Misc 7OH Potentiation

[Allylbenzene]

I've tried a whole bunch, though most either don't seem to work or are inconsistent. However, I've only taken two from this list which are Agmatine and Curcumin I've neer heard the others mention, so I'd like to give those a shot.

How did you use Agmatine? It'll work best with daily use, like pre-dosed 500mg–1g. Theacrine and hordenine are both pro-dopamine type stimulants, hordenine also has NRI and temporary MAO-Bi. You can get terpene isolates for myrcene but others are easy to find prepackaged like lemon oil (limonene, pinene, y-terpinene), 'ho wood' oil (97% linalool). Pinene and y-terpinene have opioid effects too. Beta-caryophyllene is def worth trying, it interacts with opioid receptors and reduces opioid redosing.

I don't encourage such high doses but here's what lemon oil can do. This forum has reports for several oils.

Nature's Herb Forum-Lemon Oil is Definitely Psychedelic!

So far I've done 3 high dose experiments with lemon essential oil, and I've experienced psychedelic effects all 3 times. 1st experiment (30 drops lemo

www.tapatalk.com

Btw Magnolia officinalis extract has GABAergic and cannabinoid effects so that'd work. Remember kratom alkaloids have many effects including dopamine, serotonin, adenosine, NMDA antagonist, adrenergic, cannabinoid. AFAIK 7-OH only has opioid effects so pretty dull compared to full-spectrum kratom.

 

[Mycophile]

How did you use Agmatine? It'll work best with daily use, like pre-dosed 500mg–1g. Theacrine and hordenine are both pro-dopamine type stimulants, hordenine also has NRI and temporary MAO-Bi. You can get terpene isolates for myrcene but others are easy to find prepackaged like lemon oil (limonene, pinene, y-terpinene), 'ho wood' oil (97% linalool). Pinene and y-terpinene have opioid effects too. Beta-caryophyllene is def worth trying, it interacts with opioid receptors and reduces opioid redosing.

I don't encourage such high doses but here's what lemon oil can do. This forum has reports for several oils.

Nature's Herb Forum-Lemon Oil is Definitely Psychedelic!

So far I've done 3 high dose experiments with lemon essential oil, and I've experienced psychedelic effects all 3 times. 1st experiment (30 drops lemo

www.tapatalk.com

Btw Magnolia officinalis extract has GABAergic and cannabinoid effects so that'd work. Remember kratom alkaloids have many effects including dopamine, serotonin, adenosine, NMDA antagonist, adrenergic, cannabinoid. AFAIK 7-OH only has opioid effects so pretty dull compared to full-spectrum kratom.

Whoa, these are some crazy results from just lemon oil mixed in!!! Does everyone who mixes it with Kratom get actual PSYCHEDELIC effects or just this one guy??

What were you saying is an MAO-Bi?? Cause I take prozac so I know I shouldn't have any actual MAO inhibitors. Is there anything you are mentioning that is one so I know what to avoid??

Cause it seems like you are mentioning several potentiators.

As far as Agmatine, I've only used it in one dose with whatever Kratom I'm taking. I've never taken it daily so maybe that's why it won't work.

Now I just took a whole bunch of different plant extracts with some kratom and I'm getting barely any effects. It's probably cause I used OPMS black a few days in a room. That kills my tolerance. I'm not sure what I should do cause I do like extracts but I don't like killing my tolerance. I guess I should try to take more plain leaf and get some of these potentiators.

 

[Mycophile]

If you already struggle with addictivity, don't push it. I'm not a great person to comment on this as I don't really seem to ever feel withdrawals, addictivity, etc., I assume it relates to brain damage I sustained years back.

I prefer full spectrum extracts especially alongside plain leaf, I find OPMS blacks more addictive than 7-OH personally but some disagree. To me, the vaguely dissociative quality of something like an OPMS black feels way better than the oxycodone-ish feeling of 7-oh.

