Gabapentinoids Phenibut Megathread

[throatgorge]

I used to have a problem with GHB, then it was a problem with Phenibut. I began phenibut taking a teaspoon (3 gram) dose. It was close enough to G for me and I did get a addicted a couple of times before I learned to only use it twice a week. I liked the "downer" high. Liked how it made me manic in a FUN way (at first) and most of all loved the prosexual effects, which mirrored G exactly-- extreme sexual arousal paired with difficulty achieving orgasm. I cut my dose to half a teaspoon (1.5 grams) to 1/4 teaspoon, to 1/8th of a teaspoon! That's a mere 375 miligrams-- less than they put in "Happy Camper."
The new problem isn't addiction. And virtually EVERY search on phenibut substitutes focus on "addiction" even when "Rage" is a search term...
That's my problem. Manic rage EVERY SINGLE TIME even on a dose barely high enough to feel!
There are great substitutes for the downer high-- Kava and Amanita muscaria in particular are my favorites, both a little pricey for a poor man, BUT nothing gives me the prosexual effects that I enjoyed and my wife enjoyed even more! (Now I just yell at her and hurt her emotionally.)
I quit the shit altogether about a month ago and have been looking for either a decent substitute or something to keep the manic episodes, the blind rage away!
I thought I'd give valerian a shot, but the four ounce vial of valerian essential oil (the strong stuff that has all the volitile oils that make fresh valarian SO much more powerful) that cost me about $15 a few years ago has now skyrocketed to TEN TIMES that price! Valerenic acids are the good stuff, they say, but all I can see available are valeric and isovaleric acids and there is some question as to whether those are actually psychoactive (Gabergic) or not.
I have had facoracetam in the past, and it really impressed me as to how similar the VERY mild sensation of that EXPENSIVE stuff was to phenibut. Facoracetam and ginseng are both listed as GABAB antagonists and are said to reset the brain's response to phenibut. I now have a new love for ginseng, but have yet to dip into my old stash to see if I can avoid rage.
Gotu Kola, has a GABAB agonism which is the closest thing to phenibut that I've found. I take two teaspoons of the stuff in an extract form that you're supposed to take only an eighth of a teaspoon of. Can only be used on an empty stomach, once a week or it has no effect at all.
Then there is the matter of upregulating the GABA receptors and trying to get back "that old magic" (another topic I get results on, but none of them mention manic fury). Also, not having had the stuff, I STILL fly into rages due to PTSD triggers, but at least I can calm down. On phenibut I don't stop raging until it wears off, which causes my wife to flee the home.... VERY sad about this!
We're going to start therapy tomorrow, in case anyone is alarmed, and it has been only verbal abuse so far...
Reading that passionflower upregulates GABA in the brain, and wondered about harmaline rich syrian rue, which I can gather 200 grams of a day this summer, more if I didn't have to wait until an hour before sunset to be able to tollerate the desert heat.
Harmaline and harmine turn out to be inverse GABA agonists, so it seems likely that will do the trick, BUT harmala seeds, as anti-depressant aphrodiciacs may be an ideal SUBSTITUTE (just collecting seeds for trade currently, two more afternoon walks near my home should do it, then on to treating myself.
Anyhow, I really wish I could go back to Phenibut without going into a crazy rage and having full psychotic episodes. Any advise on something to substitute or kill the manic response?
I don't even want the FUN kind of manic anymore, but I sure loved the aphrodisiac effect!

 

[Mycophile]

If you want to make your posts easier to read I'd break them up a bit.

I also sometimes get Phenibut rage and Flurophenibut rage, but it happens less with the latter.

I'd thought maybe it was cause partially by a combo of the Phenibut and the massive doses of caffeine i take, but maybe not.

But again, I find it happens less with F-Phenibut (though it is an untested RC), and even with regular, I find maybe it happens like 1 out of 4 times, but I have to avoid the wrong stresses.

I'm not married so I know that could be a stressor to some LOL...so I just avoid annoying people, annoying websites where people argue, and if nothing annoying happens, I usually have a good time.

I didn't know there were stronger acids available made from Valerian Root, cause Valerian Root by itself does very little.

NOT asking for links, but are those kinds of acids that come from valerian root made online?

