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Side effects of heavy psychedelic use?

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OctalBacchus115

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Jun 11, 2013
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Anchorage, Alaska
I'm currently taking care of a patient who has noticed some negative side effects from what he assumes are related to his heavy drug use, mainly psychedelics.

Recently he has noticed that he will completely lose his train of thought, sometimes when talking sometimes when just thinking to himself and not be able to recover the information no matter how hard he tries. May I add, my patient is only 15 years of age and has been diagnosed with major depression at an early age so that may have something to do with the seriousness of the issue. My patient has experimented with LSD, TMA-2, DMT, Shrooms, 2ce, 2c-t-7, and NBOMe's. NBOMe's being by far the most commonly used.

My patient's close friend (16 years) that shares his interest in psychedelics, especially NBOMe's, has been experiencing the same symptoms.

Even with my experience in mental illness, I am not able to diagnose my patient and he is quite scared, if there is anyone on this forum who has some type of similar experience, please speak now. Those who are able to, please explain in detail how and why my patients body is doing the things that it's doing in reaction to the psychedelics. Thank you.
 
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I have noticed that there are long term effects from taking psychedelics too regularly. They tend to be more about mind than brain though. For instance, the user's personal reference point drifts slightly from what we have defined to be consensual reality. Whether this is good or bad depends on what you think about the value of consensual reality. These effects get better after a period of abstinence.

As for more quantifiable effects, anecdotal evidence suggests that it's totally possible with chronic use to fry the brain. Little research has been done into this as far as I know and I assume that each compound would do this a little differently. The psychedelic community would generally consider that tripping could be bad for things like memory function if it becomes an abusive pattern. So use every month or so is considered relatively safe while taking something 3 or 4 times a week for a long period of time is risky. Think of it like this, you would be concerned if your patient was drinking three bottles of wine a day but not if they were sharing a bottle over dinner once every week or two.

This is speculative and based on personal experience. Others might or might not agree.

Also consider that NBOMe substances are new and their long term effects are unknown. However their method of action is unlikely to be very different from other psychedelic phenethylamines. You're sure to get a flood of posts now from the 'LSD is the only valid psychedelic' camp. They will use the opportunity to demonise some psychedelics in favour of others. Do what you will with their opinions - they are as unqualified to tell you that NBOMes are dangerous as I am to tell you they're safe.
 
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I'm a little confused. A short while ago you (OctalBacchus115) posted a question regarding heavy use of NBOMe series compounds, specifically 25I, and spoke as if you yourself were consuming them. Now you post as if you are a mental health professional who is taking care of a patient who uses (abuses?) NBOMe series compounds. Which is it? Are you a health-care professional who is using your patient's forum account for fast access to Bluelight in order to query a large number of potential NBOMe users in order to build a picture of what this compound may be capable of vis-a-vis physiological/psychological damage? Or are you just using a more creative form of non-self-incrimination ('SWIMming')?

Either way, I'd like to help as much as I can, as I am sure the rest of the forum does as well. If you are just pretending to be a physician though, I would suggest that you just be straight and tell us, as we will probably be able to help you better without lies or half-truths.

Now then, I can tell you that I have consumed 25C-NBOMe probably 20-25 times without any lasting negative effect. I have experience with many other NBOMe series compounds as well, but 25C has proven to be my favourite so far. I have noticed lingering visual hallucinations for anywhere from 2 days to 2 weeks (depending on the dose) after consuming 25C, but I have noticed this with many of the other multitude of chemicals that I have consumed as well, so this is not anything particularly unusual or frightening for me. I have not encountered any other unusual or lasting effects, positive or negative whatsoever. This is not to say that it is impossible, as I have quite a lot of experience with psychedelics, both established and of the so-called "research chemical" variety, and have never experienced any lasting negative effects, so I may just not be predisposed to such things. Still, at least it's one point of data you can add to your survey.

Do you/'your patient' have any sort of history of mental illness other than the depression mentioned. Any family history of the same? How about any history of unusual or erratic behaviour? Have you/they experienced any unexplained mental symptoms such as auditory, visual, tactile, or olfactory hallucinations while not under the influence of any substances? How about paranoia? Any obsessive-compulsive behaviours such as unusual fixations with even or odd numbers, cleanliness, persistent unwanted unpleasant thoughts regarding violence (physical, sexual, etc) against yourself/themselves, loved ones, animals, or humanity in general? Have you/they ever watched TV, listened to the radio, read a book, or browsed the internet and become convinced that what they saw or heard was directed specifically at you/them, either to deliver a secret message or to mock/insult you/them? Have you/your patient found that you/they are sometimes unusually active and stimulated, with a seemingly endless supply of energy and a desire to spend money, have sexual intercourse, go long periods without sleeping, or do other such things that are out of the ordinary for you/them?

