Random MSN Gibberings LXIX: Open your mouth, here's your money

[Jabberwocky]

Well assuming there's anything like 'equality' for women in the workplace and society in general is a start...

but men and women aren't equal. as for the workplace, i have deftly avoided it thus far so cannot comment. i don't want to argue either, i suspect a lot of my view is informed by this point:

I think you have the same attitude as my wife does towards feminism because you are both successful in the field of maths and science. You don't need the worthless crutch of an excuse. She has never had a problem doing anything she wants to do in life.

though i will say, to your point about it being a crutch, i don't think its a good choice of words. what i do think is that women in maths and science probably view the world in a different way to the women you mention and therefore whats important/even relevant in the way they consider things is entirely different.

i just think out of all the inequalities in the world to worry about, inequalities between the sexes doesn't seem to important.

monsta-= tis unfortunately not a permanent pay rise, but will be good nonetheless.

 

[monstanoodle]

Ahh right, tis indeed unfortunate but not to be scoffed at by any means

Re: Feminism - I've ignored all that bizniz, as a great deal of the time I see too many women who interpret it as "Women are better, we don't need men, we're the superiour sex! Sisterrrrrrs are doing it for themseeellllllllves!" etc.
So it ends up being as bad as misogyny.

Then again I tend to ignore a great deal of things.

 

[parttime crackhead]

If men & women are completely equal then why is it OK for me to punch a man that is annoying me but not a woman?

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

but men and women aren't equal. as for the workplace, i have deftly avoided it thus far so cannot comment. i don't want to argue either, i suspect a lot of my view is informed by this point:



though i will say, to your point about it being a crutch, i don't think its a good choice of words. what i do think is that women in maths and science probably view the world in a different way to the women you mention and therefore whats important/even relevant in the way they consider things is entirely different.

i just think out of all the inequalities in the world to worry about, inequalities between the sexes doesn't seem to important.

monsta-= tis unfortunately not a permanent pay rise, but will be good nonetheless.

I feel it is often used as a crutch to explain away why, despite the fact women have now had a few generations of equal access to education you can count on one hand the number of female Noble Prize winners in maths and science.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Re: Feminism - I've ignored all that bizniz, as a great deal of the time I see too many women who interpret it as "Women are better, we don't need men, we're the superiour sex! Sisterrrrrrs are doing it for themseeellllllllves!" etc.
So it ends up being as bad as misogyny.

i think its thats the attitude that put me firmly against feminism, and i know its not an accurate description.... men are awesome, i need them in my life more than women, apart from my mum of course.

also, feminist women who are obsessed with makeup and make me feel like some weirdo for liking maths. what the fucks that about?

i think this might actually be more to do with my own bitterness than any intellectually defensible stance.

 

[monstanoodle]

also, feminist women who are obsessed with makeup and make me feel like some weirdo for liking maths. what the fucks that about?

I think yer allowed to be bitter in this case

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Oh right, so feminism's just a 'crutch' for women who are unsuccessful in their 'careers'? I'll tell that to the successful feminist academics, artists, journalists and musicians I know.

What utter poisonous rubbish you talk sometimes.

Besides, feminists are sexier. Fact.

Hmmm, most feminists I see aren't really lookers. So we'll have to agree to disagree on that issue. But yes, I do believe feminism is a crutch. Middle class feminists use it as a way to explain the failure of their sistas, when it is more than likely that other less successful women just aren't all capable of achieving the same heights as they are, and maybe just don't want to.

 

[Myshkin]

i think its thats the attitude that put me firmly against feminism, and i know its not an accurate description.... men are awesome, i need them in my life more than women, apart from my mum of course.

also, feminist women who are obsessed with makeup and make me feel like some weirdo for liking maths. what the fucks that about?

i think this might actually be more to do with my own bitterness than any intellectually defensible stance.

Thanks for that final sentence, because the rest of what you say is far from the truth and gives me hope that there was irony in the rest of your post.

Try going out and meeting some feminists, as opposed to dickheads who hate men (whom incidentally I place on the same level as misogynists). There's a difference.

I make the mistake of assuming any decent person I meet is a feminist (and usually on a rudimentary level they are).

