Phenethylamines [Mescaline Subthread] Synthetic / Pure Mescaline - Dosage & Methods of Administration
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So I have taken synthetic mescaline orally 3 times now; 2 times at 400mg and 1 time at 500mg. The 500mg time was the day after taking some LSD, so there is most likely some cross tolerance here.
I finally broke down and tried plugging it. I think it was worth the effort. I had 275mg and 350mg weighed out and picked 350mg to plug. I dissolved it in 2ml of water and used another to 2ml water to rinse the bag and shot glass out. It dissolved very easily and made the water a slight yellow color.
[T+0] Plugged
[T+0:05] Strong rush of a drug feeling
[T+0:15] A deepening of the mind
[T+0:45] Visuals starting
[T+3.5-5] Peak
[T+8] Went to bed and feel asleep
Not too much of a trip report, but some information to go off atleast chronologically.
As the speculation that was out there, it seems to follow in the 2C-x's plugged vs oral consumption. Although i have not pushed it pasted 500mg, this was way stronger. Perhaps 2x to 3x more potent? Probably better to start at 150mg to 250mg range. It had a cleaner head feeling, less body "stuff." Although the duration was similar to oral consumption, i think at lower doses it will be shorter than a comparable dose taken orally. Also way quicker up and down. It did have a slight bit of nausea. Never made me puke, but orally it hasn't either. The effects of the drug came in huge waves of slight nausea, emotion and visuals. Maybe its better to plug half then plug half 30 minutes later?
If i have the opportunity, i way mostly likely plug it in the future. It is sad that synthetic stuff is rare and the price reflects that, so taking a smaller dose in order to get the same effects as orally helps out in some regard.
I finally broke down and tried plugging it. I think it was worth the effort. I had 275mg and 350mg weighed out and picked 350mg to plug. I dissolved it in 2ml of water and used another to 2ml water to rinse the bag and shot glass out. It dissolved very easily and made the water a slight yellow color.
[T+0] Plugged
[T+0:05] Strong rush of a drug feeling
[T+0:15] A deepening of the mind
[T+0:45] Visuals starting
[T+3.5-5] Peak
[T+8] Went to bed and feel asleep
Not too much of a trip report, but some information to go off atleast chronologically.
As the speculation that was out there, it seems to follow in the 2C-x's plugged vs oral consumption. Although i have not pushed it pasted 500mg, this was way stronger. Perhaps 2x to 3x more potent? Probably better to start at 150mg to 250mg range. It had a cleaner head feeling, less body "stuff." Although the duration was similar to oral consumption, i think at lower doses it will be shorter than a comparable dose taken orally. Also way quicker up and down. It did have a slight bit of nausea. Never made me puke, but orally it hasn't either. The effects of the drug came in huge waves of slight nausea, emotion and visuals. Maybe its better to plug half then plug half 30 minutes later?
If i have the opportunity, i way mostly likely plug it in the future. It is sad that synthetic stuff is rare and the price reflects that, so taking a smaller dose in order to get the same effects as orally helps out in some regard.
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
As mentioned, no IDing, but I can say with 100% certainty that that is not mescaline, there is absolutely nowhere near enough for a single dose there. It's probably a 2C-X (it looks like one and it would be about right potency-wise). I received 2C-E in capsules in college and told they were mescaline (I later discovered they were 2C-E based on later experiences with 2C-E).
One of the single most distinctive psychedelics, for me, 2c-e, I'm not surprised you were able to tell what you'd taken. If it's 100mg of 2c-e that's more like 4 very powerful trips. I've been floored by 15mg 2c-e before now! Even 8mg at one point was a meaty trip!
Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
That looks more like 50mg max to me... but then again I'm eyeballing a picture of a bag. I've cleaned out a lot of bags so I have some basis but who knows. Don't take any of that unless you have a milligram scale to weigh it out. Better yet don't take it at all since you don't know for sure what it is. It LOOKS like a 2C-X, and the most likely candidate would be 2C-E given I've been offered it as mescaline multiple times.
