Codeine and CWE Megathread - The long awaited!

[Mr Blonde]

^ It doesn't induce CYP2D6; DXM seems to potentiate opioids through some mechanism involving NMDA antagonism that potentiates the effects of opioid agonists. Not much is known about exactly why this is the case, I have heard several theories though. Here is a study that briefly discusses the effect in relation to their experiments showing that it affects μ and δ receptor agonists.

 

[PeacePipeChief]

thanks for the link , i read this from the codeine potentiation and synergy mega thread .

 

[Sustanon]

This is the reason why I use Panadeine Extra. Those Ibuprofen/codeine products leave a massive ball which absorbs most of the solution,unlike the former.

Just tried them for the first time today. Used a shirt like usual and thats the thing there was bearly anything left in the filter (shirt). Usually there is quite an amount of filtrate and it seems like there was nowhere near 4800mg of ibuprofen give or take few grams. Poured it all out and just used some panafen plus which is my usual. This is the very bad thing about recommending using shirts as filters (didnt even think of this before) as some brands work well with shirts others dont (they just clog up or pass through the filter way easier) Panafen plus pills are just right to use with a shirt I can vouch for that. My advice is to stick to your preferred pills and perfect the technique, there is no one exact tek for all.

 

[Sonny Jim]

My advice is to stick to your preferred pills and perfect the technique, there is no one exact tek for all.

I disagree

A CWE is only a CWE when it produces a reasonably pure filtrate and has taken into account the following;

water temp (must be ice cold, no exceptions),

water volume to pill ratio must be optimal (using a lot of water will get you a lot of ibuprofen, there are no exceptions),

the filter must work to filter out at least all visible particles leaving a clear solution ( again, no exceptions if you have a cloudy solution then you have visible ibuprofen in your product//except for the rubbery white coating on panafen plus but how the fuck can you tell what's what really? Filter paper is a bare minimum, if you think a t-shirt is OK then you should keep it to your self to be honest. T-shirt can mean any kind of material and I don't believe any are good enough to use for such small volumes, they are so risky.

The type of pills. Some will not work, some are designed to make the paracetamol or ibuprofen dissolve more quickly than usual. Some dissolve so well that they have almost killed and seriously injured members of this forum.

ALWAYS BE PREPARED TO SACRIFICE CODEINE FOR SAFETY I.E. DON'T CARRY OUT A SECOND CWE ON USED PILL SLURRY. Be happy you can get it over the counter and aim to ingest only the cream of the crop so to speak. Think about it, think about the point of even doing a CWE in the first place, think about why the government is happy to sell codeine over the counter--> They have poisoned it with para or ibu or aspirin. A CWE is not fool proof by any means. People die from this shit, its not ever like your taking pure codeine and that should be stressed at every step

 

[Captain Brewster]

Been wary as shit with the pharmisist brand lately, just don't like the pink dye.

I done about 5 filtrations with this shit, all at fridge temp, but that pink dye just doesent go away.

Hope it is just pink dye.

 

[PeacePipeChief]

Yeah panefen plus has a white dye which tricks me into thinking its ibuprofen -.- but it's not lol Incan leave the final solution in the fridge/freezer/ice bath for so long and nothing else will separate .

 

[Captain Brewster]

^ the pink dye has got me thinking, out with the coffee filters and in with the lab grade.

Can't believe people are too lazy to get coffee filters and use t-shirts instead, there would most likely be a supermarket not far from the pharmacy you got the codiene from.

 

[Busty St Clare]

think about why the government is happy to sell codeine over the counter--> They have poisoned it with para or ibu or aspirin.

Think again. There are actual therapeutic reasons to combine different drugs. Paracetamol in particular reduces fever, something that people who are actually sick from infection want.

 

[Nozphexezora]

For therapeutic reasons, which would you personally recommend? Ibuprofen or Paracetamol.

 

[Captain Brewster]

^ I'm scared about using ibuprofen due to it causing un-repairable stomach damage.

I have been on nexium, then somac, and know Zantac for the past 4 years due to a crappy doc prescribing me a cocktail of pharms to get rid of head pressures. After doing this and having ongoing acid reflux another doctor pointed out that it was the brufen (400mg ibuprofen) that would have caused it.

 

[Captain Brewster]

Just thinking about adding 2 maxydol (paracetamol 500mg, codeine 10mg, doxylamine 5.1) to my cwe, I would also use plain strong painkillers (paracetamol 500, codeine 10mg) to get the codeine high enough.

