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How bad is murdering someone?

Maya said:
Retribution is directed only at wrongs, has inherent limits, is not personal, involves no pleasure at the suffering of others. (For Common Good)
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I see how these stipulations limit the harms wrought by retribution, but what justifies retribution as "right"? In your words, how does it promote the common good (or is it somehow justified otherwise)?

ebola
 
Retribution is right when justice was served. Retribution is right when the entire country was shaken by a person or a group of people that has spread chaos and violence, hence the example above. The punishment that Escobar received was well deserved, this has not only shown the colombian people to somehow have a little faith that no "evil lasts forever" but the entire world witnessed on how his reign of terror was cut by bravery and courage.

The act of violence was justified because leaving him alive would have created more chaos as he was a very influential persona both inside and outside the government.
 
Sorry to be overly repetitious, but why; what makes retribution just (when it is)?

Retribution is right when justice was served. Retribution is right when the entire country was shaken by a person or a group of people that has spread chaos and violence, hence the example above. The punishment that Escobar received was well deserved, this has not only shown the colombian people to somehow have a little faith that no "evil lasts forever" but the entire world witnessed on how his reign of terror was cut by bravery and courage.
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Actually, you might be zeroing in on a Durkheimian understanding of retribution, whereby it (when institutionalized) is understood as the expression of "collective consciousness" (the sum shared meanings produced by society) in the face of an insult against its tenants, when such an insult threatens the very bases of society itself. For Durkheim, this expression is necessary to reinscribe the social reality described by collective consciousness.

ebola
 
Maya said:
Retribution is right when justice was served. Retribution is right when the entire country was shaken by a person or a group of people that has spread chaos and violence, hence the example above. The punishment that Escobar received was well deserved, this has not only shown the colombian people to somehow have a little faith that no "evil lasts forever" but the entire world witnessed on how his reign of terror was cut by bravery and courage.

The act of violence was justified because leaving him alive would have created more chaos as he was a very influential persona both inside and outside the government.
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That would be a much more meaningful statement if justice had a simple, universal definition... but here all you are saying is "Retribution is right when I think justice is served."
 
Muslims have a solution to retribution, Bismillah al-Rahman al-Rahim, alhamdulillahi rabbil alameen, Allah can torture a man/rape a woman to death and revive them to do it all over again a million times if he wants to. Humans can only do it one time so Muslims would lower the arms saying Allah the most grateful will take care of the challenge, and they would simply put him to death without torture, as it is mentioned in Surat An-Nisā', Chapter number 4, 56 which says:

"We will drive them into a Fire. Every time their skins are roasted through We will replace them with other skins so they may taste the punishment. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted in Might and Wise."

This verse is very useful to humanity because it prevents cruelty towards humans as an attempt of certain individuals to obtain full retribution through prolonged torture. Allah says there is no need for it because he will take the challenge so putting the perpetrator to death is punishment enough. Allah discourages such practices as being poor attempts at seeking retribution.

This removes evil practices like throwing hydrofluoric acid on the victim and giving him/her amphetamines to increase awareness while they suffer. Chinese have such an evil practice called death by 1,000 cuts.
 
Ksa said:
Muslims have a solution to retribution, Bismillah al-Rahman al-Rahim, alhamdulillahi rabbil alameen, Allah can torture a man/rape a woman to death and revive them to do it all over again a million times if he wants to. Humans can only do it one time so Muslims would lower the arms saying Allah the most grateful will take care of the challenge, and they would simply put him to death without torture, as it is mentioned in Surat An-Nisā', Chapter number 4, 56 which says:

"We will drive them into a Fire. Every time their skins are roasted through We will replace them with other skins so they may taste the punishment. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted in Might and Wise."

This verse is very useful to humanity because it prevents cruelty towards humans as an attempt of certain individuals to obtain full retribution through prolonged torture. Allah says there is no need for it because he will take the challenge so putting the perpetrator to death is punishment enough. Allah discourages such practices as being poor attempts at seeking retribution.

This removes evil practices like throwing hydrofluoric acid on the victim and giving him/her amphetamines to increase awareness while they suffer. Chinese have such an evil practice called death by 1,000 cuts.
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Right on topic as usual....managed to work in a few veiled pejorative comments about non Euro/American cultures too...

"I would torture you, but God will take care of it for me so I'll just kill you"
 
Ksa said:
Brother, you ever taken a history class? When your history teacher quoted verses from Mein Kampf, did you jump him and say he's a natzi? What I did was tell history and quoting verses word for word. If you don't like how history was written here on Earth go to another planet. Was that part of history shameful? Yes. Do I take the blame? No. Did the Bible author come ask me before writing that verse? Why do you blame me? I'm just telling history.