Yeah 2C-E is a fantastic psychedelic, but it's not mescaline, that's for sure. I find it much more intense than mescaline and decidedly neutral in character, and much more overtly psychedelic, whereas mescaline is peaceful, warm, and loving, and more subtle.
Yeah 2C-E is a fantastic psychedelic, but it's not mescaline, that's for sure. I find it much more intense than mescaline and decidedly neutral in character, and much more overtly psychedelic, whereas mescaline is peaceful, warm, and loving, and more subtle.
Ethyl_Acetate
Bluelighter
I recommend 200-300 mg to someone who has never tripped before, depends on the person. If you've got more experience tripping I'd dose 400-450. Like others have said it is quite forgiving when compared to other psychs. I'm guessing your source has experience with psychs so that's why they suggested that dose.
I personally do not like eating while tripping, so I always eat a small meal a few hours before. The larger the dose the more nausea you might experience, so it might be a good idea to break up the dose - either dissolve it in a drink and gradually consume it over 20 or so minutes or just make a few caps.
Thank you for your response. To answer my own question, 400mg was underwhelming for my friend and me, and we are not experienced trippers. We experienced a stimulated state, a threshold psychedelic headspace, and no visuals. Music however was wonderful and very emotional. I will definitely go higher next time, but of course YMMV.
Shamandrums
Bluelighter
Last weekend I took a very small dose of 15 mg mescaline HCl on an empty stomach as an allergy test. I did not expect much and indeed the experience was not intense. There was a slight mood lift, some cool increase in skin sensitivity, and a slight simulation.
There was something that I do not know and I would like to ask for your opinion. During the first 3 hours after the come up the center of my chest felt warm and nice. Nothing threatening but I don't know this feeling.
What would your guess be? Would this be a sign of elevated heart pressure? I am a bit worried that if I feel 15 mg on my heart that higher doses become dangerous to my cardiac system.
There was something that I do not know and I would like to ask for your opinion. During the first 3 hours after the come up the center of my chest felt warm and nice. Nothing threatening but I don't know this feeling.
What would your guess be? Would this be a sign of elevated heart pressure? I am a bit worried that if I feel 15 mg on my heart that higher doses become dangerous to my cardiac system.
Body load / body high type sensations can be quite complicated and hard to analyze scientifically. Often the action on the nervous system (take for example 5-MeO tryptamines) can amount to some experience of "energy" manifesting in the body. Reminiscent of "chakra" reports, there are different places in the body where this energy build-up can be felt. I'd say it is most likely a manifestation in the nervous system which "aligns" itself in some way according to certain natural flows of neural activity. Incredibly powerful energy can be felt on say 5-MeO-DMT but while it has cardiovascular activation and adrenergic activity cannot be excluded from the picture, it is not a sign of cardiac issues, at least it seems like a vast number of reports do not support such a notion. And I mean many reports involving such chest sensations, as it is very common.
Compounds like MDMA can also produce such feelings in the chest, and it can also happen sober like butterflies in your chest when falling in love. There is an emotional / empathogenic component involved and all these empathogenic substances mentioned, including mescaline, can cause you to 'open up'. You may become more sensitive and susceptible, feelings which can come from very far / deep within can be brought to the surface to rear its head... so there is a great potential for inwards and outwards engagements of such a nature.
Monitor your BP and HR if you're really that concerned, but people don't typically die from heart complications on regular doses of MDMA either whilst they can certainly cause something to bloom and flutter in your chest!
This kind of activity demands that you address it, either through communicating your feelings but also through dancing, meditation or various yogic practices. Suspecting or rejecting those feelings is not a good idea, you cannot suppress it and turned inwards it will get bottled up and do nasty things like cause nausea and make you feel like shit. I guess because this neural activity gets aimed at bodily systems which you don't want to activate?
