Side effects of heavy psychedelic use?

[atara]

Broadly speaking, side effects from psychedelics are kind of hard to predict and many may be psychosomatic. This is not to say they are strictly placebo, but that awareness or expectation of the side-effect substantially modifies it. A psychosomatic effect may be nonetheless very real and serious: the prototypical example is an asthma attack brought on by anxiety. Psychedelics can encourage delusive thinking (e.g. Terence McKenna, oh yes I said it), which exacerbates the potential for psychosomatic phenomena.

A remarkable feature of psychoneuroimmunology is that psychedelics can on occasion be able to modify the progression of autoimmune diseases, such as asthma:

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=15637

While very encouraging, the unpredictable nature of the psychedelic experience means that ordinary psychedelics are an unlikely treatment avenue. Psychosomatic effects can very easily take place in a negative direction and may include long-term anxiety, depression, and manic or fugue states. The propensity of individuals to develop such maladies may depend on preexisting mental factors, but these have not been characterized. Similar side-effects have been observed from meditative practices in which no drugs were used:

http://www.rickross.com/reference/brainwashing/brainwashing23.html

It is largely unclear what causes this. It is rather unlikely it is linked to any specific pattern of neurological changes. In particular, 5-ht2a agonists generally downregulate the 5-ht2a receptor, in common with agonists at other receptors. One would ordinarily expect this to coincide with sedation, a higher seizure threshold, lowered sociability, and a lower propensity for sensory distortion. My experience during periods of heavy psychedelic usage has been the precise opposite of all of this, with the exception of the seizure threshold (I have never had a seizure). That is to say that the long-term neurological effects of psychedelics do not in any simple way explain the long-term psychological effects.

One effect that is very real is priming, when a user expects an effect they are more likely to experience it, and so studies on drug users have, for example, shown that more drug-related impairment is measured if the subject is asked about his/her drug usage prior to completing an intelligence test as opposed to afterwards. This is known as stereotype threat in cognitive assays.

http://jop.sagepub.com/content/20/4/518.short

A result of this may be that obsession about negative psychedelic-related side effects may in fact exacerbate the phenomenon. Regardless, it is generally advisable in the event of significant difficulties to take a goddamn break because that will probably make you worry less, too.

http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/pdf/hppd.review.pdf

The unpredictable side-effects of the psychedelic experience are in a large majority of cases quite mild. If you are experiencing significant effects, it is generally advisable to discontinue usage of both psychedelics and marijuana. Nicotine is mildly antipsychotic and in the form of an electronic cigarette or patch may alleviate the effects; it has in my experience. For your own sake, please do not smoke cigarettes. Pharmacological treatment, notably clonidine, is available; consult your physician if you feel you are experiencing side-effects severe enough to require treatment.

You're obviously in denial about your depersonalization and schizoid tendencies. This is typical of well-developed and acute paranoid-schizophrenic symptoms, which your denial has confirmed.

You're not a doctor, you're not describing anything like depersonalization:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depersonalization

or schizoid personality disorder:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder

so it's not entirely clear that what you're posting is in any way beneficial or useful to the cause of harm reduction. You are simply insulting another member: consider this a warning.

 

[Anon0631]

Here you go:

Adverse Reactions to Psychedelic Drugs. A Review of the Literature
Strassman, Rick J.

The Journal of Nervous and Mental Disease . :577-595, October 1984.

 

[rickolasnice]

I've noticed psychedelic abuse can cause people to turn into smug snobs who feel they are better (although they'd never admit it) that others for being more "enlightened" and aware of the "true meaning of existence / the universe"..

 

[rickolasnice]

Oh god you're one of them.

But: No, not necessarily.

 

[rickolasnice]

Psychedelics affect the way the brain works. This can lead to thoughts or perspectives that are irrational and or illogical.

There is nothing a person on psychedelics see's more clearly than they do sober. It's a trick of the mind.

 

[RobotRipping]

what about the opposite then? Viewing something from less perspectives allows one to understand that thing better?

viewing something from one perspective is better to understand that thing? kind of leaves some room for error by the 'subject viewing' if that's the case doesn't it?

i've noticed that psychedelic abuse can alienate you from others because your ideas differ from others, or the status quo. That's actually a real issue.

Psychedelics affect the way the brain works. This can lead to thoughts or perspectives that are irrational and or illogical.

There is nothing a person on psychedelics see's more clearly than they do sober. It's a trick of the mind.

can you elaborate on that? I can't just take your word for it. I see the tree in my backyard has a beautiful bluish hue aura and that it feels mighty healthy and strong and is enjoying the summer. I can tell by its aura, which i don't see when i'm not on psychs.

the real trick is that you are not seeing objects in themselves but merely are a machine interpreting sensory data to create a subjective reality from a concrete world.