Would the Doxylamine work as a potentiater? Or is this a bad idea due to it screwing with the cwe?

 

[Nozphexezora]

Apparently Doxylamine is very water soluble, so you will get a potentiation out of it. And it's only 10mg (some of which will be lost in the solution), so I don't think it would screw up the extraction.

 

[Busty St Clare]

For therapeutic reasons, which would you personally recommend? Ibuprofen or Paracetamol.

Following surgery I prescribe them both combined. If it is only for a few days the side effects are minimal. Unless you have destroyed your stomach lining previously.

 

[88brenno]

water temp (must be ice cold, no exceptions)

This is false, if you believe in the science of a CWE then you would know that when using 21 degrees Celsius water @ 100mL only 667mg of toxic crap is soluble assuming you filter it well. Its called a cold water extraction not ICE cold water, I used to waste my time using the freezer, but that's a waste of 30minutes, fridge water is cold enough, solution comes out just as clear.

 

[Sustanon]

Another thing about t-shirts, I have a lot of experience using them to filter other stuff and they also get clogged like coffee filters the only difference is that the t-shirt getting clogged makes it a better filter. The coffee filter was a good filter to begin with. The t-shirt will initially let through a lot of particles until some of the holes get clogged with undissolved pill and starts filtering better.

Every who says there CWEs are safe also has to keep in mind that ibuprofen can be taken at toxic doses for a long time (in some people it seems) before they finally fuck their guts and vital organs. The fact that you don't die 30 minutes after ingestion does not mean what your doing is safe in the long term. These are very serious disease that CWE user are at risk of and at such a young age. Some of the shit people post in this thread makes me a bit pissed of because I worry for the younger version of myself reading some of the posts.

This shit is puts you at risk even when you do it properly, the more stupid of us don't care and that doesn't bother me too much, its the uninformed kids that I worry about and this forum has them by the bucket load.

I think we need a qualified moderator to keep this particular thread in check because there is some real dumb dangerous shit that keeps popping up, over and over, seemingly from the same people who should know better.

Its good to see you being very cautious however I'm a very scientific guy and prefer research done on things. We have discussed the T-shirt process thoroughly and in the next few days I will be doing a bit of research and calculations. Its really important which I havnt seen anyone mention is that one needs to use WARM water to dissolve the pills then GRADUALLY cooling the solution down until it is very cold.

Ibuprofen is a white powder with a melting point of 74-77° C and is very slightly soluble in water (< 1 mg/mL) and readily soluble in most organic solvents. Now I use 3ml for every pill usually which is roughly about 90ml of water. The solubility is 1mg for every ml of water making the maximum amount of ibuprofen in the water 90mg which will be deducted from the end result once I have established the exact weight of the filtered ibuprofen and other inactives such a fillers and starch etc etc.

Filtration using a very fine tight knit/woven T-shirt

Completion of the filtration leaving behind Ibuprofen and other inactives

In the beginning before the filtration it contained 6000mg Ibuprofen - 90mg (that dissolved) = 5910mg. A panafen plus pill weighs 667mg. So 667mg - 12.8mg (codeine) - 200mg (ibuprofen) = 454.2mg of other inactives x 30 pills =
13 626mg + ibuprofen= 19626mg.Now bear in mind that ibuprofen very very slightly soluble in water so basically no issues there like I mentioned earlier the solution contains roughly 90mg of ibuprofen. So after keeping the filtered contents I will dry it out and see exactly how much the weight will be. Another thing to note I prob lost about a gram give or take due to it sticking to the filter and etc. Lets see how close the figure gets to roughly 18 000mg.

Another thing to note, Im not exactly sure how soluble all the other ingredients are but I imagine a fair few of them are pretty water soluble too. Which would also bring down the 18 000mg target. When I have a bit more spare time I will conduct another experiment where I will evaporate the solution and see how much Ibuprofen + inactives are left, and can incorporate those figures into teh calculations as well.

Lets just say I evaporated my solution (its a bit cloudy but not because of the ibuprofen itself after filtration) id imagine I wouldnt end up with more than half gram of solids (which I have tried long time ago) and lets just assume that all of it was ibuprofen thats about 2.5 pills. There are ibuprofen pills out there that contain 800mg each and 2.5 pills of P+ would be the appx recommended dosage.

