Misc 7OH Potentiation

[Esperighanto]

congrats spaghetio i trust il be getting an invite to the stag/hen party

Thank you! Most of my homies are in the northeast megalopolis so getting people down here for the celebration will be a bit of a fiasco, I'm considering some ghetto shit like converting a trailer I can hitch to a pickup into a relaxing shack with a bunch of couches and TVs w/movies on external hard drives. Then doing a stop for bathrooms/gas/snacks every 2 hours, I could drive from Maine to Florida doing that in ~45 hours each way.

My fiancee and I drove here in a Nissan Versa stopping for gas ~10 times, covered 1,400 miles in 30 hours. Including the final packing we did before then, I watched the sun set and then rise three times before getting here, lost a headlight, ended up entering sleep psychosis within the last 2 hours of the drive which was pretty scary. The last 45 minutes of the drive there was such intense fog I had less than 15' of visibility with a 60mph speed limit on rural back roads. I'm just glad we got here in one peace hahaha.

I had an amphetamine laced bottle of Gatorade, a 25mg ephedrine tablet, and a bunch of caffeine pills and bupropion IR's on me too.

Thank the gods for stimulants !

 

[daturetard]

Hmm … I have a bunch of hydroxyzine lying around, maybe I’ll give the combo a try

Aye, fyi, Alcohol dehydrogenase is inhibited by hydroxyzine so it makes alcohol much stronger and alcohol poisoning is much easier to achieve.

 

[AngelsandFairiesarereal]

Aye, fyi, Alcohol dehydrogenase is inhibited by hydroxyzine so it makes alcohol much stronger and alcohol poisoning is much easier to achieve.

Aw thank you for letting me know. I don’t drink alcohol though

 

[aftershocknrock]

Thank you! Most of my homies are in the northeast megalopolis so getting people down here for the celebration will be a bit of a fiasco, I'm considering some ghetto shit like converting a trailer I can hitch to a pickup into a relaxing shack with a bunch of couches and TVs w/movies on external hard drives. Then doing a stop for bathrooms/gas/snacks every 2 hours, I could drive from Maine to Florida doing that in ~45 hours each way.

My fiancee and I drove here in a Nissan Versa stopping for gas ~10 times, covered 1,400 miles in 30 hours. Including the final packing we did before then, I watched the sun set and then rise three times before getting here, lost a headlight, ended up entering sleep psychosis within the last 2 hours of the drive which was pretty scary. The last 45 minutes of the drive there was such intense fog I had less than 15' of visibility with a 60mph speed limit on rural back roads. I'm just glad we got here in one peace hahaha.

I had an amphetamine laced bottle of Gatorade, a 25mg ephedrine tablet, and a bunch of caffeine pills and bupropion IR's on me too.

Thank the gods for stimulants !

that sounds hard bro tbh im a very very lazy lacidasical tit snorting walking scene creator so i propose...and bear with me hear i kow you yanks love bear arms i think anyway, come to belfast! fuck your mates just invest everyting in me yaaaaaaaaaaaa do it doooo it!

 

[aftershocknrock]

my mentaly ill twin can oficiate weddings no joke and il steal us a nissan (a skyline no micras or il be so fricken pissed)
i am actualy married to so many random cunts haha they dont believe her cause well noone ever does, right? fuck em whatever that crime is called its fuckin lame, oh no i got mad husbands an wifes but im not mormon im playing nintendo and eatin ass baby

 

[Esperighanto]

my mentaly ill twin can oficiate weddings no joke and il steal us a nissan (a skyline no micras or il be so fricken pissed)
i am actualy married to so many random cunts haha they dont believe her cause well noone ever does, right? fuck em whatever that crime is called its fuckin lame, oh no i got mad husbands an wifes but im not mormon im playing nintendo and eatin ass baby

I just laughed my ass off, this combination of words is something I never even pondered. You in Galway Ireland? Three of my grandparents are from county Cork but my mother's father's Romani and I'm always worried to be caught in Eastern Europe because of it hahaha.