Compounds like MDMA can also produce such feelings in the chest, and it can also happen sober like butterflies in your chest when falling in love. There is an emotional / empathogenic component involved and all these empathogenic substances mentioned, including mescaline, can cause you to 'open up'. You may become more sensitive and susceptible, feelings which can come from very far / deep within can be brought to the surface to rear its head... so there is a great potential for inwards and outwards engagements of such a nature.
Monitor your BP and HR if you're really that concerned, but people don't typically die from heart complications on regular doses of MDMA either whilst they can certainly cause something to bloom and flutter in your chest!
This kind of activity demands that you address it, either through communicating your feelings but also through dancing, meditation or various yogic practices. Suspecting or rejecting those feelings is not a good idea, you cannot suppress it and turned inwards it will get bottled up and do nasty things like cause nausea and make you feel like shit. I guess because this neural activity gets aimed at bodily systems which you don't want to activate?
Thanks a lot for your very detailed answer 
It is an interesting idea that this is mostly a sensation coming from the nervous system. This would make sense insofar that I didn't feel restless or strongly stimulated. I would compare the stimulation with less of an espresso.
I do not have cardiac issues. I am in good shape and do martial arts two times a week. So at least elevated heart rate is not unknown to me
I had two strange experiences with PEAs that worry me a bit. The first one was more than 10 years ago when Ephedra was still legal in my country and a friend of mine and I made a tea out of it. I would say a string one. Instead of the stimulus and increase in focus and I felt very dizzy, couldn't focus, and felt tired. I very much had the same symptoms when I took 60 mg of mdma for the first (and only time in this dose range). Thus lasted one hour after a nice come up and basically rendered me useless for the time. Afterward the experience was great though.
As mescaline is also supposed to be a stimulant I was thinking that something like this would be a really bad combination with a psycho active compound.
I am not sure what you mean that I have to address this feeling. When taking the mescaline and having this feeling in the chest my skin sensitivity was also increased and i was very easy to arouse. So my girlfriend and I snuggled up and had slow and sensual sex. Afterwards the feeling in the chest remained for 2-3 hours until the main effects of the drug were gone.
I guess a sensual approach would be to work myself up in doses of 50 mg and see what happens. In this way I might also find out if mescaline really a very mdma like effects at some point. It would be nice to have a long lasting, non-neurotoxic drug for festivals or something like this.
Does this make sense for you?
It is an interesting idea that this is mostly a sensation coming from the nervous system. This would make sense insofar that I didn't feel restless or strongly stimulated. I would compare the stimulation with less of an espresso.
I do not have cardiac issues. I am in good shape and do martial arts two times a week. So at least elevated heart rate is not unknown to me
I had two strange experiences with PEAs that worry me a bit. The first one was more than 10 years ago when Ephedra was still legal in my country and a friend of mine and I made a tea out of it. I would say a string one. Instead of the stimulus and increase in focus and I felt very dizzy, couldn't focus, and felt tired. I very much had the same symptoms when I took 60 mg of mdma for the first (and only time in this dose range). Thus lasted one hour after a nice come up and basically rendered me useless for the time. Afterward the experience was great though.
As mescaline is also supposed to be a stimulant I was thinking that something like this would be a really bad combination with a psycho active compound.
I am not sure what you mean that I have to address this feeling. When taking the mescaline and having this feeling in the chest my skin sensitivity was also increased and i was very easy to arouse. So my girlfriend and I snuggled up and had slow and sensual sex. Afterwards the feeling in the chest remained for 2-3 hours until the main effects of the drug were gone.
I guess a sensual approach would be to work myself up in doses of 50 mg and see what happens. In this way I might also find out if mescaline really a very mdma like effects at some point. It would be nice to have a long lasting, non-neurotoxic drug for festivals or something like this.
Does this make sense for you?
Ephedrine is an ethanolamine derivative just like cathinone metabolites, they tend to have strong cardiovascular effects which I agree can be uncomfortable and worrisome and can ultimately be problematic as is seen with e.g. mephedrone binging.
