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Lsd + maoi = game over?

Stumpled accross this thread, thought I would bump it up and chime in...

I have taken Nardil (MAOI) with shrooms and acid and as far as I can tell it has no discernable effect on either. It could "flavour" the trip in one way or another slightly but basically nada zilch.
 
^ nardil is a nonselective irreversible MAOI, so you mean you have taken it chronically for depression? in that case, it is likely that your 5HT receptor system was drastically altered by the drug's intended effects, making you less susceptible to the effects of the psychedelics.

i will add my $.02, harmala (selective reversible MAOI) plus mushrooms is most DEFINITELY "game over" in the sense of it is the single most intense trip i could (n)ever fathom.
 
Dude, I just said, Nardil made no difference. I tripped balls while on it, I tripped balls while off it
 
ah ok.

so how did it flavour the trip then? i know some people say that the MAOI in ayahuasca is the "teacher", while the DMT is merely a visionary component.
 
Moclobemide plus mushrooms is game over for certain. Converts the mushroom trip into an enormous, long-lasting DMT trip.

I havn't done enough experimentation to confirm whether LSD + moclo is game over yet. Will report back when I've got some data.
 
A few years back I was on a prescribed moclobemide regimen. I did LSD once and had a strong trip. The potency of the acid was unknown to me, but the come-up was overwhelming. I really was convinced that my hands and fingers were swollen and something was wrong, until my sober sitter reassured me they looked perfectly normal. In ~100 LSD trips I have never had this before. After the reassurance I managed to relax and eventually had a very nice trip.

I also tried 2C-B, 2C-E and 2C-I while on moclobemide (not together). I took very low doses, ranging from 1 - 6 mg. There was a ~3 x potentiation, and I had no side effects. This doesn't mean it was safe though.
 
Just wondering how the MAOI affects the LSD. Does it make the brain receptors more sensitive? Does it affect the LSD molecule itself?

With mushrooms it's obvious that it does something that means your brain interprets the mushrooms as DMT instead of psilocybin. Only difference is you don't vomit your guts up like you do on freebase DMT and moclo.
 
hamhurricane said:
not all drugs are potentiated by MAOIs, there is a journal article somewhere which demonstrates that MAOIs have no effect on LSD metabolism
Click to expand...
I did research a little bit, and I wasn't able to find such article.

I only find article that say LSD effect is reduced with a chronic use of a MAOI :
http://www.erowid.org/references/refs_view.php?ID=6208
http://www.erowid.org/references/refs_view.php?ID=2439

hamhurricane, do you have the reference of the article you were thinking about ?
 
Havn't got round to trying this but the next time I take acid I'll drop 300mg of moclo and have the definitive answer.

Mushrooms + moclo is definately game over but that's because it turns the mushrooms into a DMT trip. I imagine moclo would have a similar incredible effect on any tryptamine but LSD doesn't quite have the full tryptamine structure does it.
 
Hmm. This 'Game Over' expression is possibly unhelpfull.
I have had intense and challenging sessions combining Moclobemide with the 4sub-DMT materials only. It can get quite hectic phsically and mentally, but I wouldn't say life threatening. My rationale was to have a longer duration DMT type of headspace, and that is what was achieved quite nicely.
I wouldn't try it with any 5-sub tryptamines or other 4sub n-dialkyl ones. There are are few reports and I don't see any need to enter uncharted territory when 4sub-DMT provides such rich exploration. Obviously, the alpha methylated ones have some degree of MAOI action themselves and such a combination would be highly dangerous to no obvious purpose. The other 4 and 5 sub n-dialkyl tryptamines I have tried often have higher levels of physical effects than DMT and its close analogs without adding an MAOI. I'm not particularly attracted to extremities of that type.
The bottom line is that introducing an MAOI before your psychedelic of choice is ramping up your risk factors. It's a reasonable practice when you have got a good feel for a particular material whose effect profile agrees with you mentally and physically. But it is not like Ketchup -it doesn't go with everything. Like some posts mention, there is ample anecdotal evidence that it diminishes the effects if LSD.
The only PEA I combined with Moclobemide was Mescaline HCL and it certainly enhanced a 300mg (low) dose into a very moving experience with virtually no tummy rumbles or moments of panic.
Peace Pipp
 
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there is a difference between taking a drug while on a MAOI regime, and just taking an MAOI once for potentiating a drug. At least that was the case when I was on moclobemide. There's less increase in the effects of shrooms while on daily moclo.
 