Yeah, I'm staying away from 7-OH for now. But I've been experimenting with a bunch of different extracts and now I'm having a day where nothing is working. It's not SUPER unusual to get fewer effects when I've been semi-regularly using OPMS black. I've taken them the past few days and now these other extracts of various kinds that I ordered online aren't having any effects.

What would you recommend to get these different extracts and strains to take more effect? Cause I see mention of several potentiators I have yet to try so that's one thing, while the only other thing I could hear people saying is to use less OPMS black if I want these other strains/extracts to work....

 

[Allylbenzene]

Whoa, these are some crazy results from just lemon oil mixed in!!! Does everyone who mixes it with Kratom get actual PSYCHEDELIC effects or just this one guy??

Lemon oil has psychaoctive mood elevating (aka anti-depressant) effects on it's own. I wouldn't recommend using high doses. If you are going to use it, dilute the essential oil beforehand.
Terpenes offer a range of effects (inc GABA, opioid, serotonin, dopamine) they're popular in the cannabis scene since cannabis terpenes contribute to the overall high and make a strain what it is.

Keeping OT, plant terpenes can synergise and potentiate kratom. Approach them cautiously (diluted, low doses, pure theraputic grade steam-distilled oils). Also be aware they have a history of use in traditional medicine.

What were you saying is an MAO-Bi?? Cause I take prozac so I know I shouldn't have any actual MAO inhibitors. Is there anything you are mentioning that is one so I know what to avoid??

Cause it seems like you are mentioning several potentiators.

As far as Agmatine, I've only used it in one dose with whatever Kratom I'm taking. I've never taken it daily so maybe that's why it won't work.

Now I just took a whole bunch of different plant extracts with some kratom and I'm getting barely any effects. It's probably cause I used OPMS black a few days in a room. That kills my tolerance. I'm not sure what I should do cause I do like extracts but I don't like killing my tolerance. I guess I should try to take more plain leaf and get some of these potentiators.

Hordenine (phenethylamine-type stimulant) is a temporary reversible MAO-Bi, not an actual inhibitor.


I didn't know you are taking prozac. That is pretty significant and probably explains a lot.

It's likely that prozac is a reason for your tolerance issues and self-medication with kratom. According to a paper I read, the main alkaloid in kratom (mitragynine) activates the dopamine D2 receptor, increases dopamine via opioid activity and blocks a serotonin receptor (5-HT2A) which overall helps to mitigate the effects of SSRIs.

Rephrased - kratoms mitragynine alkaloid can provide relief from the effects of an SSRI. Pure 7-OH won't.

Prozac also works in another way:

One of the many actions of the "SSRI" (Prozac), which aren't related to their effect on serotonin, is to increase the concentration of allopregnanolone in the brain, imitating the action of increased progesterone. Following this discovery, Lilly got Prozac approved as a treatment for premenstrual syndrome. Since the production of allopregnanolone and progesterone depends on the availability of pregnenolone and cholesterol, a low cholesterol level would be one of the factors making this an inappropriate way to treat PMS.

...allopregnanolone (aka brexanolone)...is used to treat postpartum depression.

Allopregnanolone - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Essentially prozac is used for PMS-related depression because it increases one of the bodies anti-depressant hormones. Using prozac is kind of a roundabout way of treating PMS-related depression since it's simpler to use allopregnanolone (or progesterone) directly.

Well since 2019 pure allopregnanolone is prescribed for the same reason.

Since the body naturally makes all these protective hormones (in mitochondria, see below) the most effective solutionwould be to restore the bodies own production. Many things prevent mitochondria from working properly (eg hypothyroid, lack of cholesterol, lack of T3 thyroid hormone, lack of vitamin B1, lack of glucose, malfunctioning cardiolipin due to PUFA).

​

Agmatine is also interesting because it activates PPAR-α which increases the synthesis of allopregnanolone. Agmatine has been described as a fast-acting anti-depressant similar to ketamine.

