Skydancer -- A Democratic Bluelight *see first post for link to Skydancer's response*
- Thread starter xtcxtc
- Start date
Mariposa
Bluelight Crew
alasdairm said:
That is one of the most disheartening things I have read in a long time. What a fucking crock.
Alasdair, you are one of the most fantastic mods who have ever graced this site with your presence. I know my Bluelight experience would not be the same without you.
Mariposa
Bluelight Crew
Roger&Me
Bluelighter
xtcxtc said:
that's basically the point I've been trying to get at, but summed up rather eloquently. BL wouldn't be anything without the members, so they're the ones who should have the power.
Out of all you guys, im probably considered the most phreexian, and dave is a good guy. BUT, i am not dave.
OD is classified as a "heavy handed war-zone", which there may have been some, but now, i am a piss-ant about profanity, reckless endangerment, plagerism, doctor shopping, and as we ALL know, people trying to BUY, SEll or "TRADE" drugs, which is INTOLERABLE>
However, i am not gonna let, to the best of my ability and my other OD staff members.
I DO have some issue with a "hierarchy", but i am no blood thirsty anarchist, TV stealing junking. Of course there will ALWAYS be "sweet lady h". i cannot forget about her (she rarely talked back). But i believe ive kicked junk for at the VERY least now.
So how does this fit into the equations. Well, i know i am definately on the lower list, and yes, intelligence, degrees, experience and qualifications dont mean EVERYTHING (excuse the caps if they displease you, i am not yelling, i think of this like music and its more of an accent)..........
I used to call bluelight a "blueocracy", and of course i believe that there needs to be stratifacation of power. I may have enemies against me, but i try to treate this like a court of law, in respect of "NO FAVORITES". But we are all aware that favoritism, despite high number of HITS
(money?) to OD, is still considered and even titled a "war-zone". There is some guerilla bulllshit going on, as in almost every forum (particularly the drug forums), and NO we are getting the intelligent threads, and OD is smack dab in the middle of these "new" forums, such as drug basics and this very new forum "advanced drug discussion". We used to, were, non-egotistically CAPABLE of fielding essentially anything they would throw at us. Evidently, not everyone agreed upon that, though not without their merit.
We need some serious GLASNOST (if you dont know what that is.........
)
OD is classified as a "heavy handed war-zone", which there may have been some, but now, i am a piss-ant about profanity, reckless endangerment, plagerism, doctor shopping, and as we ALL know, people trying to BUY, SEll or "TRADE" drugs, which is INTOLERABLE>
However, i am not gonna let, to the best of my ability and my other OD staff members.
I DO have some issue with a "hierarchy", but i am no blood thirsty anarchist, TV stealing junking. Of course there will ALWAYS be "sweet lady h". i cannot forget about her (she rarely talked back). But i believe ive kicked junk for at the VERY least now.
So how does this fit into the equations. Well, i know i am definately on the lower list, and yes, intelligence, degrees, experience and qualifications dont mean EVERYTHING (excuse the caps if they displease you, i am not yelling, i think of this like music and its more of an accent)..........
I used to call bluelight a "blueocracy", and of course i believe that there needs to be stratifacation of power. I may have enemies against me, but i try to treate this like a court of law, in respect of "NO FAVORITES". But we are all aware that favoritism, despite high number of HITS
(money?) to OD, is still considered and even titled a "war-zone". There is some guerilla bulllshit going on, as in almost every forum (particularly the drug forums), and NO we are getting the intelligent threads, and OD is smack dab in the middle of these "new" forums, such as drug basics and this very new forum "advanced drug discussion". We used to, were, non-egotistically CAPABLE of fielding essentially anything they would throw at us. Evidently, not everyone agreed upon that, though not without their merit.
We need some serious GLASNOST (if you dont know what that is.........
)
ChemicalBeauty
Bluelighter
bong420tripper
Bluelighter
I'm not going to try and pretend that any of what is being discussed here has really ever affected me too much. Bluelight could mostly go either way and it would have very little effect on my experience here. That aside, I still can't help but feel for those who have toiled endlessly for this site, only to get screwed over. The rise and growth of BL seems to eerily parallel that of your generic major corporation today. With that in mind, I'd almost think that from a "business" point of view, things are better being run the way they are now. However, the "business" point of view is not necessarily the right way to do things. People are hurt, ruthless decisions made, you fill in the rest. Odds are if you have put it a lot of time here you can come up with your own "fill in the blank" for that situation, and well, that isn't right.
What am I wondering, not necessarily suggesting, is if a mutiny of sorts could be effective in this situation? If all current mods were to "strike," could the powers that be, be forced to address the situation at hand? Would this ultimately help things or just end up hurting the Bluelight people are trying to save even more? An alternative to a mutiny could possibly be xtcxtc agreeing to cut funding to the site until someone addressed the situation. Again, this could possibly backfire, but it could also work. Of course, it would involve great sacrifice, (We know how hard it is for some people when the site is down for a matter of hours. A cut in funding could result in the site being down for much longer than this.) but I think it could ultimately force the results many of this community's members so strongly want to see.
