Politics in 2004

[silvia saint]

nothing wrong with the policy but I'm saying things like that won't attract votes from many families or older voters....

younger people perhaps, but I'd say the majority of older people will never vote for policies as strong as that...

you should have seen the last chaser decides episode on abc to see what some of the older generation would vote for. it was hilarious, and very frightening.

 

[keystroke]

if this is anything to go by, I can't wait to see the shit storm that erupts when that wank bush gets elected again.


8(

 

[onetwothreefour]

he won't. hje fucking won't.

VOTE KERRY, CUNTS>

 

[Samadhi]

yeah we sure dont wont the prime minister to be one of the best treasurers this country has ever had. he has only delivered seven budget surpluses in a row.

Oh yeah, FOR SURE!!!! As long as the budget is in surplus, we can fuck everything else right??? The budget is in surplus, but at what cost, Pilltastic???? Medicare has gone to shit, HECS has risen by 25%, only people who earn over $50,000 have tax relief, our environment is turning to mud, there are human rights violations in our supposedly "enlightened" 1st world country...but hey! THE BUDGET IS IN SURPLUS, so that makes it aaaaall better. HOO FUCKING RA.

what a laugh.

 

[*sunflower*]

^^ haha. yeah, exactly what I've been thinking. Its the only thing liberal voters can say really hey? Its all about the money.

Not that there's anything wrong with being a liberal voter.

 

[anna!]

As someone who has spent a lot of the past 3 years dealing with the public health system (and Medicare), I will vouch for the fact that it hasn't gone to shit. We are one of very, very few countries in the world where residents are able to stay in hospital for free, visit the ER for free, deliver babies for free. As with anything, if you pay, you get to go first. But twice last year I had hospital stays, ambulance transfers, ER visits and medical screening and it didn't cost a cent and I didn't wait for weeks or even days. On the other hand, a woman I know in the US visited the ER, waited 7 hours for a blood test and ended up $600 out of pocket. Medicare is great.

The safety net is fantastic for a young family like us, and my husband and I directly benefited from the change in tax cutoffs and additions to Family Assistance.

It's not only people who earn over $50,000 who have tax relief, it's also people starting out in business, micro-businesses and people working from home, which is a huge benefit to a great number of people, especially parents, who have chosen to work from home because of high childcare costs (the rebate for which has been increased, yay) and to spend more time with their kids (like me).

I will have a greater HECS bill when I finish uni, but I'll also have greater tax benefits (presuming Labor don't dick around with it if they're in power), so it will even out. I don't mind paying for a good education. Again, there are few countries in the world that even have payment options for tertiary education. I'm ever so pleased that I even live in a country where I don't have to take out student loans or eat Maggi noodles for weeks straight just to pay for classes.

Anyway, these are the budget related things that matter to me, and some of them are reasons for my voting Liberal. But I make no apology for that, I'm a Business student and not a human rights activist, and things like this do matter to me.

 

[*sunflower*]

Anna - medicare works, and our health system is generally good and I can vouch for that as I've worked in it for 8 years. Certainly compared to other countries it is anyway. The reason our hospital system is good Anna, is not because of the liberal party being in power, its because of the doctors, nurses, physiotherapists, OTs, and other staff who work in it. They are very dedicated and well qualified. As am I.

The thing is, the waiting list for elective surgery is very long, too long, up to two years in some places and the quality of health care in the private system is not adequate, due to the health system all being about money now, at the expense of patients who need it. Private hospitals have been taken over by (mostly) American companies who have stopped nurse education, are providing less staff and a higher patient/nurse ratio and are using suboptimal medical equipment in some areas. Areas that bring in the big bucks, such as orthopaedic surgery, are given increased funding and areas like aged care and mental health are given less funding and specialty areas dealing with these clients have been closed down.

I'm sure you can understand that from a nurse's point of view, right now, you can't care for someone in the best, kindest, most effective way possible, due to staffing problems, lack of support in areas you might be inexperienced in (very scary!), people having low work moral, incredibly high sick leave, an abundance of casual staff because its not possible to get permanent staff, more overseas doctors, some of who are not adequately qualified to practice. What really pisses me off is the fact that - as someone who has private health cover - I'm paying private health insurance premiums, the medicare levy AND the gap when I go to hospital. While the guy down the road who's driving a beemer gets to walk into his local ER and have MRIs for free. And I'm a student working part time, hence don't earn a huge wage at the moment.