Agmatine as a novel candidate for rapid-onset antidepressant response - PMC

Major depressive disorder (MDD) is a disabling and highly prevalent mood disorder as well as a common cause of suicide. Chronic stress, inflammation, and intestinal dysbiosis have all been shown to play crucial roles in the pathophysiology of MDD. ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

​

So considering all that, you might find relief from agmatine, theanine (pro-GABA, anti-stress), Magnolia officinalis extract (pro-GABA, cannabinoid) and several terpenes like limonene, linalool, pinene.

 

[Mycophile]

Lemon oil has psychaoctive mood elevating (aka anti-depressant) effects on it's own. I wouldn't recommend using high doses. If you are going to use it, dilute the essential oil beforehand.
Terpenes offer a range of effects (inc GABA, opioid, serotonin, dopamine) they're popular in the cannabis scene since cannabis terpenes contribute to the overall high and make a strain what it is.

Keeping OT, plant terpenes can synergise and potentiate kratom. Approach them cautiously (diluted, low doses, pure theraputic grade steam-distilled oils). Also be aware they have a history of use in traditional medicine.

Hordenine (phenethylamine-type stimulant) is a temporary reversible MAO-Bi, not an actual inhibitor.


I didn't know you are taking prozac. That is pretty significant and probably explains a lot.

It's likely that prozac is a reason for your tolerance issues and self-medication with kratom. According to a paper I read, the main alkaloid in kratom (mitragynine) activates the dopamine D2 receptor, increases dopamine via opioid activity and blocks a serotonin receptor (5-HT2A) which overall helps to mitigate the effects of SSRIs.

Rephrased - kratoms mitragynine alkaloid can provide relief from the effects of an SSRI. Pure 7-OH won't.

Prozac also works in another way:

Allopregnanolone - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Essentially prozac is used for PMS-related depression because it increases one of the bodies anti-depressant hormones. Using prozac is kind of a roundabout way of treating PMS-related depression since it's simpler to use allopregnanolone (or progesterone) directly.

Well since 2019 pure allopregnanolone is prescribed for the same reason.

Since the body naturally makes all these protective hormones (in mitochondria, see below) the most effective solutionwould be to restore the bodies own production. Many things prevent mitochondria from working properly (eg hypothyroid, lack of cholesterol, lack of T3 thyroid hormone, lack of vitamin B1, lack of glucose, malfunctioning cardiolipin due to PUFA).

​

Agmatine is also interesting because it activates PPAR-α which increases the synthesis of allopregnanolone. Agmatine has been described as a fast-acting anti-depressant similar to ketamine.

Agmatine as a novel candidate for rapid-onset antidepressant response - PMC

Major depressive disorder (MDD) is a disabling and highly prevalent mood disorder as well as a common cause of suicide. Chronic stress, inflammation, and intestinal dysbiosis have all been shown to play crucial roles in the pathophysiology of MDD. ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

​

So considering all that, you might find relief from agmatine, theanine (pro-GABA, anti-stress), Magnolia officinalis extract (pro-GABA, cannabinoid) and several terpenes like limonene, linalool, pinene.

What do you mean that "Kratom can provide relief from the effects of an SSRI"? Cause that makes it sound like you think my prozac is just making me feel bad or something, which I don't think it is. I mean all drugs have side effects, but unfortunately I've been on prozac most of my life since age 14 and will probably be on it for many more years if not my entire life.

I'm also a man, not a woman, so I'm not sure how much your comments here applies, and I can't say I fully understand what you are saying here. Could you please explain this a bit better?


"Using prozac is kind of a roundabout way of treating PMS-related depression since it's simpler to use allopregnanolone (or progesterone) directly.

Well since 2019 pure allopregnanolone is prescribed for the same reason.

Since the body naturally makes all these protective hormones (in mitochondria, see below) the most effective solutionwould be to restore the bodies own production. Many things prevent mitochondria from working properly (eg hypothyroid, lack of cholesterol, lack of T3 thyroid hormone, lack of vitamin B1, lack of glucose, malfunctioning cardiolipin due to PUFA)."


I know I should understand what you are saying here, but I'm in kratom WD so I'm a bit out of it.