I get that.
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it's because you said "rape isnt that bad" are you saying that sarcastically, or did you mean it as a personal opinion. if the person thoughht you mean that as your own opinion on the subject of rape, then yes, they will responded accordingly. when i read that first statement, i got irked as hell and offended ngl, i hope you dont actually mean that and youre just saying that in terms of biblical history and you didnt word your comment well.
 
Ksa said:
Muslims have a solution to retribution, Bismillah al-Rahman al-Rahim, alhamdulillahi rabbil alameen, Allah can torture a man/rape a woman to death and revive them to do it all over again a million times if he wants to. Humans can only do it one time so Muslims would lower the arms saying Allah the most grateful will take care of the challenge, and they would simply put him to death without torture, as it is mentioned in Surat An-Nisā', Chapter number 4, 56 which says:

"We will drive them into a Fire. Every time their skins are roasted through We will replace them with other skins so they may taste the punishment. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted in Might and Wise."

This verse is very useful to humanity because it prevents cruelty towards humans as an attempt of certain individuals to obtain full retribution through prolonged torture. Allah says there is no need for it because he will take the challenge so putting the perpetrator to death is punishment enough. Allah discourages such practices as being poor attempts at seeking retribution.

This removes evil practices like throwing hydrofluoric acid on the victim and giving him/her amphetamines to increase awareness while they suffer. Chinese have such an evil practice called death by 1,000 cuts.
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I'm not sure why you feel the need to relate every topic you see to (supposed) tenants of Islamic scripture (somehow, I'm skeptical of your interpretations, and it's not like there's a monolithic interpretation of Islam anyway)...so let's just keep mind of the wider topic at hand going forward in this thread.

ebola
 
lalune said:
it's because you said "rape isnt that bad" are you saying that sarcastically, or did you mean it as a personal opinion. if the person thoughht you mean that as your own opinion on the subject of rape, then yes, they will responded accordingly. when i read that first statement, i got irked as hell and offended ngl, i hope you dont actually mean that and youre just saying that in terms of biblical history and you didnt word your comment well.
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The OP said RAPE is worst than MURDER. I said, it's not that bad, meaning, not worst than murder. You're misinterpreting my sayings. I never said It's not that bad as in, it's ok. It's common sense, a raped victim still has her life.

ebola? said:
I'm not sure why you feel the need to relate every topic you see to (supposed) tenants of Islamic scripture (somehow, I'm skeptical of your interpretations, and it's not like there's a monolithic interpretation of Islam anyway)...so let's just keep mind of the wider topic at hand going forward in this thread.

ebola
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Islam is a religion of peace so whenever someone engages into hateful attitude, I use it as counter argument to say that hating is not ok even for a bad person. I've quoted verses from 10s of religions, including OSHO, it's a coincidence.
 
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The OP said RAPE is worst than MURDER. I said, it's not that bad, meaning, not worst than murder. You're misinterpreting my sayings. I never said It's not that bad as in, it's ok. It's common sense, a raped victim still has her life.
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sorry i did not see what youre referencing, im assuming you mean the op of the post? i just sorta skimmed through the post.
 
John McRae, John Miller, Timothy Buss, Arthur Shawcross, Howard Allen..

Just a few reasons why capital punishment would be a good thing to have.

Evidence it has a deterrence affect:

dbp.idebate.org/en/index.php/Argument:Capital_punishment_has_a_deterrent_effect_on_criminal_activities

And again.. Some people don't deserve to live.. you said yourself ebola?.. you would want to kill someone who brutally murdered your family.. would you, objectively speaking, want that person to keep on living.. what if they laughed about it to friends (even many years later)?
 
did you go through an entire university degree using the bible and qur'an as your only source material on every subject and topic?
 
ok, using only qur'an quotes, can you tell me which is your favourite simpsons episode?
 
L2R said:
ok, using only qur'an quotes, can you tell me which is your favourite simpsons episode?
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"The Simpsons" - Season 20 Episode 7: "Mypods and Broomsticks" as it is mentioned in the Qur'an, in Sura:Saad - aya:46 which says:

"Take a broom ' containing as many sticks of straw as the number of the stripes you had sworn to give;then strike the person just once with the broom so as both to fulfil your oath and to avoid giving undue trouble to the person concerned."

:D
 
How bad is murder? Only as bad you think it is. Hence why CEO's of arms manufacturers and politician's who send young men to die have no trouble sleeping at night and smiling a big "fuck you!" smile all day. Why should murder be bad, or induce bad karma? It's bad in the sense that it fucks up our society a bit if we all have a right to kill anyone without question.. then again that's what we do through wars despite our believed justifications.

Also definitions. Someone coming into your house to steal, you shoot him in the face in the dark and he dies instantly. Versus killing that dude who you just caught banging you wife. Versus running someone over by accident. You killed all three people, what is the difference? The law. That's all. You murder animals and other life all the time to survive, why is that any different either? Karma doesn't even come into the equation. Life is built on premeditated death.
 
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