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Opioids Do you think its possible (in the future) for a drug to completely stop WD's from opiates?

The problem I've always found with so called "comfort meds" is that the symptoms of withdrawl are so far reaching and diverse that even if a med helps one sympton, it just seems to make the remaining ones seem tver more pronounced... For example, pregabalin /gabapentin, benzos and clonidine help with that awful noradrenaline storm that causes all the anxiousness and jitters but seem to make the lethargy worse... Things like Kratom or megadose loperamide (plus PGP inhibitors) help only by acting on the opioid receptors themselves and so are just effectively switching one opioid agonist for another.. Stimulants help with the fatigue but just exacerbate the anxiety....

Its just a case of finding a compromise to the point that you make yourself as comfortable as psyche until it's all over....
 
Not now, but there are ton's of drugs that make it very tolerable that you feel good while ´going through. WD's, like gabapentin, pregabalin, GHB and even some good benzos like bromazepam. loperamide for few weeks lowering the dose slowly will take them out easily done that many times.
 
Chris42393 said:
Does anyone think that it might be possible for a pharma company (or someone else for that matter) to make a drug that can stop all WD from opiates? There are several drugs out there that can help. Ie. Gabapentin. That pretty much took 100% of the WD symptoms away for me. BUT, I didnt like the way it made me feel (personally). I wonder if there is away to stop the symptoms somehow? With a pill thats specifically made for that.
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There actually is a drug out there that completely eliminates opiate withdrawal it is a drink that flushes the body instantly so that no withdrawal symptoms are ever present. But unfortunately they only have it in treatment centers and i cant afford that. Them making it so expensive to quit painlessly is the reason this epidemic is still happening.
 
Read something about this the other day.https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/04/chemists-seek-antiaddiction-drugs-save-hijacked-brains. Have a look at this article.with opiates I can honestly say that codeine has greatly reduced addiction liability when kept to one dose a day.i was taking 150mg in the morning every day for years and then just stopped with no withdrawals but when using 150mg 2x daily+ or more withdrawal symptoms were present.pholcodine supposedly has even less withdrawal symptoms.i think it has something to do with the substitution at the 3 position.also being a weaker drug probably helps.there are some studies around this area of opiates I think the research on Bentley compounds said something about it but don't quote me on it.read the above mentioned article.
 
nznity said:
As of now, there is no medication that can save you from the claws of WD. Well Ibogaine's been proven to be effective at reseting your brain, if you haven't read about it i encourage you to do some research. It tickles your brain in some profound ways that it stops wds in a matter of 2-3 days. The bad thing about Ibogaine is that people with heart issues are at risk of dying when they try a flood dose. Although is just a small portion of ppl that try Ibogaine that die(less that 1%).There's even a documentary/documentaries about it on youtube. Hope my 0.02 cents helps u a bit. NZN
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Ibogaine is some heavy shit
 
Sandyskeens said:
There actually is a drug out there that completely eliminates opiate withdrawal it is a drink that flushes the body instantly so that no withdrawal symptoms are ever present. But unfortunately they only have it in treatment centers and i cant afford that. Them making it so expensive to quit painlessly is the reason this epidemic is still happening.
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Ja, in the States the drink is called Methadone Hydrochloride Oral Concentrate 10 mg/ml USP.
The epidemic is greedy rehab racketeers trying to get the government and courts to do their recruitment work for them, and I don't think it will ever end. When one has all of the propaganda networks from FNC to CNN, CNBC, MSNBC &c plus the editorial board of the Economist snowed, that is quite an accomplishment -- even the Weapons of Mass Destruction business in 2002-3 wasn't that good . . . actually, I think Tucker Carlson of FNC smelled a rat long about 2014 and then got a goat head in his bed or something because it was his people who actually did a piece in the rehab racket . . .
What other options will people have? Make like a tree and grow your own seem to be the two. Another scramble that separates quickly into haves and have nots for the most part -- how many people have the resources/connexions to do either?
So this is the way a society treats people they have over a barrel? Ragnar Redbeard and Herod and Pontius Pilate would be proud.
 
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Shortec Stublue!! said:
Moderation long term doesn’t exist by the very definition of how opiates/Opioids work.