I also want to understand how I'd know the right dosage of these plant terpenes and how to dilute them properly cause I have ZERO chemistry experience and now I'm getting a little worried cause I have some coming in the mail.

I mean, can really bad things happen if I take too much, lets say, limonene or linalool? Cause I obviously don't want anything bad to happen, and I don't really know the right dosages of these things, but you seem to think that they can help the kratom work better right? The way you said to use them cautiously has me a bit concerned cause I don't know anything about these things. I will certainly exercise caution IF I'M AWARE OF WHAT A GOOD SAFE DOSE IS AND WHAT ISN'T, but I'm not at the moment. Could you please outline how I'd dilute this stuff to feel better?

Also, do you think the fact that I just started taking rosuvastatin could be changing my body's response to Kratom?

Cause I've recently been experimenting with some new extras and strains, and normally I won't even go into WD for 5 days, but now I'm going into WD after only one day without Kratom, and also I was feeling really bad the other day even ON a large amount of kratom, almost like I was in WD without being in WD.

I mean it's true that my body's response to Kratom has changed over the years, so maybe it isn't the statin. Do you think it's more likely to be the experimentation with new strains or the statin that's changing my reaction or both?

And how often would I have to take Agmatine to feel better and potentiate the Kratom? You said daily right? Would that be hard on my liver or kidneys to take daily with my Klonopin, prozac, statin, and Solefenacin (urinary medication)?

Finally, what would be the number one thing you think I could do or take to get the kratom to start working well again and/or mitigate WD effects and/or side effects?

 

[Allylbenzene]

Apologies for the wording in my last post.

I know you're focusing on kratom tolerance/WD but the best approach is to support your metabolic function using vitamin B1, CoQ10 and glucose (eg carbs, honey, fruit juice).

 

[Mycophile]

Apologies for the wording in my last post.

I know you're focusing on kratom tolerance/WD but the best approach is to support your metabolic function using vitamin B1, CoQ10 and glucose (eg carbs, honey, fruit juice).


What exactly did you order - pure terpenes or plant essential oils?
It's best to dilute them in olive oil beforehand.

• Find a small watertight container. Put 6 tsp (those are small spoons) of olive oil in the container.
• Add one drop of the terpene/essential oil to the container.
• Stir the mixture with something suitable. Stir it properly for at least 1 minute.
• Once you've properly mixed everything together, one drop = a very small dose. You can put one drop on your wrist and rub your wrists together.

Considering all the drugs you are taking, it would be best to start with small doses of Agmatine, around 100mg. Agmatine is something the body produces naturally so it's fairly safe. I've seen agmatine sold in capsules which would make it easier to dose.

Ok, so actually I JUST got 2 of the 4 things I ordered in the mail.

They are:

1) Magnolia (but it also says "Mumazyl" on the box, so I don't know if that's the brand or something else...) Essential Oil. It's 120ML and 4 Fl.oz and says "natural" on it.

It also says on the back (amongst other things) CAUTION: Do not apply directly to the skin, it is recommended to use after dilution" and "for external use only."

So does that mean that I shouldn't drink even the smallest amount if HEAVILY diluted?

And also:

2) Myrrh (it also says "Gumili" which I assume is the brand) Essential Oil 100% pure and natural."

Both are dropper bottles.

When you say a "watertight container," could I just use another dropper bottle, like an empty melatonin dropper bottle?

Of course, they are a bit too small to actually stir, so I guess I'd have to very carefully stir in something else, then maybe use a funnel to get it in the dropper bottle.

Is there any other kind of example of a "watertight container" you'd recommend?

Interesting that it's so effective when put on the skin. I've never in my life noticed any kind of serious mental or emotional drug effect from anything placed on my skin.

Ok, so sounds like I should supplement with C0Q10 for my statin B1 and take no more than 100mgs of Agmatine a day (I'm thinking probably only when trying to get Kratom to work or when in WD and probably not when in one of my sober periods as there's probably no benefit I'm guessing, though maybe there is?) For glucose, I could take any number of things. I could just take a teaspoon or tablespoon of honey.

