• Philosophy and Spirituality
    Welcome Guest
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
    Threads of Note Socialize
  • P&S Moderators: JackARoe | Cheshire_Kat

Does the mind or ego ever really go away?

T

thesoundofmotion

Bluelighter
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
104
I know when I meditate I can see my mind in action and make it quiet. I know when I am doing something and am really in the moment I don't tend to focus on the thoughts running through my mind.

But let me ask you, does the mind or ego ever really go away?

Don't you think we developed these thought patterns in our head for some reason?

I guess you have to really take into account how important thoughts are and how much they really relate to a "reality" if there be one.
 
The structure behind reality never goes away (Being is fixed and unchangeable), even though one's conceptions or pet ideas on what is are and can be easily swept in the wind. The ego is the seat of perceptions and represents man projecting himself on reality and defending himself from it too, but as long as one possess consciousness, The ego never disappears. Instead when reality appears against the ego (one's perceptions, conceptions, and preconceptions), its the purpose of the ego to, with thought patterns (unconscious as well as conscious) and what not, to explain it, since the ego in the end is man's vehicle of survival.
 
I read the ego was some sort of 1st person illusion created by the mind as a tool that had purpose during ancient ancestral biology. I'm not sure what it is.
 
i've never been successful in meditation, but i can't really say i've tried properly. i have, however, completely lost myself while dancing. doesn't happen often, only a handful of times, but i love it. it's the complete removal of self-consciousness, a trait i have in spades normally.
 
thesoundofmotion said:
Don't you think we developed these thought patterns in our head for some reason?
Click to expand...

Of course! There's nothing wrong with those thought patterns or emotions; it's only when we identify with them that it becomes problematic. This is the practice of meditation, your allowing thoughts and emotions to arise and fall away whilst remaining within the moment, deep meditation can produce a state of non-duality where all thoughts cease to exist and you just are, the nothingness of your being is reflected back infinitely.

The goal of meditation and other spiritual practices isnt to remove the ego permanently; but to become deeply aware. It's a bit like as you get older you care less about how people see you; you simply let go of trying to appear a certain way and just start been yourself, because you couldn't possibly be anything else.

L2R said:
i have, however, completely lost myself while dancing. doesn't happen often, only a handful of times, but i love it. it's the complete removal of self-consciousness, a trait i have in spades normally.
Click to expand...

Initially this was the determining factor in my frequent attendance to Doofs; to actually lose yourself completely while dancing.. really is something else!
 
Last edited:
When the ego goes away, you go away.

Without ego there's no first person experience.

If you consciously experience 'ego death' then it wasn't 'ego death' because 'you' were still there.
 
ego is an internal model of one's self built as an agent to represent the "who" that experiences, we all need to think we are compelled by a single entity. you are you. you've been building yourself your entire life and you wear it wherever you go. its interactions are your interactions. i heard the only way to dissolve it is to hurt it, otherwise you're its slave.
 
btw you hurt your ego not literally, but by revisiting painful memories and such. do things you're scared of. it doesn't like that.
 
I've caught glimpses of egolessness before, whilst drumming. It was absolute bliss - my hands pounding on the drumskin with abandon, creating a unique resonation that I alone had the divine right to create.

But the moment I recognise this, I lose my flow. Having restarted the self-oriented mental process in doing so, my focus is interrupted, and I cannot continue.

I guess instead, the best thing to do is experience it first, and only recognise it after the fact.
 
^ The trick is to learn not to let the self-recognition reawaken the ego.

I've been somewhat successful in this by adopting a sort of desireless, nonjudgmental perspective in which I accept everything, and reject nothing. Something worth trying.

Of course, then you have to resolve the conflict of desiring nondesire, and rejecting rejection itself. ;)
 
Isn't the ego the same thing as the self? If the ego is gone, what is it that you are recognising? How can you recognise anything at all when you no longer exist?
 
^ Perhaps, what is happening here, is simply an undermining of the ego's power and control, rather than a ruthless psychedelic-style destruction of its very existence. It's still there, it's just watching the course of nature unfold, without having any influence.
 
Ego is the dynamic and individual Form of the perception model.
It is shaped by the accumulated experience and originality of every mind.
Organically, it is set in neural synaptic paths that grow by activity levels within the brain.

The abolition of Ego could only be achieved by the inability of the perception process to execute within the brain, i.e. death.
 
would it be fair to say that all psychedelic "ego loss" or "ego death" states should really be called an extremely diminished experience of our normal individual perception?

the above caught my thoughts as well, as I'm not sure how if one experienced a total death or loss of the ego, he could ever recover it - it seems that to be in such a state would be irrevocable.
 
The term Ego-Loss describes a state of non-linear and disassociated perception wherein stimuli is beyond the ability to process, or wherein stimuli is effortlessly occluded.
This inexperience of Existence is the only means that the Totality of Existence can be experienced, as everything and nothing are one without distinction.
 
"Ego" is really one of the most confusing words of psychonautics terminology. Everyone seems to have their own take on the idea.
 
Well, it is nearly universally accepted in psychology that Ego refers to a sense of self.
My definition is based on the application of cognitive science to this psychological concept.
 
Pindar said how i feel about it essentially, and i agree with !!4iV4HF9R34g, that this is a scientific cognitive process(evaluation of I) to obtain a presence of mind which does overcome the physical self - survival instinct is the foundation of the Ego and survival instincts are many .

the point though, where the Ego begins to lose its hold with Meditation, is when the mind slips into REM, while awake - serious serious day dreaming. we dont have any survival instincts while sleeping, only the basic vital functions, and even these can be regulated to a high degree.


L2R, that is it - we can lose awareness of our self and surroundings, dancing like no-one is watching; AKA: ImpactO ProfoundO
 
I'm not sure how if one experienced a total death or loss of the ego, he could ever recover it - it seems that to be in such a state would be irrevocable.
Click to expand...
I'd go further than that. One cannot experience the death of the ego, for he is identical with it. There is nothing left to have the experience.
 
Your absolutely right, it's impossible for one to "experience" the death of their ego.. but one can enter into a state of non-duality through meditation. In my experience there seems to be a threshold point with concentrated meditation as your thoughts slow down where it becomes easier to dissolve into nothingness, you can feel your awareness expanding exponentially and this 'recognition' can trigger the fight or flight response from the self, an overwhelming fear of essentially 'non-existence'.

Thought gives rise to self, without thought there is no-thing.. the deep encompassing silence of nothing. Your divine reflection. The purpose of meditation is to become deeply aware of this silence within you; paying less attention to the story of your life that the self is wrapped up in.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top