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Official 2011 NFL Season Thread

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axl blaze said:
god damn, that Steelers WR corp looks like the best in the NFL
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to you. steelers receiving stats:

receptions: 7th
receiving yards: 5th
yards per game: 9th
touchdowns: 7th

your receivers do pretty well on fumbles: 7th
and fumbles lost: 3rd (up there with the fumbling elite of the bucs and the redskins)

your ability to look past teams like the packers, patriots & saints when talking about who's best is becoming legendary, j :)

alasdair
 
Steelers are pretty good at WR. I'd put them on a par with the Saints in joint second place, ahead of the Chargers, Cowboys and maybe then the Patriots. If Welker got hurt theyre fucked.

The Packers are top of the pile. By far.
 
suburu said:
I'd put them on a par with the Saints in joint second place, ahead of the Chargers and maybe then the Patriots. If Welker got hurt theyre fucked.
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if brown or wallace get injured, they're fucked. if anybody's top receiver gets injured, they'll take a big hit.

i agree the steelers are pretty good but they're not best - or second best - in the nfl.

alasdair
 
Theyve still got Ward, Sanders, Cotchery. Take Welker and Branch out. Youre left with Ochoshitbag and i cant even think of who else play for ye then! Gronk and hernandez are great but youre WR corp isnt that good.
 
ward? lol. 325 yards and 2 td all season.
sanders and cotchery 390 yards and 4 td between them all season.

so i agree - if you take out welker and branch, the patriots receiving corp. starts to look worse but the same is true of the steelers minus wallace and brown and just about every team in football minus their two best receivers so it's not clear to me that you're making a point.

furthermore, you agree with me that the steelers don't have a gronk and an hernandez to pick up the slack either.

axl's claim was that the steelers' wr corp. looks like the best in football. you claim they're joint second best. the numbers suggest they're about 5th or 6th (unless you're counting fumbles in which case they start to look good again :) )

if you look at receiving stats in the following categories: receptions; receiving yards; yards per game; touchdowns

then the steelers are in 7.00th in football. by the same stats, the patriots are in 2.25th place. huge difference.

the claim that the steelers are the best wr corp. in football just doesn't stand up to even the most cursory analysis.

alasdair
 
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alasdairm said:
if you look at receiving stats in the following categories: receptions; receiving yards; yards per game; touchdowns.. then the steelers are in 7.00th in football. by the same stats, the patriots are in 2.25th place. huge difference.
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But surely all those receiving stats includes Tight Ends too, which totally fucks up the numbers. And the fact that Welker is clearly ahead of anyone in yards is because Brady has only Branch as another option and no one else. Ochocinco hasnt even scored one td cos Brady refuses to throw him the ball.

I'm talking about who has the best group not who has the best individual WRs. The numbers get skewed because Brady throws the ball to Welker(i dont know what the % is but) all the time!

IMO the Packers are well ahead of everyone else and then its a toss up between maybe 4 teams. I'd rate the Steelers group much higher than Patriots group

And i dont really believe Axl deepdown thinks the Steelers are better than the Packers!
 
axl blaze said:
shoulda been 21-3, but I will give Cleveland credit. they are constantly pesky, and that is tough when they are a division foe

hey Shimmer.Fade - did you stay with Pitt WR Atonio Brown? I think he scored 24 fantasy points last night. it actually looks like Brown is surpassing Mike Wallace in total catches and yards-after-catch

god damn, that Steelers WR corp looks like the best in the NFL
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Yea he is looking good. I have a bye this week though so it doesn't matter too much =P. I hope he keeps it up, because I doubt Austin will come back 100%.
 
antonio brown 925 yards 2 tds
mike Wallace 1034 yards 8 tds
hines ward 325 2 tds
cotchery 116 2tds
sanders 224 2tds


wes welker 1253 8 tds
deion branch 665 4 tds
ochocinco 213 0 tds
we have no more WR's
 
suburu said:
But surely all those receiving stats includes Tight Ends too, which totally fucks up the numbers.
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if they are if they are receiving touchdowns, what does it matter what number is on their shirt?

but, if you're determined to force an answer out of me then, of course, i agree with you - without welker and branch, the patriots wr corp. is decimated. but, again, you could make a similar argument for any team in football if you take away their 2 best receivers.

you know rich people are the same as poor people if you ignore the fact that they have more money :)
suburu said:
And i dont really believe Axl deepdown thinks the Steelers are better than the Packers!
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he didn't say 2nd best. he said best. i think he does :)

alasdair
 
Care said:
^ Falcons are not having a losing season..... just saying. You guys sure break out the razorblades quickly for a team that is still in the playoff hunt.
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I totally cop to wishing mark Richt would get fired earlier this season, not for losing to SC, but yes, for losing to boise in such a blah way. Mike Smith, however, I think is doing an excellent job, and we'd have to skid a whole lot harder than the pretty good season we're having now before I wish we'd get a different coach.
 