Do you think taking Agmatine daily could make the difference between Kratom not having a kratom effect and it working really well? Could it lower my tolerance?

Also, do you think that one or both of these oils could really potentiate the Kratom? And do either help with WD?

I'd also like to try one of these essential oils right now, but I'm a bit nervous. Do you really think it's totally fine to do what you suggested with only ONE drop and some olive oil? It just seems funny to me that you have to be SO careful with these oils, and because I'd actually have thought it really didn't require almost any caution or thought, I'm now actually more anxious cause I realize that these things are actually very potent.

I'm also wondering if you think that the shift in my WD symptoms starting to happen earlier again and also even feeling bad sometimes while ON Kratom has more to do with experimentation with new strains, my statin, both or neither.

Thanks.

 

[drewbocop]

Yes, while you're using it. It will very much reduce opioid withdrawal effects (Anxiety, panic, rumination) but it will GREATLY reduce the euphoric and mental effects of kratom/7oh etc. It WILL lower your tolerance. I used it to go from 800mg/day of 7oh to 40mg/day in a few weeks while having a positive mindset. It is a wonderful supplement. I use 1000mg once per day and I choose to use it during my evening dose for the day while tapering 7oh (and to a lesser degree kratom). It put me in a wonderful mindset. In my mind, it is a critical tool to getting off of those two substances. It will, however, blunt the euphoria and stimulant effects of them close to entirely. I'd say 70%. If you want to get clean, it's a godsend. If you're still quietly looking for a buzz, not so much.

 

[Mycophile]

Yes, while you're using it. It will very much reduce opioid withdrawal effects (Anxiety, panic, rumination) but it will GREATLY reduce the euphoric and mental effects of kratom/7oh etc. It WILL lower your tolerance. I used it to go from 800mg/day of 7oh to 40mg/day in a few weeks while having a positive mindset. It is a wonderful supplement. I use 1000mg once per day and I choose to use it during my evening dose for the day while tapering 7oh (and to a lesser degree kratom). It put me in a wonderful mindset. In my mind, it is a critical tool to getting off of those two substances. It will, however, blunt the euphoria and stimulant effects of them close to entirely. I'd say 70%. If you want to get clean, it's a godsend. If you're still quietly looking for a buzz, not so much.

Hmm, well I'm totally looking for a potentiator and not to get clean, especially since I'm on my yearly vacation and just like to enjoy myself. But I've heard so many times that Agmatine is a potentiator. Why would I be hearing that so often if it's not?

I do NOT want blunting of the euphoria. I'm having a hard enough time getting it as it is. You know how it is. I'm constantly trying to chase that dragon and wondering if it's worth feeling bad for days to feel good for other days etc. If I weren't on vacation, I'd be doing A LOT less.

I also get different WD effects. I don't get anxiety (but I take Klonopin so that could be some of it) but I get REALLY tired, sometimes get hypersomnia and other times insomnia, and then if it's bad enough depression and sometimes a runny nose. I know that the Klonopin probably masks a lot of WD symptoms that I'd otherwise get.

Also, have you ever used any of these essential oils like Magnolia or Myrrh to potentiate?

And what, in your opinion, are the strongest actual Kratom potentiators?

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Mixing it with straight kratom leaf dramatically increases the duration and body high for me, and mixing it with carisoprodol amplifies everything about it. I've also mixed a ton of different benzodiazepines with it, flualprazolam worked well with it, bromonordiazepam didn't have a synergy neccessarily but wasn't terrible alongside it. Etizolam when vaped or taken as a sublingual liquid/blotter works really well, but normally orally administered it was tough to line up the timelines, as oral tiz takes a minute to kick in and 7-OH is brief as can be, maybe 3-4 hours at the longest in my experience.

Cannabis/alternative cannabinoids synergize well, as does hydroxyzine, and I haven't tested it yet but I'm sure that promethazine would too.

