[Combo Subthread] Mushrooms & MAOIs

[Warp Renegade]

Magic Mushrooms + MAOIs

I've read in a lot of places that if you take an MAOI alongside Magic Mushrooms then it can increase the effects twofold.

Everywhere I've read the usual MAOI to use would be Harmaline. Would taking a low dose of Selegeline instead work?

If this does work, would I then have to wait the 2 weeks (I think) until it is completly removed from my body before I can take SSRI's etc...

What kind of dose do you think would work? Would one pill be too much/not enough? Should I just take a half?

My problem is that I am what Shulgin describes as a "Hard Head". A couple of weeks ago I took 30 grams of fresh mushrooms and only reached what I would call a high level one trip. No hallucinations occured but I felt very pleasant in myself and really happy.

 

[NeighborhoodThreat]

If this does work, would I then have to wait the 2 weeks (I think) until it is completly removed from my body before I can take SSRI's etc...

Yes. The usual warnings about MAOIs apply.

My problem is that I am what Shulgin describes as a "Hard Head". A couple of weeks ago I took 30 grams of fresh mushrooms and only reached what I would call a high level one trip. No hallucinations occured but I felt very pleasant in myself and really happy.

Every batch of mushrooms has different potency, just because you didn't trip as hard as you would have liked to on 30 grams of one batch doesn't mean that the next batch will be as weak. Mixing MAOIs with anything is not a walk in the park.

I've read in a lot of places that if you take an MAOI alongside Magic Mushrooms then it can increase the effects twofold.

I don't know where you've read this, but mixing MAOIs with mushrooms is asking for serotonin syndrome. Do not do this.

There is some good conversation that could occur from this thread, but it is beyond my area of expertise. I'm going to move it over to Psychedelic Drugs and see what they think about it.

B D D - - > P D

 

[Warp Renegade]

Thank you for the reply and moving the post to the relevant forum.

I read about Magic Mushrooms mixed with Harmaline from the shroomery forums. It seems like a reasonably common thing that some people do. Obviously they are in the minority but there are still people out there that do it.

I was thinking a lose dose of Selegeline because according to Wiki:

"special dietary restrictions for lower doses have been found to be unnecessary, and dietary restrictions appear to be unnecessary at standard doses when selegiline is taken"

 

[NeighborhoodThreat]

No problem man

^MAOIs are tricky, and work differently for different people. That's why I recommend caution (or restraint) when mixing them with basically anything, probably something that's left better for a doctor to decide.

That being said, hopefully the PD crowd will be able to enlighten you better than I can, as I have no first-hand experience in the subject...

 

[tBirdee]

I don't know where you've read this, but mixing MAOIs with mushrooms is asking for serotonin syndrome. Do not do this.

You sure about that? I only ask because AFAIK taking mushrooms with an MAOI is relatively safe. (As far as being safe with MAOIs goes..) I've never heard about an adverse reaction.

I've taken mushrooms with Rue twice, both with 3-3.5 g of Rue. Let me say it certainly does intensify the trip, but at the same time it changes it's character completely, in a very good way.

 

[Warp Renegade]

No problem man

^MAOIs are tricky, and work differently for different people. That's why I recommend caution (or restraint) when mixing them with basically anything.

Yeah, I've had some laying around for a while but I've never had the confidence/stupidity to actually take any. I was just thinking that this might be a good way of using them otherwise I'll be taking a trip to a pharmacy to hand the unwanted selegeline over for safe disposal.

 

[shishigami]

You sure about that? I only ask because AFAIK taking mushrooms with an MAOI is relatively safe. (As far as being safe with MAOIs goes..) I've never heard about an adverse reaction.

I'm also gonna agree with this. If MAOI + Shrooms caused serotonin syndrome then so would MAOI + DMT, which is known to be safe. Hell its not like there are tons of ayahuasca users ending up in the hospital with SS. I would be willing to bet that any simple or 4-subbed tryptamine is safe to take with an MAOI.

