Stimulants Meth/ice as a stimulant vs other stims

[Atomic_Decay]

What comes up goes down to too hard with methamphetamine specifically.

Im OK with dl-amphetamine

I seem too have stopped having hard comedowns from meth although just a years ago they were fucking brutal. I still get lethargy and brain fog but none of the depression and emotional lability. I wonder if the concurrent use of lots of LSD somehow influences this - as nothing else has really changed that might explain it.

 

[izo]

Just as the impression might arise: Amphetamine is in no way any less dangerous or stressful than meth.

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

I'm interested to note I have recently also consumed methylphenidate or Ritalin. I have in my younger years found this fun, recreational etc.
I didn't enjoy it. I found it frustrating. The effects were as expected but my headspace didn't enjoy.

I wonder if the meth I have isn't too bad but it's my headspace. I'm early 40s, and haven't used much traditional stims over last 10 years due to availability. I have instead enjoyed Cathinones as that's all I have had. I was very surprised with the effects of Ritalin not being as enjoyable as I expected. I wonder also if Cathinones can ruin amphetamine based drugs satisfaction like synthetic weed can block real weed's effects.

I dochave though months of breaks between each drug, so doubt this.

 

[izo]

I have also mixed cathinones (several) and mph throughout the last year and found only the cathinones to be not worthwhile. Ritalin became my favorite upper of all the different I took. So for me it’s the other way round.

 

[acklac7]

And I've had similar experiences with (pharmaceutical grade) Street Meth: It's very clear, it's very crisp, yet at the same time it's very strong in a sense. I've mostly ingested it, occasionally snorted it, never smoked it or shot it.
There has to be something with smoking/shooting Meth that I'm missing out on because I don't see how people can use so much in a day. It must give you some sort of intense short-acting rush that triggers compulsive redosing, right whereas ingesting/snorting lasts longer.

 

[Nas47]

That's true-ingesting and snorting last longer.i.v. doesn't like me very much.Smokin was my way.As to neurotoxity i have read,that meth is,amphetamine is not.It fries this stuff...liver,kidneys,heart-too much load.That's how i feel it.

 

[acklac7]

That's true-ingesting and snorting last longer.i.v. doesn't like me very much.Smokin was my way.As to neurotoxity i have read,that meth is,amphetamine is not.It fries this stuff...liver,kidneys,heart-too much load.That's how i feel it.

I was referencing neurotoxicity. I can’t speak for cardiotoxicity / hepatotoxicity. I would venture a guess that you are correct, however, and Meth is substantially more toxic than Amphetamine to those organ systems (at any dose), especially street Meth.

 

[Atomic_Decay]

(pharmaceutical grade) Street Meth:

eh. Oxymoron much?

 

[foxymethoxyxoxo]

eh. Oxymoron much?

ngl laughed so hard at this. LMAO i just laughed more. I'm writing that one down. (respectfully) I wonder if the low-dose meth regimen is perhaps not working in the direction desired. So I looked a bit further I guess at his signature and stuff and yeah, uhm...

I would venture a guess that you are correct, however, and Meth is substantially more toxic than Amphetamine to those organ systems (at any dose), especially street Meth.

It's not a guess, amphetamine and dextroamphetamine cannot breach the bloodbrain barrier. This is the barrier between your brain and your circulatory system which keeps extremely unwanted chemicals from entering the neurons- yknow, the most evolutionarily important aspect of our brain. Without it, every harmful chemical would also impact your nervous system at its core. It's a very, very thin filter, so to speak, and only wants oxygen. Most drugs can still act to a near full degree only having access to the peripheral nervous system (or excress, whatever, I just took some xans dont be mad at my unspecificness).

HOWEVER
ALL DRUGS ARE NEUROTOXIC IN SOME MANNER IF NOT NATURALLY PRODUCED BY THE BODY IN A MEDICALLY PROVEN WAY (NOT SOME DMT TYPE ~EH MAYBE SORTA IN SMALL AMOUNTS~ TYPE WAY SO BE CAREFUL OK GOSH

Even from your signature's link I don't understand why you would use that study and I seriously question your ability to give advice on that merit. I would implore you to be more thorough and honest in your understanding of these serious topics which can be medically problematic. Excuse me if I am being a bit forward.

