Harm Reduction Progress Mega Thread

[HdoubleODeezy]

I totally understand that you don't want to go back on an opiate - I was just wondering if that was a possibility.
To clarify - were you still on the Zyprexa when you were on bupe, too?

and, I totally understand the body-type because I'm really similar. If you are just vigilant with exercise, you should be fine, and it sounds like it works really well for you.

Also, I get what it's like to be manic depressive - You don't need to struggle to explain it, because I know I can't explain it to people that haven't gone through it.

yeah i was on the zyprexa with the bupe.. along with 8 other meds.

 

[muvolution]

well good to hear you are cutting down the # of meds, and all in all, sounds like you are doing well.
Your original post gave me the impression you had traded the Zyprexa for the bupe.

 

[Pegasus]

So I took my last dose of bupe a few days ago and have been maintaining with kratom in the meantime. It is going pretty well, but I am having some minor issues. I feel totally fine, but I can see in my actions that I am more edgy than usual, and this has resulted in me being confrontational on a few occasions. Also, I seem to be sweating quite a bit, which is unusual for me but also happened last time I quit bupe. I have the temperature control issue of course, but kratom masks this for a few hours after each dose and so it is really only an issue for short periods.

I expect this to be my last time coming off bupe, but who knows? I said this the last time too!

 

[phr]

Plenty have said that as well, heh.

I'm sure you know, but the symptoms you described are common. Did you do a long taper? That would decrease severity.

Good to see you around.

 

[Pegasus]

^It was a long taper, but I could have gone lower, certainly. The cravings started to get a hold of me after awhile and so I didn't lower my dose past maybe 0.6mg nasally per day, the least I can take and still feel the dose. I've jumped from higher and lower amounts and know that this will be tolerable, but without the aid of kratom would be pretty unpleasant!

I enjoy being around here on BL, it is my internet home for sure! The site seems to be getting better and better by the day and I'm proud to be a part of it!

 

[Been&Done]

B&D - that's pretty much how it was for me. I'm an adult and shit, but I would see my parents and they wouldn't be ashamed or mad, they just wanted to know what was going on for the longest time.
I was pretty much miserable by the time I decided to get help - I basically just told my parents I had some problems with drugs and needed help. They understand how stubborn I am, so they just said that I had one chance to clean it the fuck up before they forced me to let them help. Luckily I have been able to hold it together, so they don't know what exactly i was up to, but they know I'm doing better which is enough.

And the parents know you so well, that they do notice any change. Mine were in denial since i was a very "junctional fukie" and for a while i was doing very well with my double life until of course the roof had to fall on my head someday. With my higher doses and years under my belt, it took them a long time to realize that i have been changing, and they definitely never thought it's because of H, their son doing heroin?! No way!! hehe. It becomes a lethal mix of denial and a wishful thinking. Later on, when we spoke freely and i told them pretty much everything, from my doses to who were my dealers, i remember just talking and talking and they told me how they used to feel when looking at me, apparently sometimes i used to nod at the dinner table or even lunch, especially the few years i mixed Rohypnol with H.

Those days and the few times i tried to get away for a few days to clean up, my only known and available remedy were 200 mg Tramadol twice a day, but still those night break dancing in bed were the worst. Never again, never again!!!! What a miserable life that was. Thanking God every day for how i became now, enjoying a glass of wine, sex, dog walks, jogs, movies....freakin' LIFE

Keep progressing everyone, it's so worth it

 

[DeLee]

Im glad I found this thread, ill be reading it through later today. (its 0500 in the morning here)
Anyway to start of my progress - im still in my Sub & Methadone clinic, been sober forabout 9months. (No alcohol, no weed, no dope - nothing except my scripts)

Ive been in my maintanence program for aprox 6 going 7 months, im on 32mg of Suboxone a day but in a few weeks I am going to switch over to Methadone.
Because the Subs ain't cutting it, im still fiending and all that. I have no physical withdrawal - Bupe keep those at bay but the psychological cravings are bad.

So Ill hope Methadone will do its thing.

Im gonna go and get some shuteye, gotta go up early to my clinic and get my daily dosage of Suboxone.
Bye!

 

[caseface99]

Switching to methadone might not be fun. I'm assuming it will be days, if not a week, before the blockade effect wears off from that amount of bupe. Which means withdrawing between the switch. That's a royal ton of suboxone, i never understood why people got prescribed that much. Were you IVing mad oxymorphone or something? What was your opiate habit like prior to bupe?