Summary of my personal experience: 3 hits of blotter all together. One Saturday I took two of them, and kept pretty careful notes of effect and duration. One Saturday a month later I took the remaining hit, but preceded 30 minutes ahead of time by 150mg harmaline/harmine (Syrian rue extraction, set up to nice crystals) orally. The effects of the one hit seemed slightly stronger than of the two hits a month before, and certainly seemed to last about 30% longer.

So, in a decently controlled same person/same kinda blotter/same sorta situation, the MAOI definitely seemed to be effective. More details I got if anyone cares.
 
hamhurricane said:
a close friend of mine tried the combo and said that he "blacked out" temporarily, this friend is a big time liar though so i might as well have not written that.
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There are a number of reports of psychedelics that ARE effected by MAOI's (ie, not LSD) causing blackouts when taken with MAOIs, particularly when the dose is not lowered as much as it should be, so this isn't inconsistent, other than the claim that it was LSD (and it could have been something other than LSD sold as such).

What the hell does "game over" mean? When I hear that term, I think "fatal combination" not "intense trip".... I don't think that a thread like this making such heavy use of that term is in the interest of harm reduction.
 
greenmeanies said:
^ nardil is a nonselective irreversible MAOI, so you mean you have taken it chronically for depression? in that case, it is likely that your 5HT receptor system was drastically altered by the drug's intended effects, making you less susceptible to the effects of the psychedelics.

i will add my $.02, harmala (selective reversible MAOI) plus mushrooms is most DEFINITELY "game over" in the sense of it is the single most intense trip i could (n)ever fathom.
Click to expand...

Yea totally. 3g ground Syrian Rue seed 45min before shrooms makes 1g feel like 2 and 2g like 4. But it is actually LESS anxiogenic. The rue just creates like this low level buzz like a bodily "OMMMM" that sort of blisses me out and made my reaction to the shrooms far more steady-state and less prone to "Oh No! Holy Crap!" type freakozoidisms. I actually felt like I was being "chaperoned" by some older wiser protecting otherworldly spirit of some kind... sort of a vague sensation by nice.
 
Pontiac said:
The effects of the one hit seemed slightly stronger than of the two hits a month before, and certainly seemed to last about 30% longer.
Click to expand...

Did it just feel like LSD tho? With mushrooms it completely changes the character of the trip.
 
PippUK said:
there is ample anecdotal evidence that it diminishes the effects if LSD.
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I don't think there's ample evidence about LSD and moclobemide tho pipp, I havn't been able to find any reliable info anyway.
 
Ismene said:
With mushrooms it's obvious that it does something that means your brain interprets the mushrooms as DMT instead of psilocybin.
Click to expand...

To be honest, it's more likely due to the fact that the effects of high-dose psilocybin and DMT are reportedly very similar. When you take a monoamine oxidase inhibitor with psilocybin you are increasing the longevity of the psilocybin molecule in the body before it gets metabolized, resulting in a much higher concentration at it's target recptors and a longer trip. The higher concentration of psiliocin at the 5-ht receptor sites is going to cause a much more intense experience. In some people that is going to push the headspace closer to DMT territory, or at least show their common ground more. Terrence Mckenna said he tried this combo and he found it overwhelming.
 
No, it's not similar to high dose psilocybin but it is similar to oral DMT.

If you try taking mushrooms and moclo twice within a week or two then you don't get the DMT trip, and interestingly you don't get a psilocybin trip either. Which suggests the receptors are treating the psilocybin as DMT.

Obviously, you can trip on mushrooms week after week but I've always found that you can't do the same with oral DMT.
 
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