POLL: psilocin vs. LSD

[Aeon Psyche]

I love both but LSD doesn't make me tired like mushrooms do to me nowadays. And tripping without energy doesn't work well. I prefer LSD right now.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

Psilocin is 4-ho-dmt. Why are you including 4-aco-dmt in the poll?

Anyway, haven't tried psilocin yet so I'll abstain from voting to reduce BIAS.

Cause ho and aco versions usually don't give a very big difference in effects.

 

[freejroll]

I like the fact that with mushrooms if i'm having a difficult time, 6 or so hours later it'll be over. I also like that they are free. I also like the taste.

hah, just kidding.

they aren't free.

 

[butane]

Sooo not true. AcO and HO versions are two totally different drugs.

 

[Girl-E]

Comparing LSD to Mushrooms is like comparing Pepperoni Pizza to Italian Sausage pizza.

Theyre both pizza just like theyre both drugs.

The toppings are both meat just like theyre both hallucinogens.

The only difference is that one pizza is slightly different tasting just like one of the drugs is slightly different feeling.

So, depending on which you feel like having that day depends on which you should do or eat, because there are slight differences but lots of similarities.


Did i blow your mind or just make you hungry???

teehee

 

[Aeon Psyche]

Sooo not true. AcO and HO versions are two totally different drugs.

In my experience so far anyway. 4-HO-DIPT and 4-ACO-DIPT for example were exactly the same for me...Guess I'll experiment some more %)

 

[Mjäll]

Cause ho and aco versions usually don't give a very big difference in effects.

How about including psilocin analog 4-ho-met? Shulgin says in TiHKAL that the effects of it and psilocin are indistinguishable. My experiences with 4-ho-met certainly come close to the descriptions of shrooms that I've read, although that's not a guarantee of course. But I think Shulgin should know, really.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

4-HO-MET and 4-HO-DMT indistinguishable? First time I hear that.

 

[Xorkoth]

How about including psilocin analog 4-ho-met? Shulgin says in TiHKAL that the effects of it and psilocin are indistinguishable. My experiences with 4-ho-met certainly come close to the descriptions of shrooms that I've read, although that's not a guarantee of course. But I think Shulgin should know, really.

Shulgin is just a man, not a superman... I find that a lot of his observations are wrong compared to my observations. I have tried both isolated 4-HO-DMT and 4-HO-MET and mushrooms extensively and I find them each to be very unique, of course similar in many ways but definitely each is a different drug (and yes, 4-HO-DMT and mushrooms are significantly different from one another as well).

Have you tried mushrooms? If not, it would be kind of hard for you to tell whether 4-HO-MET is like them or not.

In my experience so far anyway. 4-HO-DIPT and 4-ACO-DIPT for example were exactly the same for me...Guess I'll experiment some more %)

Have you tried both 4-HO-DMT and 4-AcO-DMT? I challenge you to find them indistinguishable. Personally I find that the AcO versions of each tryptamine are quite different from the HO versions, although they share many similarities.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

I've extracted 4-HO-DMT along with psilocybin once and couldn't tell much of a difference from regular mushrooms. But each trip is already different on it's own so with very minor effects I can't tell. I haven't tried synthetic 4-HO-DMT yet and my 4-ACO-DMT is still waiting for me...:D

 

[Xorkoth]

Ah, well that explains it... you extracted the mushroom alkaloids. No wonder it didn't seem much different from mushrooms! :D

I think you'll love synthetic 4-HO-DMT... it's much like mushrooms but it also definitely has its own signature. It's a much smoother experience for me physically and a little less earthy.

 

[GreenMachine]

LSD for me hands down, but its hard for me to pick one drug over another. That being said, I really have enjoyed the few mushroom trips I have had.

 

[Mjäll]

Shulgin is just a man, not a superman... I find that a lot of his observations are wrong compared to my observations. I have tried both isolated 4-HO-DMT and 4-HO-MET and mushrooms extensively and I find them each to be very unique, of course similar in many ways but definitely each is a different drug (and yes, 4-HO-DMT and mushrooms are significantly different from one another as well).

