Is this the truth? (Question about extreme visuals)

[DrugOmen]

Hey Engage how is DMT in any sense of the word "childs play"? And i really want to know what you mean by there being a 50 trip limit?

-Thanks, if you answer.

 

[Engage]

Googler = friendly.

A ten to sixty minute miracle is very hard to hold onto in real life...
Zig Zag Zen explains this.

The psychedelic experience is, sometimes, too heavy a fruit to carry.
Unless it teaches you something about how to act in real life, what's the point?
Drugs...you always come down.

Impact....distance...

 

[Solipsis]

Well I think basically all visuals are possible, that belief may not be surprising considering I also think that drugs like DMT feel to me like they tap into or unleash uninhibited imagination. Even physical and logical laws may be broken (I saw square circles for example, but absolutely could not draw one afterwards, same for seeing non-existent colors).
But, the more laws are broken the stronger the removal from sober reality needs to be. For the really crazy shit there must be some tear or break into your mental reality construction. With MDMA (esp. MDA which is a metabolite) such brain movie reality spin-offs seem common like seeing things that are not there momentarily then snapping out of it. I think the more absurd the things are you experience, the most twisted and unfluenced your mind has to become first. Although with DMT extreme things may be felt while your sense of self hardly changes. With 2C-T-7, also a very strong drug, it is also not too uncommon to become somewhat detached, delirious or dissociated at higher doses and this is again where the weird shit happens.
You mentioned ketamine as well which facilitates the dissociation and removal, so there is especially little cognitive dissonance left. I think that is why dissociatives catalyze psychedelics and extreme states so much: they provide that dissociative part of the experience psychedelics can have on their own but not as strong.

Here is the thread for 'most visual psychedelic' :

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=140341

I have to change your thread title because titles like this by themselves provide absolutely no insight as to what subject is discussed.

 

[Engage]

Pretty colors.

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

I mean thanks for the information but I either am not enough affiliated with the culture surrounding hallucinogens or you're being vague...

 

[IamMe90]

Well I think basically all visuals are possible, that belief may not be surprising considering I also think that drugs like DMT feel to me like they tap into or unleash uninhibited imagination. Even physical and logical laws may be broken (I saw square circles for example, but absolutely could not draw one afterwards, same for seeing non-existent colors).

I don't think physical and logical laws can be broken; you didn't actually see a circle square, your conceptual faculties were just seriously altered/screwed up. Unless that's what you mean by the laws being "broken."

 

[Engage]

Well, no one can affiliate you more...sorry. Certainly not here.
It's like death, kinda one-on-one personal thing...

If he said he saw a square circle then...
I've experienced unnatural geometry from psychedelics before - shapes and landscapes that somehow incorporated angles less than 0 degrees or greater than 360 degrees. It's impossible to describe them in normal terms but they were just as real as any other perception. They defied logic but they existed all the same.
Geometric laws are ultimately conceptual anyway.

Learn^^^.


There is shit out there than cannot be put into words on this realm.
Period. That's one of the first 'truths' I learned.
"No one will believe the shit you're about to see. Not even you."
It's too alien for your environment. Too, weird for your current words.
And, your own belief will fade in years....

 

[Obsidius]

the "inner mindmovies" or hole-like states of certain dissociatives can put you in absolute fantastic, surreal and intense worlds. i've never been immersed so extremely and complete like on psychedelic dissociatives.
for me personally even very low doeses of phenetylamines or tryptamines even double this effect on dissociatives.

not even with DMT i can go as far as with 25b-nbome + mxe for instance. extreme discrection adviced when stepping into this kind of comboland. it takes patience to get to your sweetspot otherwise you'll find yourself in a pretty chaotic state very quick and all beauty aside when it works, you dont wanna dash into that kind of trips unprepared.

 

[Engage]

DMT/LSD = Child's Play.
I respect mckenna, but that guy had it all wrong about dissociatives.

Go where you push your mind....it's all about intention and willpower.
But, listen up, it is addictive as fuck. And, you may have severe 'migraines'...where you wake up wanting to beat your head against a wall just to make the pain stop for a few seconds. trust. Being serious now.I beat my head in with a book at 4 AM in the morning just to stop the pain for a few breif seconds.

I forget what they call those.
Isotopic ? Some 'super' migraine shit.
Wakes you up out of a good sleep....



Something, one eye starts watering...anyways, what will you do after the experience?
THAT'S THE QUESTION.

You cannot stay high forever....that's reality.

 

[dezz]

DMT/LSD = Child's Play.
I respect mckenna, but that guy had it all wrong about dissociatives.

Go where you push your mind....it's all about intention and willpower.
But, listen up, it is addictive as fuck. And, you may have severe 'migraines'...where you wake up wanting to beat your head against a wall just to make the pain stop for a few seconds. trust. Being serious now.I beat my head in with a book at 4 AM in the morning just to stop the pain for a few breif seconds.

I forget what they call those.
Isotopic ? Some 'super' migraine shit.
Wakes you up out of a good sleep....



Something, one eye starts watering...anyways, what will you do after the experience?
THAT'S THE QUESTION.

You cannot stay high forever....that's reality.

