Opioids Help...a few questions about opiate tolerance/withdrawal, etc

[jbabep]

Hello all. I am a newbie to this forum and found it after a google search. Not really sure where to start and I want to say thanks in advance for the help.

I am relatively new to drug use compared to a lot of people, but over the past 2 years, I have worked myself into a opiate habit. I'll spare all the details on how I got to this point, but basically I am at the point where I feel like my need has turned into an addiction.

I've never done anything more than swallowing pills....except for some marijuana back when I was younger, but the past couple of years it's been pills. Mainly hydrocodone and tramadol. I've also taken percocet a darvocet but my main DOC has been the hydro and tramadol.

As of right now, I need about 25-30mg of hydrocodone at one time to feel anything and about 400mg of tramadol to feel anything. And that's just at one time, I can often take that amount, then later in the day take another dose of the same amount. It's always EITHER the hydro OR the tramadol...I never do them together. I just do whatever I have.

Anyway...I feel like it's a lot. I've built up a pretty good tolerance.

So, the reason I am posting is because....I've got to find a way to stop. Not only am I running out of resources to get these pills, but I'm tired of thinking about it...wondering when and how I'm going to get more, basing my mood on whether or not I have pills, etc. I just want to stop.

I am a 27year old mother of three and I want to do right by my kids and stop this. I am very much a functional addict. It doesn't affect any aspect of my life as far as anyone else can tell. No one knows I do this.

If I stop cold turkey...what can I expect as far as withdrawl goes. How long will it take to completely get over withdrawl and is there anything I can do to lessen it?

Also, if I do succeed and stop....will my tolerance eventually go down? For example, if I were to not take any opiates for....I don't know, 6 months or so...would my tolerance be back down to as if I had never taken them before??
Just wondering.

Thanks so much for your help.

 

[amapola]

Hi jbabep,

We've seen much higher tolerances so don't feel too bad about where you are at but wanting to get a handle on it before it gets worse is definitely a good call. What we really need to know to determine the severity of withdrawal is the average amount you are taking daily. I know you mention your personal dose but the frequency is just as important to check how dependent you are.

 

[jbabep]

OK, no problem.

Like I said, I never do both at the same time. If I have hydro, I'll take that or if I have tramadol, I'll take that but never both in one day.

If it's the tramadol -
I get the 50mg tabs and will take 8 tabs (400mg) early in the day....then that afternoon I'll usually take 5 more (250mg).
I'll do this daily until I run out...usually about 5 days in a row.

If it's the hydro...
I'll take about 25-30mg early in the day then another 25 or so mg that afternoon for a few days at a time.

That's about it. I mean, it just depends on what I have. I get the tramadol prescribed to me for a back injury and I get 60 pills at a time, but that only lasts me about 5 days so it doesn't last long.
And I get the hydro from other sources.

So if I run out of tram, I get the hydro until I can get the tram refilled....which is about every 2 weeks.

Hope that helps.

 

[donkeyPUNCH]

if you're taking these doses 2x daily then you can expect about a week of fairly mild withdrawl. by "fairly mild" I mean sweating, upset stomach/vomiting, diarrhea, insomnia, etc... for about 3 days. followed by another ~3 days of even milder versions of those symptoms. after that it's pretty much smooth sailing as far as the physical symptoms.

however the most difficult part in my opinion is after the physical is done, you have to will yourself to stay away from any opiates, and that is much harder than dealing with physical withdrawl.

so good on you for wanting to quit, just understand that it's gonna be pretty hard to do. it's good that you have a solid reason to quit (your kids) because that is what it takes in my experience to actually be done with opiates. they are a cruel mistress.

 

[amapola]

Kind of like getting the flu jbabep .

One option if you think you can control your usage would be to taper down. Start taking 3/4s of your usual dose, followed by 1/2, a 1/4 etc. until you feel like jumping off. It will help shorten your acute withdrawal symptoms but may me more difficult mentally than just going cold turkey and saying no more opiates as you'll still be using everyday and the temptation to dose just a little higher as opposed to take some instead of none is pretty easy to fall for.

I just want to make sure that you are using everyday no matter what right? Not taking three or four days off here and there? It's just you say you use hydro "...for a few days at a time." and then say "I get the hydro until I can get the tram refilled....which is about every 2 weeks." so I'm not sure if a few days at a time equals 2 weeks

Regarding tolerance once you start taking less it will drop as well. After 2 years of use I don't know if you'll get right back down to zero but you should get pretty close with long periods of abstinence. You'll likely find if you do start using again after a break your tolerance will rise faster than before though.

 

[jbabep]

Yeah pretty much every day for the past several months. Might go a day to two without here and there if I run out, but pretty much it's been an everyday thing.