 

[Rafayte]

Pregabalin, gabapentin and baclophen are gabaergic options

 

[throatgorge]

Mycophile Valerian essential oil is actually pretty nice, but it went from 15 a vail to 150! Valerenic acids, which are quite a mix of compounds, are actually the most strong parts of Valerian, and the best extracts contain only .08% of it. An old hippy who grew the stuff said the best stuff evaporated out when it was dry and fresh root or essential oil was really nice stuff. I expect some component of the herb is really close to G. Thanks for reminding me about fluoro... I DO recall that it is supposed to be more mello! Rafayte, my psychiatrist ain't prescribing me pregabalin or gabapentin. They aren't willing to consider that an option. I don't know how I'd get a scrip for baclophen, since I don't need a muscle relaxant and they only prescribe flexoral when I do. f-phenibut is supposed to be closer to baclophen in effect, so I think that merits a little exploration! Thank yee!

 

[noone1]

Are you an angry drunk too? Do you have problems with anger in general?

I've never found phenibut to make me rage. Neither does Alcohol. I've noticed certain people who fit the "addict" model start to get angry when they ingest any type of GABA.

On the other hand I've had to deal with getting opiate rage under control now for years so maybe I don't notice it.

 

[Mycophile]

Are you an angry drunk too? Do you have problems with anger in general?

I've never found phenibut to make me rage. Neither does Alcohol. I've noticed certain people who fit the "addict" model start to get angry when they ingest any type of GABA.

On the other hand I've had to deal with getting opiate rage under control now for years so maybe I don't notice it.

I'm not an angry drunk, but I do have some anger problems it's true but they usually don't come out and while I'd say about 65% of the time regular Phenibut doesn't make me angry and about 85--90% of the time F-Phenibut doesn't, I can get it too at times.

Phenibut and F-Phenibut both make me very emotional in all ways, mostly loving ways but if someone or something pisses me off it can turn to anger, but again, much more with regular Phenibut than F-Phenibut.

I think there's something to what he's describing, and it makes sense that certain drugs that can make you more emotional in one way could also make you emotional in another way.

 

[RedRum OG]

I know you're just looking for a drug recommendation but I'm going to recommend some hardcore motherfucking introspection.

Look what you're doing to your wife, man. I'm not trying to be a dick but you need a dose of reality. You are supposed to be her rock, the person she runs to, not away from. You are supposed to comfort her when she's down, not push her down. Are the mild highs you're getting really worth hurting the person who loves you most?

That is some serious addict behavior, hurting someone that much for a half assed high. I'm not judging, I've done the same thing to my parents and family. If you don't stop now, it will get worse. No slowing down, no "I can control it", no switching to a different drug. There is no third option, you get better, or you get worse.


I truly wish you and your wife the best of luck. Addiction isn't easy for anyone involved,

 

[G_Chem]

^^^This.

I think it's sad your still trying to get something out of a drug that has the potential to cause to to act like this.

I can relate man, for me it was gabapentin. I would take it in small doses with alcohol for a night out dancing but soon learned that I'd go off on the slightest provocation.

The first time it was my girls birthday and we had been fighting a lot lately so I took some gabapebtin to try and "calm down." We went for a walk to help with that. While we were walking some guys were drunk on a balcony and said something about my girls shoes. As calmly as possible I ask "hey what room you guys in?" And they tell me not thinking anything of it.

Long story short I walk into a party full of college kids and called the whole party out of 30+ people. Some guy thought he'd be tough and said he was the one yelling down at me (he wasn't) and I threw him on a ping pong table. I then barely escaped... Thankfully I know how to handle myself or I could have been fucked.

Second time I was at a show and saw my buddy had been jumped by a group of guys. I then found these guys and fought two of em, fucked em up but I also walked away with injuries.

Both times I felt somewhat justified but it scared me how easy it was to hurt people while under its influence. It took nothing for me to calmly go from normal to hurting people in a heartbeat. I say this too cuz I found gabapentin and phenibut to be very similar in action, I've not enough experience with phenibut but I can tell it has the same potential for that kind of behavior.

I say you do the same as I, if a drug is making you act like that then ditch the drug completely. It's not worth hurting your woman.

-GC

 

[CfZrx]

Does phenibut have a place in the toolbox of someone with chronic arthritis and nerve pain?

