Had enough with cigarette taboo in America?

[absent minded]

yeah we cant even smoke inside any public place even in bars ect here in washington. its ridiculous. and a pack of cigarettes with tax will run you almost 6.25 cents

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Actually a lot of the 'second hand smoke' hysteria was simply that - hysteria.

Who knows if it's true or not, a lot of studies against it were as funded and driven as much as the studies published by Tobacco companies. I'm more distrustful of Big Government, the one who illegalized marijuana of all things, than of Big Tobacco.

 

[otb01]

stop whining. this is other drugs, it's not a place to post incoherent rants about your dissatisfaction with government policies.

Ok, then find a better place to put it. Oh wait, that's right you're not a mod, it doesn't matter if you think that. 8)

yeah we cant even smoke inside any public place even in bars ect here in washington. its ridiculous. and a pack of cigarettes with tax will run you almost 6.25 cents

Yeah, and it's about to get worse. They're posting up in the bodegas that there might be a new hike of like $8 (?) per carton in federal taxes. As the ad has been saying "Enough is enough."

Actually a lot of the 'second hand smoke' hysteria was simply that - hysteria.

Who knows if it's true or not, a lot of studies against it were as funded and driven as much as the studies published by Tobacco companies. I'm more distrustful of Big Government, the one who illegalized marijuana of all things, than of Big Tobacco.

Exactly. It's all pretty much unfounded or blown out of proportion.

 

[Tsukasa]

Yes, and I should have the choice to kill myself using tobacco. I KNOW COMPLETELY WHAT TOBACCO DOES. This is what amazes me. People like you must really think that everyone is stupid. I think that people who chose not to should avoid people who smoke then. It's really simple. If you don't want smoke, walk away. Don't make millions suffer because of it. I know many people whose parents smoked with them and theres nothing wrong with them, many are healthier than most. One of them is in their 50s and looks like they're in their late 30s/early 40s.

That's not what I meant. Peer pressure is another thing. And i don't think you're stupid. You just don't make the best choice by choosing to smoke. Theirs other much better ways to deal with stress or whatever reason it is you smoke.

The actual smoke from the cigarette harms other people being exposed to it, even more than it harms the smoker. That's why I think smoking should be banned in public places.

 

[klowns]

bars, and TOBACCO SHOPS!!! its fucking rediculous here. smoking bans are popping up everywhere. even my dad has been a small private bsuiness owner for YEARS has said hes in favor of smoking bans. i dont understand it. if you dont like the smoke somwhere, go to a non smoking restuaraunt. yeah tehse little old ladies own this tobacco shop here and they used to let people smoke pipes and whatnot in there, and the worst thing is its her house. she lives upstairs. but now its illegal. people runnin out of bars back and forth freezing their asses off. fuck all you who think its fair to take away others rights because "you think smoking is bad"

 

[otb01]

That's not what I meant. Peer pressure is another thing. And i don't think you're stupid. You just don't make the best choice by choosing to smoke. Theirs other much better ways to deal with stress or whatever reason it is you smoke.

The actual smoke from the cigarette harms other people, even more than it harms the smoker. That's why I think smoking should be banned in public places.

Yes, and you don't have the right to decide what choices I make. See how that one works? It also shouldn't be your right to tell me where and when I can smoke my cigarettes!

Second hand smoke is in no way more harmful than smoking first hand. That is really hands down bullshit.

bars, and TOBACCO SHOPS!!! its fucking rediculous here. smoking bans are popping up everywhere. even my dad has been a small private bsuiness owner for YEARS has said hes in favor of smoking bans. i dont understand it. if you dont like the smoke somwhere, go to a non smoking restuaraunt. yeah tehse little old ladies own this tobacco shop here and they used to let people smoke pipes and whatnot in there, and the worst thing is its her house. she lives upstairs. but now its illegal. people runnin out of bars back and forth freezing their asses off. fuck all you who think its fair to take away others rights because "you think smoking is bad"

ditto!

 

[klowns]

tsuaksa-you are an idiot. this is a thread for smokers. why dont you jsut leave? just like why dont you leave places wher epeople smoke.
IS IT THAT FUCKIGN HARD? christ man.

 

[otb01]

tsuaksa-you are an idiot. this is a thread for smokers. why dont you jsut leave? just like why dont you leave places wher epeople smoke.
IS IT THAT FUCKIGN HARD? christ man.

I agree with him being an idiot but this thread isn't "for smokers"........

