Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

[opiates0924]

is this the future of bupes? and does the film hit you harder than tablets or no difference?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

actually the captain allready has posted the inactives in the film strips and the only thing that could be problematic is the tiny amount of "white ink" than is in the strips but not in the tablets. but I do not think this will cause any major problems, especially considering you allready got rid of a shitload of binders and fillers already that were dangerous to inject(of course without a micron filter)

Titanium dioxide is also a common inactive ingredient in other pills that are commonly shot (Ambien tablets, Atarax tablets, MS-Contin, Opana ER, the old formula of OxyContin, Rtalin-SR tablets) and also some capsules (I belive they do that for the writing on the outside of the capsule though).

Titanium dioxide is insoluble in water though, and the particle size is not large enough to be filtered out by cotton AFAIK (the statistics on inactive ingredient particle size is shaky at best).

Without micron filtering it, I am sure you would have at least some of it in your shot if not most of it. It's definitely not good for you, but doesn't appear to be a huge constituent of the film strip, especially if you scratch off what you can of it.

I already have listed the inactive ingredients for many pills that people see worthy to IV, and the statistics on each inactive ingredient I could find information on, in this thread if you are interested in learning more.

 

[JamtasticX]

is this the future of bupes? and does the film hit you harder than tablets or no difference?

No. They are pushing the strips so they can keep the revenue from a new patent. My Dr. isnt scripting anyone these

Titanium dioxide is also a common inactive ingredient in other pills that are commonly shot (Ambien tablets, Atarax tablets, MS-Contin, Opana ER, the old formula of OxyContin, Rtalin-SR tablets) and also some capsules (I belive they do that for the writing on the outside of the capsule though).

Titanium dioxide is insoluble in water though, and the particle size is not large enough to be filtered out by cotton AFAIK (the statistics on inactive ingredient particle size is shaky at best).

Without micron filtering it, I am sure you would have at least some of it in your shot if not most of it. It's definitely not good for you, but doesn't appear to be a huge constituent of the film strip, especially if you scratch off what you can of it.

I already have listed the inactive ingredients for many pills that people see worthy to IV, and the statistics on each inactive ingredient I could find information on, in this thread if you are interested in learning more.

Isn't that sunscreen? I read about using it to prevent degradation from light, is there any other reason?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Isn't that sunscreen? I read about using it to prevent degradation from light, is there any other reason?

You mean, is titanium dioxide sunscreen? I don't know.

And I'm confused by what you mean when you say "is there any other reason"?

 

[SubDude]

ahh yes see i started a big fiber diet myself when i first got on the Suboxone but it wasnt good enough. the laxatives were needed. I figured taking it every day cant be too good but i really have no other choice but to be constipated which i hate. Its looking like i gotta stay 90 days clean first on the 8mg and then from there the tapering begins

Try 1/3 cup 51% All Bran with a few frozen [cheaper] peaches, blueberries, and blackberries mixed in a blender with about 6-oz of Pomgranate or other fruit jiuce. I had chronic constipation and tried everything and this works best for me. I also try and eat some fruits and vegs [salads] daily. Rarely do i need a laxitive. The above doesn't taste great but you aren't drinking for taste.

 

[KidNapster]

exactly....as long as you know what your doing you can be taking a much smaller dose than your doctor thinks you are taking....fuck him if he says you cant taper yet. Allthough, the benefit to waiting a few months before tapering is that it gives you time to adjust to sober living which is a big mental aspect of being an addict. But, I think you should taper right now...actually, you should drop your dose to about 2-4mg's immediately, you shouldnt have any withdrawal effects, and if you do, take a little more sub until you feel better, and then taper your dose quickly to about 1mg/day within about 1-2weeks. It really isnt a hard taper to do...its not like tapering a heroin addiction or soemthign.....trust me, I know MANY MANY people including myself who have dropped doses like that with no problem whatsoever. And then, once you are on the tiny dose, you stay there for the remainder of your maintanence and when you finally wanna get off, you can lower your dose to like 0.2 mg's with no problem and stay at that for a couple weeks or maybe longer and then jump off from there with little to no withdrawal hopefully. It works for me and it has worked for all the people who have followed my advice exactly(which isnt many people yet, but im hoping more will give it a try).

