⫸Trans and LGBTQIA+ Discussion⫷

[Las Veghost grower]

[citation needed]
I'm not a male, but don't need to be one to understand this isn't how puberty works.
So using the outlier here, they don't lose 2 years. They just take longer to develop. Same concept as delayed puberty.

I don’t think your understanding what I’m saying…cause ultimately there would be no way to know if the outliers puberty ran it’s normal course or they lost 2 years of puberty…unless a study was done on identical twins where one took blockers and the other didn’t, but even then the “science” would be iffy at best

 

[Las Veghost grower]

Or how about this, this is easier to understand…..as previously mentioned let’s say a kid starts blockers at 9, never starts puberty and stays on blockers till they are 25, when they stop at 25 is their body gonna assume they are still 9 and start puberty and run it’s course and end at 30, OR, is that person shit out of luck and doomed to be a freak for the rest of their life…Jeewiz my common sense is tingling

 

[Droppersneck]

Or how about this, this is easier to understand…..as previously mentioned let’s say a kid starts blockers at 9, never starts puberty and stays on blockers till they are 25, when they stop at 25 is their body gonna assume they are still 9 and start puberty and run it’s course and end at 30, OR, is that person shit out of luck and doomed to be a freak for the rest of their life…Jeewiz my common sense is tingling

I think they are saying that they come off the blockers after a few years and the dr figures out what hormone plan to sell them. The social contagion aspect of this coupled with it being a huge issue for the over socialized, means no meaningful discussion will ever be had. I do feel compassion for the individuals who feel this way though.

 

[Las Veghost grower]

I think they are saying that they come off the blockers after a few years and the dr figures out what hormone plan to sell them. The social contagion aspect of this coupled with it being a huge issue for the over socialized, means no meaningful discussion will ever be had. I do feel compassion for the individuals who feel this way though.

so you don’t just start puberty and it runs it’s normal course after stopping the blockers , you then have to be on a supplemented puberty…yea that will work out great for most people, unless you have a shitty dr. Then I guess good luck

 

[Droppersneck]

so you don’t just start puberty and it runs it’s normal course after stopping the blockers , you then have to be on a supplemented puberty…yea that will work out great for most people, unless you have a shitty dr. Then I guess good luck

I don’t think it would just start back up in any sort of normal sense. Your body would just all of a sudden get higher levels of these hormones, but out of sequence. Who knows what the health consequences are. Probably pretty brutal. The ones I’ve read about from all of these detransitioners are pretty nightmarish.

 

[JGrimez]

you lied about leaving bluelight forever. so every single post you post confirms you are a liar.

alasdair

I don't see how this makes any sense. You're just looking for a way to dismiss political arguments.

i literally have not once said that i have, as i've said... i don't know enough about it.

Yet you're very outspoken on the issue. I guess it's easy to support "the current thing" but then when someone quizzes you on it and you realize it's actually pretty fucked up, you can just say you don't understand it.

 

[THECATINTHEHAT]

I probably didn't make it clear enough in my post, I believe no one is kept on puberty blockers longer than a couple to a few years.
However yes, the effects are generally reversible, and is agreed upon by most medical literature. Nobody has been kept on it longer than 2-3 years in my knowledge. There are risks, and that was not denied. I believe I've added adequate citations for this as well. The article you've supplied me here is a surgery done, I don't believe this has any relevancy to the question I was answering. Yes, these drugs are used in chemical castration, which is too generally reversible, it's a scary word. But the luprons own FDA approval states that. If I'm missing something here, I'd love to be corrected.
When testosterone is suppressed, libido goes down, as with sperm production in men. When you cease, it returns.



In regards of conversion therapy you bring up here - it's been backed scientifically there is no benefit, that it is damaging to an individual and is quite traumatic for many. There is nothing out there that supports otherwise. There is no benefit to it.
Maybe that is why one state in australia outlawed it?

Pretty sure conversion therapy is banned in the uk now also?

 

[nepalnt21]

Yet you're very outspoken on the issue.

ha! another one of your stupid lies. i've deliberately been quite quiet on the issue, in fact.