 

[LightTrailz]

+1 for my vote as well however in canada we dont get as many stares with smoking and the price of smokes range depending on wether your buying budget (number 7 , podium , vintage ) or premium (players . canadian classic , dumurier , peter jackson) . up there there all gauged according to how much nicotine . how refined they are ie their still strong but dont make you cough up a lung or are loaded with tar .

but i definatly agree with that obese statement its fucking disgusting that some people can walk around being 4 , 5 and 600 lbs and they act like its an everyday thing . Eating is no more an addiction that doing drugs , smoking or drinking . and quite honestly id rather smoke and do my drugs and have a habit that may start taking a toll in 10 or 15 years rather than having my arteries crammed with yellow junk and a waist size that can take on the vietcong . atleast i know i can stop when i want to instead imo obesity has much more of a strangle hold on people compared to other addictions due to changes in metabolism and the natural necessity to feed your body . except with obesity they cant just have a single sandwhich and be full it has to have bags of chips . candy bars and about enough soft drinks to fill a bath tub due to the unnatural size of the stretched stomach and changes in blood sugar .

if that want to start combat "Addictions" i think the fucking government ought to start putting those warning on fast food as well considering fast food is a much more rampant problem than other addictions maybe a :Warning: May cause hardening of arteries . varicos veins and cardiovascular disease :

Its just another way for the government to make up for things they caused to begin with going all the way back to black and white movies . Thank you for smoking ring a bell ?.

 

[Tytan]

But yeah, Ron Paul is crazy. He wants to go back to coin-only gold money. For a while he was actually minting his own money but then the secret service came knocking and was like "nuh-huh you can't do that."

It's off point so I won't elaborate, but... Ya got your facts all F'ed up, dude. Not one thing you said was true or correct.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Yea I"m not a smoker, only do it occasionally with a dopeshot, and the OP said he didn't smoke either.

 

[otb01]

It's off point so I won't elaborate, but... Ya got your facts all F'ed up, dude. Not one thing you said was true or correct.

Actually, you have your facts fucked up. Link and link. 8)

You could have even found that with a simple google search.

 

[Tsukasa]

Yes, and you don't have the right to decide what choices I make. See how that one works? It also shouldn't be your right to tell me where and when I can smoke my cigarettes!

Second hand smoke is in no way more harmful than smoking first hand. That is really hands down bullshit.

I never said it was, you don't have to tell me that.

But does that mean that it's ok for you go around spreading toxic gas around other people just because you like it? Maybe some people don't mind, but I DO. If I could I would just walk away and go to a different restaurant or whatever. But when this shit is being spread around almost everywhere by you smokers, it's hard to find a place that's free of this horrid pollution.

Second hand smoke is involuntarily inhaled by nonsmokers, lingers in the air hours after cigarettes have been extinguished and can cause or exacerbate a wide range of adverse health effects, including cancer, respiratory infections, and asthma.

Secondhand smoke has been classified by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) as a known cause of cancer in humans (Group A carcinogen).2
Secondhand smoke exposure causes disease and premature death in children and adults who do not smoke. Secondhand smoke contains hundreds of chemicals known to be toxic or carcinogenic, including formaldehyde, benzene, vinyl chloride, arsenic ammonia and hydrogen cyanide.
Secondhand smoke causes approximately 3,400 lung cancer deaths and 46,000 heart disease deaths in adult nonsmokers in the United States each year.
Nonsmokers exposed to secondhand smoke at work are at increased risk for adverse health effects. Levels of ETS in restaurants and bars were found to be 2 to 5 times higher than in residences with smokers and 2 to 6 times higher than in office workplaces.[/b]
Since 1999, 70 percent of the U.S. workforce worked under a smoke-free policy, ranging from 83.9 percent in Utah to 48.7 percent in Nevada.6 Workplace productivity was increased and absenteeism was decreased among former smokers compared with current smokers.7
Fifteen states - Arizona, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Maine, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Ohio, Rhode Island, Washington and Vermont - as well as the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico prohibit smoking in almost all public places and workplaces, including restaurants and bars. Illinois, Maryland, Minnesota, Montana, New Hampshire, Oregon and Utah have passed legislation prohibiting smoking in almost all public places and workplaces, including restaurants and bars, but the laws have not taken full effect yet.8
Secondhand smoke is especially harmful to young children. Secondhand smoke is responsible for between 150,000 and 300,000 lower respiratory tract infections in infants and children under 18 months of age, resulting in between 7,500 and 15,000 hospitalizations each year, and causes 430 sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS) deaths in the United States annually.
Secondhand smoke exposure may cause buildup of fluid in the middle ear, resulting in 790,000 physician office visits per year.10 Secondhand smoke can also aggravate symptoms in 400,000 to 1,000,000 children with asthma.11
In the United States, 21 million, or 35 percent of, children live in homes where residents or visitors smoke in the home on a regular basis.12 Approximately 50-75 percent of children in the United States have detectable levels of cotinine, the breakdown product of nicotine in the blood.13
New research indicates that private research conducted by cigarette company Philip Morris in the 1980s showed that secondhand smoke was highly toxic, yet the company suppressed the finding during the next two decades.14
The current Surgeon General’s Report concluded that scientific evidence indicates that there is no risk-free level of exposure to second hand smoke. Short exposures to second hand smoke can cause blood platelets to become stickier, damage the lining of blood vessels, decrease coronary flow velocity reserves, and reduce heart rate variability, potentially increasing the risk of heart attack.