 

[Been&Done]

^^^^I agree with Case from my BL experience since as i said before, never actually tried Methadone.
@DeLee....Congrats on your drug-free time, i'm almost on the same boat with 7 months on Subutex, but i do smoke my greens Why not try lower doses? 32 is a massive dose, i believe it's the ceiling too. I mean give 8 then 4 mg a try for a while then you can make that bold quantum leap. You got nothing to loose but if you read on here on all those amazing threads about Bupes and how they work and also about methadone, i think you'll realize that maybe staying on them might not be that bad but again try lower doses first please, especially if you really want to quit one day and you're not just replacing your DOC with a scripted one. Best of luck in whatever you choose, keep us posted.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Im glad I found this thread, ill be reading it through later today. (its 0500 in the morning here)
Anyway to start of my progress - im still in my Sub & Methadone clinic, been sober forabout 9months. (No alcohol, no weed, no dope - nothing except my scripts)

Ive been in my maintanence program for aprox 6 going 7 months, im on 32mg of Suboxone a day but in a few weeks I am going to switch over to Methadone.
Because the Subs ain't cutting it, im still fiending and all that. I have no physical withdrawal - Bupe keep those at bay but the psychological cravings are bad.

So Ill hope Methadone will do its thing.

Im gonna go and get some shuteye, gotta go up early to my clinic and get my daily dosage of Suboxone.
Bye!

I'm really happy for you DeLee! The transition to methadone from buprenorphine is easier than the opposite.

As well - I am glad to hear you are 9 months into your treatment, that's an awesome point to be at. You have a lot to be proud of - and I wish you the best during your transition to methadone.

 

[DeLee]

Switching to methadone might not be fun. I'm assuming it will be days, if not a week, before the blockade effect wears off from that amount of bupe. Which means withdrawing between the switch. That's a royal ton of suboxone, i never understood why people got prescribed that much. Were you IVing mad oxymorphone or something? What was your opiate habit like prior to bupe?

Im actually not that worried about the switch, I don't know how long I will taper down but I gotta wait 2 days where I don't take any Bupe before they switch me to 30mg of Methadone.

I guess they are gonna taper down to 2mg or something and then cut it there and then go 2 days without and then the switch.

Yes I am on a high dose of Sub now, the last 8mg that was added actually fel nothing just more side-effects.
It was a process from beginning with 4mg of Suboxone and then steady climbing up because it just didn't work. Thats why ive made the decision to go with Methadone.
Before i got into my program I was using heroin and morphine .5-2grams per day. + a shitload of bensos, muscle relaxers and GBL.

Almost killed myself in the process, ended up in the intensive care unite with sepsis and ripped heart valves and stuff.

Thanks eveyone for your kindness.
I hope you are doing great too!

 

[caseface99]

tapering down 30mgs of bupe aint gonna be a walk in the park either..

 

[phoenix_risin]

keep tapering with methadone or switch to bupe?

I have been on done for 13 years.
Was on 120 got down to 60 stayed there for months then down to 30 and recently down to 25 that number is kicking my butt a bit.

I am curious what folks think should i switch to sub to finish the taper Or just come on down and deal wth it?

i have read a lot here (THANKS) as I have limited info on sub and i am really not wanting to just get on something else that will cause me WD"s as well. i mean if i am going to deal with them i may as well stick with the done right?

THANKS

 

[Been&Done]

Wanting to reply to the above post but i feel there are much more experienced people on here who actually did this move and can help you with their experience. I know for sure that Methadone wd's aren't fun and 21 days of Subs could work well. I'm sure WD's of Subs after a proper tapering plan (0.2 mg for example) will be a walk in the park compared to 13 years of "Done". Plus, 3 weeks of Subs with tapering IME wont really get you WD's. Good luck but ask around and read more on here before you do that. Cheers.

 

[Been&Done]

Naloxone headaches


Ok, as i have posted earlier, i got 3 2mg tabs of white Suboxone to take on 15 days, 0.2 mg twice a day. At the pharma, when they explained that they don't really have Subutex in Canada, i agreed to take those 3 pills, thinking that those tiny doses will not give me anymore headaches. I was bloody wrong!!!

Before posting on here, i made a few trials but wanted to be sure that this was the case for real.
Day 1: The Subutex from the night before was still effective as i didn't get any headaches.
Day 2: Took 45 mg of Zopiklone with a few glasses of wine....slight headache
Day 3: Had a few glasses of wine....Slight headache
Day 4 (yesterday) Just my 2 doses of Suboxone.....same slight headache that remains till this very second as i'm writing! Sleeping AND waking with a headache is such a fart!!!

Now, after all those personal trials and all those readings i can safely admit that i'm part of that population % who gets headaches from Naloxone.