 

[aftershocknrock]

I just laughed my ass off, this combination of words is something I never even pondered. You in Galway Ireland? Three of my grandparents are from county Cork but my mother's father's Romani and I'm always worried to be caught in Eastern Europe because of it hahaha.

thats how you end up married to a fucken looper like me people always laugh as if my sis is uncapable of having any qualification actually it is pretty funny she can marry us but just cant ever ever do the cunting dishes ffs well she half greek so they cant be trusted with plates the mad bastards.
nah bro im in the occupied counties up north but all my yanky doodle doolalys enter dublin an cross the border il pick you up but im on bail so no gettin caught cause il throw you under so many busses but no harm i still wana paarty with you and mayby marry you dependig how fucked i am...fuck it i cant cap im defo lockin you down....but not in a creepy way...mayby a kinky way tho

i only fuck with travelers an gypsies bro, they are fuckin animals like absolute savage fighters an if you fuck wi one youl have 20 cunts with sawn off shottys at yer door but they are loyal an they can still have a scrap then shake hands after (if the lads alive)

 

[negrogesic]

I dont use it daily, just 15-20mg when needed. maybe 4 or 5 times a month.

Oh, I was under the impression you were using it daily.

If you are only taking 15-20mg 4 or 5x a month, simply take a little more, or take it with kratom leaf. I wouldn't recommend bending over backwards trying to potentiate it when the doses are so low and so infrequent.

I've been taking it daily since the holidays -- I was using it to get through the holidays (i.e , having to see/be around so many people; my girlfriend is latina so she has a big family with multiple sides to it, which means alot of visits etc.). So I sort of got stuck on 7-OH since the holidays currently taking around 120g/day of 7-OH per day. That is ontop of a kratom and regular mitragynine extract habit (around 300mg/day of mitragynine from the extracts alone).

The fucked up part is that when the holidays began I had JUST gotten off of another 7-OH habit, which I accomplished by mixing 7-OH powder with plain leaf kratom powder, and tapered off.

But yes 7-OH is expensive; I probably spent $10k last year on 7-OH products. But your doses are so low that potentiating them doesn't make sense (nor is it feasible, to a significant degree). Thus, given the infrequent, low dose use, in my mind the answer is to either a) take a little more or b) mix with plain leaf kratom (which is feasible considering your low tolerance) or c) adding black seed oil.

When I first read your post, I pictured you taking daily, moderate doses of 7-OH.

 

[red22]

I don’t drink alcohol though

Pathetic excuse for a drug, eh?

 

[Esperighanto]

thats how you end up married to a fucken looper like me people always laugh as if my sis is uncapable of having any qualification actually it is pretty funny she can marry us but just cant ever ever do the cunting dishes ffs well she half greek so they cant be trusted with plates the mad bastards.
nah bro im in the occupied counties up north but all my yanky doodle doolalys enter dublin an cross the border il pick you up but im on bail so no gettin caught cause il throw you under so many busses but no harm i still wana paarty with you and mayby marry you dependig how fucked i am...fuck it i cant cap im defo lockin you down....but not in a creepy way...mayby a kinky way tho

i only fuck with travelers an gypsies bro, they are fuckin animals like absolute savage fighters an if you fuck wi one youl have 20 cunts with sawn off shottys at yer door but they are loyal an they can still have a scrap then shake hands after (if the lads alive)

You sound like a funny ass guy, if I find myself in Ireland sometime I'll definitely hit you up man. The thing about the Romani rolling deep is for real, where I am in Florida right now there's a similar phenomenon, I bought my first car (interestingly enough, also a Nissan) by arriving with a couple cars full of us and the poor car salesman profited like $200 USD on a $5000 sale because we were shaking his ass down like never before.

I've always felt like the Irish and Romani click in a cultural way that your comments here have certainly reaffirmed to me haha

 

[aftershocknrock]

we are talking about 7-OH seven old hores rite? i spent sooooo much on bangin old dirt burds

 

[Esperighanto]

I'm very shocked we aren't seeing 7-OH kill yet, I suspect there's some sort of metabolic ceiling effect? I've seen others allude to this, but there's not a ton of peer reviewed research I've seen done in it yet.

Subjectively I found intranasal 7-OH to be more potent and faster acting than when it was orally administered, I've yet to try vaping it and honestly might never.

