Steroids & sports: IS IT FAIR?

roid-rage is mostly a myth

stunting of growth is possible if used before the growth plates fuse (aka in teens)

the only two proven to cause cancer are anadrol (liver cancer) and tbol (testicular) and in both cases the doses used were large and for a long time

could you elaborate on the abnormal and permanent changes to bodily functions, this can mean way too many things
 
Just so you know animal mother, when you say things like that your really making youself seem foolish an immature. You sound like an idiot.
 
This statement comes from "The National Institute on Drug Abuse" :

Steroid abuse may lead to serious, even irreversible, health problems. Some of the most dangerous consequences that have been linked to steroid abuse include kidney impairment or failure; damage to the liver; and cardiovascular problems including enlargement of the heart, high blood pressure, and changes in blood cholesterol leading to an increased risk of stroke and heart attack (even in young people).

Steroid use commonly causes severe acne and fluid retention, as well as several effects that are gender- and age-specific:

For men—shrinkage of the testicles (testicular atrophy), reduced sperm count or infertility, baldness, development of breasts (gynecomastia), increased risk for prostate cancer

For women—growth of facial hair, male-pattern baldness, changes in or cessation of the menstrual cycle, enlargement of the clitoris, deepened voice

For adolescents—stunted growth due to premature skeletal maturation and accelerated puberty changes, and risk of not reaching expected height if steroid use precedes the typical adolescent growth spurt
 
Children look up to and even idolize athletes. Now given that steroids are dangerous and cause so many health problems, do you really think it's a good idea to send the message that the people they idolize use steroids?
 
I'm still not convinced that most athletes use ped's. However, I have to admit that it is possible. I have to admit that it's possible because there is obviously no hard evidence that would suggest the majority of athletes do or don't. I mean, how could there be unless every single one of them admitted to using ped's and/or took the test for ped's and came up positive. So with all do respect, all of you who are so certain that ped's are so much a part of sports today, where to you get your evidence of this? Can you show me?
 
Eating a peanut can be much more dangerous than steroids. You could go into anaphylactic shock and die. Skydiving is dangerous. Tons of people die from alcohol, and you don't see any death at all from smart steroid use. Acne doesn't affect everybody, and it is curable. Baldness only happens in few people. Liver failure is caused by large doses of some orals.
The side effects are exaggerated by the media.
 
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Sorry, but if I have to make a choice whether to believe multiple doctors / scientists who spent years in college to become what they are who say steroids are very unhealthy and dangerous, if I have to choose to believe them or you, unless your a college educated doctor/ scientist yourself, for me common sense says to believe the doctors and not you.
Also, all of my disagreements with other people are constructive critisizm and never get personal because just because I have a different opinion doesn't mean I have no respect for someone because of their beliefs. So when people say things like "I bet most steroid users on here are healthier than you", or when people like animal mother calls me a bitch and a faggot (I am in fact hetero-sexual) just because my opinion differs , I dont understand these personal attacks. Do I really deserve that?
 
I wasn't attacking you, I was just saying what I think but sorry anyway. I never intend to attack anyone on a personal level, unless they insult me first.. Steroids are dangerous that's true. But not as much as they are thought to be. Being on like 500 mg of test is much healthier than smoking a pack of cigarettes a day, or having a couple beers. When doctors say "steroids can lead to heart attack, liver problems, reproductive issues and male breast growth" that doesn't mean that it will happen to all steroids users. I could say "eating a peanut can lead to death" and that would be very true. But it won't happen to everyone who eats a peanut.
 