I think that's part of the problem - because 'decent' people tend to be of a more egalitarian mindset, they assume everyone is, and it ain't the case at all. Would any of you argue that the races are in any way 'equal' in status / opportunities? Of course you wouldn't.

And MrSmokesBlunts - stop reading that Bible of yours, as it's making you come out with some embarrassing right-wing claptrap.

Feminist women aren't 'lookers'? Again, you've probably never met many, or even one. Sexiness runs deeper than looks anyway.

I give up.

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Thanks for that final sentence, because the rest of what you say is far from the truth and gives me hope that there was irony in the rest of your post.

Try going out and meeting some feminists, as opposed to dickheads who hate men (whom incidentally I place on the same level as misogynists). There's a difference.

I make the mistake of assuming any decent person I meet is a feminist (and usually on a rudimentary level they are).

I think that's part of the problem - because 'decent' people tend to be of a more egalitarian mindset, they assume everyone is, and it ain't the case at all. Would any of you argue that the races are in any way 'equal' in status / opportunities? Of course you wouldn't.

And MrSmokesBlunts - stop reading that Bible of yours, as it's making you come out with some embarrassing right-wing claptrap.

Feminist women aren't 'lookers'? Again, you've probably never met many, or even one. Sexiness runs deeper than looks anyway.

I give up.

Yeah just gloss over my post where I highlight that men are facing equal problems in our society, most of which have been caused by feminism, why don't you! Of course most people believe everyone should be equal - but that doesn't lead one to being feminist, that leads to one becoming egalitarian. Having a rigid focus on female issues causes huge problems for men, and it makes men less receptive to wanting to care or deal with issues facing women. I have met tons of feminists... I used to regularly stop by the feminist society for a good debate whilst at uni, and I can honestly say that not one looked appealing. Most were fat or looked like they lived under a bridge. I am attracted to confident, strong women, rather than women who state they are but clearly feel inferiority in some way. I see no other reason why a self confident woman would dedicate so much time to trying to prove she and all other women are equal to men.

This also has nothing to do with the bible whatsoever.

 

[parttime crackhead]

There's definitely a bird reading this board that Samhain is trying to snake.

 

[Jabberwocky]

if people stop being sexist i wont be able to use my feminine whiles to get me anywhere.

yes i'm being an arsehole.

 

[Myshkin]

Yeah just gloss over my post where I highlight that men are facing equal problems in our society, most of which have been caused by feminism, why don't you!

There's a difference between 'glossing over' and 'ignoring bullshit'.

Men have 'equal problems'?

So you carry a can of pepper spray if you're out at night in a rough area because of morbid fear of rape? What a revelation.

And it's all Germaine Greer's fault, I suppose. That bitch.

Are you aware of the fact that you're not very good at this 'logic' business sometimes?

 

[parttime crackhead]

This thread is quality entertainment today. Almost on par with the draw a cock thread.

 

[monstanoodle]

This thread is quality entertainment today. Almost on par with the draw a cock thread.

I commended DS when he told me he was on the case of creating that

 

[Jabberwocky]

it is awesome. maybe in the name of equality we should have a vagina thread. but i think vaginas are harder to draw.

gonna go see if i've gone insane in the past 2 weeks. place your bets now.

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

There's a difference between 'glossing over' and 'ignoring bullshit'.

Men have 'equal problems'?

So you carry a can of pepper spray if you're out at night in a rough area because of morbid fear of rape? What a revelation.

And it's all Germaine Greer's fault, I suppose. That bitch.

Are you aware of the fact that you're not very good at this 'logic' business sometimes?

It's not bullshit, they are all problems men face, and they are just as serious. Unless of course you genuinely believe that almost every homeless person you see on the streets isn't male? Or you don't know any men who are effectively barred from seeing their children? Or you don't see it as a problem that women out number men in university 6:4 (when clearly you would be up in arms if it was the opposite)? Or that men get the shit end of the stick - having to do the more dangerous and unsanitary jobs? Or that men commit suicide at 4x the rate of women, despite the fact that women apparently have it so bad? Or that men get higher prison sentences for identical crimes to women? Or that men have higher entry requirements for physically demanding jobs in the armed forces? Or that domestic abuse against men is just one big joke, and there is almost no where for men to turn if they are in trouble, despite the fact that some studies suggest equal amounts of abuse being carried out by women on men? These are all things that if the reverse was happening you'd be out in the street arm in arm with a bunch of lumberjacks burning bras over.