Valium and Xanax are the best common benzos to mix with. I love benzos and 7oh combo. 7oh gives me wicked anxiety about an hour after taking it and it starts wearing off the Valium chills that out and lasts all day

 

[Kurt Cobain]

In theory, cimetidine could increase (potentiate) the effects of oral 7-hydroxymitragynine by inhibiting its metabolism, but in practice, I doubt it will have any noticeable effects.

Nothing will significantly increase the effects. At least to the extent that I know you are looking for. As mentioned above, taking plain kratom may increase the effects. But 7-hydroxymitragynine raises one tolerance tremendously, so if you are taking say 5 smokeshop sourced Hydroxie brand 15mg 7-hydroxymitragynine -- a total of 75mg of 7-hydroxymitragynine-- then there is nothing that will potentiate it to the extent that I imagine you want. You can take things that have additive effects, like Black Seed oil (get the capsules, they sell it on amazon (i like this brand: https://a.co/d/4vccyUe), which can help increase the duration between doses (i.e., the amount of time before you feel like you need another dose).

But unfortunately there is nothing that will do what I know you're hoping for.

Also, like other partial agonists, I feel like 7-hydroxymitragynine has a ceiling dose (i.e., a high enough dose after which point it doesn't seem to do more). Not sure where that point is exactly, but I feel like it's fairly low, like around 100mg-150mg or so. Doses above, for arguements sake, say, 150mg, do last longer, and cause more side-effects, but they don't really get you higher. And the tolerance builds super fast.

For example, after getting some high strength 7-OH powder (like 80%+ 7-hydroxymitragynine powder) I've taken 150mg-200mg for my first dose and it got me quite high, even nodding a bit, but additional doses begin to fail to produce the same effect, even if they are larger. After using large doses for a day or two, I've taken single doses as large as 500mg, maybe more, which were surprisingly underwhelming and got me less high than that initial 150mg-200mg dose, while causing more side-effects.

In an event, there definitely seems to be a dose above which there is no additional high. And tolerance to the effects grows very fast. The only way to appreciate the effects of 7-OH is to take breaks.

Does black seed oil axruallt work though? I see it mentioned everywhere among other things and nothing really works how some people describe especially the weirdos and kiddos on reddit. Also I believe the ceiling dosage for 7oh is more around the 50-60mg range and I believe it lingers in your system though not active due to the short half life, kinda how bupe stacks up in the system although to a lesser degree

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Hmm, well I'm totally looking for a potentiator and not to get clean, especially since I'm on my yearly vacation and just like to enjoy myself. But I've heard so many times that Agmatine is a potentiator. Why would I be hearing that so often if it's not?

I do NOT want blunting of the euphoria. I'm having a hard enough time getting it as it is. You know how it is. I'm constantly trying to chase that dragon and wondering if it's worth feeling bad for days to feel good for other days etc. If I weren't on vacation, I'd be doing A LOT less.

I also get different WD effects. I don't get anxiety (but I take Klonopin so that could be some of it) but I get REALLY tired, sometimes get hypersomnia and other times insomnia, and then if it's bad enough depression and sometimes a runny nose. I know that the Klonopin probably masks a lot of WD symptoms that I'd otherwise get.

Also, have you ever used any of these essential oils like Magnolia or Myrrh to potentiate?

And what, in your opinion, are the strongest actual Kratom potentiators?

As negrostic stated there's nothing that's gonna get you where you want to be man other than some time off. Even adding a different full agonist wouldn't do much I have no data to back this up other than a collective anecdotal reports but 7 has almost as strong of a binding affinity as subs so taking other shit ontop like say morphine would likely do nothing. That would also explain why suboxone does absolutely jack shit for 7oh withdraw unless you're taking baby doses like 20mg a day or less.

 

[Allylbenzene]

Does black seed oil work though?

One of the most currently well-known alternative drugs that has been extensively studied in the management of opioid dependence and methadone is thymoquinone (TQ), a pharmacologically active compound isolated from Nigella sativa (linn seed) oil.

