanted to ask, has anyone else used gabapentin for bupe PAWS? I have pretty severe physical PAWS symptoms when i don't take gabapentin 4 times daily, at 600mgs per dose currently. I"ll get hot flashes, cold sweats/goose bumps, and an extremely uncomfortable tingly feeling in my skin. But gabapentin makes me feel almost 100% normal?? From what i can tell from searching, the mechanism of action of gabapentin is unknown so i can't figure out why it works. Anyone have more insight? because without it i know i would relapse due to the cravings caused by the physical PAWS symptoms. But now i don't have cravings for opiates whatsoever, which is weird after abusing them for 4 years; as well as treating the PAWS symptoms extremely well without causing me any side effects.

 

[gotit4cheap]

^^ Its a side effect from the naloxone if i recall correctly. The first time I took subutex i was seriously pissed off at the lack off side effects since i had been on suboxone from the prior two years, with side effects. (such as headaches) By the way what's up captain!? I haven't been around in a while but still alive an well.

So I just got back from rehab, to get off of buprenorphine! Be 30 days tomorrow. :D I knew a normal week long detox wouldn't be enough. Took 21 days before i started feeling somewhat alright, even after using heroin and other opiates in low doses for a month prior to help get it out of my system. Trippy! I know, it's ironic. I used bupe to get of heroin, then heroin to get off bupe maintenance. Im so glad i did though. I'm 100% opiate free for the first time in 4 years.

Though i wanted to ask, has anyone else used gabapentin for bupe PAWS? I have pretty severe physical PAWS symptoms when i don't take gabapentin 4 times daily, at 600mgs per dose currently. I"ll get hot flashes, cold sweats/goose bumps, and an extremely uncomfortable tingly feeling in my skin. But gabapentin makes me feel almost 100% normal?? From what i can tell from searching, the mechanism of action of gabapentin is unknown so i can't figure out why it works. Anyone have more insight? because without it i know i would relapse due to the cravings caused by the physical PAWS symptoms. But now i don't have cravings for opiates whatsoever, which is weird after abusing them for 4 years; as well as treating the PAWS symptoms extremely well without causing me any side effects.

Damn! I jus tried doing the same thing wit oxy but only took the oxy for 2 weeks.. Im currently using low doses of suboxone for the oxy withdrawal..you think i'm gonna feel terrible after the discontinuation of the suboxone in a couple days? I know I won't feel amazing but as long as I'm not withdrawing or withdrawing bad at least..

 

[Tommyboy]

Need some help. I get subs from VA healthcare and it's free. I've been on ORT [including benzos] for most of adult life- subs for 3 yrs. I take 1-1.5 mg of a prescribed 2 mg dose plus 1 mg K-Pins a day. We must give urine samples monthly. Recently [2 mos ago] they told us we need to fill the cup to near the top. Since then both screens have been negative for subs/k-pins and dr is threatening to taper me off or stop k-pins. Neither is an option for me. I have enlarged prostate which make it difficult for me to fill the cup so I've been drinking at least 2 bottles of water an hr before urine screen. Dr implies I'm not taking dose and I take both every day including subs 3 hrs prior to test. I'm pretty sure either the lab is screwed up or else the water is diluting out the sample??

Anyone else have this problem and/or suggestions?

My only suggestion is to see if the doctor will allow you to come in and supervise your dosage for a few days and then test you the next day. If it still comes up negative then at least he knows that you are being honest and the issue is with the test. I never tested positive for benzos while being prescribed them, and I was actually sent to inpatient rehab since the outpatient place told my PO that I must have been messing with the drug tests since they scripted me xanax and it was coming up negative. Luckily after I got out I went to a different outpatient rehab and they didn't care that I came up negative for benzos despite being prescribed them.

Also, did I even take enough fentanyl to even go through any withdrawals from it??? Is it possible that I any discomfort I maybe feeling is from not taking my subutex since 2pm the day before yesterday??

The withdrawals may very well have been from not taking the subutex. You wouldn't really go through fentanyl withdrawal if you went right back on the subutex after a few days since your body was getting its fix of opioids. I highly suggest lowering your subutex dosage since it is unlikely that you are experiencing any additional positive effects above 16mg. I would try to cut your dose in half down to 12mg, and I think that you will notice that you will have less negative side effects at the lowered dosage, while still experiencing the same positive effects at that dosage as you would at 24mg.