The doc wrote 1/10 2mg pill daily, i'm sure it's his first to write such a tiny dose and i have my doubts that this is also his 1st time to prx Buprenorphine as it's simply NOT that available in Canada (It is, but really hard to get, i'v done the research and made a few calls) I will simply not spend the next 2 weeks with those headaches, that's for sure.
I have to talk to him or see him soon and explain that if i'm not getting Subutex as he 1st prx, i would be MUCH better off with only Clonadine and/or Librium or anything else that does not cause me 24/7 nasty headaches. After all, i just had my Bupe-less 5-day experience at the lock up for that DUI and i was doing just fine. Thought i would share

If the 2mg Suboxone pill has 0.5 mg of Naloxone in it and i take 1/10= 0.2 mg Bupe + 0.05 mg Naloxone, and apparently only a small % is absorbed, how much "nano-second" smaller can i get here, can i be that sensitive?! Hmm


Naloxone headaches on Google: 1,360,000 results!


Would like to hear about any fellow BL'er's experience with Subutex in Canada, please feel free to share as i really want to know the "real" deal here. Is my Dr. a doofus and prx something that is simply not available, or with such a prx i should be able to find and it's my right to buy them? Should i even spare the effort? 4 pharmas, including my Suboxone one told me No until now, but i'm in the city and i can still keep looking.

 

[Pegasus]

I have been on done for 13 years.
Was on 120 got down to 60 stayed there for months then down to 30 and recently down to 25 that number is kicking my butt a bit.

I am curious what folks think should i switch to sub to finish the taper Or just come on down and deal wth it?

i have read a lot here (THANKS) as I have limited info on sub and i am really not wanting to just get on something else that will cause me WD"s as well. i mean if i am going to deal with them i may as well stick with the done right?

THANKS

I think either way would work. Bupe would probably be a bit easier to taper and the withdrawal process would probably be less intense, but you have been on methadone for awhile and there may be more trouble transitioning between the two drugs than is usual. It seems that people who have been on methadone for really long periods prefer the effects of methadone.

I think if Suboxone is used, it would probably be best used for only a short period to ease the withdrawal from methadone.

 

[phoenix_risin]

Thank you both this has NOT been a easy thing I am Determned to get off this mess and find pain relief hopefully with something that will not have me with WD's when not taken Not to mention being a slave to he docs just like i was to the dope man
Mind you Methadone saved my life I get that I just think when you get to a certain place in recovery it starts to hit you that it is time to go

If anyone else has anything to add please do.

 

[SubDude]

Thank you both this has NOT been a easy thing I am Determned to get off this mess and find pain relief hopefully with something that will not have me with WD's when not taken Not to mention being a slave to he docs just like i was to the dope man
Mind you Methadone saved my life I get that I just think when you get to a certain place in recovery it starts to hit you that it is time to go

If anyone else has anything to add please do.

This is nothing new to many of the regulars here but I first went on MMT in 197 and I've been on/off since. 15+ yrs last time. I also mentioned this previously but you may not of seen it and it's anecdotal. I knew a guy who tapered down to 5mg and stayed there for months [we use to tease him for maintaining on such a low dose] Eventually the word got out he dropped to 2-3 more mg before he quit. We got the clear liquid dispensed from some kind of computer generated dosing device. Never saw his bottles because we had to secure them in lock box before leaving dispense area. His must have been a small drop??

When he finally left... never saw him again so don't know how he did. If you have the time and money... use both. No hurry if you've been long-term. For us [and him] money wasn't a factor nor was clinic dosing. We had monthly takehomes and it didn't cost anything at the VA healthcare.

I was personally unable to quit MMT and this particular free source was about 100 miles away [I transferred from local private clinic after i got weekly TH's] Just FYI it dried up on me for a stupid mistake I made and I switched over to subs and now take that at .5mg a day. I haven't been able to quit yet but believe with the right strategy and comfort meds... it will be easier than MMT??

Have you decided how low of a dose your going too before you quit? Do you have a plan in place after your final dose? 13 yrs is a long time...

 

[SubDude]

Pegasus... haven't seen lately how you're doing with your kratom strategy. Hope it's working well for you.

 

[Pegasus]

^It's working really well. There are really no words to describe how much better kratom makes you feel when in withdrawal, it is incredibly blissful. I imagine people addicted to opiates regularly experience this type of enhanced effect from dosing after withdrawal brought their bodies below baseline...

I do feel the withdrawal to some extent, I am a bit irritable and I feel uneasy at times. I think if I dosed a little more often it would alleviate the occasional wave of withdrawal though, as I'm only dosing 2x per day rather than 3x like I usually do...