 

[rickolasnice]

You are projecting your thoughts and feelings about the tree, on to the tree, in the way of an aura.. If you saw a damaged tree or a dying tree I'm sure that aura would be different.. But how about if you saw a tree that seems healthy but has actually just been infected by Armillaria Root Disease and is destined to die? It'd probably have that same healthy aura until you knew it was infected.

Why does it have to be an opposite? What about if you could see an object, all the way round, but only from 100m away? Or you could see an object up close, from 1 side. What if you could feel an object all you wanted but you couldn't see it, or you could see an object but couldn't feel it?

Psychedelic use may make you see things differently, from different perspectives, but it doesn't mean they are better and it definitely doesn't mean they are true or even real.

 

[bloodshed344]

Psychedelics affect the way the brain works. This can lead to thoughts or perspectives that are irrational and or illogical.

There is nothing a person on psychedelics see's more clearly than they do sober. It's a trick of the mind.

How's that? When people are sober they can see things pretty unclearly. Do you doubt that a change in a person's consciousness could change the way they perceive things? No, you said that yourself actually. Which means it must be true that some people in some cases can see things more clearly when under the influence.

 

[bloodshed344]

You can warn me with bold-type all you like mate, but my diagnosis is completely consistent with the facts. The social worker who wrote the first post is actually the patient himself, in case you missed it.

What facts? You don't even know anything about a patient, including if they even exist! Your logic is completely insane! Have you been abusing psychedelics?

People, please. The OP was obviously joking. In doing so he was breaking bluelight rules regarding the use of "SWIM" etc and has been PMed about how to post appropriately. Off-topic posts have been pruned and will continue to be pruned. ~atara

 

[Reverend Random]

You're right that it's better to give some helpful advise.

However, randomly throwing out diagnoses is not in the least helpful and quite possibly just plain wrong. The OP already explained that he used this metaphor as a way of not incriminating himself. The guy's 15 years old and worried about the negative after effects of his psychedelic substance usage. That's important to take into consideration, and I wanted to stress that it's important to be sensitive to people.

Now, OP, it's important to take care of yourself. If you feel that your use of psychedelics leads to more adverse effects it's wise to stop using for a while. You're still young, so you still have the rest of your life to experiment. Remember that. You don't have to do everything now. Better to take care of yourself now and invest in the future.

By the way, you didn't mention how 'heavy' your psychedelic 'abuse' is. At any rate, if you're experiencing negative effects that should be a clear indicator. It's not abnormal if you're not able to maintain your train of thought, and thinking about it negatively and worrying about it too much tends to make things worse. Give it some time, exercise a bit, make sure you get enough sleep, eat healthy food and refrain from using substances for a while. Cannabis can aggravate symptoms like these, but I think it's wise to avoid everything for some time. If you've been diagnose with depression, this may indicate that you're prone to unstable moods, which can be worsened by (any) substance use, and since psychedelics usually intensify emotions, that's also probably the case with you.

I'd say: don't worry about it too much, take care of yourself, stay positive and you should be fine in some time. Good luck!

 

[rickolasnice]

Yeah I wouldn't listen to fixingahole if this thread is the only thing he's going on.. He's talking out of his ass.

And this:

I'd say: don't worry about it too much, take care of yourself, stay positive and you should be fine in some time. Good luck!

 

[deidara]

^^^ I don't think he believes he's a social worker or doctor, didn't you read the post where he admitted that in his first post he was "swimming"? He's just more creative than the usual "my cat swim ate x...". Not to mention that even if you were an MD, you most certainly don't have enough information to diagnose him with anything! Other than what he posted, we know nothing about him. Plus, after I read the first post I could tell it wasn't a HCP (health care professional) because even posting something like that about a patient on the internet even if you don't say their name is breaking HIPPA laws, which most professionals take very seriously.

To the OP: I haven't ever used psyches "heavily", but I would think that every one else who suggested laying off for a while would be good advice. Oh and how you mentioned you have to get drug tested regularly when school starts: Be very careful about looking for other highs if you miss weed, my mom did the exact same thing to me when I was a 15 year old pothead. I got drug tested so I couldn't smoke weed anymore, so I started looking for other drugs that got out of your system quicker. I got into prescription opiates, and eventually on H. And it was hard as hell to get off that, so just be careful over the period of time you are quitting for to make sure you don't go looking for a new DOC.

 

[rickolasnice]

I'm not denying that psychedelics may help you to consider alternate possibilities.. but the final conclusions on whether or not these thoughts make sense, are true / real or are helpful in anyway should only be done while sober.