 

[Lobsterbutch]

its got some similar effects to baclofen/pregabalin. Pregabalin is Lyrica, which is regularly prescribed for neuropathic pain. A good friend who recently had back surgery has been on it for a long time for nerve pain, of course, he has been working very closely with his doctor.

Phenibut is in the Gabapentinoid group of drugs, whit gabapentin(obviously), baclofen, pregabalyn, and a bunch of others I cant remember. They have similar effect profiles, but they vary in strength and type of effect. Phenibut may help with nerve pain, but its a strange drug,

When I used it, 3 days of use in a row resulted in rebound anxiety/depression. Not serious, but there. Longer term use has bad withdrawals. Really bad. 3g/day for 3 months had me in a delirium tremens type of w/d. Luckily I was in a hospital, but I had delusions, hallucination, sleeplesness, psychosis, and really bad tremors/shaking. No seizures though but that's probably because they got me stabilized on ativan and valium before it got to the point of life threatening, but it may have been possible to get seizures without medical intervention.

Use it cautiously, I would use the lowest effective dose a max of 3 times a week on non-consecutive days, or two days in a row with 3 days off after that. Think of it as a thing to take when you need some extra relief to do something you need to function well to do. Don't treat it like Tylenol or any other drug you'd take every day.

Start at 250mg, and titrate up from there. It takes ~2hr for a dose to take effect, so be sure to wait for the 2hr before re-dosing. that was my problem, the first time I took it I re-dosed 1g every 30 minutes, so by the time i was 3 hours in I couldn't walk and I was puking like crazy.

Physical dependency is no joke with this, but with any drug, this has the potential to be a useful and productive part of your pain management if treated with respect and diligence. Its a very "more-ish" drug when you get a "buzz" so be careful and let your doctor know what you're doing so you know if there are interactions with any other medications you take.

 

[envoy]

have there been any confirmed deaths from this or from its withdrawal?

 

[Lobsterbutch]

have there been any confirmed deaths from this or from its withdrawal?

I looked and found this: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ol-Gold-Coast-Phenibut-Australia-doctors.html

Supposedly a bunch of rich kids in a school in australia had a severe overdose on phenibut which has them hospitalized jn critical condition. BUT none of them died, and as far as I can find, no one has died "as a result of phenibut use" nor due to health problems that manifested as a result of long term use.

 

[CfZrx]

Think of it as a thing to take when you need some extra relief to do something you need to function well to do. -----------Its a very "more-ish" drug when you get a "buzz" so be careful and let your doctor know what you're doing so you know if there are interactions with any other medications you take.

Thank you for the thorough response. I approach this substance nervously, but want it for difficult days... but that "moreish" bit sounds bad tbph. I have always struggled with drugs like crack or alcohol, things that you want to re-dose....

 

[CoastTwoCoast]

Thank you for the thorough response. I approach this substance nervously, but want it for difficult days... but that "moreish" bit sounds bad tbph. I have always struggled with drugs like crack or alcohol, things that you want to re-dose....

It's very easy to start abusing phenibut. It was a miracle drug for me in the very beginning many years ago, but that's over. Never get hooked on it. Withdrawals are horrific.

Don't get into a habit of going through tubs of it, then running out and suffering withdrawals. If you can't get more right away to slowly taper off, make sure you have back-up like benzos or even Gabapentin to get through withdrawals if you ever experience it. The side effects start to outweigh the benefits when you overdo it.

 

[markosheehan]

is phenibut bad for your liver at reasonable dosages?
Id be surprised if it was considering baclofen is not and there basically the same molecule beside the CL.

very few people have reported liver problems.

 

[Lobsterbutch]

is phenibut bad for your liver at reasonable dosages?
Id be surprised if it was considering baclofen is not and there basically the same molecule beside the CL.

very few people have reported liver problems.

i had two really rediculous "binges" while I was using phenibut. The one I mentioned above I was doing ~3g daily to self medicate depression and anxiety, lasted about 3-4 months and I cold turkey withdrawal-ed in the hospital until they got wise and realized it was GABAergic and got me stable. The second was earlier, but different, as I was taking massive, unmeasured doses daily for about 3 months. Once I realized and started measuring (once I realized the w/d is insane and I had to taper and know my doses) I was stable on ~10g daily which I tapered down to .5g/day and jumped, which was uncomfortable but way better than the 10g w/d i started to feel.

