I also find Melatonin to be very effective. The doses that are available over the counter are actually a lot higher than we need. A little goes a long way, and even dosing under 1mg is effective. As for XR - yes, there is a time release formula available but I've only seen in 10mg pills. I have tried it and it does work well, but I cut the pill into slivers as 10 mg is way too high a dose. Your local drug store (Walgreens, CVS, etc) should have that option available in the Melatonin section.
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H&R Moderators: streaM Freak
Need advice tapering from kratom after opiate WD
- Thread starter SunSpot
- Start date
I also find Melatonin to be very effective. The doses that are available over the counter are actually a lot higher than we need. A little goes a long way, and even dosing under 1mg is effective. As for XR - yes, there is a time release formula available but I've only seen in 10mg pills. I have tried it and it does work well, but I cut the pill into slivers as 10 mg is way too high a dose. Your local drug store (Walgreens, CVS, etc) should have that option available in the Melatonin section.
Hey SunSpot, there are time release versions of melatonin, I have only seen 5 mg and 10 mg in those though but you could search online and possibly find others. If 2mg instant release melatonin works for you then possibly 5 mg extended release would be close to the same since it spreads it over a few hours. I have never taken these xr versions though so can't say for sure. I have the same issue with melatonin so take it with other supplements that help to stay asleep. Also, I have found I can redose melatonin during the night as long as I have 3 hours or more before I need to wake up. Usually just take 1/2 of one if dosing in the middle of the night though. A few years ago I had this stuff called Midnight that had 1 mg melatonin and some other supplement in it which was meant for this purpose, dosing after waking up in middle of the night. It worked well and I never woke up feeling groggy after dosing at that time. Hopefully you find a way for it to help you get a full nights sleep.
I just searched and found Natrol makes a time released in 3mg. Might have to order it online, I have never seen these in stores before.
EDIT: There are actually some 1mg time release melatonin on the market as well. This might be ideal so you could easily change the dosage around until you found what is right for you.
EDIT: There are actually some 1mg time release melatonin on the market as well. This might be ideal so you could easily change the dosage around until you found what is right for you.
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Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
Less is generally more with melatonin. There isn't much theralutic benefit from taking over 1mg or 2mg, although 3mg certainly is better than the 5mg and 10mg pills you see marketed at the stores. It is hard to find 1mg and 2mg pills in mu area now, it's all 3mg, 5mg most commonly and 10mg doses. This American idea that more is better, regardless if it is OTC, prescription meds or the size of your soda container or amount of cheese on your pizza. It is silly, no wonder we are a nation of type 2 diabetes, where obesity has become the new body type norm. It is sad really.
/end rant
/end rant
SunSpot
Bluelighter
Good morning everyone, jeez am i jonesing for a vape. Almost makes me forget the insomnia. Yeah im going to redose mela now and see if it works. Wish me luck ..
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
I honestly find redosing melatonin to do jack all, but no harm in trying. Maybe get yourself some valerian so that you can take your melatonin in the evening/night and the valerian if you wake up later and need something to help you get back to sleep.
SunSpot
Bluelighter
tbd, yes it did 'jack all' for me. got two more hours of semi-sleep though, which was nice. This 'quitting vaping' thing is really getting under my skin though, I feel like punching things and people .. Just yelled at Maria, our housekeeper, for coming early. I must be crazy. It'll be a fight to be civil today..
Along with redosing you could try combinations with other supplements. Like the valerian chunks you mentioned along with the melatonin or even add in some hops and take it all before bed. Others to consider include Lemon Balm, Skullcap, Motherwort, Magnolia Bark, Lavender and a quality source of Magnesium (just to name a few). Most magnesium on the market isn't absorbed well by the body so it just passes through (good for constipation) but a good one helps to relax muscles very well. Magnesium Glycinate is a good one for relaxation and I take with calcium since they work together. Also topical magnesium oil is said to be the best way to get it into the blood stream but I have never tried this route so can't speak from experience. There are studies showing that most Americans are deficient in Magnesium because of our diets so supplementation can be beneficial.
Just a few suggestions, maybe some of these will work for you.
Just a few suggestions, maybe some of these will work for you.
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
What about getting some nicotine gum, that may really help you get off the vaping. Keep up the great work SunSpot!
SunSpot
Bluelighter
Thanks tpd, stopping vaping has been easy so far. But I'll face a much bigger issue soon: so on sunday i weighed my remaining kratom and found there were only 48g. My goal is to be functional for my costa rica trip in 2.5 weeks.
I've started taking 8 to 12 g krat per day again this week, which gives me 5 hrs sleep per night and has allowed me to recover. With a 5g rescue dose set aside there are maybe 16g left. So what to do, taper (hard psychologically) or CT (hard physically)?
I've started taking 8 to 12 g krat per day again this week, which gives me 5 hrs sleep per night and has allowed me to recover. With a 5g rescue dose set aside there are maybe 16g left. So what to do, taper (hard psychologically) or CT (hard physically)?
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
Honestly I do not think it would makeca huge difference at this point, but if you can, try to taper as long and slowly as is possibl given your situation.
SunSpot
Bluelighter
Hmm, I'm not really the tapering type when it comes to the final jump. But I'll set aside a bit larger rescue dose as emergency taper. I'll use the weekend again to be sick, this is getting _ old_ real fast. I was so enjoying not having the feeling of blades of glass shoved into my brain!
