Opioids Fent/heroin withdrawl with subs

[Heero77]

Hey every one ive been doing a mix of heroin/fent a bag a day for about a month now all snorted maybe missed a day or so(I've been trying to get clean but relapsed)

I've been trying to get clean becouse I'll be going back to work soon but last time I tried I got so sick I only lasted about 24 hours but I have some Subutex now about ten years ago I use to iv heroin and I've taken subs to get clean and not go thru withdrawls but from what I've been reading if I take the subs to early I'll put myself into withdrawls anyway? Can some one help me out here I use to take them and I don't remember that ever happening?

Thanks

 

[falsifiedhypothesi]

Yes, subs will put you into precipitated withdrawals. You're supposed to wait until you are in full blown withdrawal before you take them.

Also be warned, if you go into precipitated withdrawal it's going to be pretty horrific, and you won't be able to stop it by shooting more dope. Taking more H will just put you in an extremely dangerous scenario.

 

[Heero77]

Thanks for the info that's why I'm asking last time I took a sub to get off of h, I just remember takeing it the next day I don't thinks it was 24 hours but I was already going thru withdrawls, what sould I wait like a day?

 

[falsifiedhypothesi]

It's hard to say, depending on the half life of your "heroin," which might be some fent analogue, it might take more than a day. Try and wait as long as possible, just to be sure you don't get thrown into precipitated withdrawals.

 

[Heero77]

Yea well it's def got fent in it Wich why I'm here asking I have no idea about fent so trying to get all the info I can, what if I'm like pukeing and going thru hot flash/cold flash's would that mean I'm good to go?

 

[kinkyjohn]

Fent usually has a half life of 4 hours (8 hours for carfent) but as your mixing it with heroin you'll need to wait at least 24 hours. Use common sense do you feel really good and sick. If yes .. then you can take the bupe.

You may have read that fent is notorious for causing precipitated WD at 24 hours or be worried that your heroin has something with a longer half life in it but I wouldn't worry about that too much as even though you may get a precipitated withdrawal at 24 hours it won't even be on the same scale as a precipitated withdrawal at 0 hours. Plus you have a perceptual bias so that a change from sick to sicker is less noticeable than from well to sick. Official recommendations for precipitated withdrawal are 5-10mg bupe every 30 minutes but If you can't bear it then take a lot of bupe rapidly .. 30-40mg is fine .. then lie in the dark with no stimulus till it goes. Don't worry about it - you'll get through it and it should take about an hour. For bad withdrawal I always snort my dose as it's less unpleasant than trying to sublingual and slightly faster acting plus more efficient .. though again use common sense as it's unpleasant with suboxone (the naloxone isn't an issue but pain with a side of frothy orange nose isn't really very yummy!) and is only necessary if you're mind is so gone you can't perform structured actions and your puking so constantly sublingual is a bad joke.

In practice the only dangerous and wrong thing you can do with bupe is to try and switch back to full agonists after you've taken a reasonable dose of bupe .. as this can lead to massive overdose and a russian roulette with the half lives don't do it. Personally .. I prefer the all natural method of running out of full agonists before taking bupe. I mean .. who would take bupe when they've got yummy fent around.

And finally as a hardend fent user my first ever proper withdrawal was an instructive experience. I remember my brain screaming from a dark hole at the chaos while I crawled around around in my own vomit with every single nerve impulse a kaledioscope of all the colours of pain snorting meth .. carpet .. bupe and constantly wretching it back for an hour till the bupe kicked in and I could see and comprehend the structure of the world enough to know what was going on. I remember not even realising I'd taken meth till the bupe kicked in. These days I generally microdose the bupe repeatedly without waiting for withdrawal as I'm totally not scared of precipitated withdrawal (it only last an hour .. what are u - a tourist?) and if you get it right you can avoid basically all withdrawal. Try that by all means (take a small enough dose of your fent to get well then take 20mg bupe snorted every half hour .. though you need to experiment to find your personal precipitating dose and adjust to pill weight). Obviously if attempting the above don't complain if you wind up in severe WD as that is proper hardcore labrat grade off label bupe use though do feel free to PM me or discuss it here and I'll give you proper details.

Good luck .. yours shouldn't be too bad if it's only been a month. Go for it!

 

[Heero77]

Yes it's only been a month if u want some background i use to iv heroin over ten years ago and got clean I remember haveing subs at the time to and being really sick and takeing one and it helped.

But I relapsed about a month ago and this stuff is fent/heroin so I have no idea about it so I came here looking for help (my post sould be up) made it like 30 hours but I was so sick I just needed relief so I relapsed but now I got 4 80 mg of the sub like strips (this to is new I had the orange things back in the day)

And I have a bag and a half left going to get thru the day so I can sleep tonight and I guess I'm going to wake up and just deal with the wd untill I can't anymore and take maybe half the sub, but now that I've been reading I might put myself into pw Indont know what to do

 

[kinkyjohn]

I don't recommend just going straight into precipiated WD ... try waiting till your so sick you don't care anymore then doing it.

