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i am offended by gay marriage

mrsnowygrainius said:
In the bible it states that the purpose of marriage is to PROCREATE
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Does the bible also predict global overpopulation where non-procreation is not such a bad idea? What of married couples who choose not to have children?


It is no doubt that they will be given love which is great but a child needs a mother AND a father.
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Would you say a child is better off with a single (straight) mother or father? Also, why does a child need this dynamic?
 
Hey, you made the post. You had to share you thoughts - and you got your response.

Here is the thing. Maybe this will help out. 1st, I gather you live in the USA. As in The United States of America. This is important. Because you don't live in Iran or Saudi Arabia. One of the important differences is that those countries are operated, controlled and governed by religion. If the USA became a Christian version of those countries (which many in the USA *want* to happen) - then we are no longer the USA and will be no different than those countries.

Nothing in our Constitution says a word about your bible. And its YOUR bible. Not mine. As an American, I do NOT have to FORCED into your beliefs. Isn't that cool? I mean, what if a President ordered that everyone one must a Mormon, Catholic or Scientologist? Let me make it even easier for you to understand.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
That is our first Amendment to our Constitution.

Here is the 14th: "Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

Thus, its a civil rights issue. Gay Americans people are still 100% American people and they get the rights they were BORN with, until someone decided because of their opinion or beliefs that a law should be made against them.
If Gays getting married is EFFECTING your life directly - then you got some issues and need to reflect HOW? We got Muslims in our country - are they turning you into Muslims?

Also, what do gay people do that others don't? Do women have sex in the butt? yes. And many of them are wives. Many of them are Christian wives.
Do women suck dick? yes... they do. And it used to be illegal in the USA. There are some who want to make it illegal again... guess who?

The reason same sex marriage won in every single state (except for 1), was because the arguments against it were stupid every single time. Its icky. My god says XYZ. They can't have children, blah blah. Oh, there are gay people who have CHILDREN!

Hey, remember Evangelical leader Ted Haggard, father of 4-5 kids.... was outed for having a long term relationship with at least one man. Actually, a lot of "righteous" people have been caught being gay.

Here something else you may not know about gay people. As human beings, they have feelings. Just like you and me. They do fall in love.
Are you in love with anyone? Or ever have been? How'd you feel if someone told you "you're a pervert. you're not allowed to love anyone or be loved!"? Put yourself in their place.

We have 7 billion humans on this planet. If anything, gay people are helping to save the human race by slowing down our virus-like overpopulation problems. We *ARE* running out of drinkable water... Having 3~5~10 kids is stupid, we're killing our future and its the religious nuts of Christians, Catholics and Muslims telling people to shoot babies out like rabbits.

You have a right to your beliefs. I have the rights to mine. Yours stops the moment it interferes with mine or anyone else's.


 
Marriage as a custom has a far more complex a history than the christian viewpoint gives. Letting gays get married does NOT delegitimize that of straight people. If you are a christian, perhaps consider that the state does not get to decide what is and isn't marriage, and that those christian hetrosexual marriages derive their legitimacy from the bible, not law. And so in that sense, gay marriage is simply a matter of law, irrelevant to you, and that your beliefs in marriage as a christian are wholly separate from the law and government, both coinciding but not connected.

As for children of gay couples, once I would have agreed with you that all children deserve a man and woman as parents, but the statistics have simply not shown that assumption to be true. It is a mistake to believe it is so when the evidence points to such a belief being incorrect. That is why I no longer object to a gay couple having children. Single parents are much more a problem than gay couples. Hell hetro parents are more of a problem due to them getting pregnant by accident, something that seldom happens when gay people get a child.

Marriage is linked to marriage and for a man and a woman in a christian viewpoint. And it can remain so regardless of the states political decision. Do you think the state has the right, over god, to decide who gets married? If not, then the atheist institution of marriage conducted by gays and atheist hetrosexual couples is a slightly different thing from biblical marriage. And that one is not affected by the other.
 