http://www.lungusa.org/site/pp.asp?c=dvLUK9O0E&b=35422

according to my sources it's not bullshit.

 

[Tsukasa]

tsuaksa-you are an idiot. this is a thread for smokers. why dont you jsut leave? just like why dont you leave places wher epeople smoke.
IS IT THAT FUCKIGN HARD? christ man.

I think you are the idiot. This is a DISCUSSION. I'm just presenting the other side of the argument. How is this a thread for just smokers? I don't see it anywhere in the rules of this forum.

 

[Tytan]

Actually, you have your facts fucked up. Link and link. 8)

You could have even found that with a simple google search.

LoL, I didn't have to google it... I've already read all about it from credible sources. Perhaps you should try the same.

Your first link (a blog entry) even says it was his supporters. He had nothing to do with making and distributing Libery coins.

The monetary system being based on gold merely means that somthing of value (gold) will govern the printing of money. Currently it is printed (by the Federal Reserve which is no more "Federal" than Federal Express) whenever the goverment wants it, which is why our dollar is worth less than Canada'a right now.

Damn, no wonder america is going to shit, with ignorant wack jobs such as yourself. Educate yourself dude.

 

[euro9097]

Actually a lot of the 'second hand smoke' hysteria was simply that - hysteria.

Who knows if it's true or not, a lot of studies against it were as funded and driven as much as the studies published by Tobacco companies. I'm more distrustful of Big Government, the one who illegalized marijuana of all things, than of Big Tobacco.

next you'll be saying you don't believe in global warming.

i mean come on.

you don't think second hand smoke is hazardous to one's health? Tell it to the people who get smoking related diseases even though theyve never touched a cigarette in their life. Like people working in bars or the entertainment industry where you're performing in a room filled with smoke. Ever been to europe? You go into a bar there and after half an hour your eyes are so dry because literally everyone is chain-smoking.

 

[rave23]

Smoking not only hurts the smoker, but it hurts those around them even more. I personally wouldn't want nasty toxic cigarette smoke being blown into my babies face or anyones for that matter.

Holly THE FUCKING SHIT MAN!
People like you bring out the worst in me. Nobody is gonna be blowing shit in your babies face. If you worry so god damn much then just stay away from smokers, but realize that you're gonna get toxins in you one way or the other. Breathing air in a big city is just as bad. At the same time you eat your Yogurt out of Plastic containers, not caring about all the fungicides they put on the lid, and giving a shit about how bad all the crap is you put in your body.

God, most smokers respect it that they shouldn't smoke if someone is bothered by it. If someone gives me the look while smoking anywhere where smoking is allowed i stop smoking, even though they are in an area where smoking is acceptable. And then they start to bitch about it. If you don't want any fucking smoke then don't go to places where it's acceptable to smoke! Holly shit, it's my decision to smoke. I know the risks. CHRIST! Nobody is forced to be around a smoker, and if someone asks you to put out your cigarette because he's bothered by it then fucking do so and show some courtesy! BUT AGAIN, THEY DON'T HAVE TO! There are places where smoking is allowed, and if you're Americas #1 Anti-Smoker then just avoid these places. I don't see why you wanna take your baby to a bar anyway...

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

The monetary system being based on gold merely means that somthing of value (gold) will govern the printing of money. Currently it is printed (by the Federal Reserve which is no more "Federal" than Federal Express) whenever the goverment wants it, which is why our dollar is worth less than Canada'a right now.

Gold standard means nothing. Money is a scam, it literally is. But everyone buys into it, so the system works, which is all that's needed. All it takes to make cash worth something is your neighbor saying "Sure I'll sell you my CD for $2".

Why don't you educate yourself?