Point is, I had blood work done after both of these binges and my liver enzyme tests came back normal, no problems.

Now, this is just from ~3-4 months of use, so that doesn't mean its not bad for the liver, its just that my relatively extreme use of it for multi-month use didn't affect my liver in a noticeable record-able way. YMMV

 

[Mycophile]

PHENIBUT IS REALLY FUCKING DANGEROUS
AFTER TAKING NONSTOP 60 500 mg pills my liver just nearly died, my shit was white and i probably never really recovered from that incident, i really enjoyed taking those high doses, the high is actually one of the best I experienced so far. But taking 8000mg for weeks was a bad idea for sure, its definitely a very aggressive liver poison, so anyone taking it should never overdose or take high doses on a daily base, being a great fan of GHB, GBL I can not recommend it. Phenibut became the very last choice for me, there is lot of other Substances that are far less dangerous to take. It really can damage your liver very bad, dont think it is the same like alcohol. The acute damage may last you forever and i am not the only one who experienced this effect.

Now I'm very sorry to hear you say that you did that to yourself, and while YES, to SOME extent Phenibut can be dangerous, ESPECIALLY when so heavily abused as you did, and it's VERY addictive, you have to realize that there's proper use and abuse of all drugs, and what you did was take TWICE the MAX WEEKLY DOSE daily for weeks on end, so really, there was no possible way you weren't going to have something bad happen to you.

Alcohol is dangerous too, but if you drink 10 beers once a week you'll be fine.

The equivalent of what you did is basically take 20 shots a day, every day, for a month.

You were doing so much that even if SOMEHOW your liver had been ok you would have been so addicted that you could have died from withdrawal and people have had bad psychotic episodes from that kind of abuse.

When I used regular Phenibut (HCL or FFA...these days I use F-Phenibut which is an RC and is diffferent), my sweet spot was 3,200mgs (and that's a high dose), and I would never ever let myself use it more than 2 days a week, and I was always fine.

So yes, everyone needs to know to be very careful with Phenibut, but I can't help but feel that you are mis representing a drug and its dangers when you use such obscene amounts and then talk about how dangerous it is.

If you take obscene amounts of most substances bad things will happen, but if you take moderate amounts of most substances than most of the time they won't.

 

[inwardx]

Hello everyone,


Just couple of questions regarding phenibut.

Bottom line, I am looking very optimistically to substitute this to alcohol in a night game/clubbing occasionally.
First of all, why? Well as most of you agree the alcohol high itself is not so special/enjoyable, makes you drowsy, lazy etc. Specially if I am out on a night game, picking up women at some point if you are too drunk, I always feel the urge to do cocaine because of the adverse effects of alcohol consumption. That combo (however enjoyable) is something you do not want to do on a monthly basis. In fact I have been trying to stay away from this combo at all, but couple of times in a year it happens. Maybe I have tried so many various drugs in my lifetime, that alcohol for me has no real value, experience wise. There is the shitty feeling next day and being unproductive, I also workout in the gym regularly so everything really adds up. I definitely do not have a problem with alcohol, as I tend to consume it rarely and in minimum doses. However my weakness still is the alcohol+cocaine combo, so I try to avoid these settings in general. I have nice stack of benzos at home, which I use rarely and have not abused. So given the horror stories I have read I will try to proceed with extreme caution with phenibut.


However I have read that people still complain about brain fog, tiredness/lack of motivation/ rebound anxiety/depression the next day. If used 2-3 times a month, will you still experience these side effects, or so to say hangover ? It depends of the dose you take ? Of course there is the special G, but I am in a foreign country and it is not the easiest way to get my hands on this. However G has its own pros and cons.

e: Finally got the post structured.

 

[ComfortablyNumb95]

Honestly it 100% depends on the person. I dose higher than most people and I don't even have a tolerance, and yet I feel completely normal the day after. Not even an afterglow. 2-3 times a month is absolutely fine as far as wds/physical harm goes but we can't really tell how it's gonna affect you otherwise

 

[imma bee]

This drug is so much fun, and it's great for sex!! :D

While the withdrawals from phenibut are not nice, they are over fairly quickly from my experience.