What is your DOC? “Clear pure Opioid?”
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That may have something to do with the economics too -- opium and derivatives are renewable and sustainable because they come from plants which can grow all sorts of places and in theory in equatorial and other frost-free regions a really highly-motivated farmer can get four crops a year . . 4-phenypiperidines, open-chain opioids, and anilidopiperidines like fentanils and ampromides and intermediate cases like piritramide and others like the benzimidazoles can and often do eventually come from petroleum and coal tar in a lot of cases, so if less is being burned for transportation it is maybe a more environmentally friendly and sustainable use for said hydrocarbons, but having to come off dextromoramide and switch to something else at short notice because of the precursor shortage in the early XXI. Century, I'd rather stick to morphine and friends myself . . .

Oodles more hectares of land can and should be put into poppies -- ever see what passes for pain management in a lot of developing and mid-income countries? Any country that develops a fungus to kill poppies should be jammed up with sanctions worse that the hurt everyone is putting on Iran at this time.
 
draculic acid69 said:
Is there actually a fungus that kills poppies developed by a country?
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It was, along with some kind of coca blight, two of the things the DEA was working on in United States for a long time, and various anti-cannabis ones too -- I think the thing which catalysed this change in direction in research must have been the bad press about 2,4,5-trichlorophenoxyacetic & 2,4-dichlorophenoxyacetic acids (mixtures of esters of which are known Agent Orange and Agent Purple) and other colour-coded herbicides including some with dioxins in them . . . especially since Papaver somniferum Linnaeus 1762 and other plants something like that would probably affect, as well as coca plants for that matter, are food plants as well (coca leaves are exceptionally nutritious which is another reason they are chewed -- even the Decocainised Coca Leaf Extract gives Coca-Cola drinkers some small amount of Vitamin C, B Complex Vitamins, and a number of minerals) , I would think it would be obvious that such a thing is a Weapon of Mass Destruction on a couple of grounds. Quite aside from the fact that the United Nations has declared that morphine, codeine, and opium are amongst the things needed for a basic healthcare system and humans have a right to freedom from pain . . .
 
Mr.Deeds said:
Man I love your posts @Nicomorphinist
I always learn something new while getting my daily dose of political hatred that does not swing to the left or right. Keep it up sir =D
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I'd like to second that. I'm a lapsed member who can't remember the PW to my old account or to the associated email account for that matter but joined again recently specifically due to the quality of posts made by users such as yourself. I hope to be able to assist other users as I once did in the past.

Though I'll admit I re-joined with the intention of posting some questions I have that I thought some members here might be able to help me with. So I'm not entirely selfless in my intentions. ;)

I look forward to interacting with you & other members when I'm ready to look for the information I seek. In the meantime my apologies for interrupting the thread. I would have used a like but I'm assuming that's limited considering this is a new account as I don't see the option. I have a tendency to be verbose & digress, so again my apologies for having done both.

As for the the thread topic I don't really know. I can definitively say that I hope so. As such a substance would be of immense use to many. As a chronic pain patient who is mercilessly denied my needed medication & doing what I can to survive; I know I personally have need for such a substance more times than I should. Sadly I live in the country that is host to the 3 letter agency nico refers to in his posts.

Again my apologies as I appear to be digressing again. Nico's wonderful dose of political hatred has caused my own feelings of righteos indignation over the treatment of the people in the stated country to start to kick in a bit strongly. So I'll shut up for now.

Thanks for the great posts @Nicomorphinist. As stated; keep it up good sir! (y)=D
 
I’ve heard that low dose ketamine will stop we but I’m not sure how long you can take that stuff consistently
 
Karamazov said:
I’ve heard that low dose ketamine will stop we but I’m not sure how long you can take that stuff consistently
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Well, I would say at least long enough to get through the narcotic withdrawal syndrome, and I have heard of people coming off of methadone using ketamine, hydroxyzine, and clonidine, in one case with and another case without a gabapentinoid like gabapentin, pregabalin, or baclofen. Ketamine does not last very long and has to be dosed on the hour, which is fine but potentially disruptive . . . I get the impression from using it myself for that purpose and others doing the same thing that it anaesthetises the body against the withdrawal symptoms rather than any significant interaction with the opioid receptors as in that case it would never work.

The use of a high-dose injection of ketamine which has anti-craving effects for up to six months seems to use another protocol and may work by knocking the patient on their arse for a while and it is probably an example of the seemingly miraculous field of psychedelic therapy for various things. People also have broken the habit in at least the intermediate term with ibogaine, psilocybin, mescaline, MDA, MDMA, LSD, and so forth . . . What a shame that research on it ground to a complete halt by the early 1970s because of all of those things being outlawed. Does anyone know if 4-methylaminorex (U4Euh) does the same kind of thing?
 