Ok flyhighk, I guess I misunderstood you and you didn't attack me.
Sorry. I guess I'm on edge from some of the others here who have
Really insulted me for no reason.
 
cmpetr2k said:
Sorry, but if I have to make a choice whether to believe multiple doctors / scientists who spent years in college to become what they are who say steroids are very unhealthy and dangerous, if I have to choose to believe them or you, unless your a college educated doctor/ scientist yourself, for me common sense says to believe the doctors and not you.
Also, all of my disagreements with other people are constructive critisizm and never get personal because just because I have a different opinion doesn't mean I have no respect for someone because of their beliefs. So when people say things like "I bet most steroid users on here are healthier than you", or when people like animal mother calls me a bitch and a faggot (I am in fact hetero-sexual) just because my opinion differs , I dont understand these personal attacks. Do I really deserve that?
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Doctors PRESCRIBE steroids, by the boatload. What you listed was a bunch of effects that may appear, but probably won't. There are plenty of doctors who themselves jump on hormone replacement for the benefits it provides.

There just aren't that many negative effects from steroid use. It's safer than practically every recreational drug that comes to mind.

The key is to not abuse them. You know what, HR in mind and anything. The actual dosages that would constituents "abuse" are out of this world. If you are healthy and monitor yourself while using you will be absolutely fine. Steroids have been around and been used and abused by people with far less knowledge available to them then we have today. Nobody is dropping dead. NOBODY, show me the bodies and il entertain steroids as this dangerous drug.
 
cmpetr2k said:
I'm still not convinced that most athletes use ped's. However, I have to admit that it is possible. I have to admit that it's possible because there is obviously no hard evidence that would suggest the majority of athletes do or don't. I mean, how could there be unless every single one of them admitted to using ped's and/or took the test for ped's and came up positive. So with all do respect, all of you who are so certain that ped's are so much a part of sports today, where to you get your evidence of this? Can you show me?
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Look you need to address what I'm saying ignoring it for convenience makes me believe you're just here to troll.

The only "hard" evidence of steroid use is a failed test. You won't ever get that. The ways around tests are innumerable, the only way someone fails a test is if they get careless or someone really wants them to. To test for a substance you have to KNOW IT EXISTS. You may know it exists and still be unable to test for it simply due to its nature (HGH). If both of those things do not apply, metabolites that can be tested for leave the system after a given number of days or hours, using that information to cycle off for a test is quite easy. Actually ON TOP OF ALL THAT no organization tests all its athletes. Not a single one, the cost is prohibitive, and its in their best interest not to, a paltry number get screened.

The best way I can make my point is to point out that A-rod did NOT fail a test, he got caught because biogenesis went awol. If it wasnt for that freak occurrence you would still be worshipping him.

Lance Armstrong never got caught. NOBODY associated with BALCO got caught.

Now give THOSE facts hopefully you realize we will never have "hard" evidence. What we do have is anecdotal evidence and LOGIC.

IM STILL WAITING FOR AN INCENTIVE NOT TO USE.

Go on, give me a single plausible one other than the goodness of someone's heart not to use PEDs. YOU CANT SO YOU JUST IGNORE ME.

Steroids absolutely work, if a middling performer gets caught on them you can absolutely bet your life the guys beating them are also on them. At the very top genetic variance only means so much, PEDs can more than make up for what 0.5% a middle of the pav performer lacks, so the guy 0.5% better than him naturally is OBLIGATED to use to maintain his advantage.

Also dude stop getting your feewings hurt. It just doesn't matter than much. I'm very sure you're "in fact hetero sexual" the dude calling you a fuck boy and a pussyhole didn't change that. It was just hilarious. So try not to worry.

You are starting to smell like a troll though. Or just an asshole who has his mind made up that came here to argue instead of learn anything.
 
cmpetr2k said:
This statement comes from "The National Institute on Drug Abuse" :

Steroid abuse may lead to serious, even irreversible, health problems. Some of the most dangerous consequences that have been linked to steroid abuse include kidney impairment or failure; damage to the liver; and cardiovascular problems including enlargement of the heart, high blood pressure, and changes in blood cholesterol leading to an increased risk of stroke and heart attack (even in young people).

