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P&S Alternative Theories thread v. orange tang

There's no proof of the existence of extraterrestrial lifeforms anywhere in the observable universe scientists have heretofore examined. Frankly, I don't think there are any. But if indeed there are, the odds of their intelligence being greater than a bacterium is exceeding improbable.

A mention of the Fermi paradox would be apropos at this point in the thread's precipitous decline into quixotic speculation and mendacious malarkey.
 
Speed of light doesn't really apply to interdimensional beings. If they reside in the 5th dimension, outside of space and time, they can relocate themselves to wherever they want in the blink of an eye. I think the problem is more that 3rd dimensional life is so incompatible with that lifeform. The problem is probably more spiritual and not if they can arrive here in time.
 
Are we due for the landings?
I would rather spend the money on this World, taking care of our own precious blue ball floating in the abyss of our Milky Way before venturing out towards other possible 'Goldilocks' planets.
Billions of dollars could do much to preserve, re furbish homes to be environmentally sustainable, feed the World and take care of what we do have; focus on clean water, healthy Oceans, Healthy Forest for fresh Air to breath, good clean growing dirt for food to eat..
We could feed the World with all the dosh spent on exploration of the stars.

Yet perhaps our need to explore and the time spent doing it will finally teach us truly that THIS is HOME, our ONE HOME and though we may not be alone, this is all we have and must , MUST take much better care of IT. or everything is screwed and we have no right to do so.
All living things are our brothers and sisters in some way, we are all connected
 
Haha this is great news if true! Ashtar command to the rescue, with laser guns to incinerate the illuminati. Ninae do you know them personally? And mods, this is serious topic and people like Sekio are ad hominemming poor Ninae while going way off-topic.

Is there a source to all this information?

"
The cabal has very cleverly managed to short-circuit every attempt by the Obama administration to return some power to the people by removing the power from the corporations and returning it to the elected government. Except for a small beginning with "Obamacare", which was reviled because it was the first step in removing power from insurance companies, it has been completely unsuccessful. "

ahahaha Ashtar command are democrats obviously. liars too.

"Now, more than 60% of Earth inhabitants acknowledge they have seen a ship at one time or another."

I feel left out now.

p.s. OP was horrible.
 
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Nom de Plume said:
There's no proof of the existence of extraterrestrial lifeforms anywhere in the observable universe scientists have heretofore examined. Frankly, I don't think there are any. But if indeed there are, the odds of their intelligence being greater than a bacterium is exceeding improbable.

A mention of the Fermi paradox would be apropos at this point in the thread's precipitous decline into quixotic speculation and mendacious malarkey.
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Do you impress yourself?

What about slime molds? They are rather intelligent, or they seem to display behavior that we associate with intelligence, such as anticipation, and ability to navigate mazes. I imagine intelligence might be seen in forms we with ours have yet to grasp, at least at large, and it might be rather foolish to deem anything "not intelligent".

Saying its malarkey is an opinion, and perhaps flat out wrong. Do birds just sing bullshit? Do insects? What if another species has a way to see through, to make sense of things... Having "ears to hear, and eyes to see" (or some other sense)? Assuming another species, or another perceptive intelligence, may exist. Maybe we are relaying some kind of temperature/climate, like crickets. We reflect something real.

Does bullshit exist? It depends on how you look at it, maybe. But I admit its much easier, and perhaps better for our time, to call it bullshit for the time being, sometimes, and move onto other things. I don't know. Our own rejection of things too might be in the action of some intelligence, sometimes, and I doubt we would have got here without certain impedance.
 
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To What 23:


Do you impress yourself?
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If this is intended as a yes-no interrogative statement, then it depends. Which in your view is more palatable? Cavalier honesty or polite mendacity?

What about slime molds? They are rather intelligent, or they seem to display behavior that we associate with intelligence, such as anticipation, and ability to navigate mazes. I imagine intelligence might be seen in forms we with ours have yet to grasp, at least at large, and it might be rather foolish to deem anything "not intelligent".
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It's apparent you are conflating sentience with intelligence. The set of all known organisms are sentient, by virtue of their percepts and qualia. Sentience is a necessary and sufficient condition for life, as life is currently defined scientifically. (Be advised that science doesn't have a definitive and unanimously accepted definition of life. However, some definitions are more popular than others, and I am herein referring to the scientific definition with the most support and popularity). The set of all intelligent organisms is a small subset of the set of all sentient organisms. I won't proffer a definition of intelligence.

I shan't toil in the mud and waste my time playing teacher to the slow class. Ignorance itself is innocuous and universal. Blind, obstinate, and self-assured ignorance is deleterious and confined to troglodytes, querulous anti-intellectuals, and languid pseudo-intellectuals.