Thymoquinone: From Nigella sativa to a protective pharmacological compound in managing opioid dependence and amphetamine type stimulant issues - PMC

Opioids, amphetamines, and other types of substances have been widely abused around the world. Opioid dependence and tolerance are two distinct phenomena that have been associated with substance abuse issues. The management of its adverse ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Oh, I was under the impression you were using it daily.

If you are only taking 15-20mg 4 or 5x a month, simply take a little more, or take it with kratom leaf. I wouldn't recommend bending over backwards trying to potentiate it when the doses are so low and so infrequent.

I've been taking it daily since the holidays -- I was using it to get through the holidays (i.e , having to see/be around so many people; my girlfriend is latina so she has a big family with multiple sides to it, which means alot of visits etc.). So I sort of got stuck on 7-OH since the holidays currently taking around 120g/day of 7-OH per day. That is ontop of a kratom and regular mitragynine extract habit (around 300mg/day of mitragynine from the extracts alone).

The fucked up part is that when the holidays began I had JUST gotten off of another 7-OH habit, which I accomplished by mixing 7-OH powder with plain leaf kratom powder, and tapered off.

But yes 7-OH is expensive; I probably spent $10k last year on 7-OH products. But your doses are so low that potentiating them doesn't make sense (nor is it feasible, to a significant degree). Thus, given the infrequent, low dose use, in my mind the answer is to either a) take a little more or b) mix with plain leaf kratom (which is feasible considering your low tolerance) or c) adding black seed oil.

When I first read your post, I pictured you taking daily, moderate doses of 7-OH.

I wouldn't recommend taking more I mean if he's gonna do it he's gonna do it, it won't kill him but I don't quite think he fully understands what he's getting himself into

 

[Deleted member 585202]

Does black seed oil axruallt work though? I see it mentioned everywhere among other things and nothing really works how some people describe especially the weirdos and kiddos on reddit.

BSO is better as a withdrawal aid than a potentiator in my experience, but it does work in that fashion i directly; as an enzyme inhibitor and its also a calcium channel blocker.

BSO also has a decent little anti-depressant effect and is mildly psychoactive on its own. It directly raises serotonin levels (it can also contribute to serotonin syndrome so be cautious). It is a potent enzyme inhibitor.

But as with most non-narcotic "opioid potentiators", the effect for this purpose is modest and nothing to go crazy over. With that said, I find BSO useful enough to keep buying it.

 

[TheLightBringer]

Kind of unrelated question, from using google it seems as if 7-OH is around 13x more potent than morphine. Seems a bit too high for what people are describing no?
I cant see how it would be 13x stronger when non tolerant users report taking 25mg their first time which would be equivalent to 325mg oral morphine and being fine

Theyre probably quoting this study which stated 7-oh is 13 fold more potent than morphine and 46 fold more potent than mitragynine

Evaluation of the rewarding effects of mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitragynine in an intracranial self-stimulation procedure in male and female rats - PMC

Kratom (Mitragyna speciosa Korth.) has been used in Southeast Asia for hundreds of years to increase energy, for relaxation, and to diminish opioid withdrawal. Kratom use has recently spread to Western countries. Kratom could potentially be used for ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

However this was done in guinea pigs and with intracranial administration which will not necessarily translate to the same potency in humans

What are your subjective experiences with 7-OH potency compared to other oral opiates?

 

[Kurt Cobain]

BSO is better as a withdrawal aid than a potentiator in my experience, but it does work in that fashion i directly; as an enzyme inhibitor and its also a calcium channel blocker.

BSO also has a decent little anti-depressant effect and is mildly psychoactive on its own. It directly raises serotonin levels (it can also contribute to serotonin syndrome so be cautious). It is a potent enzyme inhibitor.

But as with most non-narcotic "opioid potentiators", the effect for this purpose is modest and nothing to go crazy over. With that said, I find BSO useful enough to keep buying it.

So basically it'll just potentially give it a little more legs and little less umph like most "potentiators" I've never used it for a withdrawal aid I wonder if it'd help 7oh wds bc subs don't help me at all in that department and im about to go back into 7 withdraw after a short relapse