Yea you are definitely right about immedietly able to tapper down myself now. My doctor within the clinic always reinforces the 90 days clean before we can do anything else which i find bullshit. I know my body and im fine with starting to taper down now. With my experience over the weekend i found that 2mg is the furthers i can taper down to at this time. any less then that i will go through withdrawal. Def 2 mg of Suboxone is doable. Thanks for the advice!

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I would just take some pseudoephedrine (or dexedrine or meth) and let stimulants counteract any unpleasant constipation brought on by buprenorphine use.

That's not good HR advice though as many people find these drugs addictive, plus they aren't something you should ever get to the point of using daily IMO.

 

[KidNapster]

I would just take some pseudoephedrine (or dexedrine or meth) and let stimulants counteract any unpleasant constipation brought on by buprenorphine use.

That's not good HR advice though as many people find these drugs addictive, plus they aren't something you should ever get to the point of using daily IMO.

Its funny because my doctor who is prescribing me the Suboxone knows about my constipation issue since i have brought it up to him. His suggestion was taking 100mg Coalace 2 - 3 pills DAILY. now this striked me as odd since i never felt that taking that many laxatives can be good on the body

 

[ThePharmicist]

You would think so? But no.

With heroin, I would get a really nice long peak and overall high with snorting it. I preferred the 3-4 hour long plateau.

When I tried shooting it, the high was amazing for 15-30 seconds, and the high did last about 1-2 hours, but I found that with IV use, you'll go through a lot more heroin since peaking is often what heroin addicts are "chasing" so to speak.

Honestly, IV Heroin is great. The rush is amazing, so euphoric and pleasurable - instant hard on! (no joke) Buuuuuut, the high that your left with is essentially just sedation with a little bit of euphoria and itching. Smoking does end up lasting a whole lot longer, plus it's a whole lot safer. It's actually waaaay safer for me because I can only get tar, no powder (it comes around but not that often).

So as I've posted in here several times, I've been using heroin for the past 2 and a half months or so. I've tried several times to get back on bupe to no avail. This time I think I may have gotten it, for the past week I've essentially been transitioning from heroin to bupe. I would take 1mg of bupe in the morning, then shoot some dope (which I still felt, regardless of the bupe) sometimes it seemed like the bupe was racing the dope to my receptors, but the dope always won. . . Either way now I've been able to stay on the bupe for the past two days without feeling like utter shit, I've actually felt pretty good. Hopefully I can stay on it now!

 

[JamtasticX]

I'm usually good with subs and stuff, just wondered what you think about this.

I usually get 75mg of Kpin per 30 days, I usually take them all first few days, then I have to get some ( I just walked 25+ miles to get 7x1mg) so I can pass my drug test to get a new script.

Last week I took 4mg of sub + 3-4mg of pins and was nodding hard. It was weird, because i can jump eassily between sub/heroin, but never get fucked up with taking subs, or with benzos I need a ton.

I figured being almost 1 month since I had any, then 1 day two weeks ago that got me wrecked, that maybe with my 7mg of kpin tonight I should be able to get wrecked.

I took 4mg insuffilated at 12, then I just did another 2mg at 8, with 3 kpins in me. I kinda feel the kpins creeeping up, but not much in sense of jam.

What do you think my best bet to get the most out of this night, do another 2mg (I think over 8 would ruin anything.), making it 4mg @ 12, 2mg @ 8 and 2mg @9-9:30. Then should I just take a few more pins and maybe catch a nod.

Newb for asking, and saying answer quickly would be helped since my g/f doesn't like me on here at here house, but its ok, i love her.

Also, I could drink tonight, but that would be a great high, just not what I'm looking for. Its just weird because out of the blue kpin+4mg of sub had me nodding so hard, harder than any dope I've done in weeks.

 

[jamesBrown]

No....after like 2-4mg's of suboxone there really is no more beneficial effect you can get from suboxone if you keep taking more and more. The only thing that could happen would be you get a headache or you feel more tired. Your not gonna feel "better". You really should max out at 4 mg's tops....and as you know I reccommend a much lower dose than that even, but anyway, my point is....i dont reccommend taking any more bupe, its not gonna help in my opinion.

 

[Paulination]

hi all im actually going to experiment on doing a sublingual and nasal dose 4mg nasally throughout the day and 8mg sublingual each day. it will allow for the subutex to absorb inside the nasal membranes and mucuous membranes

 

[SkagKush]

dont use more bupe!!!!