Notwithstanding your patently obvious semantic and lexical challenges, I presume your reading comprehension is still sufficient to at least comprehend the omphalos of a text. So, for the sake of your edification and perhaps seeming less like a maladroit schnook (which you absolutely are not, in point of fact. To proclaim otherwise would constitute an ad hominim attack and a transgression of this forum's rules. I mean only a hypothetical maladroit schnook!) in future discourse, here are some topically apposite reading materials:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentience

http://www2.astro.psu.edu/users/dfox/A001/Notes/lec37.html

http://bigthink.com/dr-kakus-universe/is-there-intelligent-life-in-the-universe

http://www.universetoday.com/13741/the-odds-of-intelligent-life-in-the-universe/

http://www.hawking.org.uk/life-in-the-universe.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraterrestrial_life

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/inane/2141

http://www.astrobio.net/news-exclusive/dolphins-aliens-and-the-search-for-intelligent-life/

Note: The foregoing references were culled hurriedly from a Google search and each were only given a cursory examination before deciding their suitability for including in this comment.

Saying its malarkey is an opinion, and perhaps flat out wrong.
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Are you insensate? Are you blind and typing in braille and incapable of reading even the title of this utterly execrable thread? You take umbrage with my stating an opinion in a thread predicated on an opinion and exists to solicit other people's opinions? The whole chassis of this discourse is manufactured out of subjectivity.

But on the topic of real, incontrovertible, and unalloyed malarkey, behold this monstrous mound of malodorous manure disguised as language:

Do birds just sing bullshit?
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I dunno. Are you a bird? If yes, then yes.

Do insects? What if another species has a way to see through, to make sense of things... Having "ears to and eyes to see" (or some other sense)? Assuming another species, or another intelligence, somehow. Maybe we are relaying some kind of temperature/climate, like crickets.
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This excerpt deserves nothing but applause and adulation. I think we've a prospective Nobel laureate in our presence.

Does bullshit exist?
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Well, I think with your demonstrative argumentation you make quite a compelling case for its existence.


It depends on how you look at it, maybe. But I admit its much easier, and perhaps better for our time, to call it bullshit for the time being, sometimes, and move onto other things. I don't know. Our own rejection of things too might be in the action of some intelligence, sometimes, and I doubt we would have got here without certain impedance.
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What are you even saying?!
 
Ears to hear and eyes to see. My editing messed me up a bit. My apologies. I caught a few seeming errors in one of your posts awhile back, and I almost pointed them out, or almost asked about them in a P.M., because I can see you take pride in language... but I decided not to get involved/say anything.

The "opinion" that began this thread was not an opinion... It was an option for a belief- one that, if say imminent is defined as one week, would prove to be right or wrong, depending on if this landing happened or not. And then what it was founded on, that story of the landings coming, was full of belief... Not opinion. Opinion and belief are not the same same. Opinion is more like Apple Pie is better than Pineapple Pie, or I like Red better than Green (Or, I like one, and the other is "gross"). Sure, there are sames, and there are differences. It is my belief that Red is my favorite color. But it is also my opinion. What this thread is predicated upon more closely aligns with belief, as if imminent was detailed better, as said, as maybe some set number of days or a set number of weeks, then we can simply say they were wrong, or right, depending on if it happened. Their belief turned out to be right. Their belief turned out to be false/wrong, relative to the closest truth possible. An opinion, in my mind, I use like musical "tastes", other "tastes", maybe perceptions, etc. An opinion can be like a preference-- It can align with preference. Like I have a preference for slightly thick redheads, and my buddy for skinny blonds. Each has their own opinion as to what is more sexy. Yes belief aligns as well, but believe can cover some other areas, like what this thread began with.... Beliefs that very well might be, quite literally, wrong, relative to the most objective truth.

Does "bullshit" exist? I seem to think so, a lot. But is it right, to try this again, to call nature itself "bullshit"? Its a question I have sometimes. And does nature stop at us? I like to choose the more favorable view of things.

I'm not sure what I think, about aliens. I think a lot. I've had dreams, as I have mentioned in this thread, and others, and then have had experiences of running into things the next day, and things happening that relate very strongly, and precisely with those dreams. The only thing I'm pretty sure of, is that I don't know.

I'm sorry how I began my last post ("do you impress yourself?"). But, sometimes what I've read of you seems... perhaps ostentatious.