Thats fucked up. Sorry but it is.

I am happy though, that families such as yours are being looked after, and you clearly are, as you've experienced it. But there are many problems with our health system that the general population doesn't see. And it will get worse. I'm not saying a labour government in power would have made any difference - we have a labour government up here in Qld who has no respect for the health system or nurses, but I'm not going to give the liberal party any credit for a good health system, when it clearly needs vast improvement and there are no signs of this happening.

Regarding HECS - I don't have a problem paying for my uni education but Anna - I ate plenty of maggi noodles and had to take out student loans and work when I was doing my undergrad - I wasn't living at home and I didn't get any financial support from my parents. Like a lot of students.

Depends where a person is coming from I guess.

 

[anna!]

I agree, the amount you pay as a private patient is outrageous. Insurance is hugely expensive and then the excess AND Medicare costs on top of that make it ridiculous. I have trouble justifying the expense in my own mind, I feel like it's one of those things that we just have because we're "supposed" to. When I was pregnant last time, I had my obstetric appointments as a private patient but delivered as a public patient because the excess was SO high (about $3000 I think). So I totally agree. And it's interesting to see the health system from the POV of someone who works in it, there are clearly parts of it that really suck.

This is going a bit off-topic, but I do wonder about the waiting lists. I know my sister had elective surgery in July and she was referred by her specialist and operated on within about 3 weeks. Is there some reason why some people have to wait and others don't? I'm not really familiar with the actual reasons.

I'm not giving the Liberal party specific credit for anything in the health system or even saying that it doesn't need improving, as it obviously does. I just wanted to give my own experience of the public system and Medicare

As for HECS, I'm not living at home or with any financial support from my parents either (I was stupid enough to give up my window of opportunity to study while I was at home!), and we're paying off my husband's HECS as well, but I guess I just see it as "one of those things you have to pay for", like car registration. We would be in a far worse situation if we had to pay $10,000 a year in fees on top of everything else, so I'm happy with that

 

[*sunflower*]

Re the waiting lists – people are categorised according to urgency of treatment, but they also need to wait until a surgeon and bed is available in their particular area. Most urgent cases are supposedly treated within a month. I’ve heard of inconsistencies though - women with CIN3 (cervical dysplasia - fairly high and a slight possibility of carcinoma being present) who've had to wait two months for surgery and people waiting for minor orthopaedic surgery like knee arthroscopies who've waited only a few weeks. The problem is the closure of public hospital beds – this has increased the wait for elective surgery in most states.

I am glad that I'm hearing good things about the health system though. As much as I complain about the health system, I hate hearing the general public complaining because I know how hard we all work in it and how good it is in comparison to other countries. So it’s great to hear positive feed back.

And yeah, we're lucky we don't have to pay up to $100,000 for a degree - yet! Methinks it will happen, for our kids most likely.

 

[Charlie Brown]

I heard that the liberals have a near absolute majority...does that mean they can pass any bill they like without much opposition?

For example if they wanted to pass that ridiculous land tax, they wanted a few years back where they tax land owners for the value off land they owned, they can pass that if they wanted easily?

 

[doofqueen]

I can't believe this. The majority of australian voters are more stupid then i thought they were. Guess people just get sucked in by the media and believe whatever is fed to them without actually looking into it.

Not happy that my degree is going to take me forever to pay off and i already owe $8000.

Fucking hell.

The one good thing is that the greens actually get more and more votes every year which does count for something. Maybe when our kids are our age we might actually have a government that cares about the environement and humanitarian issues. Hopefully if we educate our children they will realise that things have to change and maybe the "well it doesn't directly affect ME so i don't really give a shit" attitude will disapear.

*hopefully*

 

[lostpunk5545]

^ (Charlie Brown) Yes that's exactly what it means. So all the lib. voters can cheer about how great the new fucking economy is while human rights issues dissapear into the black, vacuous, hole that is J. Howards heart.

Hooray for democracy and idiots getting their way for the third time in a row.

"We must therefore ensure that those idiots out there don't get into trouble. By actually using their theoretical right to vote, to interfere where they don't belong. Like in the public arena."

