Dail Mail - Chemical imbalance: Lethal Ivory Wave is banned, but 'legal highs'...

edgarshade

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Chemical imbalance: Lethal Ivory Wave is banned, but 'legal highs' still on sale may be worse

By Rob Waugh

Last updated at 5:10 PM on 14th September 2011

With reader comments

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...legal-highs-sale-worse.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

A popular, widely available drug which can cause violent hallucinations and severe paranoia is to be banned, Government advisers ruled today. The drug, known as Ivory Wave, is sold freely via websites and should be made a Class B illegal drug, the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD) said. However, today's announcement fails to cover dozens of other designer drugs, including derivatives of the notorious hallucinogen PCP, credited with users hurling themselves from buildings. Tranquillisers such as Etizolam, similar to the drug Librium that may have killed Amy Winehouse, also remain freely on sale.

Other 'legal highs' freely on sale, such as the anaesthetic methoxyketamine, known as MXE, can cause paralysis and terrifying hallucinations. Users on online 'trip report' sites describe being paralysed for hours, unable to speak or walk, and even being close to death. One unnamed user wrote: 'For those hours I have no memory of what went on physically as the doctors tried to keep my body alive. 'I was told later that they thought I had had a stroke and was brain damaged, in a coma (until the tests showed no organic damage and I started to come to.) 'Everyone thought I had intentionally overdosed to try suicide.' Etizolam, a tranquilliser also available freely online, is similar to benzodiapenes such as Librium, now thought to be a possible cause of Amy Winehouse's death.
 
Oh how I hope that mxe doesn't end up being sold in headshops; that will be the end of it.

I really want to try it out; I should order some while I can still get it for very cheap before prices goes up in case anything happens.
 
This isn't going to end well for mxe...and I only tried it somewhat recently. I enjoyed it though it was a bit moreish for my taste. At the same time, I hear that it is less toxic to the bladder than ketamine. If only they would allow proper research and not just go "OH DEAR GOD PEOPLE ARE GETTING HIGH BAN IT!!!"

That attitude is starting to get to me. I mean, they're supposed to prove there is a good reason for a chemical to be illegal and that should include proper research but it doesn't. If I've read correctly, MDMA was made illegal for no reason whatsoever other than lots of people were taking it. Just people enjoying it...
 
^Perhaps enjoyment is just what's wrong about drugs according to the unexamined intuitions of many. Sam Harris has an interesting idea about why our society demands the outlawing of drugs without substantial evidence of their causing individual or social harm.

The End of Faith (book) said:
The idea of a victimless crime is nothing more than a judicial reprise of the Christian notion of sin.

It is no accident that people of faith often want to curtail the private freedoms of others. This impulse has less to do with the history of religion and more to do with its logic, because the very idea of privacy is incompatible with the existence of God. If God sees and knows all things, and remains so provincial a creature as to be scandalized by certain sexual behaviors or states of the brain, then what people do in the privacy of their own homes, though it may not have the slightest implication for their behavior in public, will still be a matter of public concern for people of faith...

...As it happens, there are many substances — many of them naturally occurring — the consumption of which leads to transient states of inordinate pleasure. Occasionally, it is true, they lead to transient states of misery as well, but there is no doubt that pleasure is the norm, otherwise human beings would not have felt the continual desire to take such substances for millennia. Of course, pleasure is precisely the problem with these substances, since pleasure and piety have always had an uneasy relationship...

...When one looks at our drug laws — indeed, at our vice laws altogether — the only organizing principle that appears to make sense of them is that anything which might radically eclipse prayer or procreative sexuality as a source of pleasure has been outlawed. In particular, any drug (LSD, mescaline, psilocybin, DMT, MDMA, marijuana, etc.) to which spiritual or religious significance has been ascribed by its users has been prohibited. Concerns about the health of our citizens, or about their productivity, are red herrings in this debate, as the legality of alcohol and cigarettes attests...