I guess it's easy to support "the current thing"

find me a quote of mine where i said i supported or condemned it... you won't, so please stfu. you actually are foreigner, aren't you?

you can just say you don't understand it.

cause i'm not a chronic liar, like you? sometimes the right answer is "i dunno". deal with it. go bother someone else.

 

[JGrimez]

You're just being lazy. Do some fucking research instead of crying when people call out your nonsense.

 

[burn out]

Haven't read the whole thread but I read through the initial post and agreed with pretty much everything except this

I also don't agree that this is exactly the same as refusing to be with someone based on their race. If you are not physically attracted to someone then you're not physically attracted to someone, but if you specifically have ruled out an entire ethnicity then that is racist because people come in all kinds of configurations within an ethnicity.

The two statements I bolded are in direct conflict. While it's true that people come in a variety of configurations within an ethnicity it's not an infinite set and can easily still fall outside the set of what someone finds physically attractive. For example I am not attracted to black women. That doesn't mean I think all black women are the same but none the less all black women I have thus encountered have in common the fact that they lack the features of the European women I am attracted to. For example, there are no fair skinned blue eyed blonde black women with long silky straight hair and European facial features and that is the type of woman I tend to find physically attractive.

So how is that fundamentally different from what you're saying? I can't really control what I find physically attractive and even if I could to some degree I don't see why I should be under any obligation to do so. What's wrong with finding women from your own race to be most attractive? I think it's natural actually and it's something the majority of the world's people seem to share.

Granted you didn't actually say there was anything wrong with it, you said it was "racist" and I am assuming you think there is something wrong because that word tends to have very negative connotations but maybe you should be clear on what exactly you mean by "racist".

 

[Juniper Bruhmomentius]

While the TBK wear women clothes its cringe but when I do it its BASED!

 

[Jabberwocky]

There's already a detransition movement starting. Your comparison is flawed. Knee surgery is a necessary procedure especially if walking is affected. There's nothing necessary about immediately granting transition to a child.

What detrasition movement? Link? I'm active on reddit where trans issues flourish and have seen no such thing.

Yes, there are some noteworthy cases of people who regretted transitioning later as adults, but they're quite isolated and I am not aware of any such movement.

I agree it is a very flawed comparison, dysfunction & acute physical pain is also different from dysphoria, and people generally do not make the elective decision to get knee surgery at 15 either... but saying there is an anti-trans movement made of trans people is nonsense as far as I'm aware. Sounds like conservative fantasy to me.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Haven't read the whole thread but I read through the initial post and agreed with pretty much everything except this



The two statements I bolded are in direct conflict. While it's true that people come in a variety of configurations within an ethnicity it's not an infinite set and can easily still fall outside the set of what someone finds physically attractive. For example I am not attracted to black women. That doesn't mean I think all black women are the same but none the less all black women I have thus encountered have in common the fact that they lack the features of the European women I am attracted to. For example, there are no fair skinned blue eyed blonde black women with long silky straight hair and European facial features and that is the type of woman I tend to find physically attractive.

So how is that fundamentally different from what you're saying? I can't really control what I find physically attractive and even if I could to some degree I don't see why I should be under any obligation to do so. What's wrong with finding women from your own race to be most attractive? I think it's natural actually and it's something the majority of the world's people seem to share.

Granted you didn't actually say there was anything wrong with it, you said it was "racist" and I am assuming you think there is something wrong because that word tends to have very negative connotations but maybe you should be clear on what exactly you mean by "racist".

Yes, that's a big gripe for me as well. The idea of bigotry has been weaponized by the left. They confuse preference with hatred (transphobia, bigotry, racism, etc).

The word transphobia gets tossed around way too lightly and arbitrarily.

I have no problem with trans people, I support them on almost everything, I give them their due respect... but I would never date one for any reason even if I found them objectively attractive.

I don't even need to explain why not, because it doesn't fucking matter. I like the color green, nobody asks me WHY I like green and not purple. Because it doesn't even matter and ultimately none of their business.