Maybe the lower bp from quitting nicotine will help with the headaches though. Then again, being sick can be very distracting, my right arm is proof of that. Still I'm getting glimpses of total sobriety and the boredom / tsunami of things to do seems overwhelming. I need a vape .. (Punches something in absence of said vape)
Maybe the lower bp from quitting nicotine will help with the headaches though. Then again, being sick can be very distracting, my right arm is proof of that. Still I'm getting glimpses of total sobriety and the boredom / tsunami of things to do seems overwhelming. I need a vape .. (Punches something in absence of said vape)
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
I tend to find that when I set aside a dosecor two for "just un case" when I am attempting to detox ends up leading me to just using it during the detox. That said, I know people who can set drugs aside and not use them for years and years, so I guess all I am saying is make sure you are clear on your true intentions during this process and hold true to them, particularly as regards the goal(s) you hope to achieve. Be well my friend 
I find that holding base a dose helps me to quit. It's just a mental thing, knowing its there if I need it makes it easier imo. There has been times where I ended up taking it though but as long as I waited a while (at least 1.5 days or longer) before taking that 'reserve' dose I was fine in the end. It didn't seem to hinder me in quitting. This my experience at least. I have actually kept that single dose for long periods and never taking it.
SunSpot, how long has it been since you had your last dose of tea? Seems like it's been at least 3 weeks so you should be past any acute withdrawal from that at least.
SunSpot, how long has it been since you had your last dose of tea? Seems like it's been at least 3 weeks so you should be past any acute withdrawal from that at least.
Concerning the melatonin we discussed a few days back, I tested a lower dose the last 3 nights, so here are the results. Was taking 5 mg nightly so broke those in half and took 2.5 mg for two nights and got a full night sleep with both. Last night I broke a 3 mg in half (dosing 1.5 mg) and slept well for a few hours then woke up. Didn't go right back to sleep so I took another 1 mg and slept the rest of the night.
So for me it seems 2.5 mg is the sweet spot to get a full nights sleep. This is while tapering suboxone so once I make that final jump this may change temporarily. We shall see.
So for me it seems 2.5 mg is the sweet spot to get a full nights sleep. This is while tapering suboxone so once I make that final jump this may change temporarily. We shall see.
SunSpot
Bluelighter
Hi OpiDawg, that's easy to figure out! I made it so my first full day of no dose was May 1st, so today is Day 27! And you're right, the physical WDs are over, though I can't be sure as I've been taking a higher dose of Kratom to recuperate a bit. I'm curious what will happen when I run out, there are only 6.5g 2X leaf left, 3 of which I'll take in sec. On the 21st even while taking some kratom I still had physical WDs, mostly light shivering, some tummy issues and really twitchy muscles. Those were very uncomfortable!!
This time I'm better prepped to deal with any lingering WD, I've psyched myself to go to the Dr. and ask for sleep meds and to be put on water pills. So my rule is if I don't sleep this weekend, I'll go monday afternoon. Man, opiods sure do suck ..
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Yea, I am thinking about going to the doc as well and asking for clonidine. I'm told it's not controlled so they should prescribe if you ask for it. I know it works great for withdrawal so I really want to but am hesitant to go to the doc.
Btw, why ask for water pills? Does that help in some way?
SunSpot
Bluelighter
Hi OpiDawg, that's easy to figure out! I made it so my first full day of no dose was May 1st, so today is Day 27! And you're right, the physical WDs are over, though I can't be sure as I've been taking a higher dose of Kratom to recuperate a bit. I'm curious what will happen when I run out, there are only 6.5g 2X leaf left, 3 of which I'll take in sec. On the 21st even while taking some kratom I still had physical WDs, mostly light shivering, some tummy issues and really twitchy muscles. Those were very uncomfortable!!
This time I'm better prepped to deal with any lingering WD, I've psyched myself to go to the Dr. and ask for sleep meds and to be put on water pills. So my rule is if I don't sleep this weekend, I'll go monday afternoon. Man, opiods sure do suck ..
edit: just finished my last kratom now at 1pm. It's really helping with the nerve pain of my arm. I'm not crazy about the upcoming weekend, WD from kratom AND nicotine with a hurting arm will not be nice. I swear, that stupid arm gave me 5/10 pain this morning, with occasional bursts to the 8 pain area (seeing stars, involuntary tears etc). i've had broken bones that were less painful. oh well if things get really bad you'll find me in the jokes thread, it's so distracting. if anyone wants to pm me that'd be cool too, anything to think of something else ..
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SunSpot
Bluelighter
Just to update I'm officially out of kratom, took the last bit at 2 this morning. Stupid cravings bother me, but i have our washing machine to repair which is distracting. Its a whirlpool duet and the drum doesn't turn. Took everything apart, sadly it looks like the shaft bent and warped everything. So an unfixable total write off, a bent 1 inch hardened steel rod can do quite some damage! and just after warranty too, we had it for 5 years and change. Warranty was five years exactly. How do they do it??
Can't wait until tonight to see if I'll sleep or this will be insomnia 2.0.
Can't wait until tonight to see if I'll sleep or this will be insomnia 2.0.
That's so frustrating about your washer. I've been really lucky in that department. I've had a few issues but have managed to fix everything myself. My set is 16 years old - not pretty or exciting but runs quick and gets the job done. I finally sold them a few years ago for almost what I paid as my husband and I got married and his set is much newer. His set is pretty and has loads of options, but it seems to throw a code twice a year - glad we hve the manual. So far nothing big, but I don't have a lot of faith for these laying long with all the computerized components and sensors.
Hope you get some quality sleep tonight!
Hope you get some quality sleep tonight!