I do find your words valuable. And despite what other I may have said, you are impressive, from what I catch. One of your first posts where you said "I don't write well", I immediately thought "bullshit you don't write well", when I began to read. But I dislike such broad insults, and elitism that also seemed to rear its ugly head. I can understand the majority of posters on this forum, when I want to, but with you its like I'm referring to the dictionary to make sure I'm comprehending, and then on top of that its like you rub this intelligence that you have in, and wish to make others feel stupid, deficient, or retarded, when most are simply average (of course), or likely slightly above, to be engaging here at all. The challenge of words I don't hear commonly is fine. In fact, its beneficial. The other stuff like preemptively calling us retards (other threads), or expecting bad behavior, is not. Not to say you did that here, exactly, but I saw something like it in another thread. And that's sort of why I had the attitude.

Let me know what you think about what I said about opinion and belief, if you want. Unfortunately, with these beliefs that this thread was sparked by- that this thread is in question of, with the lack of framing of "immanent", its hard to prove them right or wrong, true or false, and the author is free to keep twisting.

Don't confuse my openness with encouragement of investment into this, let alone belief. I tend to play around, and feel safer remaining open, even if things seem unbelievable.

Aliens... The most sure thing I can say about the subject is that I don't know. The Fermi Paradox is an interesting argument against. It still proves nothing to me, as far as intelligent life existing or not. It's also possible that intelligent life, like human life, with the potential to fathom space travel, and other worlds, destroys itself before it reaches that. I've heard arguments, like why, if this life should be common, aren't we seeing more radio signals indicative of it, from other worlds. And answers to that could be that maybe they are as (or near as, relative to age of the universe as we know it) old as we are, or similar, and just weren't spitting out signals in any time that it would have got here already. Perhaps they find a way to shield it, as well. Maybe we live in some kind of illusion. It may be that if a race could actually visit us, from light years away, cruising around the galaxy, that they may have God-like abilities, manipulating space around us. So why would they leave evidence, unless they wanted to? Just a thought. I guess they could be less advanced than that, though. I just wonder if they could be, though, and still be able to travel such distances, so fast, and withstand the journey. It seems they would need some kind of tricks, to be alive still.

So many things had to be perfect here, on Earth, for us to come about. I agree life, like us, seems improbable, sometimes. But the universe is a pretty big place. Sometimes I'm certain that it would exist, even if rare.
 
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Why don't Ashtar just come down and speak to us on international television before landing with his fleet? (although it's doubtful this would be allowed).

Or Jesus, the commander of the largest ship "The New Jerusalem" and said to be the head of the whole operation, could come down. I'm sure at least he would be welcomed by most. Apart from the really evil people in this world who would completely freak out like the last time. His agenda is so adverse to theirs.

I'm thinking this is connected into "free will" in some sense though. Apparantly, in this world free will reigns supreme, no matter the consequences. Don't see how they could get the approval of the whole of humanity anytime soon, though, as there aren't that many who even believe or are interested in the topic.
 
Jesus said:
34“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn

“ ‘a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
36a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.
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I'd be more happy if he stayed on his ship tbh.

He's already made his visit to earth again anyway.. it didn't go well.

MzipB.jpg
 
I suppose you think that's something funny to make fun of. It might not have turned out that well for him, but it led to a lot of improvement for us. Before he came along the official religion in most places was a form of Pagan Satanism. Many cultures, like the Vikings, took very many centuries to be Christianised. That's the case for most of the world before teachers like Mohammed and Jesus came along.
 
Don't need to read any dodgy websites. Before Christianity came along my city would perform public sacrifices to Baal and Odin. It was called "Blot" and even the sites are well known. The area was very resistant towards being Christianised. The old Viking culture was very primitive and savage and not known for compassion.
 
Ninae said:
Don't need to read any dodgy websites. Before Christianity came along my city would perform public sacrifices to Baal and Odin. It was called "Blot" and even the sites are well known. The area was very resistant towards being Christianised. The old Viking culture was very primitive and savage and not known for compassion.
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Referring to your post at top of page. Maybe, I'm not sure Ninae, but I'd throw some caution to grouping 'Paganism' with 'satanism' together, don't you think? After all, essentially 'Paganism' is about respecting and celebrating the Mother, the HOme of us all. This Planet called EArth. Finding harmony and balance with our natural surroundings; as after all, we are natural creatures who have unfortunately become very distracted and lost from this connection so as a fellow 'Pagan', when you imply my beliefs are linked with some horned creature named Satan, well, it hurts my feelings.
Of all the beliefs of past and present, being a Pagan/Buddhist seems to better represent a harmonious union with this great Globe.
Please don't imply that because I respect and cherish this place that I'm some satan worshipper. That is truly cruel and misguided.
 
It began that way. It was a form of stewardship of the Earth. But that wasn't how it ended.
 