- Noam Chomsky

 

[drEaMtiMe*@#]

I can't believe this. The majority of australian voters are more stupid then i thought they were.

really? i wasn't surprised at all actually, unfortunately

 

[420star]

too true drEaMtie*@# too true
i think i will have a very stiff drink

 

[killarava2day]

Me neither, it just reaffirmed the contempt I feel for the vast majority off Australians... Although I was shocked by the size of the swing towards the right, scary stuff.

 

[killarava2day]

Dear god, it gets worse

How Mr 1.9% may hold the balance
By Bridie Smith, Josh Gordon
October 11, 2004

He represents a party that few Australians had heard of before this election. He has never before stood for Parliament. And on Saturday, in his first crack at federal politics, he secured just 1.9 per cent of the Senate vote in Victoria.

But thanks to the amazing quirks of Australia's preferential voting system, Steve Fielding, 43, could soon find himself in one of the most important jobs in the country.

Mr Fielding, lead candidate in Victoria for the Christian conservative Family First party, has won the sixth and last Senate seat to be decided in the state.

Depending on other results, Mr Fielding could end up with the balance of power in the Senate - an immensely powerful position that would give him the final say on controversial legislation such as the full sale of Telstra, industrial relations changes and cross-media ownership laws.

Following Saturday's election, the Coalition has secured 38 of the Senate's 76 seats after gains in Queensland, NSW and Tasmania, and has a good chance of winning a 39th seat in Queensland. Should it fail to win a 39th seat, it will be one short of an absolute majority and potentially reliant on Mr Fielding's support in the Senate.
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But if this teetotal, non-smoking, Collingwood-supporting superannuation fund manager from Melbourne's outer east is feeling the weight of his potential new role, he was not showing it yesterday as he calmly fielded media questions, surrounded by his wife and three children outside his Wantirna South home.

Nor was he giving much away about how he would vote on specific legislation, except to say that if it was good for families, it would get his support.

Family First has negotiated an agreement with Prime Minister John Howard to ensure that all legislation is subjected to a "family impact statement" during consideration by cabinet.

"We will be looking at all those issues and I can say to the Australian people that we are not a puppet of any other political party," Mr Fielding said.

"This is an historic time in Australian political history as we are about to see a family values based party elected to Parliament."

Mr Fielding said he would talk to the Government about a range of family friendly policies, including allowing couples to split their incomes to take advantage of two tax-free thresholds and allowing people access to their superannuation to buy a family home.

Family First has its roots in the Assemblies of God congregations in Adelaide. Federal leader Andrea Mason yesterday continued to maintain that it was not specifically a Christian party. "Our policies are not religious policies at all," she said.

"We will introduce and pass legislation that is good for the family."

The rise of Family First has raised the prospect that the religious right will become a strong force in Australian politics. Liberal Party campaign director Brian Loughnane said the party had tapped into community sentiment.

"They have as much right as any other group in Australia to put forward a policy and seek the support of the Australian people," he said.

Family First received more than 4 per cent in 23 of the 109 seats it contested and about 2 per cent nationally.

Until now, Mr Fielding's only political experience was his election to the Knox Council last year. He owes his Senate win to the preferences of Labor and the Australian Democrats, and at the expense of the Greens, who received about three times as many primary votes as Family First.

Mr Fielding dismissed suggestions that his victory was illegitimate. "This is the Australian political system and it is a system we have come to love and cherish. It's a democracy and this is fantastic for families in Australia," he said.

He hit out at the Greens and their leader Bob Brown, saying they were not acting in the best interests of families. "Bob's forest is a dangerous place," Mr Fielding said.

Amid the intense media interest, Mr Fielding, his wife Sue and their three children James, 15, Campbell, 13 and Gabrielle, 10 kept to routine yesterday morning and went to their local Pentecostal church.

A short walk from the family home, the CityLife church has recently undergone a $7 million renovation.

It has a cafe, creche, an auditorium for 2000 people and a recording and editing suite that produces a weekly religious program for cable television.

Yesterday the congregation was revelling in the success of their newly famous member, giving him and his family a rapturous welcome.

Yesterday's 90-minute service had all the ingredients of a well organised pop-rock concert. Uniformed ushers with earpieces guided the line of worshippers to their padded pews in the auditorium. Three giant screens carried footage of the 20-plus singers and band members on a wide, well-lit stage.