As while tripping, like i said, the most irrational and illogical thoughts can make complete sense.

And no.. How the brain works is not a trick of the mind. It exists within the physical realm.

 

[B9]

. Either way, nature looks prettier with HPPD anyway.

I do not agree with this.
HPPD is a sign that your brain has been reordered into a state which to some degree resembles permanent intoxication, which is hardly a cause for celebration, unless you're a desperado escapist.
Like driving is enjoyable & useful but you don't want to watch the landscape eternally passing you by when you're sat in the living room trying to type an e-mail.

 

[kidklmx]

^I agree but, for me at least*, once I learned to work with it a lot of the annoying effects subsided. My HPPD is still going strong, ever so slightly, but I no longer see after images (apart of the occasional one in my peripheral vision) and other annoying things that I can't give a name. Something about the way the world looks has changed, there's light halos and when I really look at something there's I see some wiggly lines. It's never in-your-face and definitely not an annoyance, it's when I was stressing about it that it was bad. Definitely not alone in this, a lot of people claim HPPD effects to subside when they stop giving a damn.

Not that you should take HPPD lightly, no. When it pops up you know that you're doing psychs (phenethylamines, mainly?) a bit too often and it can get really bad when you continue abusing them. But then it's your own mistake and we all know the cure: stop. abusing. psychedelics.

*I use this phrase a bit too much, but everything about psychedelics is subjective so ehh

 

[kidklmx]

Jezus man, you on a personal crusade to discredit my posts or something? :D

In all seriousness, you're definitely right and "everything" is a bit of a generalization but that's not the point. Was just providing a reasonable explanation for why I use "for me at least" a lot, because the way you interpret/feel/experience a trip, psychosomatic side-effects or HPPD is definitely subjective.

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

@the OP, cut back on the tripping. The drugs aren't going anywhere (well, maybe specific RCs will, but psychedelics will always be there). See if things don't improve within a few months break. I think, over time, you'll find that unlike most drugs, the beauty of tripping is something that stays with you. You can't hoard wisdom like treasure, so treat these drugs as something of awe and inspiration, to be taken occasionally when the time is right, not as an express lane to enlightenment, nor as trifling amusements.

i've noticed that psychedelic abuse can alienate you from others because your ideas differ from others, or the status quo. That's actually a real issue.

Indubitably, 'tis why I recommend against people happy with their lives and place in the world trying psychedelics, or at least I think that they should consider what they hope to gain from the psychedelic experience versus what they could lose.

 

[Ismene]

Good initial post Octal - I was totally convinced you were a 50 year old social worker rather than a 15 year old kid :D

All I can suggest is lay off the drugs for a while and things will calm down. Also work on improving your memory - the mind is a muscle. Do a few basic exercises to get your brain functioning - reading out loud and doing simple sums (3 +6) as quickly as you can appear to be two excellent brain improves.

 

[Bubbly Boobly]

OP:

I don't think you've necessarily done anything bad so try not to feel too guilty or beat yourself up. I've never had side effects as acute as yours but I'm sure everyone experiences some degree of lingering after effect from psychedelics, so you'#re nothing out of the ordinary.

My sister is a neuroscientist and told me that the worst thing you can do with drug use is to worry (though I can't remember the scientific specifics). It'll give you a feedback loop of negativity, and negative feelings are associated with the release of certain neurotransmitter chemicals. Instead, try to focus on the positive aspects of your drug experiences.

From what I've read on the matter, abstinence will do you good - it restores almost everybody to their baseline level after a while. This goes for psychological effects like anxiety and the mysterious HPPD visual symptoms. Talk to a doctor if it's really bad and they'll give you valium to stop you from worrying. (Don't rely on vals too heavily, I've seen people use it as a crutch and become very dependent).

Remember you only live once, and in some ways you're incredibly lucky to have seen and experienced what you have. Most people live their whole lives unaware of how tiny quantities of stuff can alter awareness so much.

 

[JBrandon]

Ignoring most of the replies and getting back to the OP:

You need to change things right now. When I got into a VERY frequent dosing schedule, my anxiety, depression, and general malaise worsened significantly. There was an increase in neurotic thinking, it was just a bad situation overall. Two or three months of sobriety and I felt like a new person.

If you feel the need to do drugs frequently, you need to look into therapy before you become addicted to something that leads to physical dependency. Barring that, I guess you can investigate amphetamines or something else. Just be careful and make sure you keep it under control, you are very young and your brain is still very plastic, I'd really recommend talking to a therapist. All of that said, as destructive as recreational drugs can be, I'd rather do amphetamines or opiates frequently than psychs. For me, I can deal with dependency much better than neurosis.