Feminism

[lurkerguy]

The grand irony is that men and women are really co-dependant. We need women to make men.

I always thought we needed men to make women too?

Doesn't sperm play a role in reproduction too or did I not pay attention in sexual education classes as a child?

 

[up all night]

Candyslut: I thought lurker was really only referring to western society and he'd probably agree with you regarding Africa and the Middle East.

Honestly, women in Australia are pretty lucky these days. While I definitely think feminism still has a place in ALL cultures (yes, even ours) I can see why some men would actually think women do have it easier in a lot of cicrumstances.

I really can't think of any situation where I've been discriminated against for being female and can definitely think of many circumstances where it's been a benefit being female (even down to getting into a club etc)

Also, I don't think female idiocy is actually an implicit part of our society at all. I'm sure there are some men who think that but not many from my experience and definitely not a majority.

 

[lurkerguy]

EDIT: for lurkyguy ( although smacking M4dd0g upside the head could be a new hobby)

^ you need a smack upside the head if you honestly think that women have an equal place with men in any society. Check out female circumcision in Africa - do you really think feminist ideology is not relevant for them? Or lets move onto oppression of women in the Middle East, where in many countries, women have only just gotten the right to basic education.

If I lived in Afghanistan or 17th century America I would be right next to feminists fighting for the cause.

But when I see modern day divorced women sitting in their husbands payed off house and not even working for a living talking about "feminism" and how evil men are it just makes me sick.

Perhaps you should stop speaking from your male, Anglo-Saxon perspective for a moment. And i do not know what fucked up feminism you are acquainted with, but I highly doubt it would advocate anything as vitriolic as 'kill the men'

I see feminists saying things like "all men are scum", "men are stupid", "men cause all the evil" etc all the time.

And yes, I even commonly hear "the world would be better with NO men at ALL" type comments.

TV Shows and popular albums do not need to talk about this. It is already implicit within much of society.

So even though more TV shows and albums actually come right out and SAY "fuck men" or "fuck whitey", it is really us white males who are the most racist and bigoted against women, because our racism/bigotry is "implicit" i.e. we don't even have to say anything you all ready know we are dirty chauvinist crackers before we even open our mouths.

Brilliant.

 

[MR Candyslut]

^ I understand this UAN, but I think it is a double standard to say there is no place for feminism in Western societies (which i disagree with anyway) but is relevant for countries that he perceives to have less advanced rights for females.

Feminism was never meant to be country specific. It is simply because the ideology gained a foothold within the Liberal discourse of the Enlightenment, and that in turn has been the key ideology in terms of the development of Western societies. To say that it is not relevant to western societies but then say it has a place in other geographical areas is an artificial and problematic delineation, IMO.

 

[lurkerguy]

Feminism was never meant to be country specific. It is simply because the ideology gained an foothold within the Liberal discourse of the Enlightenment. To say that it is not relevant to western societies but then say it has a place in other geographical areas is an artificial and problematic delineation, IMO.

The idea that women should have equal rights with men will always be relevant.

However, you can cross a line into reverse sexism which is exactly what happened with the feminist movement.

Equal rights are fine and good, but when you start demanding special rights that no one else has, and thinking your superior to the people who used to be oppressing you it becomes the ultimate irony.

 

[MR Candyslut]

No the ultimate irony is you talking about Reverse Sexism.

There is still major under representation of women in executive positions, qualified professions and politics (yes, i refer to the glass ceiling). The HREOC Status of Women Report recently concluded that there was equal participation of women in tertiary studies - 51% - and yet an over-representation of women in administrative jobs - 78%. In the last year, the Sex Discrimination Commissioner documented a 31% increase in cases brought before the Tribunal, with 70% of them resulting in a determination in favour of the complainant.

So really, go have a cry about reverse sexism, read the statistical data relating to women and their participation in the Labour market and then talk about the disadvantages men experience.

