• Current Events & Politics
    Welcome Guest
    Please read before posting:
    Forum Guidelines Bluelight Rules
  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: tryptakid | Foreigner

2017 Trump Presidency Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
Ryan01 said:
Bolsheviks were arguably worse than Nazi Germany. Just the amount of people they starved to death is more than the holocaust. Oh and I never defended Goebbels, I posted a quote of his regarding propaganda.
Click to expand...

Source on that? Also do you count every person that dies from starvation and inadequate healthcare in a capitalist society as dying because of capitalism?
 
noone1 said:
Source on that? Also do you count every person that dies from starvation and inadequate healthcare in a capitalist society as dying because of capitalism?
Click to expand...

Traditionally, Stalin has been considered the more murderous of the two dictators, and that wasn't really controversial. Some of Stalin's purges and famines were state-managed genocide (directed at specific races and classes).

Nowadays, with better access to Eastern European and ex-Soviet archives, we believe Hitler probably killed a few million more than Stalin. Regardless, discussing which is the worse butcher misses the point - they were both fucking psychopathic mad men. And trying to squeeze them into the lens of left-or right wing is also absurd since few think Soviet Russia or the Bolsheviks were 'communist' - in the same way nobody believes the German Democratic Republic was democratic.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/03/10/hitler-vs-stalin-who-killed-more/
 
Indeed, they were democratic and at some point the majority liked Hittler. Years before the war itself.
Interesting article about these two butchers.
 
Erikmen said:
Indeed, they were democratic and at some point the majority liked Hitler.
Click to expand...

Hitler never got the majority in any election.

I'd consider Hitler to be worse, since he actively engaged in genocide and he had an expansionist drive which destabilized Europe. Stalin just didn't seem to really care if his policies ended up wiping out a bunch of people.
 
Hitler himself had 36,8% of the popular vote, imagine that when you have the Nazi Party as the largest party in Germany who controlled the majority of its seats. That was enough to get him appointed as Chancellor of Germany in January, 1933.
 
Last edited:
Erikmen said:
Hitler himself had 36,8% of the popular vote, imagine that when you have the Nazi Party as the largest party in Germany who controlled the majority of its seats. That was enough to get him appointed as Chancellor of Germany in January, 1933.
Click to expand...

Did they control a majority of the seats? Or a plurality of the seats?

I thought the mechanism behind Hitler's rise to power was to become a major political party, although one without a majority, and then leverage their power through a coalition of those stupid enough to believe that Hitler could be controlled, which ended up with Hitler controlling others and becoming dictator.
 
I meant they were the largest party and they controlled the Parliament but I think you understood that.

There are a lot of toughts, theories about Hitler and there's history often taught in different ways, not to mention what the famiies passed to us. But here in this thread I'm going back to listen to what people think about Trump.
Take care.
 
Last edited:
CFC said:
Traditionally, Stalin has been considered the more murderous of the two dictators, and that wasn't really controversial. Some of Stalin's purges and famines were state-managed genocide (directed at specific races and classes).

Nowadays, with better access to Eastern European and ex-Soviet archives, we believe Hitler probably killed a few million more than Stalin. Regardless, discussing which is the worse butcher misses the point - they were both fucking psychopathic mad men. And trying to squeeze them into the lens of left-or right wing is also absurd since few think Soviet Russia or the Bolsheviks were 'communist' - in the same way nobody believes the German Democratic Republic was democratic.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/03/10/hitler-vs-stalin-who-killed-more/
Click to expand...

Yes I'm only needling the people who have grown up in capitalism who go "yes socialism will work THIS TIME IF WE DO IT JUSSSST RIGHT HAHAHA"

The negatives of capitalism get completely glossed over because it has been the the ruling system since forever. History is written by the winners. Canada, the Scandinavian countries, FDR's policies etc get completely glossed over.

You could say the same about Laissez faire economy as communism. Every time we deregulate the market millions suffer but it never gets tallied anywhere as it does with socialist policies because the capitalists are in charge and have a conspiracy to make sure the system doesn't change.
 
noone1 said:
The negatives of capitalism get completely glossed over because it has been the the ruling system since forever. History is written by the winners. Canada, the Scandinavian countries, FDR's policies etc get completely glossed over.

You could say the same about Laissez faire economy as communism. Every time we deregulate the market millions suffer but it never gets tallied anywhere as it does with socialist policies because the capitalists are in charge and have a conspiracy to make sure the system doesn't change.
Click to expand...

I don't entirely agree that the benefits of regulated market economics is overlooked. But obviously the people who own most of the capital possess the greatest direct (businesses/jobs/salaries etc) and indirect (marketing/media/brainwashing etc) means to promote their interests above yours and mine. Sometimes they go too far and we kill or overthrow them; most of the time we engage in unbalanced compromises that give them the lion's share of the monetary output of our labour. Nevertheless, the system could be changed at any time.
 
I really hope the system changes fast. :\
I guess in some ways things are pretty much the same in most places. Even in Scandinavian countries there's always these people trying to get their interests first, or going around the system.
 
Most people are - to a greater or lesser extent - selfish, and so will happily take decisions that harm your interests in their favour. Unless you resist them, fight them, or pass laws to regulate or control them. Democracy has generally allowed opposing interest groups to compete and balance each other out without resorting to dramatic revolutions, unrest, or social crisis. But if one grows too strong, it unbalances the system. Ultimately that needs to be corrected, somehow or other.
 
Actual headline: "35 of 37 economists said Trump was wrong. The other two misread the question."

President Trump's administration says his tax cut will pay for itself. It turns out it's really hard to find an economist who agrees.

The University of Chicago's Booth School of Business regularly polls economists on controversial questions. In a survey the school published last week on Trump's tax plans, only two out of the 37 economists that responded said that the cuts would stimulate the economy enough to cancel out the effect on total tax revenue.

Those two economists now both say they made a mistake, and that they misunderstood the question.
Click to expand...
 
yep.

this is the same jeff sessions who recused himself ("I have decided to recuse myself from any existing or future investigations of any matters related in any way to the campaigns for President of the United States") who's now recommended to the president that he fire the fbi director who's investigating him.

this is richard nixon level b.s.

alasdair
 
It's way beyond Nixon level of wrong. There's no way Nixon would have openly done what Trump has been doing. This is more latin american dictatorship level.
 
There's no dictatorship in Latin America, except maybe for Venezuela. But their People are fighting hard against it, with the help of neighboring countries.

In Brazil people have expelled/impeached two presidents already - democratically. And Venezuela is soon out of 'Mercosur' if the Government keeps screwing up.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top