 

[Warp Renegade]

Excellent. Is there a way of working out out much to take or should I just start with 1 pill and see how it goes? And does it really double the strength of the Mushrooms or is that just people exaggerating?

 

[atara]

Selegiline in particular is not a serotonin syndrome risk because it doesn't inhibit the subtype of monoamine oxidase which is required for the degradation of serotonin. Serotonin is metabolized by MAO-A, whereas selegiline selectively inhibits MAO-B at normal doses.

At the same time, this means that any MAO-A-mediated effects you may desire are not likely to occur.

Psilocin has negligible SERT affinity and so does not present a serotonin syndrome risk in combination with a MAOI. Several other tryptamines such as AMT or 5-MeO-MiPT do inhibit or reverse SERT and should not be combined with MAOIs.

 

[Amu]

From http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=108959

Hallucinogens (LSD/Acid, psilocybin/Shrooms, Tryptamines, 2-ct-2,DPT, DMT etc, Salvia): Apparently, people taking MAOIs are LESS sensitive to hallucinogens/tryptamines than normally. This is especially true with LSD. Interactions with the tryptamines and with salvia are not well established, so please be VERY CAREFUL when combining. Start out with a LOW DOSE and see how the drug affects you before proceeding.

Reversible MAOIs:: If you are taking a RIMA, do not use recreational drugs that are warned against in this FAQ within SEVEN DAYS of going on or off your medication. I.e., if you get high on a contraindicated drug (this means a drug that you can't take on a RIMA), you should wait 7 days before starting to take your medicine. If you STOP taking your RIMA, you should be off the medicine for at least 7 days before you attempt to get high.

Irreversible MAOIs If you are taking an irreversible MAOI, you need to abstain from drug for a week before starting your medication. If you are going OFF an irreversible MAOI, you need to avoid recreational drugs for THREE WEEKS. Please be careful and heed this advice, or severe medical problems and/or death are possible.

 

[Ismene]

Mushrooms and Moclobemide are the ultimate psychedelic experience. There's not enough superaltives to describe it. The greatest bodyhigh of any drug, the most wildly psychedelic, the friendliest and the most euphoric.

I've never used rue or any other MAOI so I'm just talking about moclobemide but I imagine taking harmaline would be pretty similar.

It doesn't make the mushrooms twice as intense, what it does is convert the psilocybin trip into an oral DMT trip. But there's no nausea and the peak lasts for 2-3 hours longer than a DMT trip. It's an utterly breathtaking once in a lifetime experience.

 

[DwayneHoover]

You sure about that? I only ask because AFAIK taking mushrooms with an MAOI is relatively safe. (As far as being safe with MAOIs goes..) I've never heard about an adverse reaction.

I've taken mushrooms with Rue twice, both with 3-3.5 g of Rue. Let me say it certainly does intensify the trip, but at the same time it changes it's character completely, in a very good way.

Agreed completely. Syrian Rue is going to be safer than pharms as its a short term mao-b only inhibitor... obey dietary restrictions, but you dont need to wait 2 weeks to eat cheese or have a beer... its effect wears off pretty quick... next day and you would be back to normal. Using the pharm(s) mentioned would probably have a similar effect (but NOT serotonin syndrome, not fromt he shrooms anyway) but probably require more leeway before using contraindicated stuff.. some (but not all) pharma MAOIs are longer and broader acting than Rue.

 

[shishigami]

Syrian Rue is going to be safer than pharms as its a short term mao-b only inhibitor...

Just wanted to make the correction that the Harmala alkaloids are MAO-A (and reversible ones at that) inhibitors. Because the inhibition is reversible (meaning the chemical is displaced at the receptor sites by tyramine) little strict diet needs to be followed with these ones. Personally I would just not eat any tyramine containing products for 2 hours before and 2 hours after the experience. If your worried cut tyramine containing products out for a day in advance, it can't hurt.

If you are using pharmaceutical MAOIs than chances are they aren't reversible and you should strictly adhere to a tyramine free diet for 2.5 weeks after last dose. I personally wouldn't fuck with drugs on a pharmaceutical MAOI.