If you/they answered in the affirmative to any of these questions, it is possible that your/their psychedelic use has triggered or exacerbated a mental illness that had either not yet presented itself or had gone thus-far-undiagnosed. Your/their depression would/should have been a very good indicator that you/they should have been very cautious with your/their consumption of mind altering substances. Either way, the thing to do at this point is to cease all consumption of psychedelics and marijuana at the very least, and see if things improve. If I am addressing a physician, consider a full psychiatric evaluation, as there may be much more going on than the patient has been forthcoming about or is even aware of.

If I am speaking to the individual, please man, don't take any more NBOMe series compounds, or any other psychedelics for that matter, and definitely abstain from marijuana. I have heard of other people who have experienced such confusion after protracted use of psychedelics, and the damage has never been permanent in any of those cases. All that was required was that the individual take a break, and let their mind return to baseline. Maybe take this opportunity to look at things objectively and ask yourself why you are consuming psychedelics so heavily.

I hope this has been helpful, I wish I could offer more. If you/they have any more questions or concerns, I'm sure the whole forum will do whatever they can to help. I know I will.
 
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SeenSoFar said:
If I am speaking to the individual, please man, don't take any more NBOMe series compounds, or any other psychedelics for that matter, and definitely abstain from marijuana. I have heard of other people who have experienced such confusion after protracted use of psychedelics, and the damage has never been permanent in any of those cases. All that was required was that the individual take a break, and let their mind return to baseline. Maybe take this opportunity to look at things objectively and ask yourself why you are consuming psychedelics so heavily.
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I am indeed using a creative form of "SWIMming", I don't see how your answer may differ if the question were to be asked at a different perspective, but you helped nonetheless. I am already planning on taking a break, I've been contemplating it for a really long time, and it's simply not healthy the way that I'm doing it and I need to break that habit. It gives me hope after hearing that all the people you know with a similar problem have been able to return to how they functioned before by simply taking a long break. My only fear is that I may not be as lucky and may stay this way even after stopping because at my age, my brain is still developing and may continue to develop with this disability.

Does anyone have any tips on how to stop using psychedelics? I'm not addicted, but I've become accustomed to the lifestyle and when school starts I have to submit to random drug testing preventing me from using marijuana as well which has been my favorite drug for years now. I guess I'm looking for some other drug to replace the ones I can't/shouldn't be doing, but I don't know if there is one.
 
MBOMe's active dosage is in the micro grams and I have seen it for sale in the 1-25 (always wonder if someone actually ever buys that much) gram range. It's apparently blood soluble and if I assume its a he has been taking it without measuring anything you need to get an estimate on how much of it he has taken. In a way it's to late to work about now but it will give an estimate on how long it might take to get out of his system
 
I myself went through a period of psychedelic abuse several years ago following a period of depression. I mainly used 2C-E, 2C-I and 4-AcO-DMT on different days along with JWH-xxx compounds, adding in a few others from time to time. Altogether I was tripping about two times a week, often with mid-range doses of cheap powder methylone. The symptoms I experienced were far worse than what you're describing and included at times a total loss of connection to reality, severe anxiety, scrambled thinking, visual distortions, hypomanic episodes, and hearing hidden messages in songs or getting weird meanings from ordinary television shows that somehow related to my life. All in all I was completely dysfunctional.

A month of sobriety (including weed and alcohol) and good diet/exercise and I was able to function normally again. Two more months staying away from drugs and I felt completely normal with no residual side effects. The only substance that helped during this time period was xanax that I was prescribed by a doctor to help with panic attacks related to delusions from this abuse.

The brain is very resilient to abuse such as this in most cases, so unless you've triggered some underlying illness I wouldn't fret just yet. Take it easy for a while and make sure you're maintaining a healthy routine. As for tips on stopping use, just find new hobbies. Remind yourself of the damage you've done and how it could get worse if you don't stay away. Also stop checking vendors and sources you used to obtain these compounds as new items may perk your interest again. I'd suggest deleting these from your bookmarks or however you may have them stored. Try to hang around people who don't use drugs for a while as well.