 

[MONSTA!!]

Dropping my suboxone

Hi,


I'm currently on 22mg of suboxone a day, from what I've read and comments made on this site this dose is much to high.

I have a couple of questions -

Today I dropped my dose to 8mg and intend to keep it there, do you think I will experience any discomfort from the reduced dosage? (I've been at 22mg for 3 months)

Also do you think I could go lower? I want to be on the lowest dose that will keep me comfortable. I don't mind a little pain getting there but not to much

Any input would be greatly appreciated as I am relatively new to opiate maintenance.

Thanks
MONSTA!!

 

[JamtasticX]

I did another 2 much later and it just reinforced some of the fading effects + with 7mg kpin + vodka +tagamine.

i mean I'm fcked

 

[Sublimit]

Possibly...I am not sure if I will ever have to quit any time soon though.

I'm not prescribed it for these reasons, I just find it effective for them. I have pain from splitting my toenail at least 1/4th of an inch or so into my toenail. It is very annoying. Otherwise I typically don't have pain.

I use 31G needles every time. They are my favorite! And I probably inject 4 times at least a day, up onwards to maybe 10 times (if I am awake through an entire 24 hour period for instance). I probably average 6 to 8 shots per day.

I have tons of veins I can use. I typically use my hand/wrist ones, all the way to the forearms, the crook, and the other veins running near the elbow/upper forearm.

At the moment I am only using 20 to 28 mcg at a time. So, on average, I am probably only going through 200 mcg per day (spread out) at the most.

I dug this out of the last thread. Im currently doing my subs thing and i mainly use the 29gauge needles and try to stick to a 2mg a day. I've been using just over 4ml of water to 2mg and i see what you mean by shooting multiple times a day, i;ve noticed the subtle benefits of dosing multiple times a day. i'd sometimes use a 3ml barrel with 2.1ml of water giving me 1mg of bupe straight up, but usually i'd try and stick to .6 to .8ml dosing which leaves me with four to se7en shots in a day. it's funny because bupe seems to have 2 come on stages. the first happens the first unit i push in i get a sutle lemon/lime flavour opiate taste and a 1 second hardly noticeable rush. that always seems to happen. even when i dose 1mg at a time i always feel this litteraly like a secod after gently putting pressure on the plunger, I can see why you can dose as you do more clear now. the second come on is about.... roughly 10mins maybe less and again. it is very subtle but noticeable with the more experience i have with IV'ing this drug. I guess it feels like a mild opiate in the sense of body load, and it works great for analgesia and subduing being dopesick to a certain degree, as buprenorphine will always have its limitations. i get some euphoria on the second onset and a static opiate lite head soon after. sometimes i'lll get noticeable waves of subtle euphoria out of nowhere, hours after dosing, but i am on clonazepam which i think might be triggering these spikes in the buprenorphine flow. It is quite good because i've been stable on 2mg for 2 weeks now and i feel like i could go without a full agonist for another 2, and the best part is that i'm stockpiling my monthly oxy script plus all the extra OC and MS contins i get when they're cheap. i bought 20 40mg oc's the other day just because they were cheap and go within one day, my source through in another slide of 40's (10) and and 40x10 oc's for good measure... normally he isn't that generous. my Sub source has just been beaten by more that half price from someone i met recently. lets just say 2x40mg oc(street price) gets me 10 8mg subs i know pricing isn't allows but is that ok to value something by comparison?


Anyway CH those are my thought on buprenorphine, still got that sore toenail I cant seem to find any higher gauge needle that 29 in any of our NSP's but would like to try it. the 29's are fine for me at the moment, although it becoming a bit notiable as i only use the crutch of my elbow's unlike you, maybe i should experiment with my wrist.... still do a filter every day instead of using B water.... i'll swap you plenty of my MF's at cost if you want ie $1AU

I know someone who uses buprenorphine the same way I do for back pain, and they are using doses closer to yours as it works better as an analgesic at those levels.

Glad to hear back from you though - I have been busy too, talk to you later!

yeah i'm finding 2mg a day is enough analgesia for me atm seeing as i'm not working. i'd love to be able to MF a couple of those 40s but i know that i'll have to plan it and i'm quite comfortable TBH. because we IV buprenorphine does that effect the HL or the time it takes to get the full effects from using another opiate? i've heard 40 hours is enough time to wait from the last bupe shot being on 2 mg a day (which is the same as if i was taking almost 8mg sub tongue, i think)

what do you think? If it was more like 72 hours then i'd probably fill one of my tram scripts i got lying around, but i don't think its that long because we IV it right?