I highly recommend the following link (calculated from studies down by Curtin University and the Office of the Status of Women):

here

and

here

 

[up all night]

I wish statistics also showed how many women actually want to work 80 hour weeks with little family/ recreation time.

edit: Sorry, I sounded like I was disagreeing. I believe in the glass ceiling to a certain extent. I also think actually being able to birth a child has an effect on your opinion of the important things in life. Is that old fashioned? Anti-feminist? Maybe.

 

[MR Candyslut]

You fucking homemaker. Go stick on that NY shirt and pop out some brats.

(ps it is not a bad thing to actually disagree)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, out of interest, when you say "I also think actually being able to birth a child has an effect on your opinion of the important things in life" you mean that men who support feminist ideology can not really speak from the perspective of a someone who is able to give birth?

I think i agree with this. I think men have to realise the limitations of their perspective and the dangers that comes with that limitation. When we advocate feminisim, whatever its guise, we have to realise that, essentially, we are not women and thus may have a tendency to triviliase childbirth or other, inherently, female perspectives.

 

[lurkerguy]

How do you know it is sexism and not just lack of interest?

The vast, vast, vast majority of scientists are men as well, does that mean universities are sexist pigs, or maybe just that less women want to be scientists?

 

[up all night]

Candyslut: Really? You mean I can have an opinion of my own? Oh my god! You're the first male to ever say that to me!

oh and edit: You can't edit your post to make it look like I was ignoring the pro-cervical stretching comments you made. Well, you can and did but this counter-edit should sort shit out.

 

[MR Candyslut]

^ Totally. Permission granted. Just make sure it isn't too credible. No one, least of all me, likes an intelligent female.

 

[up all night]

Yeah, they're pretty annoying. They also take all those good admin jobs.

I would like it noted that I've never had a baby so in reality I'm in the same boat as most men. Except Arnie. Apparently he had a baby at some stage.

 

[doofqueen]

^ Well you have to admit, it's pretty self-important to bump your own thread for about the 3rd time, and say nothing of substance.

Cos everyone on here including yourself always posts with substance? 8)

I read the forum backwards (oldest to newsest post) and it happened to be the oldest one since i've been back so i posted in it. Fucking shoot me.

I shouldn't have to justify when and how I post. Fuck.

Look at the great discussion it led to. I'm oh so freaking important. So much so that i'm going to bed and can't be bothered reading the rest of BL today and even adding anything to my oh so important thread.

Grow the fuck up. Was what you said really needed to be voiced or you were just generally being a bitch to me again?

 

[MR Candyslut]

c'mon ladies, play nice.

there are plenty of secretarial jobs to go round

 

[Doppelganger]

I'm oh so freaking important. So much so that i'm going to bed and can't be bothered reading the rest of BL today and even adding anything to my oh so important thread.

As mentioned in my previous 2 posts, my point is that you don't add anything worth mentioning to your oh so important thread!

 

[UnSquare]

It Goin' Down...

so in reality I'm in the same boat as most men.

Hands up for the sketch.

 

[Benefit]

I can see why some men would actually think women do have it easier in a lot of cicrumstances.

Seriously. Like popping an 8 pound ham out of your vagina is even that hard. Get real.

 

[doofqueen]

c'mon ladies, play nice.

I'm always nice. It's in my nature But sometimes I can't bite my toungue any longer when bitchiness is always directed at me just for the sake of bitchiness itself.

Oh look there I go again - adding something of no importance just to bump my thread.

deal with it.

Bump bump fucking bump

 

[UnSquare]

Clawed Out My Eyes, They Did. I Only Wanted Some FUCKIN' Singlets Fo' Peats Ridge....

Feminism is on hold at Christmas sales,
yeah?

Caus otherwise I got a FUCKIN' tirade!

 

[MR Candyslut]

I'm always nice. It's in my nature But sometimes I can't bite my toungue any longer when bitchiness is always directed at me just for the sake of bitchiness itself.

Oh look there I go again - adding something of no importance just to bump my thread.

deal with it.

Bump bump fucking bump

Someone may bump you off soon, DQ