Yeah tried ephedra when it was still legal and found it useful for parties but then again I had limited experience or other drugs available to me at the time, looking back it's an inferior product in my opinion... I wouldn't go partying on caffeine either, although that at least isn't unsafe.
MDMA can make one pretty mellowed out, it's not always that stimulating. So the lethargy is not that uncommon and I don't think it's a sign of any real issue.
I don't know what you mean by mescaline's stimulating qualities being a bad combination with psychoactivity, why? (yes it stimulates the sympathetic nervous system most likely but many psychedelics do and it's fine)
You don't have to address the feeling, but in my experience/opinion (and it seems others arrive at pretty much similar conclusions from what I read) it begs you to "open up" rather than suppress it. I usually give examples of meditation, freeflowing dancing or yogic practices (some martial arts types are really good, I practiced pencak silat which is meditative and graceful rather than some aggressive krav maga blows or jerky movements).
But obviously having sensual / slow sex is excellent for both the release of bodily energies as well as emotional / empathogenic connection.
For me personally I doubt I would find mescaline ideal for festivals per se, because my experiences (at one of my own previous homes and another time at the very beautiful home I grew up in) were very delicate and personal. However MDMA can also be that way and is still of course a good party / festival drug. But, while mescaline is not like traditional psychedelics it can still put you in incredible states of consciousness some of which I would not find appropriate for a party, but maybe at lower dose yes. Not sure if I would find it a little bit of a waste that way, I couldn't say. You could try it.
I've taken LSD before at parties and festivals and that too can be borderline "inappropriate", if some parts of a strong-ish trip are such an experience of their own that it distracts from being at a party. Again, not much of an issue at lower doses, but there aren't all that many psychedelics or empathogens that would be bad at a festival at low doses.
Going up in 50 mg increments from 50 mg is very conservative, I have taken 300 mg and 450 mg (staggered) and found the experiences subtle in some ways and powerful in other ways. But the prevailing feeling is that I would find anything under 250 mg or so annoyingly low.
But I know you're very careful about all this, and nobody should really tell you not to be. I just wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be a bit of a waste of time and material. For a healthy person just taking mescaline, there does not seem to be any evidence whatsoever that it isn't safe.
If you're talking about taking 1000 mg, well then I'd start to wonder what it does to the body, even though I do not know of reported health problems.
Let's see what erowid experiences labeled health problems entail for mescaline and cacti.
Yeah tried ephedra when it was still legal and found it useful for parties but then again I had limited experience or other drugs available to me at the time, looking back it's an inferior product in my opinion... I wouldn't go partying on caffeine either, although that at least isn't unsafe.
MDMA can make one pretty mellowed out, it's not always that stimulating. So the lethargy is not that uncommon and I don't think it's a sign of any real issue.
I don't know what you mean by mescaline's stimulating qualities being a bad combination with psychoactivity, why? (yes it stimulates the sympathetic nervous system most likely but many psychedelics do and it's fine)
You don't have to address the feeling, but in my experience/opinion (and it seems others arrive at pretty much similar conclusions from what I read) it begs you to "open up" rather than suppress it. I usually give examples of meditation, freeflowing dancing or yogic practices (some martial arts types are really good, I practiced pencak silat which is meditative and graceful rather than some aggressive krav maga blows or jerky movements).
But obviously having sensual / slow sex is excellent for both the release of bodily energies as well as emotional / empathogenic connection.
For me personally I doubt I would find mescaline ideal for festivals per se, because my experiences (at one of my own previous homes and another time at the very beautiful home I grew up in) were very delicate and personal. However MDMA can also be that way and is still of course a good party / festival drug. But, while mescaline is not like traditional psychedelics it can still put you in incredible states of consciousness some of which I would not find appropriate for a party, but maybe at lower dose yes. Not sure if I would find it a little bit of a waste that way, I couldn't say. You could try it.
I've taken LSD before at parties and festivals and that too can be borderline "inappropriate", if some parts of a strong-ish trip are such an experience of their own that it distracts from being at a party. Again, not much of an issue at lower doses, but there aren't all that many psychedelics or empathogens that would be bad at a festival at low doses.