"However, recent evidence from our laboratory indicates that low doses of methamphetamine can produce robust neuroprotection when administered within 12 h after severe traumatic brain injury (TBI) in rodents. Thus, it appears that methamphetamine under certain circumstances and correct dosing can produce a neuroprotective effect" (Rau 2016)

Elaboration: This only worked after a serious brain injury and within 12 hours and only on mice and there was just one study. I didn't read further into it but I bet the sample size was n < 10 for some reason. I may be mistaken

Cited

Rau, Thomas, et al. “The Neuroprotective Potential of Low-Dose Methamphetamine in Preclinical Models of Stroke and Traumatic Brain Injury.” Progress in Neuro-Psychopharmacology and Biological Psychiatry, vol. 64, 2016, pp. 231–236., https://doi.org/10.1016/j.pnpbp.2015.02.013.

And I've had similar experiences with (pharmaceutical grade) Street Meth: It's very clear, it's very crisp, yet at the same time it's very strong in a sense. I've mostly ingested it, occasionally snorted it, never smoked it or shot it.
There has to be something with smoking/shooting Meth that I'm missing out on because I don't see how people can use so much in a day. It must give you some sort of intense short-acting rush that triggers compulsive redosing, right whereas ingesting/snorting lasts longer.

Oral: Slow onset, longer lasting, less intense, less side effects, less euphoric
Insufflated: Fast onset, short duration, very intense, ow my nose, very euphoric
Smoked: VERY FAST ONSET, Short/medium duration usually shorter, rush, followed by semi-intense, VERY VERY euphoric
Injected: VERY FAST very fast very VERY ONSET THE DURATIONSG AGIS REALLY LONG THERES A CRAZY RUSHGDA ANTHAT LASTS SA WIHLE AND ITS WSUEPR EUPHROIC

 

[Atomic_Decay]

ngl laughed so hard at this. LMAO i just laughed more. I'm writing that one down. (respectfully) I wonder if the low-dose meth regimen is perhaps not working in the direction desired. So I looked a bit further I guess at his signature and stuff and yeah, uhm...


It's not a guess, amphetamine and dextroamphetamine cannot breach the bloodbrain barrier. This is the barrier between your brain and your circulatory system which keeps extremely unwanted chemicals from entering the neurons- yknow, the most evolutionarily important aspect of our brain. Without it, every harmful chemical would also impact your nervous system at its core. It's a very, very thin filter, so to speak, and only wants oxygen. Most drugs can still act to a near full degree only having access to the peripheral nervous system (or excress, whatever, I just took some xans dont be mad at my unspecificness).

HOWEVER
ALL DRUGS ARE NEUROTOXIC IN SOME MANNER IF NOT NATURALLY PRODUCED BY THE BODY IN A MEDICALLY PROVEN WAY (NOT SOME DMT TYPE ~EH MAYBE SORTA IN SMALL AMOUNTS~ TYPE WAY SO BE CAREFUL OK GOSH

Even from your signature's link I don't understand why you would use that study and I seriously question your ability to give advice on that merit. I would implore you to be more thorough and honest in your understanding of these serious topics which can be medically problematic. Excuse me if I am being a bit forward.

"However, recent evidence from our laboratory indicates that low doses of methamphetamine can produce robust neuroprotection when administered within 12 h after severe traumatic brain injury (TBI) in rodents. Thus, it appears that methamphetamine under certain circumstances and correct dosing can produce a neuroprotective effect" (Rau 2016)

Elaboration: This only worked after a serious brain injury and within 12 hours and only on mice and there was just one study. I didn't read further into it but I bet the sample size was n < 10 for some reason. I may be mistaken

Cited

Rau, Thomas, et al. “The Neuroprotective Potential of Low-Dose Methamphetamine in Preclinical Models of Stroke and Traumatic Brain Injury.” Progress in Neuro-Psychopharmacology and Biological Psychiatry, vol. 64, 2016, pp. 231–236., https://doi.org/10.1016/j.pnpbp.2015.02.013.