Steroid use commonly causes severe acne and fluid retention, as well as several effects that are gender- and age-specific:

For men—shrinkage of the testicles (testicular atrophy), reduced sperm count or infertility, baldness, development of breasts (gynecomastia), increased risk for prostate cancer

For women—growth of facial hair, male-pattern baldness, changes in or cessation of the menstrual cycle, enlargement of the clitoris, deepened voice

For adolescents—stunted growth due to premature skeletal maturation and accelerated puberty changes, and risk of not reaching expected height if steroid use precedes the typical adolescent growth spurt
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Why didn't you start with the cardiovascular stuff? That's probably the most universally agreed dangerous side effect along with the liver toxicity of orals. I mean you make some good points but mix them with so much fluff that the entire thing becomes really hard to believe. If you stuck to cardiovascular problems, baldness, increased chance of infertility (but in no way certain), virilization of women and stunted growth of adolescents than nobody could really say it's not true.

But once you start with fluid retention (passes when the offending drug is removed), gyno preventable by aromatase inhibitors, cancer (only proven for anadrol and tbol and both doses much above normal). And the link between steroids and prostate cancer isn't that clear. Existing androgen sensitive prostate cancer will grow faster with more test. But test actually causing prostate cancer... that links is much more iffy. And roid rage is mostly a myth, an ashole is an ashole weather on a gram of tren or not.

I'm still not convinced that most athletes use ped's. However, I have to admit that it is possible. I have to admit that it's possible because there is obviously no hard evidence that would suggest the majority of athletes do or don't. I mean, how could there be unless every single one of them admitted to using ped's and/or took the test for ped's and came up positive. So with all do respect, all of you who are so certain that ped's are so much a part of sports today, where to you get your evidence of this? Can you show me?
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Two things plot the improvement in world records and discovery of new peds on the same graph and how come nobody on youtube is beating records left and right? I mean they could take as much as they could afford and peds do improve performance and there still isn't a dude clean and jerking 600 pounds on youtube.
 
cmpetr2k, you really seem to have an issue with steroids and it's easy to see where you're coming from considering the type of attention they receive in mainstream media, but coming to a harm-reduction forum for steroids and arguing against them is akin to preaching abortion at a baby shower.

If you want to further your education on steroids and their actual effects on the human body and also dispel a few of the myths that you've mentioned earlier (like "irreversible" health problems), you should take some time to watch a fantastic documentary called "Bigger, Faster, Stronger." Here's a link that will take you directly to the film: http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/bigger-stronger-faster/.

There's also a fantastic National Geographic documentary on YouTube called "The Science of Steroids," that explains what they are, how common they are, and how modern medicine has concluded that most steroids, when used properly, are much safer than mainstream media will have you believe.

I think you need to take a good look at the other side of the equation rather than just what you hear on Fox News and government sponsored sources like NIDA.
 
I certainly haven't been ignoring you, I read all your posts, and I thought I was giving reasons not to use steroids. Look, I'm just a guy who's shocked because if what people here are saying is true, I've definitely been living in the dark concerning athletes using PED's. I guess I've been over influenced by the media who maintain that most athletes don't use PED's. I've never had a discussion so in depth about steroids, and after spending most of my life being influenced to believe steroids are bad and few athletes use PED's and they usually get caught, its hard for me to adjust to the idea that I've been deceived for so long. But I am keeping an open mind, and I am starting to realize that I may have been wrong this entire time. Onetwonine said something that made sense to me and really made me think: "the key is not to abuse them. If you are healthy and monitor yourself while using you will be absolutely fine." That makes sense to me because all drugs are really bad for you when they are over-used excessively, so why would it be any different for steroids. Look, I hope he's right and that steroids ARE safe when used properly and in moderation. I have a membership at a local gym here and work out regularly. But I cant seem to get what I want out of it-the washboard stomach and a defined muscular sexy body. Could steroids be the answer for me? I'm not scared to admit that I've been deceived by the media and wrong about steroids for all these years. I just need to hear the truth, and even several times, to un-do the many years of deceptive influence. I am willing to learn new things and that I was wrong. Also, I am new to this site and don't fully understand some of the terms about the forums, like "harm reduction forum" and "trolling". I came in to this forum thinking that "harm reduction" meant being educated about the harmfull effects. And I have no idea what "trolling" means. I enjoy these discussions with you people and I dont want to break the rules or offend anyone. So could you please enlighten me as to the meaning of these terms?
 