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"personally, i don't think the government has any business regulating marriage period." - then who decides who is married? What legal form would people come up with to tell the govt. (in any country) that those two people have a legal contract among themselves and that their children is attached to them? Marriage is about property and love. When the parents die, the children get the property. hence A simple legal form from the state makes it easy.

Telling the IRS, the hospital, what-not that you are married is not proof of marriage. Or making a hand-written note "We are married" is not good enough.

So yes, in the modern world - Govt. stores the record of marriage, as it does for business entities. Who else should? WalMart? What if Target doesn't want to honor your Walmart Marriage record?

ALSO - now that Marriage equality is in ALL 50 states, it makes things so much smoother and simpler in the country!
You could get married in about 37 states a week ago. Some stated recognized same-sex unions (not the same as marriage on many levels + complexity of tax code and other rights). Some did not. Some states that did not have SSM, would not recognize an out of state marriage Same sex couple as "married" - so the state just un-marry's people when they cross the boarder? What bullshit is that? ITs fucked up. Its insulting... and its stupid.

Think of the amount of money the GOP wasted tax dollars (OUR MONEY) on deny rights to Americans. They should be sued and personally pay back every cent.

Civil unions are no longer needed. There is no patch work map on what is what and where. Its done.

PS: Remember, if someone brings up the bible's rules on marriage. It also says that if a man rapes a teenage girl, he *MUST* marry her and they can never get divorced. Great, she is forced to marry her rapist. Nice god you got there.
 
Marriage has nothing to legally do with children. That's what a birth certificate is for. Even then this can be trumped by a paternity test.


Every one knows dads are better than mums. They are more fun, allow kids to grow and develop a sense of wonder and adventure. Mums are rule followers, too concerned with keeping their kids safe than cultivating anything other than robotic vegetable eating mothers group clones. It makes sense that two dads will create a breed of super children, questioning stale old concepts such as religion, powering future generations to explore and populate the universe in fabulous silvery astronaut suits.

I'm against lesbian couples adopting for obvious reasons
 
"Look, I have nothing against gay people, I just don't think they deserve the same rights as everyone else" blah blah blah...It's a good thing the law isn't dictated by what you find offensive or not.
 
If marriage was simply a religious contract between two people and God I could understand the entitled resistance, however the legal entitlements that marriage allows in our society simple demands that any couple, straight or gay should be allowed the same equality.

If God still wishes to condem homosexuals for his own reasons then surely that is up to only Him to pass judgement when one passes from earth to heaven.
 
mrsnowygrainius said:
What about the adopted children who are going to be raised by 2 dads or 2 moms? Just thinking about that makes me cringe. It is no doubt that they will be given love which is great but a child needs a mother AND a father.
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I work with kids (very young ones) and I have for over thirty years so I have a bit of experience at this point seeing lots of different kinds of families. One of the things that I have noticed is that my students who come from families with two moms or two dads come from families that were very conscious about becoming one! In other words, these were two people who thought long and hard about the responsibilities of becoming parents. No accidental pregnacies throwing two people that can barely stand each other together. No jumping into marriage because the biological clock is ticking. No over-stressed single parenting from moms that have no support for drug problems, joblessness or any of the other tough situations that a parent might find themselves in. I'm not saying that these situations cannot also occur for gay parents just that they usually do not in my experience simply because of the way gay parents go into it which is usually very different for how many straight parents do. Again, I am not saying that many straight parents don't also take the decision very seriously and plan (I'm a parent and I waited a long time to become one for these exact reasons). Kids get brought up a lot as an argument against gay marriage because there is an assumption that they suffer. Just wanted to say that is not my experience and I see a lot of suffering kids at my school every day.

Also, this has become so mundane where I live that there is simply not the stigma there was even 10 years ago.

I applaud you for asking for different opinions.<3
 
I got a lot of insight from you people but my opinion on the matter has not changed one bit. I just can not support such a thing, and those of you who bash God and/ or reject Him truly are missing out on something wonderful.
 