Anyway. sorry again for getting back to you so long after, just been in and out of rehab, and now i go to 5 NA meetings a week. being on bupe and having all these full agonists around ( i'm getting 10 60mscontins cheap tomorrow) is just so i will never have the urge to use H ever again. I don't have that urge, and being at NA is helping me in so many ways.... if i was to wait the 40 hours and put 80mg of oxy in a spoon and relapse. then i would have no problem with walking in and identifying myself has 1 day clean. i have so much more respect for opiates now and instead of banging 80mg i will dose 20 twice a day and i thank NA and buprenorphine for giving me power over my addiction and for giving me the ability to stick to a dosing regime. anyway thats enough ramble for now...

bupe is a very versatile drug +1 for it. can't get over people who write it off and say it does fuck all, people that need to be instantly gratified shit me.... right time for another shot

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I dug this out of the last thread. Im currently doing my subs thing and i mainly use the 29gauge needles and try to stick to a 2mg a day. I've been using just over 4ml of water to 2mg and i see what you mean by shooting multiple times a day, i;ve noticed the subtle benefits of dosing multiple times a day. i'd sometimes use a 3ml barrel with 2.1ml of water giving me 1mg of bupe straight up, but usually i'd try and stick to .6 to .8ml dosing which leaves me with four to se7en shots in a day. it's funny because bupe seems to have 2 come on stages. the first happens the first unit i push in i get a sutle lemon/lime flavour opiate taste and a 1 second hardly noticeable rush. that always seems to happen. even when i dose 1mg at a time i always feel this litteraly like a secod after gently putting pressure on the plunger, I can see why you can dose as you do more clear now. the second come on is about.... roughly 10mins maybe less and again. it is very subtle but noticeable with the more experience i have with IV'ing this drug. I guess it feels like a mild opiate in the sense of body load, and it works great for analgesia and subduing being dopesick to a certain degree, as buprenorphine will always have its limitations. i get some euphoria on the second onset and a static opiate lite head soon after. sometimes i'lll get noticeable waves of subtle euphoria out of nowhere, hours after dosing, but i am on clonazepam which i think might be triggering these spikes in the buprenorphine flow. It is quite good because i've been stable on 2mg for 2 weeks now and i feel like i could go without a full agonist for another 2, and the best part is that i'm stockpiling my monthly oxy script plus all the extra OC and MS contins i get when they're cheap. i bought 20 40mg oc's the other day just because they were cheap and go within one day, my source through in another slide of 40's (10) and and 40x10 oc's for good measure... normally he isn't that generous. my Sub source has just been beaten by more that half price from someone i met recently. lets just say 2x40mg oc(street price) gets me 10 8mg subs i know pricing isn't allows but is that ok to value something by comparison?


Anyway CH those are my thought on buprenorphine, still got that sore toenail I cant seem to find any higher gauge needle that 29 in any of our NSP's but would like to try it. the 29's are fine for me at the moment, although it becoming a bit notiable as i only use the crutch of my elbow's unlike you, maybe i should experiment with my wrist.... still do a filter every day instead of using B water.... i'll swap you plenty of my MF's at cost if you want ie $1AU

I like your thoughts on buprenorphine, I also experience most of what you talk about here.

My toenail is finally healed (at least the huge split down the middle is). It took months to heal.

I am also broke but thank you for the offer. The needle exchanges here rarely if ever have anything larger than 27G, they sometimes get donations from people who have passed away (and were diabetics and had tons of extra very much so useable needles) and most of them use 31G's.

Other than two exchanges I have heard of (both of which are in southern California, go figure) I have never heard of any exchanges having 31G's on the regular.

yeah i'm finding 2mg a day is enough analgesia for me atm seeing as i'm not working. i'd love to be able to MF a couple of those 40s but i know that i'll have to plan it and i'm quite comfortable TBH. because we IV buprenorphine does that effect the HL or the time it takes to get the full effects from using another opiate? i've heard 40 hours is enough time to wait from the last bupe shot being on 2 mg a day (which is the same as if i was taking almost 8mg sub tongue, i think)

I don't believe it effects the half life, but it does effect the duration greatly.