Looking at your writing style and way of thinking you are one of those drug users that I despise, more so then heroin/crackheads.

 

[Solipsis]

I don't think physical and logical laws can be broken;

No not in the measurable 'outside' consensus reality but that is not where I saw it.

you didn't actually see a circle square,

Not with my eyes, no. Still I experienced this, I know I did because I realized it when I did and the memory is vivid.

your conceptual faculties were just seriously altered/screwed up.

I know! That was also my point: to experience the impossible, one first needs to loosen the grasp of what is possible and what's not. The further you go from the type of reality we are used to, the closer you go towards states like lucid dreaming, OOBE's and other mystical states.

Unless that's what you mean by the laws being "broken."

I guess I did, and I understand your frustration: IMO it just represents the cognitive dissonance of such experiences apparently being possible. It is a classic approach: to validate that someone experienced something does not have to be the same as qualifying it as a consensus reality event, i.e. tangible or empirical.

 

[notaduck]

What you "see' in you're mind's eye is some highly processed form of the information received by your eyeballs and other sensory organs. Many things, but psychedelics almost by definition change the way brain processes information by altering the physical substrate of the mind. As a result, almost any sort of perception becomes possible, although there are definitely classes of visual "effects" that are more common than others.

 

[ziggo]

!

Yeah I had the same kind of thing on salvia and some words from john lilly mixed with my experience is totally this.

hell is when one is fused with other entities though out the universe but these are all bad/evil entities and one's self is bad/evil and meaningless. It's an extremely high energy state that lasts eternally, although it has to end it feels eternal because you believe that it is because you have no hope at all in this state, no hope of escape from it.

 

[TangerinO]

Something no one has brought up is that the sensitivity to these substances varies greatly from person to person.

I have friends who can eat huge doses of psychedelics and barely get OEV's, I on the other hand have eaten 160ugs of LSD and had a plant literally morph into a scorpion and spit at me. One time I was attacked by grass, on 1 tab of acid (Craziest OEV's I've ever had)

DMT is beyond a joke for me in terms of psychedelic visual boot to the face. I LOOOOVE it but do it very rarely for this reason. In fact my brian seems to be reversed in this function, I find it very difficult to achieve distinct CEV's.

So my point is, you have to try these compounds and see how they work for you. Don't bother getting others to try and explain it to you, just do it. Make sure you know what you're getting yourself into, do a good amount of reading on erowid, be prepared, be safe etc.

Then just try not to over think the whole process and just let go

 

[notaduck]

Something no one has brought up is that the sensitivity to these substances varies greatly from person to person.

I can relate to this. Compared to other people I know, I have to be much more conservative with my hallucinogen dosage. Following Erowid dosage suggestions, in general I find the lower end of "light" to be a medium experience and the upper end of "light" to be a strong experience.

 

[rickolasnice]

Yeah those kind of visuals are possible..

I've had them from high dose MDMA + Cannabis, ketamine, DMT, Salvia, diphenhydramine..

Each drug with it's own unique, yet equally intense, visuals.

Think about some vivid dreams you have.. your mind is capable of amazing things.

 

[MrKitty2]

The person saying there is a 50 trip limit. You are giving off fuckng stupid misinformation .ive tripped a few thousand times at least, and you can be high all your life if you can afford it like some of us

 

[notaduck]

The person saying there is a 50 trip limit. You are giving off fuckng stupid misinformation .ive tripped a few thousand times at least, and A
you can be high all your life if you can afford it like some of us

I can't imagine a biological or psychological mechanic that would imposed some sort of "trip limit", and certainly not one that would be consistent between people. I might argue that if one were to spend a large enough proportion of time in a high state as compared to sober, the brain and mind could adapt to the high state such that the sober state didn't feel "normal" any more.

While that might be interesting or desired by some, I at least don't relish the idea of being reliant on anything more than necessary to feel normal. But I can say that because in general I like life when sober - and not everyone else is so fortunate.

 

[webbykevin]

700ugs LSD + 5 grams of mushrooms - that should convince you people are not fibbing.

 

[notaduck]

I don't think physical and logical laws can be broken; you didn't actually see a circle square, your conceptual faculties were just seriously altered/screwed up. Unless that's what you mean by the laws being "broken."

20th century analytical philosophy (Bertrand Russell), a person's perceptions are cannot be false. That is to say, if you perceive something, you cannot question the fact of the perception itself. You're sensory apparatus, interpretation or other mental processing may be faulty. So if Solipsis truthfully says "I saw square circles", then I would first suggest using a lot more words to define and describe that perception because clearly, most people have no idea what that means. Saying "I saw square circles" is a nice shorthand, but anyone listening, what we hear is "I saw something impossible". That is one conclusion, but no one is really going to believe your deductive reasoning for anything you saw while high. (If you know of a bunch of people who believe you, I think that qualifies as a cult)

That said, learning to just be descriptive without drawing a lot of inferences is valuable (at least to me). I am always on the lookout to compare notes with others.
I'm not trying to be condescending either... I frustrated my friends with the same sort of things. Q: Can you tell me what your trip was like? A: I saw some cool shit. Q: well.. ok good for you but thanks for the pithy reply