...The only explanation is that our discourse on this subject has never been obliged to function within the bounds of rationality. Under our current laws, it is safe to say, if a drug were invented that posed no risk of physical harm or addiction to its users but produced a brief feeling of spiritual bliss and epiphany in 100 percent of those who tried it, this drug would be illegal, and people would be punished mercilessly for its use. Only anxiety about the biblical crime of idolatry would appear to make sense of this retributive impulse. Because we are a people of faith, taught to concern ourselves with the sinfulness of our neighbors, we have grown tolerant of irrational uses of state power.

...Anyone who believes that God is watching us from beyond the stars will feel that punishing peaceful men and women for their private pleasure is perfectly reasonable.
It's an interesting idea: perhaps arguing rationally about the baseless nature of most drug laws on their own terms isn't an effective means of changing minds, whereas, oddly, undermining religious faith could be.
 
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Sorry to break it...but MXE is already in the headshops locally (a large city in the NW UK), I've only seen it in one, but thats saying sod all really as I've only LOOKED in one. The major-player headshop near me has it, as well as methiopropamine, AMT, MDAI and others. I went there looking actually today, as my latest lot of MXE is coming and I fancied a shot (gah...damn the consumer product, it has insoluable filler material also within the small capsules its made up in and needs micron filtering to blazes)

Went to somewhere smaller, not really the sort of place to find it in the first place, but the only other place I know of in the town center that might have fit the bill, and asked, turned out no, they never have had any, after finding the headshop out of stock....and got told the person at place no.2 found it quite surprising they had sold out, having bought at least a hundred dosage units earlier in the week. Its very popular, apparently.

Not surprising really, at least, not in my opinion having used the stuff. The headshop owner does at least seem to be the responsible type, although not so sure its going to amount to much, in refusing to sell in grams, due to him fearing people would start ODing and dropping like flies (I think it might be geuinely why, rather than profit, given he could easily purchase even at retail prices on a gram basis, or even 100g at a time, cap his own, and make a killing, comparitively speaking)

Good luck banning ivory wave though...its a brand, not a drug. And if legislation to persecute...sorry prosecute possessors of the brand were to be enacted, specifically naming 'ivory wave', the company would just rebrand with the same or another drug (they have changed the fomulation before, I liked the original MDPV/pentylone mixture for studying, then it got banned before I was able to get more, not being a big stimulant person at all, and going through my original gram very, very slowly, over a good few months, a new one came out, and another if I remember right. I recall hearing something nasty here, that people then started getting fucked by the stuff en masse, due to one of the new ones being oh, right, way to go lawmakers, desoxy-fucking-pipradrol!

Desoxy is still legal here, is it not, in the UK? I do hope so, as I find it functionally useful, and again, I go through it, like any stimulant, very slowly, still got most of my 100mg test purchase, and that has been in EtOH solution for months again. If not...means I best get in there quickly before it becomes unavailable.
 
Methoxyketamine?



BULLSHIT

If they went to erowid to get that one report, they would have noticed the many more positive reports. So this article is completely biased, misleading and wholly uninformative. Fucking daily mail...Its only purpose is to inject fear and hate into society.
 
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Maybe Erowid could have a Daily Mail reading "vault".

Train wrecks and trip disasters: Terrible time. Thought it would never end. Fear, hate and a one party state.
 
The most irresponsible "vendors" though, are the ones who sell chems such as AMT, MXE, high potency stuff without also selling scales,

Ones that are at least capabale of measuring say 20mg are quite sufficient.

Can cut that into 5 little piles, = 4 -5 mg Max then per pile.
 
Actually, all of the negative effects listed in the 1st post from the mail can be caused by alcohol too. And I bet that the [number of incidences / 100,000 doses] is higher for alcohol than all the chemicals listed above. Funny how they don't mention that I think. Odd though, as alcohol is easily the most unpredictable drug I've taken, especially in terms of the way it affects me and has frequently got me in states where I could really have got into trouble.

that's a first, I think. How long do you give it?

Probably less than 2-3 months now sadly. Same with aMT. Not quite so sure about the others. Hoping MPA escapes under the radar as I like that one particularly...
 
The government's answer to moderately dangerous cocaine is to outlaw it and let highly dangerous cathinones take over, and their answer to cathinones is to outlaw that and let things that are no more than a poison take over. Good move there, Mr. DEA.
 
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