Going up in 50 mg increments from 50 mg is very conservative, I have taken 300 mg and 450 mg (staggered) and found the experiences subtle in some ways and powerful in other ways. But the prevailing feeling is that I would find anything under 250 mg or so annoyingly low.
But I know you're very careful about all this, and nobody should really tell you not to be. I just wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be a bit of a waste of time and material. For a healthy person just taking mescaline, there does not seem to be any evidence whatsoever that it isn't safe.
If you're talking about taking 1000 mg, well then I'd start to wonder what it does to the body, even though I do not know of reported health problems.
Let's see what erowid experiences labeled health problems entail for mescaline and cacti.
Volsam
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2016
- Messages
- 908
About the nausea -
As I know, Mescaline causes nausea mainly because it activates 5HT-3 receptor subtypes, mainly in the gut, thus causing "false" brain alerts to empty the stomach. To counterpart it, theoretically we can use any prescription 5HT-3 antagonists, taken prior taking Mescaline but I prefer to stay natural.
In my personal experience, Ive found some natural 5HT-3 antagonists - menthol and boldine, the second one is being a lot harder to find, but you can buy menthol crystals food grade very cheap, also Halls extra strength (more mg of menthol - the better). If you live in a city that has russian or ukranian stores, look for Validol there (all the supplements are usually by the counter) - it is extremely cheap OTC supp and it is the menthyl ester of isovaleric acid and works as a mild relaxant and anti-emetic. I like it a lot for that purpose.
I have also had good results with essential lemon oil as well combined with menthol oil - both must be food grade!
As I know, Mescaline causes nausea mainly because it activates 5HT-3 receptor subtypes, mainly in the gut, thus causing "false" brain alerts to empty the stomach. To counterpart it, theoretically we can use any prescription 5HT-3 antagonists, taken prior taking Mescaline but I prefer to stay natural.
In my personal experience, Ive found some natural 5HT-3 antagonists - menthol and boldine, the second one is being a lot harder to find, but you can buy menthol crystals food grade very cheap, also Halls extra strength (more mg of menthol - the better). If you live in a city that has russian or ukranian stores, look for Validol there (all the supplements are usually by the counter) - it is extremely cheap OTC supp and it is the menthyl ester of isovaleric acid and works as a mild relaxant and anti-emetic. I like it a lot for that purpose.
I have also had good results with essential lemon oil as well combined with menthol oil - both must be food grade!
LandsUnknown
Bluelighter
Sounds like the initial effects happened faster than usual, but the overall timeline was fairly similar. I wonder what plugging other psychedelics would be like? I've only heard of opiate plugging which never interested me since I've never been into opiates or had any interest in them, but this sounds like it could lead to something very interesting. It sounds as though you bypassed the period of waiting for effects to start for the most part.
I assumed that the problems I had with MDMA were mainly due to overstimulation. The come up on MDMA was nice but then everything was too much and for an hour I felt miserably and just wanted to go home. It could be that my muscles were making problem and putting pressure on a nerve. I have this some times when I have tense muscles. Perhaps stimulation is not really the problem but the muscle tension components?
If you read the reports from the people who extracted mescaline on DMT nexus, I get the feeling that doses between (100-125 mg) should reassemble MDMA. If that works on a festival or at a party is to be confirmed
I know that I might be too conservative but please keep in mind that I did only try 15 mg not 50 mg. Again, if you read the reports on DMT nexus there seems to be some people that react towards mescaline with far less then what you took.
Considering my whooping thresholds for 2C-B of 1 mg and 10-20 mg for MDMA, I am just very cautious :D It goes without saying that the word placebo comes to one's mind. It might be true or it might not be, hard to investigate on my own. For 2C-B I worked myself up from 1 mg to 11 mg in intervals of 2.5 mg and wrote a long report about the experiences (sadly in German as there was basically nothing in the German speaking internet on this topic). Something like this would be nice for mescaline as I never found something like this. So I am not that concerned about loosing time and material. There are three interesting stages that I read about but not very detailed. The first one is the one of an aphrodisiac (at about 50 mg), the second one should be like MDMA and the third one should be a tool for introspection. Let's see what I can find there.