 

[red22]

ive dabbed a 60%+ extract and it definitely worked. tasted god awful but it worked

daddyfatknuckles, Nov 24, 2023, reddit

 

[negrogesic]

I'm very shocked we aren't seeing 7-OH kill yet, I suspect there's some sort of metabolic ceiling effect? I've seen others allude to this, but there's not a ton of peer reviewed research I've seen done in it yet.

It has nothing to do with some sort of "metabolic ceiling" (which refers to a limit on how much or how quickly a substance can be metabolized and cleared). 7-hydroxymitragynine is a partial agonist of the MOR, and there is a large amount of peer reviewed research that characterizes 7-hydroxymitragynine as such. This means that it produces a submaximal response (incomplete receptor activation) even at very high concentration.

So given that 7-hydroxymitragynine is a partial agonist, why would one be, "very shocked we aren't seeing 7-OH kill yet"? The wording of your comment suggests that you're apprised of research in this realm ("there's not a ton of peer reviewed research I've seen done in it yet"), when in fact there a boatload of research to this effect. Meanwhile you spread an alarmist hypothesis that 7-OH can kill (i.e., you are "very shocked we aren't seeing 7-OH kill") which to a lay person might seem like a valid one since you purport to be up-to-date on the research. Then you propose that the reason might be metabolic, when the actual reason has to do with pharmacodynamics (which is well established). Don't play the role here of someone who is scientifically-minded and well-informed if that isn't the case. We take misinformation very seriously here, and I'll start deleting your posts if you continue making bogus assertions. Misinformation is a poison and spreads like a disease. Someone reads something from a guy who seems like he knows what he's talking about, and then repeats it somewhere, which is the repeated again somewhere else.

7-hydroxymitragynine, as a partial agonist, is unlikely to produce overdose deaths because it cannot fully activate the MOR (just like it's uncommon for buprenorphine to cause overdose death). Nothing to do with metabolism, and there is plenty of research on the subject. No in vivo research in humans is needed to affirm this, and it is by no means shocking that, "we aren't seeing 7-OH kill yet".

 

[daturetard]

Aw thank you for letting me know. I don’t drink alcohol though

Very wise. I was kind of looking for a mention of hydroxyzine here to bring that up since I found it out. Only drug I know of to inhibit it. Or at least, the only specifically mentioned one on the alcohol dehydogenase wiki.

Pathetic excuse for a drug, eh?

Truly the most foul and least pleasant drug aside from tobacco. I don't even feel good from it. It just makes me cry if I'm not on like 10 other drugs.

 

[Esperighanto]

I'm not very knowledgeable about mu opioid agonists in general, nor the profoundly complicated realm of kratom alkaloids which seem to span into playing with adrenergic and NMDA receptors as well in ways I don't understand. I want to make it very clear that I'm well researched almost exclusively on cannabinoids and serotonergics, not mu opioids, and only somewhat on kappa selective opioids (salvinorin A, symmetry, etc).

7-hydroxymitragynine, as a partial agonist, is unlikely to produce overdose deaths because it cannot fully activate the MOR (just like it's uncommon for buprenorphine to cause overdose death). Nothing to do with metabolism, and there is plenty of research on the subject.

I appreciate the information here! It's given me the direction to go off of with further researching this, my apologies if I was too ambiguous about which areas I've read in and which I haven't earlier. Are there any chemists whose literature you'd recommend I parse through, or textbooks/writings on the subject of mu opioid agonists? Recently they've become more interesting to me as a result of 7-OH, mitragynine, pseudoindoxyl mitragynine and tapentadol, but when you compare the ~3 chemical scaffolds of psychedelics to the seemingly infinite scaffolds of mu opioid agonists, it's difficult to find a solid starting point.

 

[negrogesic]

I'm not very knowledgeable about mu opioid agonists in general, nor the profoundly complicated realm of kratom alkaloids which seem to span into playing with adrenergic and NMDA receptors as well in ways I don't understand. I want to make it very clear that I'm well researched almost exclusively on cannabinoids and serotonergics, not mu opioids, and only somewhat on kappa selective opioids (salvinorin A, symmetry, etc).

