Sinning, as Jesus and the church say, is good. Turn or burn Christians.

[Gnostic Bishop]

where do jesus, and/or the church, say sinning is good?

alasdair

Protestants through Martin Luther agree.
“Be a sinner and sin strongly, but more strongly have faith and rejoice in Christ.” Martin Luther

Christians and Catholics agree and sing of sin being a happy fault, due to keeping Yahweh’s Great Plan on track.

The Eden myth agrees as it has Yahweh insuring sin by putting the talking serpent into Eden, --- possessed by Satan, --- and giving her a role.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

And no Hitler to Hell. Same rule applies to ALL mankind. The wage of sin is death.

Good, although that is a lie.

Jesus earned his death. So did the genocidal prick Yahweh.

May they both burn in hell forever.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

Where did I mention Hitler? Making your comment a pontification of nonsense basically. Do you see?

It seems that for now, you are a pseudo-intellectual with your head firmly wedged in an unhelpful location.

You don't have to be that guy bro. Waste of a prefrontal lobe.

I mentioned Hitler, who you should condemn just as much as your genocidal god, if you were a moral person, and not a moral coward.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

I dont think he punishes, its more like a consequence of refusing help that you needed.

Nor do I think hell was ever intended to imply eternal punishment.

It was a reference to a garbage dump basically, that was always on fire. It implies a probably unpleasant and perhaps permanent destruction, not eternal punishment. In my view.

Torture in hell, without purpose, is what you describe, and seem to like and accept.

Your God spends a lot of time pulling wings off flies, then kills them.

You and your god are quite sick in the head.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

Gehenna, yep aka Sheol.

If hell is on earth, do you believe Jesus when he says heaven is also on earth?

Gnostic Christian Jesus said, "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all.

[And after they have reigned they will rest.]"

"If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you.

If they say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.

Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.

[Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father.

But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."

As you can see from that quote, if we see God's kingdom all around us and inside of us, we cannot think that the world is anything but evolving perfection. Most just don't see it and live in poverty. Let me try to make you see the world the way I do.

Here is a mind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that can possibly be, given our past history, or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

That means that we live in the best of all possible worlds, because it is the only possible world, given all the conditions at hand and the history that got us here. That is an irrefutable statement given entropy and the anthropic principle.

Regards
DL

 

[morpher001]

Bait isnt even very tasty anymore

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

Bait isnt even very tasty anymore

To the brain dead, correct.

Regards
DL

 

[Shady's Fox]

am eatin cheesecake

listen bro

shut up and post that quote

with they came for what was

 

[alasdairm]

Protestants through Martin Luther agree.
“Be a sinner and sin strongly, but more strongly have faith and rejoice in Christ.” Martin Luther

Christians and Catholics agree and sing of sin being a happy fault, due to keeping Yahweh’s Great Plan on track.

The Eden myth agrees as it has Yahweh insuring sin by putting the talking serpent into Eden, --- possessed by Satan, --- and giving her a role.

that is interesting, and tangentially related, but doesn't really answer the question.

where does jesus say sinning is good?

thanks.

alasdair

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

that is interesting, and tangentially related, but doesn't really answer the question.

where does jesus say sinning is good?

thanks.

alasdair

If not good, why do Christians say it is in their hymn and ideology?

They, like myself, extrapolate that from the bible.

Psalm 51:5 "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me."

It says we are born sinners and if created by god, we must be in his image and scriptures show Yahweh to be quite the sinner, given his genocidal ways.

Regards
DL

 

[alasdairm]

your thread claims: "Sinning, as Jesus and the church say, is good."

where does jesus say sinning is good?

thanks.

alasdair

 

[mokele]

I believe in spirituality heavily. Just not too religious. The only one I agree with is Paganism, but i'm still not going to call it home, Because I personally want to live a free life and grow up free of religious guidelines and "sins" fuck that we as humans are made to make mistakes. Just do what's morally right and not what others would find disturbing you know

You really mean your signature??
There is a devil in every culture, be it Ginns in the arabic World or those horned, evil entitys in China. Evil spirits in Africa, etc.
The american Way of cultic religion is not my stuff, nor do i think the Pope stands between us and God. I am on no side except on Jesus Christs! If the devil ever pulled something big off it was to make the World believe he doesnt exist. And if hell exists, would you believe that old liar you can actually have a comfy place there?? There is a ongoing battle between good and evil on this World.
I find wise Words in the Bible, esp the New Testament!!! I lived long without any even thinking about such things. But i have my own testimony which gave me FAITH. And that noone can take away from me or talk me out of it!!

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

your thread claims: "Sinning, as Jesus and the church say, is good."

where does jesus say sinning is good?

thanks.

alasdair

It would be silly to think that Jesus would hate sin and lose his position as savior. He was chosen for that even before the potential for sin, so he would be sitting back and waiting patiently for it so that he could do what he was chosen to do. Die for us.

If sin is the happy fault and necessary to god's plan, as the hymn suggests, and the church speak for Jesus and Christianity, then Jesus is on board with his religion in thinking sin is good, as it is necessary to keep god's plan on the rails.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

I find wise Words in the Bible, esp the New Testament!!! I lived long without any even thinking about such things. But i have my own testimony which gave me FAITH. And that noone can take away from me or talk me out of it!!

What does your bible say? I adlib.