Button line: I am probably overthinking this :D In a couple of days I am going for an other try and report back.
I don't think very high sensitivity is all that common, but if you have it with other similar drugs it's possible or even likely that translates to mescaline.
About those thresholds, it really depends what you call the threshold and maybe it is more helpful to compare how much it takes for you to call it a full experience where you don't want to take any less or any more. Not out of concerns but just from the intensity.
If I pay close attention I might possibly feel doses not *that* much higher than what you are describing, so yeah it's better to compare full dosages.
As an aphrodisiac or empathogen low doses of 2C-B are worthwhile, but as a tactile psychedelic my doses need to be higher. I have had low dose appreciation periods in my tripping career and I can certainly understand the appeal. If you're into that kind of thing your plan sounds great.
A lot of people come here looking for mescaline to really show what it's worth, including as a psychedelic. Since it's atypical that can require higher dosages than you're looking for.
Just be careful not to be too hypochondriac about it all. It's good to be careful with drugs, but probably not good to get stressed out about things that don't warrant it. Not all side effects are serious, not at all, similar to how after effects don't necessarily tell you anything about real long term health effects.
Feeling miserable and wanting to go home with MDMA of course doesn't sound pleasant... unfortunately it's a vague description that doesn't give me any symptoms so it's nigh impossible to investigate what's going on with side effects. Everything becoming too much is a sign of just overstimulation though, which is not bodily stimulation here but the sensitization to stimuli. It's normal to get sensitive / vulnerable / tender with MDMA. Not sure how much tension was psychosomatic. But possibly there were set and setting issues or the dose was not appropriate for the setting.
These kinds of things are potential issues with wanting to use e.g. 2C-B at parties. I've done it, but the tactile, sensorical and psychedelic effects can certainly make it harder to cope. I do have mental issues that can make that more of a challenge, but still, it's kinda true for everyone I would say. These are the downsides to being in that kind of state in such a setting.
About those thresholds, it really depends what you call the threshold and maybe it is more helpful to compare how much it takes for you to call it a full experience where you don't want to take any less or any more. Not out of concerns but just from the intensity.
If I pay close attention I might possibly feel doses not *that* much higher than what you are describing, so yeah it's better to compare full dosages.
As an aphrodisiac or empathogen low doses of 2C-B are worthwhile, but as a tactile psychedelic my doses need to be higher. I have had low dose appreciation periods in my tripping career and I can certainly understand the appeal. If you're into that kind of thing your plan sounds great.
A lot of people come here looking for mescaline to really show what it's worth, including as a psychedelic. Since it's atypical that can require higher dosages than you're looking for.
Just be careful not to be too hypochondriac about it all. It's good to be careful with drugs, but probably not good to get stressed out about things that don't warrant it. Not all side effects are serious, not at all, similar to how after effects don't necessarily tell you anything about real long term health effects.
Feeling miserable and wanting to go home with MDMA of course doesn't sound pleasant... unfortunately it's a vague description that doesn't give me any symptoms so it's nigh impossible to investigate what's going on with side effects. Everything becoming too much is a sign of just overstimulation though, which is not bodily stimulation here but the sensitization to stimuli. It's normal to get sensitive / vulnerable / tender with MDMA. Not sure how much tension was psychosomatic. But possibly there were set and setting issues or the dose was not appropriate for the setting.
These kinds of things are potential issues with wanting to use e.g. 2C-B at parties. I've done it, but the tactile, sensorical and psychedelic effects can certainly make it harder to cope. I do have mental issues that can make that more of a challenge, but still, it's kinda true for everyone I would say. These are the downsides to being in that kind of state in such a setting.