Oral: Slow onset, longer lasting, less intense, less side effects, less euphoric
Insufflated: Fast onset, short duration, very intense, ow my nose, very euphoric
Smoked: VERY FAST ONSET, Short/medium duration usually shorter, rush, followed by semi-intense, VERY VERY euphoric
Injected: VERY FAST very fast very VERY ONSET THE DURATIONSG AGIS REALLY LONG THERES A CRAZY RUSHGDA ANTHAT LASTS SA WIHLE AND ITS WSUEPR EUPHROIC

We’ve been telling @acklac7 since forever that his whole sacred mission to bring low-dose meth to the ignorant and the needy is built entirely on the testimony of one little community of brain-damaged rats.

 

[foxymethoxyxoxo]

We’ve been telling @acklac7 since forever that his whole sacred mission to bring low-dose meth to the ignorant and the needy is built entirely on the testimony of one little community of brain-damaged rats.

Ahh I see. I tend to jump into this without knowing context but maybe my post will add information he wasn't aware of. Or not. hahahaha

Poor fellow. If he wants I can break down this arguments piece by piece because I can actually read those papers. But then again, I am far from the most qualified here, but I may have the most time and patience. Or not. I may never open this forum again for another two years. Them's the chops.

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

Tested tonight.

25mg meth (from my experiences with good quality when younger this should definitely show activity)
Snorted. No redosing.

Immediate effect, body temp, sweaty hands. No real mood lift.

3hrs in. No noticeable mood affects, some minor residual feeling when still though
Will see if I can sleep in 2 or 3 hours.

Not great stuff but I wasn't expecting a heap.

Will repeat with 50mg next time

 

[Atomic_Decay]

Ahh I see. I tend to jump into this without knowing context but maybe my post will add information he wasn't aware of. Or not. hahahaha

Poor fellow. If he wants I can break down this arguments piece by piece because I can actually read those papers. But then again, I am far from the most qualified here, but I may have the most time and patience. Or not. I may never open this forum again for another two years. Them's the chops.

The context is that @acklac7 was annointed the leader of mankind’s salvation by a transdimensional AI which revealed to him the capacity of special kinds of organic meth to rapidly increase the speed of human evolutilon.

It turns out that only human minds that have been exposed to meth are suitable for the kinds of upgrades that the AI is offering.

At least that’s how I understood it.

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

Decided to add 5mg Ritalin. I'm aware I'm using very low doses here. Instant mood lift. Might help buffer the apparent euphoria I found with this and why i started the thread.

Last week, I consumed .75 of this meth and was very stimmed but no euphoria or push at all. Hence I'm trying to work out best way forward and working through whether my cathinone abuse caused me to not enjoy or if the meth is a single isomer and crap

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

So methylphenidate low doses combined with unknown meth low doses produced much better head space than the meth alone at higher dose.

Not tired but feeling ready to start to unwind. Interesting experience.
I didn't intend to add anything tonight to the meth/ice as I wanted to see how long the low dose kept me from sleep, but low Ritalin dose hasn't added any length, so will see how 50mg meth goes.

The trial I mentioned last week of .75mg did about 9 hrs and needed 12.5mg valium and some restavit to sleep. (Had some commitments next day)
Trying to find how to get enjoyment from the meth without being up for days as effectively a side effect (from pursuing enjoyable dose)

 

[cdin]

Yup this is it. Exactly the same. Quite confused. Have you smoked ? I snorted and am wondering if oral or smoking will improve it?

i think you are both just sensible users, with many others being in trauma, highly desperate and having a hard time differentiating kick in the teeth peripheral effects from mind/mood etc. I think that for anyone reasonable 30mg is the upper limit you want to push any form of m-amp. there's noted toxicity in the literature above that and, as you noted - just a longer more side-effect laden experience. the people describing "crazy rushes" are often niave about pharmacology and will just sit and smoke a fucking gram to the face. like, sure that causes a distinct change in reality, whether or not that is positive is another matter entirely. honestly i think m-amp is the most toxic/destructive compound i have ever witnessed in humans, more so even than the fent analogues.