Have you tried mushrooms? If not, it would be kind of hard for you to tell whether 4-HO-MET is like them or not.

No, as I stated before (and sort of between the lines in your quoted post) I haven't tried shrooms. I'm going by Shulgin's line - and descriptions of shrooms. Of course he might be wrong, but trips are very influenced by your expectation of the substance. I understand that you're quite experienced with psychedelics, but Shulgin was not only experienced - but also quite forced to have a less biased stance. Of course, you might be doing research too for what I know.

Don't take this as an offense, man. Don't wanna come across as a fly in the eye (or a floater slightly to the left).

 

[Xorkoth]

No offense taken at all. It is true of course that Shulgin had very few, if any, preconceptions about the substances he discovered. And it's certainly true that our experiences are influenced by whatever experiences were shared in the community... in fact this is one of the main reasons I write trip reports and find it fascinating to be a part of the online community.

On the other hand, many people find some of Shulgin's descriptions to not line up with their own. After all, we are all affected differently. Also myself and some others at PD were among the first to ever try 4-HO-MET... in fact I wrote the first full report that I'm aware of. Actually we were among the first to ever try synthetic 4-HO-DMT as well. So whatever my own experience was probably impacted the experiences of those to follow, to some extent anyway.

What I do know is that the general consensus among those who have tried the various 4-HO-tryptamines more than a time or two is that they are all quite unique, although similar in many ways as well. Of course every individual trip is unique also... no two trips are the same. But when you have used a chemical a number of times, more than just once or twice, you start to notice that although each trip is different, there are a set of effects that occur each time. And then as you get more and more experience you can determine how each chemical is different by seeing what effects manifest every time. Then you can correspond with other "researchers" and when all of you start reporting the same set of recurring effects, you can start to make loose generalizations about the substance.

 

[Mjäll]

No offense taken at all. It is true of course that Shulgin had very few, if any, preconceptions about the substances he discovered. And it's certainly true that our experiences are influenced by whatever experiences were shared in the community... in fact this is one of the main reasons I write trip reports and find it fascinating to be a part of the online community.

On the other hand, many people find some of Shulgin's descriptions to not line up with their own. After all, we are all affected differently. Also myself and some others at PD were among the first to ever try 4-HO-MET... in fact I wrote the first full report that I'm aware of. Actually we were among the first to ever try synthetic 4-HO-DMT as well. So whatever my own experience was probably impacted the experiences of those to follow, to some extent anyway.

What I do know is that the general consensus among those who have tried the various 4-HO-tryptamines more than a time or two is that they are all quite unique, although similar in many ways as well. Of course every individual trip is unique also... no two trips are the same. But when you have used a chemical a number of times, more than just once or twice, you start to notice that although each trip is different, there are a set of effects that occur each time. And then as you get more and more experience you can determine how each chemical is different by seeing what effects manifest every time. Then you can correspond with other "researchers" and when all of you start reporting the same set of recurring effects, you can start to make loose generalizations about the substance.

How would you described 4-ho-met compared to 4-ho-dmt?

(sorry for a bit off topic)

 

[Mylo]

A high mushroom dose has yet to be surpassed by any psychedelic for me.

Plus the inconsistency of blotters nowadays is annoying .

 

[Xorkoth]

How would you described 4-ho-met compared to 4-ho-dmt?

(sorry for a bit off topic)

Sorry for the delay. Let's see...

4-HO-MET is much lighter than 4-HO-DMT in several ways. It does not seem to contain much, if any, darkness. It produces a light, euphoric buzz for me which feels really good. 4-HO-DMT produces a crawling, heavy buzzing in my body which can feel good but is not uniform - ie, it alternates between heavy and alien/uncomfortable and strongly euphoric. 4-HO-MET's buzz is uniformly positive and pleasant and light.