I found it was easy to switch from IV buprenorphine to full agonists (when I used to do this, a long time ago) even when my buprenorphine dose was higher.

what do you think? If it was more like 72 hours then i'd probably fill one of my tram scripts i got lying around, but i don't think its that long because we IV it right?

Anyway. sorry again for getting back to you so long after, just been in and out of rehab, and now i go to 5 NA meetings a week. being on bupe and having all these full agonists around ( i'm getting 10 60mscontins cheap tomorrow) is just so i will never have the urge to use H ever again. I don't have that urge, and being at NA is helping me in so many ways.... if i was to wait the 40 hours and put 80mg of oxy in a spoon and relapse. then i would have no problem with walking in and identifying myself has 1 day clean. i have so much more respect for opiates now and instead of banging 80mg i will dose 20 twice a day and i thank NA and buprenorphine for giving me power over my addiction and for giving me the ability to stick to a dosing regime. anyway thats enough ramble for now...

bupe is a very versatile drug +1 for it. can't get over people who write it off and say it does fuck all, people that need to be instantly gratified shit me.... right time for another shot

You can use tramadol while on buprenorphine.

Glad to hear things are working out for you. It's OK you took a while to reply that's no problem.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Why not taper down 2mg per day until you get to 8mg?

-> Suboxone Mega Thread

 

[SkagKush]

damn C.H i was gunna say tram was ok! lol.......

also i like the idea of tapering down 2mg a day


UPDATE

i have an update in regards to my bupe therapy, and in tapering down to a low dose.

i have been on 2mg now for about three and a half pills, so thats two weeks.... last couple of mornings i have got the most "euphoria" or high out of my sub that i ever have.... now that i have stabilized at 2mg SL, its actually a small amount due to BA, i hardly have any in my body and i am getting great results......

layed in bed last couple of mornings half asleep, half awake, just totally happy.....it was awesome.......

having pk oil and blueberry buds also helps

 

[Sublimit]

^^^^^ it is a decent drug and very underrated IMO. i'm still a bit skeptical of the long term effects of nalaxone andbeprenorphine itself. it has been established, but ther;s no long term usage data. the nalaxone is rendered useless because it looses the race dor the receptor and isn't able to rip the bupe out. I've always wondered if subutex 8 mg would be stronger than suboxone 8 mg because of the nalaxone having any minor effect.

is IV'ing subutex exactly the same feeling as suboxone? i iv's subutex 5-6 years ago and it almost felt like H,,,, could have been because it was my first experience with buprenorphine and it is a vague memory,

CH, do you think nalaxone or buprenorphine itself is a long term health concern.... especially taking into account IV ROA? coming into summer now and i'm concious of not just wearing a t shirt becuse of my arms. one is noticable from 1-2 metres away and i've just swiched over to my right. there are som many veins that i've had bad experiances with and are scared to attemped bupe, i just tried my wrist, the one near your thumb with a 29 G and it just went under the skin to i just did it in my usual spots. I never ever used a tornicade during my H days. i only started with IV;n 2ml of oc. i've got good prominent veins, but the usual spots are becoming hsrder to hit.

I want to try different areas. i saw a guy shoot dope up his neck before and i remember him saying it was an instant rush and its no worse than IV'ing anywhere else. is that true? Is there an in-depth guide of injecting in alternate sites with pics?

Its good that we can relate from the bupe and our ROA. i don't regularly keep up to date with your thread but are there many people here that IV as their ROA od choice?

good to hear you're not in pain. its an amazingly strong drug to be able to give analgesia in low doses micrograms

can you be more specific when you say "I don't believe it effects the half life, but it does effect the duration greatly.

I found it was easy to switch from IV buprenorphine to full agonists (when I used to do this, a long time ago) even when my buprenorphine dose was higher."?

30 max? that would be pushing it at a guess. 2mg a day,,,, already used 4 today,[no need to divulge that information - leftwing] but as i was saying. if i;m IV'ing mg a day... ballpark figure... how long until i'm at least able to get 80% of a full agonist? thanks for the tram trick btw. i was on that shite for ages and have taken it on bupe and got no noticable effects from it, but thy;re a life saver when dopesick or swiching to bupe or to another opiate.

Thanks heaps man for replying? sorry bout my spelling but ive had seroquel and clonaz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz