Do you consider Ketamine a Psychedelic?

[alantis360]

i say no just because of them in generarl, if ketamine is then all of them are and they really arent, however much we like them.

 

[Solipsis]

Classic psyches: internal amplifier, external amplifier.
Ketamine : internal amplifier, external inhibitor.

Yeah pretty much agreed.
There are different ways to separate and categorize and classify, a lot of people here emphasize different things, some emphasize differences and others similarities.
So - this is being said the third time now - it's semantics.

Proper metaphysics don't say 'this is how stuff works', there are different metaphysics that come in handy most in their own appropriate context. The question is asked here as good as context-free which explains the resulting discussion. How to categorize best depends on what the situation asks to emphasize.

 

[lightitup]

Well, as said it's just to open up discussion. But let's just completely forget this venn-diagram that we are referencing, and think about it in terms of what it means to each person. There is a reason that (almost exactly) 1/3 of people here are voting no.

As said before, I and others have experienced dissociative effects on LSD, as well as delirium on mushrooms or something similar. If we throw that little reference of where things "fit" then it makes it a much harder question. Each drug has the ABILITY to give the user dissociation or delirium, but that doesn't make it a psych. Referencing the 2-c's and MDxx's is really helpful, because they are not what I would call psychedelic. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't "Psychedelic Dissociative" just a classification based on the effects on a user, and now deemed official?

I feel like the poll is asking "is it a psych" which is very open. It makes it helpful to know whether people are thinking of it in it's grouping of drugs or how it effects the user.

 

[Shakti]

I voted no, and pretty much entirely agree with jammy's position. Except of course, for our preferences. I'd take just about any psychedelic over K any day. Except if I'm hitting up the sensory deprivation tanks. Then a little dissociation before I begin to float helps kick things off nicely.

 

[LysergicEpiphany]

I voted yes for MDMA but no for Ketamine; that shit aint no psychedelic I kaned it for years and the only thing I got out of my experiences was A bowel disorder, stomach ulcers, & multiple bladder infections!

 

[LysergicEpiphany]

Psychedelic means mind expanding/manifesting. To me, this means a drug experience that taps into the unconscious to stir up images or memories, and/or disrupts the normal functioning of the ego profoundly. Ketamine certainly does this, so I'd call it psychedelic. Most drugs have at least a small potential to be psychedelic in the right set and setting, but to call a drug "a psychedelic" implies to me that it's known for usually producing such effects. Opiates can be psychedelic in the sense of pulling up unconscious content, but most of the time they aren't all that mind manifesting.

Ketamine is shut down...

 

[Quantum_Think]

I think ketamine is kind of a psychedelic, but not in the traditional sense.

MDMA is most definately a psychedelic. i have tripped just as hard on MDMA as i have on LSD during the "crack out phase" of multiple rolls. i witnessed my reality begin to shift to a completely hallucinated dream world.

on MDMA, the universe unwound itself in completely the same fashion that it did during LSD and 2C-E trips. the only difference is that with MDMA, it took longer for me to meditate myself into it.

 

[solistus]

Ketamine is shut down...

lolwut?

 

[Static_Color]

Is K a psychedelic? No farkin clue to be honest, Out of all the K-holes I had, they been mostly interesting, confusing, profound and other-worldly for sure...

Insightful? Not nearly as much as say Shrooms or LSD... Mushies being my favs...

 

[iloveenimatek]

I voted yes.......by the way new to the board.

I love K, has been my fave drug for about 10yrs now, Now I know what I am doing and not just getting wiped out I find long K Sessions ( 1-2days at a Festival ), I thinks its an psychedelic drug. Colour Enhancment, warped vision...........good I want some!!!

 

[Big)Sky]

Ketamine is without a doubt a Psychedelic.

Ive experienced a few "K Holes" where anything i would think of would pop right into my CEV's. I was seeing the gas prices of the last gas pump where i pumped at.
I was seeing the stage of The Mike Gordon band right i was at that night. Any color i would think about would manifest its self right there.