If I were to sum up my criticism of trans people it would be that they expect their life choices and expectations, which go against established normality, to be immune from criticism. Sorry, life doesn't work that way.

Things or people that go against established norms are subject to harsh opinions. That's math, not hatred.

I might as well call anyone who judges me for being an alcoholic a hateful bigot. I was born this way (?). You don't want to date me or hang out because I drink alcohol? Is that hateful? No.

I've had many male gay friends in my life. I've been hit on from them many times. I've never been called homophobic for saying no, sorry, I'm straight.

As I've said before, I think the trans movement could learn a thing or two from LGB people and their successful movement in the 80s/90s. Seek legal equality, not social equality. Find your own space socially. I think gay people pulled that off gracefully.

Ultimately, I think the trans movement has some growing pains to deal with, both figuratively and literally.

 

[Las Veghost grower]

I don’t think it would just start back up in any sort of normal sense. Your body would just all of a sudden get higher levels of these hormones, but out of sequence. Who knows what the health consequences are. Probably pretty brutal. The ones I’ve read about from all of these detransitioners are pretty nightmarish.

Right, but they try to make it sound like you just stop the blockers then everything goes back to normal , when that’s clearly not the case you would have to be put on a hormone maintenance program, shits crazy to me how any parent would sign off on this shit

 

[Foreigner]

You're just being lazy. Do some fucking research instead of crying when people call out your nonsense.

I seriously would just not engage with this individual. Nothing good can come of it.

 

[Foreigner]

Lupron is used to chemically castrate sexual predators. Calling them puberty blockers is an off-brand use of them and is disingenuous.

When you block a child's puberty, you are depriving them of major physical developmental milestones, and psychological ones as well.

Even if that child is then put on opposite sex hormones, it's not going to be a one-to-one relationship equivalent to what their natural hormones would be. Synthetic hormones do not behave the same way as natural ones. Anyone who does HRT in the fitness world can tell you that.

People like to poo poo lack of bone density development but what's going to happen when you are in your late 30s and you break your hip doing normal life activities?

These drugs are dangerous and they are prescribing them without any long-term studies on the harms and benefits. It's basically unscientific.

There have already been many undercover documentaries showing how easy it is to get a gender dysphoria diagnosis and the drugs you want. They are practically giving them out like candy.

The world endocrinology association has banned puberty blockers and most forms of gender reassignment for children. The only country that is not on board is the United States. The US is pretty much off the grid at this point.

 

[Droppersneck]

Lupron is used to chemically castrate sexual predators. Calling them puberty blockers is an off-brand use of them and is disingenuous.

When you block a child's puberty, you are depriving them of major physical developmental milestones, and psychological ones as well.

Even if that child is then put on opposite sex hormones, it's not going to be a one-to-one relationship equivalent to what their natural hormones would be. Synthetic hormones do not behave the same way as natural ones. Anyone who does HRT in the fitness world can tell you that.

People like to poo poo lack of bone density development but what's going to happen when you are in your late 30s and you break your hip doing normal life activities?

These drugs are dangerous and they are prescribing them without any long-term studies on the harms and benefits. It's basically unscientific.

There have already been many undercover documentaries showing how easy it is to get a gender dysphoria diagnosis and the drugs you want. They are practically giving them out like candy.

The world endocrinology association has banned puberty blockers and most forms of gender reassignment for children. The only country that is not on board is the United States. The US is pretty much off the grid at this point.

Watch for the hit pieces about the world endocrinology’s association. They will try and discredit them, it’s the same playbook over and over.

 

[Foreigner]

Watch for the hit pieces about the world endocrinology’s association. They will try and discredit them, it’s the same playbook over and over.

Medical science in the US is becoming less and less credible. It's hard to believe results when they are all bought.

 

[Las Veghost grower]

Science in the US is actually “science”

 

[Droppersneck]

Medical science in the US is becoming less and less credible. It's hard to believe results when they are all bought.

Total agency capture happened over the past few decades. I don’t trust any of them, and don’t know what it would take for me to ever trust them again. Virtually everything has been infiltrated and subverted.