Mr Fielding said his strong Christian values would not blinker his performance in the Senate.

"We are for freedom of choice, freedom of speech and freedom of religion," he said.

On abortion, Family First believes in informed consent. "This is a difficult decision that can affect people over the long term, so we really believe people should be informed at that time," Mr Fielding said.

Mr Fielding said Family First supported the Coalition's stance on gay marriage, believing marriage should be reserved for men and women.

Mr Fielding, the seventh of 16 children, said he considered the family concept to be broad, including single parents, couples and individuals.

- with AA

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/10/10/1097406426307.html

 

[ctrl]

Me neither, it just reaffirmed the contempt I feel for the vast majority off Australians...

Yeah I know that feeling..

In relation to that, I found what Hugh Mackay had to say on Compass last night quite interesting:
from http://www.abc.net.au/compass/s1217354.htm

Well I think we, particularly intelligent people are extremely impatient with unintelligent people. And assume that they’re doing silly things because they’ve deliberately done silly things, yes. We just have to acknowledge that by definition half the population has average or below average intelligence. I mean these are very rubbery terms, but in broad terms I think we have to acknowledge that there is a distribution of intelligence through the community which is not equal. And a lot of people do silly things because they’re not very bright. A lot of people do silly things on the road or make irresponsible purchase decisions, or can’t manage their finances, or don’t really know much about how to raise their children, just because they’re not very bright.

And maybe, just maybe, these same people are easily influenced by negative campaigns based on scaremongering...
Idiots. I really don't feel any compassion towards them right now..

 

[BREAKaBEAT]

Actually a minority of Australians voted for the Coalition or One Nation, something like 46%. The other 54% wanted someone else to win... but under electoral system we live under a fractured flow of preferences gave it to the Coalition, oh well..

Secondly don't blame Coalition voters if Howard ends up with absolute control in the senate, blame Labor. By giving preferences to Family First over the Greens in Victoria, Labor are one of the primary reasons that a conservative Family First will quite likely end up with a senator that holds the balance of power. Stupid Stupid move Labor.

Anyway, I'm interested in what the Liberal voters out there in Bluelight land think of some of the reforms that the government will now be pushing through the senate.

The the abolition of cross media ownership laws. Does the thought of Packer and Murdoch owning every single print and tv outlet scare anyone else?

I'm really scared as to what's going to happen to Fairfax.

Also changes to industrial relations... abolishing minimum wages, abolishing enterprise bargaining and introducing australian workers agreements that remove penalty loadings and result in lower wages for low paid workers.

And this... Nick Minchin the Finance Minister and a senior voice in cabinet has suggested the abolition of compulsory voting in Australia as it 'unfairly denies Australians the choice to vote'. John Howard is privately known to also be partial to this line of thinking. Personally I think it would be a travesty if compulsory voting were to be abolished.

All of this will quite likely become reality in the next few years... I wonder how the rest of you feel about it?

 

[CynaKill]

From where I stand, there is no correlation between opposing views and levels of intelligence. Hugh Mackay has proven once again the blatant bias of the so-called independent ABC.

By your judgement, half of Australia is less intelligent than you because they share opposing ideologies or views on the issues that matter to them. You do realise that you are a walking ALP propaganda machine. The moment they lost the election, their line (without waivering for a second) was that the Coalition won because of negative scare tactics.

Perhaps you could raise the bar for all of us and express some original thought.

I was not afraid when I voted. I voted, after making a judgement on what I thought was important. And I wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[CynaKill]

On IR: in 1993, the Keating government began the labour market deregulation agenda. The Liberal government simply followed in their footsteps.
As far as I'm aware, there is no such policy that includes abolishing EBAs. AWAs are already in place. AWAs must pass a 'no disadvantage test' by the Office of the Employment Advocate to determine whether any overall loss if suffered as a result of the agreement. The main policy which has been knocked back time and time again (the most publicised one) relates to unfair dismissal. I too am concerned with this, it seems the rights of employees are on continual decline.

I voted Liberal and agree with most of the labour market deregulation reforms. The Workplace Relations Act, streamlining of awards and removing centralised wage fixing has undoubtedly been a factor behind strong productivity gains. But I'm afraid of just how radical Howard's agenda is, and the negative implications it will have particularly on the non-standard workforce.