I actually think that a family should be bigger than just the parents and children. there should be a big immediate support net for children consisting of adults and peers (can be related but not necessarily). parents can be asshole sometimes. children who don't really interact with adults other than their parents might need somebody to tell them that adults and especially parents aren't infallible and sometimes completely stupid even. I personally don't want to raise children in a small flat only living with my partner. also the other way round, parents also need a rest sometimes, and wouldn't it be good if you live with people who you trust your children with, so you can have a relaxed and romantic evening out every once in a while?

in my opinion this standard model of family is a complete failure.
 
from huxley's 'island'

"We all belong," Susila explained, "to an MAC---a Mutual Adoption Club. Every MAC consists of anything from fifteen to twenty-five assorted couples. Newly elected brides and bridegrooms, old-timers with growing children, grandparents and great-grandparents---everybody in the club adopts everyone else. Besides our own blood relations, we all have our quota of deputy mothers, deputy fathers, deputy aunts and uncles, deputy brothers and sisters, deputy babies and toddlers and teen-agers."

[...]

"Nothing," she assured him, "could be less like a commune than an MAC. An MAC isn't run by the government, it's run by its members. And we're not militaristic. We're not interested in turning out good party members; we're interested in turning out good human beings. We don't inculcate dogmas. And finally we don't take the children away from their parents; on the contrary, we give the children additional parents and the parents additional children. [...]"
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mrsnowygrainius said:
I got a lot of insight from you people but my opinion on the matter has not changed one bit. I just can not support such a thing, and those of you who bash God and/ or reject Him truly are missing out on something wonderful.
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Sigh...I wasn't trying to bash God or speak lowly of anyone that defines themselves as Christians. There is nothing wrong with having faith in what you believe, and I think that believing in something is enough to make just about anything real.

But you are a blind fool, and very close-minded from my perspective on things. Fortunately, it's only going to worse for you and others that share similar beliefs. Some people just can't evolve. They have been conditioned to believe in certain things, and that's okay. I guess.
 
^ not entirely true about being conditioned, i had no religious upbringing at all. it was only in recent years that I came to know God's love.
 
"Judge not, lest ye be judged yourself."--The Bible. If you can't do that, eat a dick!
 
^
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You should probably keep these sort of opinions to yourself OP. Soon they will be the equivalent to modern day racism. I would put them at the same level in terms of immorality. It's really quite shameful. Please change your mind.
 
In the bible, it also says a lot of stuff that is ridiculous.

It says you should never harm an animal - do you eat meat, dairy, etc.??? Well that is harming animals, as you aren't allowed to do, as per the bible. I guess that should be illegal too. I don't think this in itself is ridiculous but I know that MANY religious people eat meat. So they are contradicting the bible.
You're not supposed to masturbate or watch porn. Have you ever done that? Do you think others should be allowed to do that if they wish?
It also says you shouldn't gossip. Have you ever done that? Sure it's not a great thing to do, but face it, most people have done it before.
Also, sex before marriage. You'd better stay a virgin until you're married. And don't use birth control either, because that's not allowed. You should have as many kids as god wants you to have.

I absolutely HATE anyone who is against marriage. I say marriage as a whole because gay, straight, it's all the same. It's about two people loving each other.

If my partner and I don't plan to have kids, does that mean we shouldn't get married? Just because we don't want to procreate? Guess what, we also use birth control, have pre-marital sex, masturbate, watch porn, and sometimes do porn. (The only thing we don't do, from the list above, is harm animals.)

Why is it that so many religious people only believe what they want to believe? They believe gay marriage shouldn't be allowed even though that is not harming them. But they don't care about harming animals, even though that is harming SO MANY others?
Contradictory, that's what it is.

Religious people really need to figure their stuff out. And get with the times. Maybe put their money towards something useful (ex. helping people in need) rather than things that don't bother anyone (ex. anti gay marriage campaigns).
 
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