 

[cletusSamboy]

i think you are both just sensible users, with many others being in trauma, highly desperate and having a hard time differentiating kick in the teeth peripheral effects from mind/mood etc. I think that for anyone reasonable 30mg is the upper limit you want to push any form of m-amp. there's noted toxicity in the literature above that and, as you noted - just a longer more side-effect laden experience. the people describing "crazy rushes" are often niave about pharmacology and will just sit and smoke a fucking gram to the face. like, sure that causes a distinct change in reality, whether or not that is positive is another matter entirely. honestly i think m-amp is the most toxic/destructive compound i have ever witnessed in humans, more so even than the fent analogues.

I think being sensible with meth has a lot to do with one's individual reaction to it. I can push it past 100mg with no noticeable change in positive effect so I don't see any point in going over 30mg. Others can keep getting higher and higher the more they take. It's probably rare for people not to feel high off meth and am one of those people. The same can be said with alcohol. Many people love to drink till shitfaced while I can't tolerate the vertigo and sickness that comes along with being drunk and so never push it with alcohol either.

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

I think meth quality varies so much, reactions simply follow.

My experiment with 25mg was testing and the addition of 5mg methylphenidate really surprised me how much it added.
Tried 5mg methylphenidate alone, no noticeable affects. I do think a synergy is present but yet to confirm if can be taken together or if being spaced apart Is needed
More testing to come

 

[Roided1]

I'm using meth for weightloss because the only comparable compound for burning fat to a drastic level is DNP and that drug can kill. I know the risk but I work in Fitness an industry where appearance is almost everything. I hydrate eat sleep and take supplements and I have been getting weekly check ups it seems like everything is under control except each day I keep using a bit more plus I have come to look forward to and ecstatically enjoy the euphoria. It's scary but I will see how this ride goes. No cautionary discourse please. I have read everything.

 

[Roided1]

Actually, it seems quite plausible that your disappointment stems having meth that is too clean & strong and too much of a purely d-isomer product, rather than the reverse situation. I myself find meth quite euphoric in any form, via any ROA. But IMHO that euphoria is still less "up-front" than (d-)amphetamine's, especially at lower doses, and much less physically stimulating, to be sure.

Racemic meth probably would've provided more of the "push" you were looking for, along with greater jitteriness. . . assuming, that is, that the "dex- : racemic" analogy for plain amp. still holds up once after being methylated. And, to take a wild guess, maybe the impurities in meth (or certain of them) could tend to "roughen up" the high, in a way that might be somewhat appealing.

Meth in general, though, tends to have much "smoother" (and much longer-lived) effects than regular amphetamine does, no matter their respective forms/types. So it's kind of ironic that meth, one of the "hardest" members of the stimulant family, also manages to be one of the subtlest, compared to its more socially acceptable cousins like Adderall, Vy/Elvanse, or even Euro speed.

As mentioned, once you increase your dose above a threshold, the effects can be boosted greatly, giving you that "push" undeniably, along with physical stimulation. By that point, however, you're in for a long ride. . . As an ROA, smoking can be much more "hard-hitting," with a distinct euphoria for each big lungful, but I wouldn't say it beats snorting over a whole session/run.

I'm astonished by the way in which the discourse on euphoria was limited to snorting and smoking when in my experience which spans a couple of decades slamming is the most euphoric ROA. From the moment of injection and the ensuing rush consciousness is elevated to a pinnacle. Smoking meth is a social ritual promoted by youth who love to gaze at the clouds so an Aesthetic element stands on its own. For me though once the plunger is depressed euphoria is achieved within moments