--
As an aside, I think the idea presented earlier in the thread whereby a vote would take place with Admins getting 3 votes, Super Mods, 2, regular Mods, 1, seems as though it'd be a great idea. Once again though, something drastic will probably need to be done for that even be considered.
Best of luck..
What am I wondering, not necessarily suggesting, is if a mutiny of sorts could be effective in this situation? If all current mods were to "strike," could the powers that be, be forced to address the situation at hand? Would this ultimately help things or just end up hurting the Bluelight people are trying to save even more? An alternative to a mutiny could possibly be xtcxtc agreeing to cut funding to the site until someone addressed the situation. Again, this could possibly backfire, but it could also work. Of course, it would involve great sacrifice, (We know how hard it is for some people when the site is down for a matter of hours. A cut in funding could result in the site being down for much longer than this.) but I think it could ultimately force the results many of this community's members so strongly want to see.
--
As an aside, I think the idea presented earlier in the thread whereby a vote would take place with Admins getting 3 votes, Super Mods, 2, regular Mods, 1, seems as though it'd be a great idea. Once again though, something drastic will probably need to be done for that even be considered.
Best of luck..
tathra
bluelighter
before the post quota (part of what came with wanting to run bl like a business), quality was obviously more important than quantity. immediately after the post quota came into effect, i posted in the thread announcing such things that i was going to stop posting quality stuff and simply post bs one-liners in order to meet my quota. i'm pretty sure others followed my example as well. quality was immediately defenestrated, as we realized taht quantity was the most important thing to the admins. it was a sad day indeed.
about having all the mods go on strike, i've thought about that too, but unfortunately, the admins see the staff as totally replacable, and they are right. if all of the current mods were removed, there would be plenty of "new" people ready to step up and fill the spots, as they do not know of the problems that lie beneath the surface. another big problem of the new guys is that they dont know how things used to be, the total feeling of 'togetherness', 'community,' and everythign else taht we used to associate with this board, so they would simply accept things as they are, thinking thats how they've always been, and things would only continue to get worse from there
about having all the mods go on strike, i've thought about that too, but unfortunately, the admins see the staff as totally replacable, and they are right. if all of the current mods were removed, there would be plenty of "new" people ready to step up and fill the spots, as they do not know of the problems that lie beneath the surface. another big problem of the new guys is that they dont know how things used to be, the total feeling of 'togetherness', 'community,' and everythign else taht we used to associate with this board, so they would simply accept things as they are, thinking thats how they've always been, and things would only continue to get worse from there
Mariposa
Bluelight Crew
I love SLR too much to strike, and I think my colleagues would agree.
The best way to show love and dedication to a project is to stick with it and try to make things better rather than abandoning ship.
The best way to show love and dedication to a project is to stick with it and try to make things better rather than abandoning ship.
tathra
bluelighter
mariposa420 said:
Sebastian's Ghost was a perfect example of this, sticking around after his initial demotion (admin down to supermod) instead of saying "fuckitall" and focussing purely on Erowid.org and everywhere else he is a huge contributer, but he was eventually removed from all of his positions, which shows just how much the administration cares about the contributions of their staff
that was one of teh biggest tragedies of these incidents, in my eyes.
xtcxtc
Bluelighter
- Joined
- May 30, 1999
- Messages
- 1,978
tathra said:Sebastian's Ghost was a perfect example of this, sticking around after his initial demotion (admin down to supermod) instead of saying "fuckitall" and focussing purely on Erowid.org and everywhere else he is a huge contributer, but he was eventually removed from all of his positions, which shows just how much the administration cares about the contributions of their staff
that was one of teh biggest tragedies of these incidents, in my eyes.
i emailed him but no response. can you contact him ?? how could i find him at Erowid ( btw i made v large donation to them, for the first time, last July )
tathra
bluelighter
^ i havent seen him online lately (he's a busy man), but i will relay that you are trying to get ahold of him asap, and i will also link him to this thread 
silverwheel
Bluelighter
This thread has been enlightening. I, a common peasant in the BL world, knew nothing of this until now, but a dropoff in the general quality of the content has been apparent for a while now. It's like the par for content got set back a few levels, and I see lots of quips and opinions floating around but not enough real discussion. I'm so glad to hear that I'm not the only one wanting some change 
oh, and tathra, thank you so much for using the word "defenestrate" in a sentence.
oh, and tathra, thank you so much for using the word "defenestrate" in a sentence.
So if the post quotas go away, can I have my old mod spot back?
I was one of the first to go as a result of the "quantity over quality" policy... that and like Morrison's Lament, I refused to grovel. In fact, I called C22 out, in public, on several occasions.