It hasn't been at that high of a dose for several months...I've just now gotten up to those doses. I started out just taking 2-3 tramadol at a time and maybe Ten mg of hydro....but I've worked up to this point over a period of time.

 

[BrokedownPalace]

Physically many people claim 'oh it's like the flu, it's not bad, blah blah'. Speaking from years of experience and many failed attempts at detox/withdrawal, and also defeating stage 4 lymphoma last year, withdrawals are rather unique compared to the flu..

Physically the symptoms may mirror having a bad flu, but in my opinion the HARDEST fucking part of it is the psychological aspects of giving up the drugs. For me, the anxiety/depression/insomnia are the hardest things to deal with. I can deal with sweating and shitting for a week, but mentally it breaks you down.

But, luckily your habit is not very large in the grand scheme of things. I would not expect a hardcore, crippling week long withdrawal. The poster up yonder basically got it right.

Also, there are a number of meds you can use to help ease the pain. OTC things like Immodium (loperamide), benadryl, doxylamine, valerian, etc. If you decided to seek professional help, they would likely prescribe you a couple week's worth of clonidine, (which is a godsend for the high BP, hot/cold sweats, and helps you sleep). Benzos are also a godsend, but are addictive in themselves so it may not be the best route since you don't want to develop another addiction.

Lastly, there is the option of seeing a doctor and using Suboxone, and doing a short term taper which would greatly reduce the symptoms. Methadone is also an option, but the withdrawals from methadone are so long lasting, and horrible. Worse than heroin. I know this from experience.

Whatever you do there are many resources available on this site, as well as the whole internet. If you have any questions or just want to talk about the best way to go about getting through withdrawals don't hesitate to Private Message me.

Best of luck.

 

[Mora Fiend]

^ Very accurate. The physical symptoms can be managed with obvious meds, but that psychological aspect is the real crippler.

Only thing I would add to this thread is that (in my experiences with it) tramadol withdrawl is worse than the hydrocodone because of the SSRI aspect and longer halflife. I have always found that for low dose narcotics the 2 things that have saved me just about all my withdrawl symptoms is Lyrica, and loperamide. These are just my opinions though.

 

[BrokedownPalace]

^Yep. It is horrible, the psychological aftermath of opiate addiction. I mean, it is obviously case dependent, but personally I have a number of diagnosed mental "afflictions", that get exacerbated to the point of near suicide during withdrawal, if I do not have the meds I need to control my anxiety, high BP, depression, insomnia..

I am prescribed klonopin, soma, neurontin, and seroquel, and (when I have them), the combination of those make withdrawal basically bearable. Without klonopin/neurontin though my anxiety would drive me near suicide. No matter how hard I try to 'will it away', anxiety is not just mental, but physical. The extreme physical symptoms of an anxiety attack, coupled with extreme opiate withdrawal symptoms is .. well, probably the worst fucking thing you can experience.

Not trying to scare you, but it is the sad reality of the epic beast of opiate withdrawal. Once you make it through the physical symptoms, you need to make sure you take the steps to deal with the mental aspect, or else you'll just be sober and miserable. Therapy, rehab, AA/NA, whatever.. Gotta do something to change. This is the part I cannot seem to succeed at, despite knowing exactly the way things should progress.

And every time I relapse and know I failed yet again, the psychological effect just gets worse and worse. I had jumped of methadone 24 days ago, at ~70mg daily for 1.5 years after years of heroin/oxycontin use. Not a good idea. Not a good fucking idea.. Relapsed on dope last week, but finally got my shit together and am using suboxone to taper down this week until I can refill my klonopin and soma which got used up within the first week of trying the c/t methadone withdrawal. Methadone is the devil's medicine, once you try and get off of it. Now, it definitely did save my life but damn near drove me to suicide after stopping it. Ugh.

Sorry for the rant..

 

[Mora Fiend]

What really helped me with the mental addiction was exercise after I got over the physical symptoms, go for a bike ride, brisk walk, lift weights or even better do all 3! To me exercise was a substitute for drugs (I basically switched addictions), and a lot more constructive.

 

[BrokedownPalace]

What really helped me with the mental addiction was exercise after I got over the physical symptoms, go for a bike ride, brisk walk, lift weights or even better do all 3! To me exercise was a substitute for drugs (I basically switched addictions), and a lot more constructive.

Definitely a good point. You need to help your brain start producing the correct number of endorphins on its own again. Exercise definitely does help, even taking a walk around the block or something. I feel like even setting a small small goal like that initially, and then completing it, is very rewarding. Problem is sometimes my depression and whatnot gets to the point of where I am basically catatonic. It is crippling. I am glad though that I finally made the move to start seeing a new therapist/psychiatrist.