As for the declining ratio of American money, that simply means America is having a huge export deficit, which is a good sign - it means Americans are buying up all the shit everyone else makes, a sign that America is fucking rich and has huge spending power compared to the rest of the world.

next you'll be saying you don't believe in global warming.

i mean come on.

LoL. I believe in global warming, everyone does - in the sense that the globe is getting warmer. However, the idea that humans are the principle cause of global warming, is bullshit, and has no evidence to support it and evidence against it, like how Earth and Mars are correspondingly getting warmer in coordination with Sun radiative activity going up. But that's another issue, and PM me if you want to talk about that.

My point is that many of the studies about Second-hand smoke are questionable. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, I'm just saying before you go and say it's 'prove', take a second look. Yes, Big Tobacco is funding studies to slant a certain way. But what's to say politicians, who get lobbying money from anti-smoking groups as much as smoking groups, aren't funding studies slanted to find results a certain way? Fact is, is government studies of all kinds are almost always bullshit.

Take global warming studies - scientists are paid to find the impact of humans on the environment's warming, rather than find WHAT is impacting the environment's warming.

Not saying that as proof global warming, or second smoke, doesnt exist, but take a fucking grain of salt before you leap to be the spokesperson of something we has questionable goals sometimes.

 

[otb01]

I never said it was, you don't have to tell me that.

But does that mean that it's ok for you go around spreading toxic gas around other people just because you like it? Maybe some people don't mind, but I DO. If I could I would just walk away and go to a different restaurant or whatever. But when this shit is being spread around almost everywhere by you smokers, it's hard to find a place that's free of this horrid pollution.



http://www.lungusa.org/site/pp.asp?c=dvLUK9O0E&b=35422

according to my sources it's not bullshit.

Yes, but your sources refuse to acknowledge that the amount of second hand smoke that people are generally exposed to is nowhere near enough to actually cause a case of cancer. Most of those so-called "cases" actually had tons of other variables at play than just second hand smoke.

LoL, I didn't have to google it... I've already read all about it from credible sources. Perhaps you should try the same.

Your first link (a blog entry) even says it was his supporters. He had nothing to do with making and distributing Libery coins.

The monetary system being based on gold merely means that somthing of value (gold) will govern the printing of money. Currently it is printed (by the Federal Reserve which is no more "Federal" than Federal Express) whenever the goverment wants it, which is why our dollar is worth less than Canada'a right now.

Damn, no wonder america is going to shit, with ignorant wack jobs such as yourself. Educate yourself dude.

Yes, I'm sure you've read from "credible" sources. I know I got the him minting money thing wrong but he still DOES want to go to the gold standard. Which, as I have said, is insane.

Holly THE FUCKING SHIT MAN!
People like you bring out the worst in me. Nobody is gonna be blowing shit in your babies face. If you worry so god damn much then just stay away from smokers, but realize that you're gonna get toxins in you one way or the other. Breathing air in a big city is just as bad. At the same time you eat your Yogurt out of Plastic containers, not caring about all the fungicides they put on the lid, and giving a shit about how bad all the crap is you put in your body.

God, most smokers respect it that they shouldn't smoke if someone is bothered by it. If someone gives me the look while smoking anywhere where smoking is allowed i stop smoking, even though they are in an area where smoking is acceptable. And then they start to bitch about it. If you don't want any fucking smoke then don't go to places where it's acceptable to smoke! Holly shit, it's my decision to smoke. I know the risks. CHRIST! Nobody is forced to be around a smoker, and if someone asks you to put out your cigarette because he's bothered by it then fucking do so and show some courtesy! BUT AGAIN, THEY DON'T HAVE TO! There are places where smoking is allowed, and if you're Americas #1 Anti-Smoker then just avoid these places. I don't see why you wanna take your baby to a bar anyway...

Exactly.

 

[Tsukasa]

Yes, but your sources refuse to acknowledge that the amount of second hand smoke that people are generally exposed to is nowhere near enough to actually cause a case of cancer. Most of those so-called "cases" actually had tons of other variables at play than just second hand smoke.

But second-hand smoke is the main factor of those cancer cases. The cancer wouldn't be diagnosed as being caused by second hand smoke unless their was tar and other crap in the victims lungs, and traces of nicotine metabolite found in the body.

Cancer isn't the only disease that it causes. You ignored the fact that it cause over 13 TIMES as many heart diseases, and up to nearly 90 TIMES as many lower respiratory tract infections, as it does cancer. It also causes 430 sudden infant death syndrome deaths anually, and people say that they would never blow smoke into a babies face. BULLSHIT! It also aggravates symptoms in up to a million children with asthma anually.

So this MOTHERFUCKING BULLSHIT has to stop.