I appreciate the information here! It's given me the direction to go off of with further researching this, my apologies if I was too ambiguous about which areas I've read in and which I haven't earlier. Are there any chemists whose literature you'd recommend I parse through, or textbooks/writings on the subject of mu opioid agonists? Recently they've become more interesting to me as a result of 7-OH, mitragynine, pseudoindoxyl mitragynine and tapentadol, but when you compare the ~3 chemical scaffolds of psychedelics to the seemingly infinite scaffolds of mu opioid agonists, it's difficult to find a solid starting point.

It's fine, I’m generally very laid back and non-disciplinarian; I’m just uniquely sensitive when it comes to the risk of misinformation since I’ve found that ideas can spread like wildfires and opinions stated on here can become perceived as fact. Then suddenly, in some alarmist news article on 7-hydroxymitragynine, a writer, having "done their research" describes it as "the next deadly ticking time bomb of the opioid crisis", etc. This sort of concept gets substances banned, and when in the future some street fentanyl addict is looking good for an OTC substance to help then get off, substances like 7-OH aren't available. Not like one comment gets something banned, but its all cumulative, a nail in the coffin so to speak.

That’s why we need to be careful about what we say here, particularly when it comes to describing fairly innocuous things as potentially deadly. The risk is heightened when it appears as though the reader is credible (e.g., “I’ve reviewed the literature and I’m surprised we aren’t seeing more deaths,” etc.). Of course the opposite is even worse: describing deadly things as innocuous, but that is pretty rare, and when it happens we crack down on it quickly. I like to think of bluelight as a beacon of light/truth, so I moderate with that in mind -- knowing that many people will randomly read these threads over time, potentially well into the future, and possibly consider what they read here as fact (even repeating what they've read to others). So that's why I'm touchy on the subject -- I want this place to be a lighthouse among the darkness, where fact and fiction are clearly delineated.

As far as literature about the MOR, alot of it is beyond paywalls, but there are simple primers like this:

https://www.painphysicianjournal.com/current/pdf?article=OTg3&journal=42

 

[red22]

MAOIs are a good example of that.


...there is a great deal of misinformation and mythology about their dietary and drug interactions.

Practical guide for prescribing MAOIs: debunking myths and removing barriers. 2012. Grady MM, Stahl SM. CNS Spectrums. 17(1):2-10. doi:10.1017/S109285291200003X

These hurdles cause doctors to shy away from using MAOIs, but they are largely illusory. The two most prominent seem to be (1) the misperception that there are frequent drug interactions and (2) that there is a major risk of ingesting excessive tyramine (Tyr). Neither hurdle is complex nor difficult to overcome if the latest scientific evidence is considered.

“Much ado about nothing”: monoamine oxidase inhibitors, drug interactions, and dietary tyramine. 2017. Ken Gillman, MD. CNS Spectrums. 22(5):385-387. doi:10.1017/S1092852916000651 (Introduction)

It is, unfortunately, necessary to state clearly from the beginning that much of what is published by doctors in books and journals about MAOIs is either poorly informed, or just plain wrong. As an example, much of the information that comes with MAOIs (the PI, or product information sheet) contains inaccurate material concerning, among other things: serotonin toxicity, drug interactions generally, and dietary tyramine.

MAOIs (Parnate, Nardil): Misconceptions and Questions No. 1. Ken Gillman, MD. PsychoTropical Research. Nov. 14, 2012

 

[red22]

Not sourcing, but I didn’t even think soma was around anymore.

Maybe that's a blessing. That stuff caused me really bad memory impairment and dis-coordination. I fell down at the doctor's office and the next time I went they presented me with a wheelchair and I didn't know why cuz I didn't even remember it. I also fell in the shower and still have scars from it.

 

[Didgital]

I'm very shocked we aren't seeing 7-OH kill yet, I suspect there's some sort of metabolic ceiling effect? I've seen others allude to this, but there's not a ton of peer reviewed research I've seen done in it yet.

Subjectively I found intranasal 7-OH to be more potent and faster acting than when it was orally administered, I've yet to try vaping it and honestly might never.

I have been told of someone knowingly taking 500mg orally and being fine, granted the person had a tolerance.

As far as intranasal that surprises me because it's almost aways a freebase so I wouldn't think absorption would be the best.

I can attest that smoking/vaping does work. I do not recommend it. It's kind of addictive.

I also notice that 7-OH by itself strongly potentiates alcohol for me.