In Judaism, as far as I know, Satan wasn't a being. It was "obstruction", for one. Only in Christianity, and later, in Islam was it personified, in these Abrahamic faiths. Zoroastrianism can be said to predate and be a source of stories (and its sources were the other stories and traditions of the region) that went into Judaism, and Christianity, and Islam, unless I am mistaken. There is a religion which is related/has similar, but different beliefs, called Yazidism. Well, they revere Shaytan (Satan), where Christians and Muslims consider him the source of Evil. To Yazidis, "Evil" and Good are both in the minds and spirits of man (I believe this strongly, as I'm not a coward or finger pointer, for one). Yazidis believe that God created Tawuse Melek (Malek Taus as "he" is referred to in English) from his own "illumination", and he is one of the seven archangels that God has delegated to care for the Earth. He is the chief Angel. This aligns with the somewhat confusing "The Ruler of this Earth is the Prince of Darkness", that has been stated, in spirit, in at least one other religion, I think (Christianity?). I can't be sure exactly how to say this. But it interests me.

Their story about the beginning is the same/similar. God created Tawûsê Melek (Satan/Shaytan), and told him to bow before none other. Then God created later these other six archangels. Then God told them to gather dust, and God created Adam with this dust. He then told the other angels to bow to Adam, and when Tawûsê Melek was asked to (or they were all asked at once), he refused, asking God "how can I, when I was created in your illumination?", more or less. So here, God rewarded Tawûsê Melek, with the position of leader of the archangels, and basically, ruler of Earth/universe. God in this Religion is somewhat deistic, therefore.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yazidi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melek_Taus

Could it be that when Satan tempted Jesus, that Jesus merely faced "Satan's temptation"? That, to choose, between good, and evil? In this story, of Melek Taus, he obeyed God's first command, and the second one was seen as a test. The story of Abraham has a similar test of good and evil, as it's interpreted by some, although, God first told Abraham to kill his son, and then told him not to (through an angel of God), and he chose the later, perhaps, because it was "good". "Test the spirits".

If you do not believe that "Christianity and Judaism" have sinned, then you are mistaken. And Muhammad, that you speak of in the same line as Jesus, ordered hands to be cut off. And Jesus, wants you to cut your hand off, if it causes you to sin. Metaphor schmetaphor- the ways Christians justify certain words... I'll listen to myself, and myself says that my hand can't cause me to sin. My eye can't cause sin (which he also said to pluck out, if it does). And now, these "new age religions" only see this benevolent Jesus, and see him as an ascended master, when he basically says everyone is going to hell, multiple times, and that the reason he speaks in parable is to confuse people, so that they don't receive the message of God, so that they aren't saved. He comes not to bring peace, but a sword. Jesus referred to a woman, who wasn't Jewish, as like a Dog (in reference to), and only when she got really low, admitting it, saying "yes! but dogs also sometimes get scraps that the children drop!" (something like that), did he help her. He believed he came only for the Jews, and that it was up to them to spread his message.

Deuteronomy 22:22 "If a man is found sleeping with another man's wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die."

And Jesus said

Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. Matthew 5:27-28

I should go pluck my eye out? Cut my hand off that spilled seed? What if I trace the cause back to my God-given instinct? I can't cut that off. So I should die.

Religion is so fucked. I can accept this world as an illusion, but it doesn't have to be a nightmare.
 
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My apologies for posting after my last one... But I wanted to share this.

On Ashtar Command, from Wikipedia:

As the weekly channeling sessions at Giant Rock continued through the early 1950s, the alleged Ashtar messages became much more elaborate and began to provide details of the purported existence of an extraterrestrial "government", which claimed to closely monitor activities on Earth and offered material and spiritual support to its citizens. This concept of an "Ashtar Command" was appropriated for use by a number of prominent early alleged channelers, both inside and outside the Giant Rock community, and was soon being utilized by several in the context of their own personal claimed messages from Ashtar, along with the use of the figure of Ashtar himself, originally developed by Van Tassel.[5]

By 1955, a few well known channelers of the era, including Elouise Moeller, had incorporated the concept of an Ashtar Command and related ideas, as key components of their own developing systems. Several channelers, including Van Tassel himself, began publishing accounts which described predictions of the imminent arrival of an Ashtar-led UFO armada on Earth, in order to guide and protect mankind. The public failure of these predictions had an enormous negative effect on the expansion of the Ashtar Command 'movement'. Without Van Tassel's role as a single authority constituting the sole source of messages from Ashtar, the movement became less cohesive and began to splinter from internal pressures. Several dozen channelers were simultaneously claiming to be obtaining, in some cases, competing authoritative messages directly from Ashtar. The overall movement began to wane in relative popularity because of infighting.
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Mr. Ashtar,

Please,

I know you're not so limited as to not understand the difference in time here from how "time" is "where" "you" "are". Next time, I implore you, to let us know what the frame is, for imminent, or else we will have people saying imminent could be 900 years from now.

Thanks,

Jeff
 
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