 

[Solipsis]

Okay merged an existing thread with this new one and copied/moved posts from the general mushroom combination & potentiation thread. The latter is an absolute disaster of incorrectly merged threads on LSD storage and what not, and it still has to be figured out. It's not pretty. Meanwhile lets focus on the more specific combo's.

 

[Ismene]

Moclobemide is a reversible MAOI. Taking a 300mg tablet is a surefire way of attaining MAOI inhibition. Choking down rue seeds or caapi is going to be a lot more unpleasant and you're never going to know the exact dose you took. I've taken moclobemide and mushrooms dozens of times without following any diet restrictions and never noticed any side-effects.

 

[webbykevin]

Vegetable TV

I have heard mckenna talking about taking a medium dose ( 2 to 3 grams) of mushrooms and then after 2 hours smoking 1 gram of rue seeds in a pipe and getting 20 minutes of insane and beautiful hallucinations, he called it vegetable TV, has anyone tried this ?

The reason I ask is that I am really staying away from cannabis at the moment, trying to go at least 6 months without any, But I am finding that without smoking pot as an addition to mushrooms i am not getting nearly as many visuals with them, so I am intersted in seeing whether rue smoked with mushrooms in this way really does work to ramp up the visuals.

I know i could just try it and find out but in the interests of sensible harm reduction and sanity presevation I thought the best place to start would be to ask if anyone can give me a heads up on this method.

cheers

 

[Jesusgreen]

Merged

MAOIs potentiate tryptamines, so yes that should work. Someone else with more experience is likely to be able to give you a more detailed answer though.

 

[greenmeanies]

I have heard mckenna talking about taking a medium dose ( 2 to 3 grams) of mushrooms and then after 2 hours smoking 1 gram of rue seeds in a pipe and getting 20 minutes of insane and beautiful hallucinations, he called it vegetable TV, has anyone tried this ?

The reason I ask is that I am really staying away from cannabis at the moment, trying to go at least 6 months without any, But I am finding that without smoking pot as an addition to mushrooms i am not getting nearly as many visuals with them, so I am intersted in seeing whether rue smoked with mushrooms in this way really does work to ramp up the visuals.

I know i could just try it and find out but in the interests of sensible harm reduction and sanity presevation I thought the best place to start would be to ask if anyone can give me a heads up on this method.

cheers

Personally I wouldn't smoke rue seeds. Any seed in general is largely fatty compounds (why you take seeds out of cannabis for smoking, because it creates thick black cough-inducing clouds) and in particular the active compounds in syrian rue are located in the red-brown seed coat instead of the seed itself. Simply pop the seeds in a coffee grinder for thirty seconds and you will be able to sift the red dust away from the seed kernels. As to whether this is psychoactive when smoked, I don't know. I've consumed rue orally with mushrooms to great effect as detailed in this thread, but have never smoked it myself. It probably does work.

As far as McKenna and "vegetable TV" goes, who's to say what exactly he saw on his trips. Everyone has a different version of everything. IMO, rue plus mushrooms is about as spiritual as I've ever seen a trip go, with the most amazing potential to tear down the soul and build it back up again.

 

[eerr11cc]

Could an irreversible MAOI like Parnate be used safely with mushrooms assuming they are dosed carefully?

 

[lysergication]

Personally I wouldn't smoke rue seeds. Any seed in general is largely fatty compounds (why you take seeds out of cannabis for smoking, because it creates thick black cough-inducing clouds) and in particular the active compounds in syrian rue are located in the red-brown seed coat instead of the seed itself. Simply pop the seeds in a coffee grinder for thirty seconds and you will be able to sift the red dust away from the seed kernels. As to whether this is psychoactive when smoked, I don't know. I've consumed rue orally with mushrooms to great effect as detailed in this thread, but have never smoked it myself. It probably does work.

Yes it works well, I grind the seeds and let them smoke on a burning charcoal then I inhale the smoke..I think that's the traditional use actually.