 

[Sonny Jim]

This is false, if you believe in the science of a CWE then you would know that when using 21 degrees Celsius water @ 100mL only 667mg of toxic crap is soluble assuming you filter it well. Its called a cold water extraction not ICE cold water, I used to waste my time using the freezer, but that's a waste of 30minutes, fridge water is cold enough, solution comes out just as clear.

100% not false. The colder the water the better. It doesn't matter how you get the water cold but if you want it quick just add a lot of ice to water then strain, BINGO! you got icey cold water but ideally you'd also chill you extraction vessels. A quick soak in ice water (heaps of crushed ice) does the trick in a few minutes, if that.

It's called a cold water extraction not a roughly room temperature water extraction. For real, the cold water is non negotiable. Don't be lulled into a false sense of security, this shit is dodgy and you have to be careful.

"solution comes out just as clear."
The clarity of the solution is not a complete picture of what is dissolved in it. You could very easily make a paracetamol or ibuprofen solution that was crystal clear but lethal.

 

[Sonny Jim]

hey good work with the write up sustanon, I haven't been able to go through it properly yet but this is the kind of thing we need to start doing I think.

hopefully we can work out how to make your experiment nice and simple and lots of us can have a go and post results. We could potentially get some very valuable info that way but its kind of hard work lol

 

[88brenno]

100% not false. The colder the water the better. It doesn't matter how you get the water cold but if you want it quick just add a lot of ice to water then strain, BINGO! you got icey cold water but ideally you'd also chill you extraction vessels. A quick soak in ice water (heaps of crushed ice) does the trick in a few minutes, if that.

It's called a cold water extraction not a roughly room temperature water extraction. For real, the cold water is non negotiable. Don't be lulled into a false sense of security, this shit is dodgy and you have to be careful.

"solution comes out just as clear."
The clarity of the solution is not a complete picture of what is dissolved in it. You could very easily make a paracetamol or ibuprofen solution that was crystal clear but lethal.

LOL where in my post did I say "roughly room temperature water extraction"

I simply stated the solubility of APAP and said fridge water is cold enough to make a safe solution instead of people putting it in the freezer for half an hour, which a lot of people do.

Where do you get this false sense of security crap from? If you don't believe in the science behind a CWE maybe you shouldn't do them.

I don't know where you get the idea that a clear solution can be lethal, it is general knowledge that the milkier your CWE is, the more suspended APAP is in the final solution.

My method:
I crush my pills place 2 at a time in a tablespoon and crush with a teaspoon and pour directly into a shot glass, (this takes me 5 minutes) add some fridge water (no more than ~50mL which is good for like 25-30 pills) and stir it up good. Then dampen my coffee filter and hanky in the fridge water, gently place the coffee filter in first and then hanky goes in the coffee filter, pour my solution into the hanky wait ~5-10mins until the visible liquid has gone and gently twist the top together and squeeze the goodies directly into the coffee filter as hard as possible (wanna get every last drop) and leave to filter I am left with an almost clear (a little greyish) but certainly not white or milky which I attribute to binders as I have had clearer results from different brands.

I don't know if the water solubility matters after I have squeezed the goodies into the coffee filter, (separated the liquid from the gunk) assuming it does and warms up to 21 degrees Celsius while filtering (from fridge temperature mind you which is 3-5degrees) I would be ingesting 333 mg APAP (less than half the recommended dose) assuming you don't get impatient and squeeze the coffee filter which will make it go cloudy and let suspended APAP through.

 

[Sonny Jim]

"I don't know where you get the idea that a clear solution can be lethal, it is general knowledge that the milkier your CWE is, the more suspended APAP is in the final solution."

No, it is easy to make a crystal clear solution that has a lethal dose of ibuprofen or paracetamol. Both of these chemicals are colourless and do not change the appearance of the water at all.

Do you agree that every CWE you make, WITHOUT EXCEPTION, has a significant amount of dissolved (invisible) paracetamol or ibuprofen in it?

It doesn't matter if you do a perfect CWE, it will contain dissolved para or ibu. Just like it contains dissolved (invisible) codeine.

 

[Sonny Jim]

Also, do you agree that assuming quality pills and pure or at least quality tap water the only thing that influences the amount of dissolved (invisible) para or ibu in solution is the temperature of water, the volume of water to pill ratio and the time allowed for crushed pill to dissolve. Oh and of course the filter but that is after the water/pill interaction.