Yea after reading on bupe for hours last night (working midnights) I felt a lot more comfortable with my dosage. I was feeling pretty shitty most of the night so I took my first 4mgs about an hour ago, approx. 16 hrs since my last opiate intake. I was a bit concerned with precipitated w/d's but I seem to be fine so far. My legs are still pretty achy but otherwise I feel ok. I think I may have messed up the absorption a bit due to the unexpected large amt of saliva that ended up in my mouth which cause me to swish around a bit. Also my doc told me to spit everything out and rinse my mouth after it dissolved, haven't really read that anywhere else.. any input on that and/or getting the best out of absorption? I'm going to try and get some sleep now, will probably take the second half this evening right before work. Thanks for the feedback guys, I'm kind of in this by myself at the moment.

I have read a few posts about spitting out your saliva after like 1 minute of it completely dissolving under your tongue. I don't know if it helps at all though. My only other suggestion for you is to keep your dosage low.

 

[caseface99]

I'll tell you what my doctor told me. You can taper all you want, and switch all you want, but if you want to be clean then at some point you just have to take your last opiate, and that includes suboxone. How long were you on maintenance for?


Oh snap. 46 mins ago i made it 30 days clean and sober! not even smoking cannabis anymore.

 

[gotit4cheap]

I'll tell you what my doctor told me. You can taper all you want, and switch all you want, but if you want to be clean then at some point you just have to take your last opiate, and that includes suboxone. How long were you on maintenance for?


Oh snap. 46 mins ago i made it 30 days clean and sober! not even smoking cannabis anymore.

Congrats on bein completely clean! I kno when i'm done Im not really gonna smoke too much either. I was on sub maitenance since like May maybe? April / May

 

[milagro]

Question-

This question is about Butrans patches using them with BT pain meds. You do not have to read the link below because it is pretty much identical to the question I am asking in this thread.

I just wantedto let the mods know I am not trying to double post. I just need an answer to my question here as soon as possible.

My PM doc has been pushing me to take buprenorphine in lieu of Oxycontin for some time now and I have tried it on several occasions. It is not as weak as I used to think. Once at a stable dose, I much prefer it to Oxy (op) for baseline pain because I can take it without worrying about missing a dose and I can wake up in the morning and not be contorted by pain. My final dose of Oxy at bedtime always wears off before I wake up making mornings hell

My doc has me trying a "rotation" of oxy and Subutex. He/she believes that I can take bupe at doses 4-8mg/day and still use my oxy IR for BT pain. I was skeptical but tried it. I was recently stable on the subutex 4-8mg/day and had a bad flare up. I tried the Oxy IR/20mgs and it did not work. I found that I have to stop taking the Subutex for >36 hours before the Oxy IR can work effectively. I am afraid of PWDs if I go too long between doses of subutex.

One member of BL suggested Temgesic but it is not available in the US. I recently spoke with my pharmacist about using micro doses of bupe and he suggested 'Butrans' patches and showed me several different strengths. My doctor is gone for another 3 weeks so I hope I can find some assistance before suggesting the patches when he/she returns.

I want to stop taking Oxycontin and use bupe but I have to have a proven method of using bupe for pain that allows me to use BT meds as well. It is an insurance thing and I have been spending a lot of money out of pocket on the Subutex during this rotation process. The insurance will not cover Oxycontin and bupe at the same time. In fact, it will not cover bupe at all w/o pre authorization from my doctor. So we are trying to figure out how to work bupe into my rotation and leave the Oxy(OP) behind.

Does anyone here use these Butrans patches with BT full agonist opioids like oxycodone hcl 5-15 mg/dose for acute flare ups with success? My current oxy combo provides great pain relief but the constant need to keep my plasma levels high enough and the constant battles with tolerance using the OXY has been a challenge and I feel I can get adequate pain relief from bupe . I haven't used any form of bupe other than
subutex sublingual tabs.

I need to provide ample evidence that the bupe will work in place of the Oxycontin before I ask my doc for a pre-authorization for the subutex. Insurance will not cover bupe in any form for pain control unless I have evidence it truly works.

 

[caseface99]

Congrats on bein completely clean! I kno when i'm done Im not really gonna smoke too much either. I was on sub maitenance since like May maybe? April / May

Thanks man. I was on bupe maintenance since June of '09, with some relapses on heroin here and there - it's been a ride. Took me over a year just to taper, then another year and a half of fucking up and abusing opiates/switching between bupe and full agonists randomly after that.



To the post above me, Im not sure why your doctor is giving you so much damn bupe for chronic pain?? For analgesic effect, LESS is MORE with bupe. That's why the buprenorphine pain patches are prescribed in the microgram range, because the metabolite(s) is a full agonist while bupe itself is a partial agonist/antagonist. Meaning more than a few mgs of bupe blocks your receptors, even from the metabolite. Ask for a bupe pain patch, it will take a week or 2 to stabilize from your tolerance but I bet in the long run your chronic pain will be tons better, 24/7, without a bullshit dosing regime of pills. I know 2 people with chronic pain in person who are TONS happier after switching to the bupe patch. They also don't get the hazy mind full agonists can cause.