I too wouldn't mind carrying a can of pepper spray around at night, not because i'm scared of being raped but because I am much more likely to be subjected to a violent attack from another man or group of men. And what exactly you think wearing a feminist badge does to stop rapists achieves exactly? Do you think that if you tell rapists it's wrong enough times it might sink in and they'll stop? Because I don't. Male rape is taken far less seriously than female rape too. Rape in prisons around the world is endemic and not one country has instituted a half decent policy to sort the issue out.

It is only logical that if you claim to be a feminist because you care about equality, instead of some sort of feeling that women are inferior and need your protection, that you would care about these issues. But nope. White straight men can get fucked. You are essentially epitomising everything I dislike about feminists and the feminist movement. I care about all the issues that women face in our society, like rape. I just don't think they need or deserve an entire social movement dedicated to them. But you brush off men's issues like they are nothing. Then you expect people to give a damn when women are on the news complaining about various things. It's known as double standards.

 

[Myshkin]

I completely missed the part of my post where I said white straight men are inferior, or that they could 'get fucked'.

I've written that on toilet walls, but in very different circumstances.

Ah, that's right - you're not addressing my posts at all. You're addressing your idea of a 'feminist' and expressing your fear and hatred of such.

And I never denied domestic abuse of men (or of children by women) either. I could tell you a story, but it's personal and I wouldn't feel comfortable sharing it.

MSB - if you want a debate, at least stay relevant. Parts of what you've written are a little, well... swivel-eyed. Are you Melanie Phillips in disguise?

So I'll leave you to your fear, wish you well and hope you're wife's chowing down on hairy-pitted bus-driver stereotype furbuger right this minute...

 

[Mailmonkey]

I think MSB makes some really good points, I see myself as an egalitarian, I'll challenge people at work, in the pub, even ust in conversation with friends and family if they are deriding anyone on the basis of their sex, sexuality, colour, whatever....

I got sent home from work one day for accusing a woman of being sexist when she made a "flippant" remark, "oh, typical Man" she said to me when I had problems finding something....I KNOW that if I had made a sweeping generalisation about women, and a female colleague had found it offensive and accused me of being sexist, I would have been sent home from work, but not her....

I'm not gonna join in this debate, cos I'm not as eloquent as you lot, but I think you're being harsh on MSB Sam, fair enough, pick him up if he's misquoting you, or misattributing ideals to you, but he's making a lot of valid and true points. In my opinion ayway.

Anyway, I'm gonna go and powerbomb some pussy.

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

Well I didn't miss it. You called the issues I highlighted to you 'bullshit'. I think I have more than substantiated that men face equal problems in society, and anyone who is unbiased and impartial will tell you that. I haven't missed one of your points, if you can call them that. The only point I can discern from anything you have posted directly to me is that you think women have it so much worse, and that by extension they deserve an entire movement dedicated to them with everything that entails...

 

[Mr Smokes Blunts.]

I think MSB makes some really good points, I see myself as an egalitarian, I'll challenge people at work, in the pub, even ust in conversation with friends and family if they are deriding anyone on the basis of their sex, sexuality, colour, whatever....

I got sent home from work one day for accusing a woman of being sexist when she made a "flippant" remark, "oh, typical Man" she said to me when I had problems finding something....I KNOW that if I had made a sweeping generalisation about women, and a female colleague had found it offensive and accused me of being sexist, I would have been sent home from work, but not her....

I'm not gonna join in this debate, cos I'm not as eloquent as you lot, but I think you're being harsh on MSB Sam, fair enough, pick him up if he's misquoting you, or misattributing ideals to you, but he's making a lot of valid and true points. In my opinion ayway.

Anyway, I'm gonna go and powerbomb some pussy.

Thanks mate. I totally hear what you're saying about the double standards in the work place. Most places i've worked i've had my ass slapped at least once. The walls in most of the offices i've worked in were also plastered in posters of shirtless male celebrities. Not that I can complain (or even give a shit, i'm a big boy I can handle it), I did get hired to an office by a manager in a sauna because in her words 'the office needs some men, it's got way too much estrogen at the minute'.

I think there is some anger directed towards my attempts to refute Sams white knightery.