Adios,
Steve
I was one of the first to go as a result of the "quantity over quality" policy... that and like Morrison's Lament, I refused to grovel. In fact, I called C22 out, in public, on several occasions.
Adios,
Steve
-Thoth
Bluelight Crew
Originally posted by killarava2day
What is the 'post quota' anyway?
mods get sacked if they dont make a required number of posts in a forum.
Like CMB.
What is the 'post quota' anyway?
mods get sacked if they dont make a required number of posts in a forum.
Like CMB.
It also happened to me. Without prior discussion, despite inital assurances such descisions were to be made on a 'case by case basis.' I was only privy to the descision after it had been made. After putting nearly 4 years of work into CEP, it did leave a slightly bitter taste in my mouth.
Not to mention, the forum was subequently then left with only one active moderator: Belisarius. It was months before the go ahed was given to select a new mod. I feel somewhat miffed that I was 'retired' from a busy forum for no specific reason other than a beurecratic desire on catch's part to reduce the ammount of staff involved with the site.
The reason given for this 'reduction' was ostensibly that moderators were milking the 'prestige' of holding a title, and they wanted to cut down on this.
I think that sums up the kind of attitude the management of this site held for its volunteers right there: That they were doing US a favor by letting us engage in the work. All that fucking unpaid, vigilant work. I feel our work wasn't particularly valued at all, in the end.
Pretty damn dissatisfying actually. I'm sad it came to this.
BilZ0r
Bluelight Crew
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2003
- Messages
- 6,675
I'm going to comment only because I was asked to (via that mass email).
I'm a bit of a noob really, and I also don't hang around in the social circels much so I don't really know whats going on. All I can say is really the obvious. There is a surprisingly large amount of ill-feeling being released here, it seems to be that it would be hard for C22 to continue in his current position after this. Even in my short time of BlueLight membership (I used to read back in '99, but I didn't think I knew enough to bother joining), I have noticed the massive increase in moderator drop out in recent times, and to me that means something is truely wrong. When I first became an Admin I was shocked by the "icy" feeling the Staff Forum/MPC had; I honestly thought I might get my moderatorship removed if I made a slight faux pas in there.
I don't know the perfect solution to this problem, and I feel that anyone who thinks they do is either unawear of the situation, or is a bit over confident. Personally, whatever happens, I'd like to see things a bit more out in the open, and have things run (even if not physically executed) by several people. Fine if you don't want to trust newbie mods like me, but there are a huge number of mods I would trust with the future of BlueLight. (and something to make the staff forum a bit more loungey would be nice, I really wish I knew my Co-moderators opinions a bit more)
Finally, I don't know whether this makes me a big hippy, or a pussy, or what, but I'm a bit dissapointed at the level of anger, and what is tantamount to hatred, pointed at Catch-22. I mean, you'd have to be a bit of a hard-ass to think that they guy hasn't worked hard. And he's not evil, he will have tried to do what he thinks is best for BlueLight. Now he's obviously made mistakes, judging by the public opinion in here (unless it's just tall poppy syndrome), but who doesn't fuck up? I just wish people weren't being so mean, you know? If I was him, and I read this, I'd probably be one upset mother fucker. So I hope, Catch, if you ever do read this, that you don't let it get to you too much...
...Maybe I am just a pussy.
I'm a bit of a noob really, and I also don't hang around in the social circels much so I don't really know whats going on. All I can say is really the obvious. There is a surprisingly large amount of ill-feeling being released here, it seems to be that it would be hard for C22 to continue in his current position after this. Even in my short time of BlueLight membership (I used to read back in '99, but I didn't think I knew enough to bother joining), I have noticed the massive increase in moderator drop out in recent times, and to me that means something is truely wrong. When I first became an Admin I was shocked by the "icy" feeling the Staff Forum/MPC had; I honestly thought I might get my moderatorship removed if I made a slight faux pas in there.
I don't know the perfect solution to this problem, and I feel that anyone who thinks they do is either unawear of the situation, or is a bit over confident. Personally, whatever happens, I'd like to see things a bit more out in the open, and have things run (even if not physically executed) by several people. Fine if you don't want to trust newbie mods like me, but there are a huge number of mods I would trust with the future of BlueLight. (and something to make the staff forum a bit more loungey would be nice, I really wish I knew my Co-moderators opinions a bit more)
Finally, I don't know whether this makes me a big hippy, or a pussy, or what, but I'm a bit dissapointed at the level of anger, and what is tantamount to hatred, pointed at Catch-22. I mean, you'd have to be a bit of a hard-ass to think that they guy hasn't worked hard. And he's not evil, he will have tried to do what he thinks is best for BlueLight. Now he's obviously made mistakes, judging by the public opinion in here (unless it's just tall poppy syndrome), but who doesn't fuck up? I just wish people weren't being so mean, you know? If I was him, and I read this, I'd probably be one upset mother fucker. So I hope, Catch, if you ever do read this, that you don't let it get to you too much...
...Maybe I am just a pussy.