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I_Hate_This_Place said:
I'd like to second that. I'm a lapsed member who can't remember the PW to my old account or to the associated email account for that matter but joined again recently specifically due to the quality of posts made by users such as yourself. I hope to be able to assist other users as I once did in the past.

Though I'll admit I re-joined with the intention of posting some questions I have that I thought some members here might be able to help me with. So I'm not entirely selfless in my intentions. ;)

I look forward to interacting with you & other members when I'm ready to look for the information I seek. In the meantime my apologies for interrupting the thread. I would have used a like but I'm assuming that's limited considering this is a new account as I don't see the option. I have a tendency to be verbose & digress, so again my apologies for having done both.

As for the the thread topic I don't really know. I can definitively say that I hope so. As such a substance would be of immense use to many. As a chronic pain patient who is mercilessly denied my needed medication & doing what I can to survive; I know I personally have need for such a substance more times than I should. Sadly I live in the country that is host to the 3 letter agency nico refers to in his posts.

Again my apologies as I appear to be digressing again. Nico's wonderful dose of political hatred has caused my own feelings of righteos indignation over the treatment of the people in the stated country to start to kick in a bit strongly. So I'll shut up for now.

Thanks for the great posts @Nicomorphinist. As stated; keep it up good sir! (y)=D
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Thank you so much . .. as far as topic drift, was it Henry David Thoreau who said the only way we really find anything worthwhile is to get lost? It may have been Robert Frost, Ralph Waldo Emerson or some combination of two of the three, or all three . . .
 
Nicomorphinist said:
Well, I would say at least long enough to get through the narcotic withdrawal syndrome, and I have heard of people coming off of methadone using ketamine, hydroxyzine, and clonidine, in one case with and another case without a gabapentinoid like gabapentin, pregabalin, or baclofen. Ketamine does not last very long and has to be dosed on the hour, which is fine but potentially disruptive . . . I get the impression from using it myself for that purpose and others doing the same thing that it anaesthitises the body against the withdrawal symptoms rather than any significant interaction with the opioid receptors as in that case it would never work.

The use of a high-dose injection of ketamine which has anti-craving effects for up to six months seems to use another protocol and may work by knocking the patient on their arse for a while and it is probably an example of the seemingly miraculous field of psychedelic therapy for various things. People also have broken the habit in at least the intermediate term with ibogaine, psilocybin, mescaline, MDA, MDMA, LSD, and so forth . . . What a shame that research on it ground to a complete halt by the early 1970s because of all of those things being outlawed. Does anyone know if 4-methylaminorex (U4Euh) does the same kind of thing?
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4methylaminorex would be fine for methamphetamine substitution but doesn't have much other applications other than enjoyment.its quite enjoyable.try it if you can.synthesize it your self if u have to.it'd be worth it.
 
draculic acid69 said:
4methylaminorex would be fine for methamphetamine substitution but doesn't have much other applications other than enjoyment.its quite enjoyable.try it if you can.synthesize it your self if u have to.it'd be worth it.
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4-methylaminorex is one of the stimulants that I tried starting out as a box-ticking exercise more than anything else, and I was pleasantly surprised as I was expecting something that may be like pemoline, with which I was familiar as being a truly shitty drug, especially when comparing it to methylphenidate. It lasted about 18 hours and had the kind of modest impact on blood pressure which seemed like it could be used to reduce the impact of the strong narcotics on vital signs -- the reason why, for example, both Scophedal and 2,4-dinitrophenylmorphine were invented in the 1920s and 1930s, and was a consideration in the ingredient list of a number of combinations like Brompton Mixture (invented be Dr Herbert Snow in London in 1896) and co-administering methamphetamine with Pantopon to lessen orthostatic hypotension and similar mixtures mainly in the 1930s to maybe 1955 or 1960 or so. The three stories I have heard about the speedball was that a medic came up with it during the Franco-Prussian War (1870-1871), it was invented by doctors, nurses, and/or surgeons somewhere in the 1890s, or Harry Kendall Thaw, the famous troublemaker, came up with the idea circa 1900.
 
I've done many methyl aminorex speedballs with heroin in the pipe together.it was beautiful and delicious.
 
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