I should add that I've been able to do psychedelics and other drugs since, but it was about a year off before I even attempted a low dose again. Stay safe when using anything after your break if you should choose to partake again.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
Indeed. I know people who binge on various psychedelics or who are heavy users of them and this happened to them. These are both psychedelics like LSD, mushrooms, cannabis, and DMT, and research chemicals.
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I'll add that I've had huge binges of 2C's and nbomes and my only side effects were depression, heavy visual artifacts, and lessened quality of psychedelic trips.
 
yeah really, you can't diagnose someone that is on drugs, so OP is stupid. EDIT: sorry i should have known it was a SWIM type deal lol

side effects of heavy use? having an open mind? HPPD? after heavy use you can experience a psychotic break or episodic depression/anxiety/PTSD but it all depends on the person. It can certainly bring out mental illnesses earlier than they would have come out but only in people with underlying mental illnesses.

if you're young you may be susceptible to becoming a new age hipster spiritualist or something, that's pretty serious but rare.

really, psychosis is a risk, HPPD does happen but big deal, i have been a heavy psych user since 17, and have had thousands of trips, wouldn't have it any other way.

EDIT:

Sorry, i now see that you're only 15, jesus christ how did u get your hands on tma-2 but anyway, it's not so much that your brain is developing that is the issue, it's that your sense of self is developing too. You need a strong ground/base before you start messing with it using psychedelics and you just haven't had enough time to experience life to establish that. The side effects for such a young psych user cannot be predicted but if i had to guess, you may end up with loose associations with reality, a very different way of thinking (not such a bad thing), HPPD, anxiety if you can't integrate your experiences or understand them and possibly psychosis and substance abuse issues in your future.

How to stop? well stop chasing that high, psychs aren't recreational (some are but you shouldn't use them that way). If you want to get high - well at 15, i can't recommend anything except cannabis but cannabis is no good if you are in the mental state you describe, stay far away from it. If i were you i'd get out of whatever scene you are in and find good people to be around, work hard in school and when you're 18 or 19, you can go play around with psychedelics.

Drugs aren't going to go anywhere, you can always use them later in life, but you can't get back those teenage years or recover from the shit you cause during those years. If you work hard now at making a good life, it will pay off big time when you are older and you will enjoy psychedelics and drugs far more if you are successful, happy and fulfilled before you start using them on any sort of regular basis.

Perhaps speaking to a counselor about your goals in life and what you want to do and accomplish will help. Psychedelics are great but you have to be prepared to use them, they are not toys, they will fuck you badly if you don't know what you are doing.
 
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I don't think psychedelics will cause permanent damage, but as others have said there are definite side effects to be noticed after heavy use.
When I was using psyches a couple times a week for the better part of 3 months I had difficulty concentrating and it worsened my social anxiety

EDIT: These kids you're "taking care of" should also note that they are very young, their brain is in crucial development stages, which can be harmed or hindered with drug use.
You only have one brain, hold off on the drugs they have the rest of their lives to experiment.
 
OctalBacchus115 said:
. My only fear is that I may not be as lucky and may stay this way even after stopping because at my age, my brain is still developing and may continue to develop with this disability.
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Try not to convince yourself that your effects are worse than they appear. Excessive worrying about it is pointless. At your age the brain is very flexible and can recover quite well from a bit of chemically induced neural disharmony.
Having a break when you notice things becoming stranger than usual is quite important, for if you don't there may be the chance of the psychedelia leaking into everyday reality. (gasps)

RobotRipping said:
if you're young you may be susceptible to becoming a new age hipster spiritualist or something, that's pretty serious but rare.
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Lol , I am one of those. Its great.
 
elucidator said:
Try not to convince yourself that your effects are worse than they appear. Excessive worrying about it is pointless. At your age the brain is very flexible and can recover quite well from a bit of chemically induced neural disharmony.
Having a break when you notice things becoming stranger than usual is quite important, for if you don't there may be the chance of the psychedelia leaking into everyday reality. (gasps)



Lol , I am one of those. Its great.
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That's not what happens. When that happens it's called psychosis and is not at all similar to psychedelia. No big deal I just don't want people getting the wrong idea, plenty of people already think psychedelics make you temporarily crazy.
 
^^^ I was referring to HPPD which is vastly less serious. I don't think having bits of psychedelia in my everyday reality to be to be such a bad thing.
I know what you mean, I have been trying to show people that psychedelics make you temporarily saner than previously (shows more of the big picture).
 
bloodshed344 said:
That's not what happens. When that happens it's called psychosis and is not at all similar to psychedelia. No big deal I just don't want people getting the wrong idea, plenty of people already think psychedelics make you temporarily crazy.
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Just because you have not experienced it does not mean it is not real. To anyone who does not feel like LSD can cause permenant or long-lasting LSD-like effects (very similar to a low dose ~75ug) I would question whether or not you are getting real acid.
 