Harm reduction is basically usage of drugs in safer ways. Trolling is when people come to have fun/make fun of people and then just get banned.
You can get a "sexy body" without steroids. You gotta learn to eat/train/rest right.
 
Thank you for educating me. I can assure you I most definitely am not trolling. I have been eating healthy and use a training routine that according to my research is a safe and effective one. I've been at it for about 8 months now, and I have made some progress, but I still can't seem to get the body I really want. After 8 months am I still being to impatient? After the discussions I've had in this forum I'm beginning to consider trying a safe and proper steroid regiment to see if that will take me the rest of the way to my goal from working out. Any advice from you people who know about this stuff would be greatly appreciated.
 
Would it be possible for a separate division of sports to be created which allows use of steroids and other illicit substances? I could imagine it would be many times more entertaining, but I don't know much about steroids or even sports for that matter so I can't envision many of the downsides. Would many professional athletes make a move to the drug-allowing division? Would people continue to use performance enhancers in the drug-intolerant division?
I could imagine that careers for these athletes would be shorter due to health issues from abuse, and perhaps uncontrollable violent outbreaks when emotions become fragile. But I have also read that 'roid rage' is a myth, and Stallone is still going strong so maybe these foresights are incorrect. Just a random thought.
 
cmpetr2k said:
http://www.counselingwashington.com/ardisplay.aspx?ID=60&SecID=131
This is a link to one of many websites that exlain changes in the body due to steroids.
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I'm making MYself look foolish? Bitch, please, do you realize that you came to a steroid forum full of people who understand steroids, their biomechanisms , and every balance and factor that goes into using them properly.....and YOU are hear explaining steroids to US?! And don't fucking tell me that you weren't either
"Ever heard of "roid-rage"? Stunting of growth? Certain cancers caused by roids? Abnormal and permanent bodily functions? If you haven't, perhaps you should do a little research about steroids....."

There you go spouting off the biggest myth about steroids, all matter of factly.

Knowing something that isn't true is ignorant. Coming to people that know more about the subject than you, and repeating things that you only know based on word of mouth, is just fucking idiotic. Bitch, I will debate you about anything, any time, and every time, I will win.
 
cmpetr2k said:
I certainly haven't been ignoring you, I read all your posts, and I thought I was giving reasons not to use steroids. Look, I'm just a guy who's shocked because if what people here are saying is true, I've definitely been living in the dark concerning athletes using PED's. I guess I've been over influenced by the media who maintain that most athletes don't use PED's. I've never had a discussion so in depth about steroids, and after spending most of my life being influenced to believe steroids are bad and few athletes use PED's and they usually get caught, its hard for me to adjust to the idea that I've been deceived for so long. But I am keeping an open mind, and I am starting to realize that I may have been wrong this entire time. Onetwonine said something that made sense to me and really made me think: "the key is not to abuse them. If you are healthy and monitor yourself while using you will be absolutely fine." That makes sense to me because all drugs are really bad for you when they are over-used excessively, so why would it be any different for steroids. Look, I hope he's right and that steroids ARE safe when used properly and in moderation. I have a membership at a local gym here and work out regularly. But I cant seem to get what I want out of it-the washboard stomach and a defined muscular sexy body. Could steroids be the answer for me? I'm not scared to admit that I've been deceived by the media and wrong about steroids for all these years. I just need to hear the truth, and even several times, to un-do the many years of deceptive influence. I am willing to learn new things and that I was wrong. Also, I am new to this site and don't fully understand some of the terms about the forums, like "harm reduction forum" and "trolling". I came in to this forum thinking that "harm reduction" meant being educated about the harmfull effects. And I have no idea what "trolling" means. I enjoy these discussions with you people and I dont want to break the rules or offend anyone. So could you please enlighten me as to the meaning of these terms?
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I hope that this has been a grand learning experience for you, and you can apply this same template of thought to other things in life.
 
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