 

[Znegative]

^Caseface99 makes some good points. The idea of using buprenorphine for chronic pain at dosages above 1-2mg/day is ludicrous IMO. Subutex, like Suboxone was formulated to treat recovering opiate addicts, not for pain management. Like it was already mentioned, bupe can only be effective for pain control in microgram dosages, which is why the bupe formulas intended for pain management (Temgesic, BuTrans, Buprenex), are all prescribed in dosages under a mg. However, I still think that someone would be better off using a low dose of methadone for their long acting pain med instead, as it's a full agonist which means that you wouldn't have to worry about precipitated withdrawals, or a blocking effect (so long as you stay under 60mg/day) for when you need BT meds.

 

[cire113]

wow this sucks just lost my insurance dr visit is 140;

90 subs used to be free;; now its atleast $500 for 90..

And my stupid Dr refuses to perscribe Subutex..

I have about a years supply left still; i take about 4-6mg a day

Can anyone come up with a reasonable argument to get him to prescribe subutex?

I seriously have no clue why so many drs refuse tex.. He's really smart and i have a good relationship with him

 

[caseface99]

The reasonable argument is that if you want to shoot suboxone, you will - naloxone wont stop you. I did it for a year, and captain.heroin has done it for multiple years i believe - the naloxone is benign as far as that goes (if you're dependent to bupe not full ags), but it can still cause sheisty side effects like headaches and physical discomfort. Look up some side effects and tell your doctor your experiencing them. If he still wont switch you, get a new doctor that will.

Oh yeah.. Not to mention the fact that you just simply can't afford suboxones outrageous prices is a pretty damn good reason for him to do it too.

 

[Tommyboy]

wow this sucks just lost my insurance dr visit is 140;

90 subs used to be free;; now its atleast $500 for 90..

And my stupid Dr refuses to perscribe Subutex..

I have about a years supply left still; i take about 4-6mg a day

Can anyone come up with a reasonable argument to get him to prescribe subutex?

I seriously have no clue why so many drs refuse tex.. He's really smart and i have a good relationship with him

Short of walking into the office and prepping a shot of suboxone and doing it in front of him, the part in bold is a reasonable, valid argument.

 

[caseface99]

^^ Oh yes, i forgot that prescribing doctors still thing you can't shoot suboxone.

Still makes me laugh a little inside.

 

[cire113]

I Feel like he knows the nalaxone doesn't do anything but still won't prescribe Tex... Not sure if he gets kick backs from RB secretly to prescribe film who knows;

It really is a shame; Because i believe also the nalaxone does give me side effects;

Atleast I've been able to stockpile; as i knew this day would come sooner or later..

I guess ill call sub drs on the phone explain my situation and see what they say... I hate the ones that won't even answer your questions without you paying first... Stupid ..

Worst are the Dr's who can prescribe sub usually psychiatrists that make you sign a sub treatment contract saying you will pay them usually a few thousand dollars over X time for Sub treatment.. Its retarded and absolutely used to take advantage of people..

I think I'm gonna just do ibogaine when i run outta sub in a year and pray it works... lol

 

[caseface99]

^ I'm not saying Iboga will work 100% sure, but i haven't met anyone it's failed.

Personally DMT has worked somewhat for me, im 30 full days clean on sober without even a minor craving for anything yet. I still plan on using psychs on occasion but that's it.

 

[syntheticbreakfast]

Hi guys, I'm thinking about combining buprenorphine with pregabalin this weekend, and I'm wondering if anyone has any insight on this combo. I have no tolerance to either drug, and I plan to take between 0.25 and 1 mg of buprenorphine with between 450 and 750 mg of pregabalin. Does anyone know how safe this is? I have taken 6 mg of hydromorphone with 300 mg of PGN before, but I didn't dose the PGN until the hydro was starting to wear off.

I did make a separate thread about this, but I thought I might have more luck here, so I'll just check both for now. Feel free to ignore this post and reply in my thread instead. http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/646754-Buprenorphine-and-pregabalin

 

[Znegative]

The reasonable argument is that if you want to shoot suboxone, you will - naloxone wont stop you. I did it for a year, and captain.heroin has done it for multiple years i believe - the naloxone is benign as far as that goes (if you're dependent to bupe not full ags), but it can still cause sheisty side effects like headaches and physical discomfort. Look up some side effects and tell your doctor your experiencing them. If he still wont switch you, get a new doctor that will.

Oh yeah.. Not to mention the fact that you just simply can't afford suboxones outrageous prices is a pretty damn good reason for him to do it too.

I had the same problem as cire113 for months until I got on medicaid. It sucked, I begged my doctor for subutex, even convinced her that you could inject suboxone just the same, but I was still denied it.