^as opposed to fake acid? lol i've had real clean perfect LSD like 10 years ago that was amazing with just one tab and weaker LSD as well but just a few doses of it won't bring out anything that wasn't there already. There's no doubt a percentage of people lose their shit from even their first psychedelic trip but the vast majority of people do not. The heavy abusers of us end up with HPPD and perhaps a different way of thinking but that's about it.

if you have long lasting effects like that of a low dose of LSD you have HPPD and/or are just slightly different from the average bear. It is a risk of heavy abuse of psychedelics, not once or twice kind of thing, like years and years of heavy psych use. I have HPPD but it took a serious amount of psych use to cause it. Either way, nature looks prettier with HPPD anyway.
 
RobotRipping said:
^as opposed to fake acid? lol i've had real clean perfect LSD like 10 years ago that was amazing with just one tab and weaker LSD as well but just a few doses of it won't bring out anything that wasn't there already. There's no doubt a percentage of people lose their shit from even their first psychedelic trip but the vast majority of people do not. The heavy abusers of us end up with HPPD and perhaps a different way of thinking but that's about it.

if you have long lasting effects like that of a low dose of LSD you have HPPD and/or are just slightly different from the average bear. It is a risk of heavy abuse of psychedelics, not once or twice kind of thing, like years and years of heavy psych use. I have HPPD but it took a serious amount of psych use to cause it. Either way, nature looks prettier with HPPD anyway.
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I find that completely bullshit. One does not need to have an underlaying issue to experience side-effects or psychosis from psychedelics. I know many, many people who have been using these tools for quite a long time and have similar effects to me. I am not just talking about HPPD, I am talking mental-metaphors and transcendental experience and visuals etc... I suggest you look up my thread 'Mass psychedelic user delusion/denial' :-)
 
That's pretty much what he said, HPPD and a different way of thinking. It's only how you deal with it that makes it tough, some people experience things with more weight than others. It doesn't mean that psychedelics make you crazy or anything and with abstinence, health and time it will get better. Once I stopped caring the after-images went away. Sometimes see one in my peripheral vision, but nothing I worry about.

Agreeing on the way nature looks on HPPD, been wondering for a long while why nature looked so much better but now I realized I'm just tripping soberly. Same goes for light, much prettier than before :)
 
yes i participated in that thread lol No, one does not necessarily have to have an underlying issue to experience side effects or psychosis, but if they don't have an underlying disorder, then whatever they experience is most likely temporary ie. will go away.

if you were going to be a paranoid schizophrenic at age 23 but you took LSD at 19, well in that case you just brought it out earlier, it was going to happen anyway. If you are 19 and were never going to be schizophrenic and had drug induced psychosis, it'll clear up and go away and you'll be back to normal after. If you were to keep using heavily from that time onward though i'd expect the same results as i or you have.

I've had psychosis from psychs, but i'm definitely predisposed to psychosis anyway. I think of things in a state of mind that is pretty damn close to psychosis most of the time but i'm by no means what anyone would call 'psychotic' I think most of us psychonauts are like this anyway, bordering on insanity/sanity at all times. The vast majority of people i have encountered do not even want to enter this kind of territory though and will use psychs a few times then never touch them again.

hell i have similar effects that you have and i'm a heavy psych user (tripping right now in fact) but psych use has been so integral to my life that they are inseparable. But for a person with absolutely no indication of mental health issues they aren't likely going to be affected in the same way - fuck i'd even just give it a 50/50 shot as psychs are unpredictable as the people who take them, seems like a small percentage of people flip from either the first dose or first few, others never take them again and the last bit of percentage end up as psychonauts bordering on the edge of sanity/insanity what's real what's not, an accepted side effect of the lifestyle.

In that thread i mention that it's definitely a risk you take with psychs - they can be unpredictable. Even one dose, whether the first, or one of many, can be the one that sends you for a huge spin. They aren't drugs to fuck around with. The side effects i mention above though are still true. I don't mean to minimize the side effects as they are significant, but i think once you are that heavy of a psych user you kind of know what you got yourself into anyway and accept things as they are.
 
I'm just curious, since what you initially described sounds like impaired short-term memory, if you smoke cannabis? That might have something to do with it if it's happening while stoned.
 
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