alasdairm said:
if they are if they are receiving touchdowns, what does it matter what number is on their shirt?
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No, it doesnt matter. Anyway when Gronkowski and Brady tearing it up like they are, why would you throw the ball to Ochocinco. Its hardly the offense Pats need to worry about right now. Maybe the defense should start banging some Pornstars, seems to have done the trick for Gronk.
 
eh, I still believe that the Steelers have the best WR Corp in the league. and although the team doesn't run as much as they used to, they still do a good amount of running (take for example last game for Cleveland). so ali, your stats are cute and all, but they are just stats

the Patriots truly only have Welker these days. if you would pay a bit more attention to formations (I know them all, thanks years of playing ball), the Patriots really focus their offense on their two Tight Ends, and then some Wes Welker. I am impressed though, I do believe that in the NFL (hell all levels of play) a team offensively should use their TEs more often

the Steelers WR corp are very very young (Ward and Crotchery are old, but they don't even seen very much playing time at all now). they are amazingly skilled, fast, and very young/raw. I will compromise and say that teams like the Packers and the Saints also have some talent at WRs, enough talent to perhaps tie Pittsburgh's talent

Alasdairm - it's not like I'm making up this statement out of my ass. if it gives you any consolation, many sports talking heads have also crowned the Steelers WR corp as the best in the league. so the statement itself is not inane to make, and I would hazard that many posters here in S+G agree with me, or agree with me mostly

hell, Suburu is a surly Irishman and he is the fan of my teams most hated (and respected) arch-rival Ravens. and he appears to mostly agree with that statement

hell, talking about the Ravens. they should have one of the best WR corps in the league, but apparently Joe Flacco only has superb games (this year) when he plays my men in black + gold ;)
 
axl blaze said:
so ali, your stats are cute and all, but they are just stats
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i think the colts are better than the packers. sure, you say the packers are 12-0 and the colts are 0-12. your stats are cute and all but they're just, like, stats...
axl blaze said:
I will compromise and say that teams like the Packers and the Saints also have some talent at WRs, enough talent to perhaps tie Pittsburgh's talent
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so let's talk about what they're best at?

the great thing about american sports in general - and baseball and football in particular - is that they're analysed extensively. the great thing about stats is that they can be used to objectively measure teams and players against each other. there's no argument that aaron rodgers is a better quarterback than eli manning because his stats (rating, completion percentage, etc.) are objectively better than eli manning's.

indeed, the whole result of a game itself is one big stat - the team with the most points at the end of the game wins. if pittsburgh beats cincinnati 24-17, we don't go to a judging table who say "well, pittsburgh has the most points but cincinnati played a better game so we'll give them the win". that would be ridiculous and so it is with player stats.

you can say that the pittsburgh receiving corp. is the best in football but the stats - the only meaningful, objective measure we have - say they're not. they're not in the top 5 in any major receiving category.

so if they're the best in football, what are they best at?

alasdair
 
I think that the NFL is a bit different from a sport as say, the MLB, where stats truly reign supreme. but, I can win my argument this way, as well, so I'll play

on Antonio Brown - "Over the past seven weeks, Steelers WR Antonio Brown has a league-best +13.1 receiving grade from Pro Football Focus. Brown is feasting on single coverage, averaging 5. Read more: http://www.fantasysp.com/player/nfl/Antonio_Brown/1964944/over-the-past-seven-weeks-steelers-wr-antonio-brown-has-a-league-best#ixzz1gA7Be9kz"

on Mike Wallace - "Steelers receiver Mike Wallace is among the league leaders in receptions (43), yards (800), touchdown catches (five) and yards per catch (18.6), but according to Baltimore cornerback Lardarius Webb, Wallace isn't even the best receiver the Steelers have on their roster. Every time somebody asks me, they're always talking about Mike Wallace," Webb told the Baltimore Sun. "But they have a guy in No. 84, Antonio Brown, who's better than (No.) 17 in all aspects of the game. Read more: Ravens' Webb: Wallace not Steelers best WR - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_765280.html#ixzz1gA7lqhz4"

so you say these players lack sufficient stats? I just read "league best" for one WR, and "league leading receptions, yards per catch, yards, and TD catches" for the other receiver (wow Mike Wallace is leading in almost every WR statistical category)
 
^ Well your steelers are about to face the #1 run defense in the league so we'll find out if those receivers can be clutch when you need them to be without play action being effective. I watched the thursady night game this week and the steelers offense looked pretty anemic outside of 3 or 4 big plays. That goal line stand by the browns after wallace went down at the 2 was pretty bad. Also, those redzone turnovers were killer.

I think you are going to need to score more than 14 points this time and against a much better defense to win on the left coast against the niners.

Also, its looking quite possible that Harrison will get suspended for his hit on McCoy. He clearly led with the helmet right into the facemask.
 
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^ I think they'll be just fine vs the cards. I hope he sits so he has a better chance of playing vs the steelers.
 
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