Precipiated WD will be a whole new world of hurt you've probably never experienced before. By all means - do it for the experience - it won't kill you no matter how bad it is provided you have no underlying health conditions .. but don't do it because you don't know what to do.

 

[Heero77]

Sorry that last part came out wrong I don't want to put myself into pw, that's why I'm asking questions but let me clear up that last but again

I got like a bag and a half that I'm going to chip away with today and hopefully be done with it and sleep for a few hoirs, wake up and deal with the withdrawls I'll prolly be okay till I can't sleep so if anything I'll take the sub about 12 to 14 hours after last dose but I don't want that to happen to me so maybe I'll tuff it out for 24 hours

 

[Heero77]

Sorry that last part came out wrong I don't want to put myself into pw, that's why I'm asking questions but let me clear up that last but again

I got like a bag and a half that I'm going to chip away with today and hopefully be done with it and sleep for a few hours, wake up and deal with the withdrawls I'll prolly be okay till I can't sleep so if anything I'll take the sub about 12 to 14 hours after last dose but I don't want that to happen to me so maybe I'll tuff it out for 24 hours

 

[kinkyjohn]

If you'd been doing massive overdoses of fent offset by meth for a month I'd tell you to prepare for a journey through the extermities of reality defined by pain .. but you've presumably been taking "crappy H" cut with fent which shouldn't be that strong. You probably won't even be sick after the bupe has taken effect .. and should be able to stop the bupe in a week and be opiate naive. I don't think your WD is gonna be that bad.

I think your plan is sound - sleep before you start the WD as you ain't gonna be sleeping for a while and do all the normal prep. I'm sure you know the drill - tell somebody to check on you .. get some easily accessible fluids and make sure you've got your bupe set out. I personally don't use anything else for WD as with bupe you should be well enough after it's kicked in and you don't have time to get it now anyway. If you haven't got any I would go to the store and get some immodium though as it's always a relief to clear out all that constipation .. but after that it's much nicer to be able to lie in bed rather than on the bathroom floor waiting for the next explosion. Immodium is an opiate that selectively targets your intenstines so you can take a bit more than the recommend amount if you're opiate habituated. I have used large doses in emergencies to suppress withdrawal (usually when abroad) - but frankly that's not healthy.

 

[Heero77]

Yea it is crappy h cut with fent well I assume that's what it is but thanks for your help I decided to come here to check on a sub dose and started reading about this pw and got scared lol that's why I made the post.

I would have woke up tommorow took the sub and I woulda been in a world of hurt I'm sure I can go 24 hours when I tried to get clean before I wish I had subs I got like 33 hours but I just wanted to get some sleep,
And yes the wd weren't that bad just really really despressed Wich was hell but with the subs and some bud I'm going to pick up later I sould be good.

So I got these 80mg strips sould I cut them in half and take it? I don't think I need a full 80, and I'll get immodium if u think I'll need it but thank you for all your help I really have no idea about fent and last time I kicked was from a pure h IV habit Wich I took those orange subs for maybe two days and that's all I needed

 

[Pickledlemons]

Thanks for the info that's why I'm asking last time I took a sub to get off of h, I just remember takeing it the next day I don't thinks it was 24 hours but I was already going thru withdrawls, what sould I wait like a day?

Actually you can reverse precipitated withdrawals with fentanyl.. you just have to use more of it, more frequently until the subs are out of your system.. fent is strong enough to compete for receptor sites unlike other opioids. but obviously that is not the desired result.. so leave 24 hours or until you are unbearably sick. precipitated withdrawal was the worst experience of my life. It was like smoking salvia while in regular withdrawal. avoid at all costs. the longer you wait the better.

 

[Heero77]

Actually you can reverse precipitated withdrawals with fentanyl.. you just have to use more of it, more frequently until the subs are out of your system.. fent is strong enough to compete for receptor sites unlike other opioids. but obviously that is not the desired result.. so leave 24 hours or until you are unbearably sick. precipitated withdrawal was the worst experience of my life. It was like smoking salvia while in regular withdrawal. avoid at all costs. the longer you wait the better.

Okay I will I got a bag right now and I'm just chipping away at it trying to deal with wd as little as I have to I had tried to get clean about 2 weeks before this got to like 30 hours and I just needed something to help me sleep if I had these strips then I wouldent be posting now lol,

But thanks every one I had no idea about the PW and like I said before I use to do h and I remember taking a sub while wd and it helped and there was no like 24 hour wait you know so u all saved me

 

[kinkyjohn]

Yea it is crappy h cut with fent well I assume that's what it is but thanks for your help I decided to come here to check on a sub dose and started reading about this pw and got scared lol that's why I made the post.