It's also much lighter in emotional content, generally producing "celestial" feelings. It tends to make my mind turn to euphoric, rather manic thoughts about space and the vast scales present in the macroscopic universe. 4-HO-DMT tends to throw me into "the loop" which is kind of hard to explain, but it's basically the thought loop that leads you to ego death and the Void. 4-HO-MET does not seem to reduce the ego much at all... it leaves me feeling like me except with a euphoric tryptamine mindset and free association. 4-HO-DMT attempts to reduce me to nothingness (as do mushrooms, not surprisingly). This is probably the greatest difference between the two... mentally they are really not the same whatsoever (for me at least).

Visually, 4-HO-DMT contains a lot of blues and greens and some greeny yellows. The patterns are organic in appearance and seem to envelop me and draw me in. 4-HO-MET's patterns contain primarily bright reds and oranges, although all colors are present. I find 4-HO-MET to be more colorful, especially with closed eyes, and brighter, which fits with the positive mindset it elicits. The patterns are much crisper than 4-HO-DMT's, and they seem to be more "technological" in appearance... the closed-eye visuals remind me of a visualizer like MilkDrop that plays on your computer with music. The visuals from 4-HO-MET do not seem to draw me in - rather, I feel like an outside observer watching beautiful structures unfolding from above. Conversely, 4-HO-DMT draws me in to the visuals and makes me a part of them (or them a part of me).

As you can see I find them quite different, really almost on two opposite ends of the tryptamine spectrum. I find it strange that Shulgin found it virtually indistinguishable from mushrooms, as I find that to be very far from my experience. And I have tried it a number of times with the same general results every time. I kind of wonder how much experience Shulgin actuallty has with mushrooms and how many times he used 4-HO-MET. If I recall, he is a phenethylamine man as it is and prefers them.

A quick note: in these descriptions, most of what I say about 4-HO-DMT applies to mushrooms as well. I do find mushrooms and pure/synthetic 4-HO-DMT to be different enough to consider them two separate drugs, but the differences are much more subtle than the difference between 4-HO-MET and 4-HO-DMT.

 

[Mjäll]

Sorry for the delay. Let's see...

Thanks for the well written reply. I can see what you mean about 4-HO-MET not giving "that loop" with cosmic thoughts. I can see the lightness that you are referring too as well. 4-HO-MET tends to alter my cognition drastically, but not in the way of LSD and LSA which make me prone to thinking about relativity and stuff like that. Instead it is a relatively subject-neutral association enhancer, intensely potent for me. Ego-death might be too much to describe my experiences (I could always have told you my name, even though it seemed meaningless during trip) but it is ego-shattering in every sense of the word. I come back to earth with a nice feeling of "everything is glowing" but also "how do I make life important again when I've reached such heights of pure unadultered thought".

And I must say that, as most psychedelics, it can make one bad thought turn into a cognitive hell that just surrounds you. It just so happens that the theme of the loop will not very likely be something about cosmos, but rather something about yourself. But during my next 4-HO-MET trip, I'll try to invoke a feeling of cosmos. It might be that I were alone during my ergot alkaloid trips, and that's why I reached thoughts about "deeper" matters instead of viewing my social functions through a looking glass. Therefore, I will trip alone on sunday to see how much "space potential" this substance holds.

Peace.

 

[psood0nym]

^Xorkoth your description of 4-ho-MET sounds like a lot of the 4-ho-DET reports. Have you sampled that compound, and, if so, do you agree with that assessment? I forgot whether or not you've used MET or not. If so, did you notice any METness soaking through the experience the way DMTness sometimes does with 4-ho/AcO-DMT (esp. with an MAOI)? It all makes me that much more interested in 4-ho/AcO-DPT, whose forbearer I consider to be the most unique in the tryptamine family in terms of its mental and spiritual experience (judging by my own experiences and the consensus of reports.)

 

[Xorkoth]

No, I haven't tried MET itself... I had 80mg but I ended up trading it, which I regret now. I'm sure I'll locate some sometime in the future. I also have not tried 4-HO-DET (or 4-AcO-DET).

I have a friend who has some DET and was going to give me some... I haven't heard from him in a while though. I sure hope I get a chance to try that one! It sounds great.