The wisdom you see is garbage to god.

I will not attempt to change your view of Yahweh, but tell us how you can justify his many mass murders and how you can be in Jesus' corner when his Armageddon is Jesus doing another mass murder.

Would a good god kill or cure the afflicted?

Jesus said he came to cure, and here you are adoring a god who will come to kill.

Regards
DL

 

[alasdairm]

It would be silly to think that Jesus would hate sin and lose his position as savior.

maybe. but that's not what you said.

you said, quite plainly, that (paraphrasing) "jesus says sinning is good"

well, if he does, it should be pretty simple to point out where he says that. except you can't or won't.

tell us how you can justify his many mass murders

what on earth are you talking about? i've said nothing about justifying mass murder.

i feel like you are adding 2 and 2 and getting 10.

so, i'll answer your op - "jesus says sinning is good" - thus: no he doesn't.

alasdair

 

[mokele]

Thanks for the compliments.

Gnostic Christianity does not agree often with the bible or Christianity but in this case we agree. The Exsultet hymn says that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary. It is when you consider our evolution and how losers to competition will think evil has befallen them.

Christians have forgotten how to do their apologetics on this. The logic is that without sin, there would be no laws to regulate the level of sin. Religions are all about laws or rules for us. Take away sin and you have no need of laws and commandments.

Other than that, I do not think sins are shown in scriptures to have much value or be good.

Consider though how the Jews originally and still see Eden as where man was elevated and not where we fell. They do not see Original Sin. They see Original Virtue.

The Original Meaning Of Original Sin

In an overview of Judaism and Christianity, Kenan Malik contrasts their understandings of evil and sin: The story of Adam and Eve, and of the serpent in the Garden of Eden, was, of course, original…

dish.andrewsullivan.com

Regards
DL

Interesting. But i think you cant read the Bible like a Book. Much is a Allegorie ( hope thats correct in english) and there is a meaning which doesnt immediately show hidden behind many words. Also not to forget the Bible was translated, rewritten, had pages torn out etc over the centurys. Love is a universal force and Faith, real Faith is a powerful and wonderful gift.

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

maybe. but that's not what you said.

you said, quite plainly, that (paraphrasing) "jesus says sinning is good"

well, if he does, it should be pretty simple to point out where he says that. except you can't or won't.


what on earth are you talking about? i've said nothing about justifying mass murder.

i feel like you are adding 2 and 2 and getting 10.

so, i'll answer your op - "jesus says sinning is good" - thus: no he doesn't.

alasdair

Who is the head of the church?

Jesus.

The church sings that Adam's sin is a happy fault and necessary to Yahweh's plan.

If you do not have the whit to connect the dots, -----

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

Interesting. But i think you cant read the Bible like a Book. Much is a Allegorie ( hope thats correct in english) and there is a meaning which doesnt immediately show hidden behind many words. Also not to forget the Bible was translated, rewritten, had pages torn out etc over the centurys. Love is a universal force and Faith, real Faith is a powerful and wonderful gift.

We read in a similar way.
I read the bible as myth, not history. Almost none of it can or should be taken as literal or historic.

As to your last on faith. Yuk buddy. Please read this old O.P of mine.

Faith closes the mind. It is pure idol worship.

Faith is a way to quit using, "God given" power of Reason and Logic, and cause the faithful to embrace doctrines that moral people reject.

The God of the OT says, “Come now, and let us reason together,” [Isaiah 1:18]

How can literalists reason on God when they must ignore reason and logic and discard them when turning into literalist?

Those who are literalists can only reply somewhat in the fashion that Martin Luther did.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”

This attitude effectively kills all worthy communication that non-theists can have with theist. Faith closes the believers mind as it is pure idol worship.

Literalism is an evil practice that hides the true messages of myths. We cannot show our faith based friends that they are wrong through their faith colored glasses. Their faith also plugs their ears.

Regards
DL

 

[mokele]

What does your bible say? I adlib.

The wisdom you see is garbage to god.

I will not attempt to change your view of Yahweh, but tell us how you can justify his many mass murders and how you can be in Jesus' corner when his Armageddon is Jesus doing another mass murder.

Would a good god kill or cure the afflicted?

Jesus said he came to cure, and here you are adoring a god who will come to kill.

Regards
DL

Well,who rules the World? (!).I dont claim to understand the New Testament and dont want to repeat my other posts on this. I dont quite get why you are so feverish trying to make others beliefs look ridiculous, if you are american i can somewhat understand your hate, if you tried that in a muslim country you would very fast have no more arguments coz theyd shoot you. Are you maybe a muslim or satanist? Satanist i dont think cause they know, only work against the soul. I think you at least believe in your soul (?). We could go through this point for point but you have your belief, so be it, respect others, that is not much to ask.
But Jesus Christ will come back, if in this World or after death is another question.
I have my testimony after decades of not even thinking and laughing about the whole thing. But now i have Faith! I dont belong to any religion. I believe because i know. I would love to share it with you but i fear it is too personal and it was cut for me ( some things i cant word so good in english, xcuse that ).
It gave me Faith and that will never go.
Why are we even arguing?? Let each believe what they want as long as they dont harm the next Person. Stay safe and healthy you ALL through these hard times

 

[Gormur]

There is a devil in every culture

Devils are very much a Christian concept. Judaism doesn't have devils