I would have woke up tommorow took the sub and I woulda been in a world of hurt I'm sure I can go 24 hours when I tried to get clean before I wish I had subs I got like 33 hours but I just wanted to get some sleep,
And yes the wd weren't that bad just really really despressed Wich was hell but with the subs and some bud I'm going to pick up later I sould be good.

So I got these 80mg strips sould I cut them in half and take it? I don't think I need a full 80, and I'll get immodium if u think I'll need it but thank you for all your help I really have no idea about fent and last time I kicked was from a pure h IV habit Wich I took those orange subs for maybe two days and that's all I needed

Bit late for this reply I guess .. but in case others read.

I would take 8mg .. you proably won't need more, but unless you know your mininimum it's a safe place to start. My minimum dose to get well is actually 5mg .. but then I've really explored this and done crazy shit with precipitated WD .. so don't gio there. Also .. a higher dose will kick in faster. After the first half take 4mg till you get well. Officially you do this every 30 mins but if you want to conserve your supply of bupe wait an hour (peak blood plasma is about 30 mins when snorted .. but it takes another 30 mins before you really feel it).

The immodium is useful for normal withdrawal as if it's pretty bad you'll have constant diarahea. It's also insanely useful if you get precipitated WD as you're bowels will explode .. and as I said - you'd rather be in a dark quiet place with no stimulus than lying on the bathroom floor (or worse .. a bed full of faeces).

Damn .. isn't withdrawal fun!

 

[Heero77]

Acctully no I've been messing around still my buddy hooked me up since I was able to get him bud, but I did the last bit I had about a hour ago I do have some tramadol to take I don't know if it would even help during withdrawl,

But I am kinda scared talked to a old friend of mine who told me he tried getting clean took a sub 3 days after his last does and he said the next 2 weeks where hell.....(he was shooting fent) maybe I sould wait 48 hours before takeing my subs?

 

[kinkyjohn]

Acctully no I've been messing around still my buddy hooked me up since I was able to get him bud, but I did the last bit I had about a hour ago I do have some tramadol to take I don't know if it would even help during withdrawl,

But I am kinda scared talked to a old friend of mine who told me he tried getting clean took a sub 3 days after his last does and he said the next 2 weeks where hell.....(he was shooting fent) maybe I sould wait 48 hours before takeing my subs?

That was cos he was shooting fent. The WD is so bad the bupe doesn't stop them. You never feel quite right on bupe but with a normal WD you won't feel that sick. For serious fent withdrawal though they are a godsend as your WD will go from journey through that gates of hell .. to just a normal heroin style withdrawal. He also may not have taken enough bupe ... you know when you get there as you feel much better.

People love to big up their withdrawals (just look at me). You can wait 48 hours if you like .. I guarantee absolutely no precipitated withdrawal but I have tried precipitated withdrawal at all points and trust me .. it's not that bad at 24 hours.

If you wanna see my "experiments ..." read.

Bupe - Buprenorphine induction by microdosing without waiting for withdrawal or triggering precipitated withdrawal

Introduction: So, thought I would finally post this buprenorphine induction technique on the off chance anybody else is brave enough to give it a try. Sorry it's a little terse, but it's tested only on me and should be considered at best a hypothesis rather than a "will work for you too"...

www.bluelight.org

 

[kinkyjohn]

That was cos he was shooting fent. The WD is so bad the bupe doesn't stop them. You never feel quite right on bupe but with a normal WD you won't feel that sick. For serious fent withdrawal though they are a godsend as your WD will go from journey through that gates of hell .. to just a normal heroin style withdrawal. He also may not have taken enough bupe ... you know when you get there as you feel much better.

People love to big up their withdrawals (just look at me). You can wait 48 hours if you like .. I guarantee absolutely no precipitated withdrawal but I have tried precipitated withdrawal at all points and trust me .. it's not that bad at 24 hours.

If you wanna see my "experiments ..." read.

Bupe - Buprenorphine induction by microdosing without waiting for withdrawal or triggering precipitated withdrawal

Introduction: So, thought I would finally post this buprenorphine induction technique on the off chance anybody else is brave enough to give it a try. Sorry it's a little terse, but it's tested only on me and should be considered at best a hypothesis rather than a "will work for you too"...

www.bluelight.org

I do actually have a PhD .. and at least used to have quite an incisive mind.

My PhD wasn't in buprenophine induction .. but who knows bet I could pass the viva on that one now!

 

[Heero77]

I do actually have a PhD .. and at least used to have quite an incisive mind.

My PhD wasn't in buprenophine induction .. but who knows bet I could pass the viva on that one now!
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Well it's been about ten hours and I've taken about mg of bupe all small slivers one to make my skin stop crawling and it worked and I got some sleep I'm not like in pw but I just feel like shit and want it to stop lol about to take the other 4 mg in a bit I think I'm safe

 

[Fiori di Bella]

Is it Imodium or Lomotil that’s an opiate? If it’s Imodium, AKA: Loperamide then I should be taking this now during my time of trying to get by while running out of Oxys.