Altho one time it was completely uncontrollable. I indulged in a .2 dose of some S+ and oh god was that an experience. Not positive either. I felt like a 1000lb sumo wrestler was dancing on my chest. I could barley breathe and thought i had gone out so far i would never return. I was outside my body flying through an intergalatic cosmic explosion of manifesting stars exploding.

Last time ive indulged in ketamine.

 

[brasil]

i do not agree but if you consider ecstasyan psychedelic you should consider ketamine...

 

[Peacefulandfree87]

The same applies to All

Psychedelic means mind expanding/manifesting. To me, this means a drug experience that taps into the unconscious to stir up images or memories, and/or disrupts the normal functioning of the ego profoundly. Ketamine certainly does this, so I'd call it psychedelic. Most drugs have at least a small potential to be psychedelic in the right set and setting, but to call a drug "a psychedelic" implies to me that it's known for usually producing such effects. Opiates can be psychedelic in the sense of pulling up unconscious content, but most of the time they aren't all that mind manifesting.

This definition of answering the initial question is the most legitimate one I've seen

 

[ahint]

I don't consider ketamine a psychedelic (nor do I consider MDMA a psychedelic). I tend to view psychedelics as things like DMT, LSD, mushrooms, 2c-b, etc.

 

[kidklmx]

Seconding the Solistus quote. Consider the Greek use of the word, where as an adjective it denoted that something was visible/clear. It is something that shows the world of the inner soul. Many drugs have this effect, though for something to be a psychedelic drug that would be the intended effect of the experience. Also keep in mind when Harvey Osmond coined the term in the 50s, empathogens and dissociatives didn't even exist yet. Those drugs are certainly able to reach to same goals he was looking for with his research.

The classics are a distinct type of experience, you recognize the serotonergic activity immediately. Here is what I just posted in another thread when going off a tangent to differentiate between them and the dissos:

I once coined psycholythics for these. Might sound counter-intuitive for those aware of Stanislav Grof, but the etymology checks out. Psyche/Psukhe = the ego; -lythic means "to cause lysis", the destruction of cells or in our case the ego. Why not entheogen? Because e.g Datura would also be an entheogen due to its shamanic use.

 

[PotatoMan]

ketamine, to me is a drug that makes all the cogs and joints and sockets in my body fill with this liquid molecule (DA) that allows everything to move loosely in my body, thus, enabling me to dance and move easily.

too much and i'm begging to chill on the floor, seeing double and stumbling all over the place.

the hole isn't very fun so i don't venture past the casual bump when tripping, rolling, raving.

it isn't psychedelic in the least bit IMO. just a clean dissociative, IME.

 

[.:Holy::Toast:.]

I like the Terrence McKenna distinction, where psychedelics generate their effects via 5-HT mediation and all others are simply classified as hallucinogens.
There is something distinctly different between the hallucinogenic effects generated by serotonergic psychedelics and any other class such as NMDA dissociatives or cholinergic deliriants.

 

[Crashing]

To the posters from 2010:

Psychedelics and dissociatives can be used for similar purposes, but they are different, and thus we categorize them differently.

Ketamine is classified as a 'dissociative' because of it's mechanism of action.

Ketamine isn't a psychedelic for the same reason that Oxycodone isn't a stimulant, unless of course you want to reinvent the matrix that defines current medical science.

Subjective experience has proven that many drug users feel paradoxically stimulated while taking CNS 'depressants', or paradoxically calmed by CNS 'stimulants'. But scientific classification unfortunately relies on objectivity.

Should Ketamine be discussed in the "Psychedelic" forum on Bluelight? Well, when you put it that way...

 

[Poppy-jay]

It's amazing at how many people have a different view on what a psychedelic is to them.

To me a psychedelic is something that produces visual in the sense of colours, geometrical patterns. And the body high associated with things like LSD/ shrooms and mescaline.

I would call MDMA a psychedelic too. Again this is only my
Opinion.
Because of the very very light colour changes and things appearing blighting and more sparkly. But it's more of a predictable psychedelic to me.

Ketamine to me is not a psychedelic.

Nor is weed.

Also how do I add to the poll?

 

[Bigazznugz]

No its a dissociative which makes me wonder why there is not a dissociative forum here