Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

[ThePharmicist]

Quick question! I just made a solution of bacteriostatic water and subxone. That's cool right? I can shoot bateriostatic water WITH suboxone, but you just can't shoot bacteriostatic water ALONE correct?

Help quick

 

[needlejuice]

I might smoke. We'll see. I'm taking the 16mg sublingually but have only been doing so for less than a week. When I take it I don't feel anything. It just keeps me from being sick. If I continue to take the 16mg sublingually for another week or two you would still only recommend banging 1-2mg when I decide to go there??? I would think that I'd have a tolerance and that 1-2mg wouldn't do much.

I'm just trying to get really faded a few times. If I were to bang 8-10mg would I get pretty faded, do you think that would be overkill, or would I need more? I've banged a variety of chems and narcotics but never brand name subutex. This is why I'm asking. Also, once crushed and added to water is it going to gum up and frustrate me or does it break down pretty well?

yea i thought the same thing when i started iv'ing subs. i was doing 16mg subling. but u really cant bang more than 2mg. i used to do 4mg, but it is just a waste because the lower u go with banging the better the high as u get adjusted to ur dose. (if u want to get high off ur subs just cut ur dose down for a week and u wont feel any high and might feel kinda crappy for that week, but after that u are able to get more effect from the medicine)

yes name brand subutex dissolves very easily in water. just add cold water, and filter it good if ur not using a micron

 

[Znegative]

I agree with needle juice. I too thought hey, if 1 mg I.V. feels good, I'll get rocked on 8 mg. It's not true though, it just fucks up your tolerance, and then you have to start tapering over again. I now shoot no more .5 mg at a time, and I've been trying to stick with .1 to .25.

One thing I wanted to ask. I am unable to get a micron filter (unless I can find a needle exchange in NY that supplies them). I use a cotton, but I filter them a minimum of five times each, and ideally ten times. I find that by the end of this process, I have lost close to half the solution that I originally drew up. So my question is, am I losing loads of the bupe, or mostly just the crappy binders?

 

[Lando138]

While we don't really do drug testing questions, the idea behind drug tests is that they're inherently flawed. I wouldn't be surprised if you tested positive for drugs that you did not take, or tested negative for drugs you did take.

My bad. The question wasn't really a drug testing question it was more a question of why does bupe stay in your system so long. Not sure how else to word it really. But thats a good point CH and like somebody else said its most likely the long half life.

One more thing. Can lowering your bupe dose significantly (jumping from 8 to 2mg's) cause mild-moderate pains? I don't recall hearing this as a withdrawal symptom but i strained my back a month ago and it seems worse since i lowered my dose. And i haven't experienced any of the typical withdrawal symptoms, in fact i've been feeling better not taking so much of that crap, besides the pain of course.

 

[needlejuice]

I agree with needle juice. I too thought hey, if 1 mg I.V. feels good, I'll get rocked on 8 mg. It's not true though, it just fucks up your tolerance, and then you have to start tapering over again. I now shoot no more .5 mg at a time, and I've been trying to stick with .1 to .25.

One thing I wanted to ask. I am unable to get a micron filter (unless I can find a needle exchange in NY that supplies them). I use a cotton, but I filter them a minimum of five times each, and ideally ten times. I find that by the end of this process, I have lost close to half the solution that I originally drew up. So my question is, am I losing loads of the bupe, or mostly just the crappy binders?

there is no need to use that many filters, ur gonna waste a lot doing that. ive been using my cottons lately becuz i ran out of bupe and can safely say for every unit lost to the original cotton, that is amount of bupe leftover. i filter once with a regular cotton and then cut out 10 little circles of coffee filter the same size as the circumference of the needle barrell, then i stuff these filters in another syringe and shoot the original solution thru that and it alwasy comes back clear, and u only are gonna lose about 10-20 units and it will prob be filtered way better and youl be wasting less than ur 5 seperate cottons

 

[Mandatory17]

Hey everyone, I have a friend who is having some issues with starting Suboxone and I was hoping to get some advice if possible. The unfortunate thing is that she is 2 hours away from me-meaning that I'm hoping she's telling me the 100% truth, but that's really all I have to go on for now since I've only talked to her on the phone multiple times over the last 2 days.

okay so, she was taking 400 mgs of morphine (timed release) daily, with 10-20 norcos on the days that those were available to her. From what I know, she stopped the Morphine on Monday, I'm assuming Monday morning sometimes. Then Tuesday she went to see the Sub. doctor, he prescribed her up to 2 1/2 8mg subs, if she needed that much. She went home that day, still wasn't sick because the timed release morphine was still hanging around from Monday. As far as I know, she took nothing on Tuesday. Then yesterday she went to fill the sub script, in the afternoon, say 2pm, she took 1 1/2 and called me immediately and said that all of her hair on her body was literally sticking straight up, she was having horrible stomach pains, etc etc. This sounded to me like precipitated withdrawal? So she went home & popped 10 norcos at about 4pm yesterday afternoon, I guess she thought that would stop the pre-w/d if that's what she was feeling. Evidently either those or the sub stopped her from feeling the precipitated w/d, because she then sounded FINE on the phone with me. I told her to PLEASE try and not take anything else, then wake up today and try to take the sub again (it would've been about 18 hours since Norco, and I know the usual wait time is about 24 hours, but everyone is different it seems).

So here we are on Thursday morning, she says she woke up at about 9am, took 2 8mg subs, and she still doesn't feel good. Her words were 'you know that heavy feeling you feel when in w/d?'

Now, I know I didn't feel 100% the first day I took sub, but from what I remember I was pretty ok after my first dose, and by the next morning I woke up and was like a new person. I was scanning all these old photos for my grade school friends on Facebook and things like that lol Stuff I would never have done while I was using. That was just my experience w/ sub and I waited about 24 hours after my last oxy before I took it.

So that brings me to today, Thursday, she says she took 2 subs this morning and still feels sick so she's going to take 10 norcos again. Please keep in mind that theres not a darn thing I can do or say to stop her, shes 2 hours away from me and shes going to do what she wants no matter what I say. She says she'll try to take the sub again in the morning tomorrow, Friday. What should I tell her to do? Any advice? Is it completely ridiculous that she even thinks norcos are making her feel better after taking 2 subs?

I realize this sounds ridiculous, but I'm just at a loss here.. don't know wtf to tell her at this point? I've been trying to help, but it almost seems to me like shes making this sh*t up because she really doesn't want to be clean. Thoughts anyone? I just don't know what to tell her to do next. ugh. Thanks everyone & hope all is well.

 

[needlejuice]

yeah shes wasting the norcos. with suboxone, u should either just stick to it strictly, or get off and do opiates. because if u use them together, they cancel eachother out and u end up in precipitated withdrawl or wasting money. if they refuse to commit to the suboxone, then maybe methadone would be a better alternative. (i believe its the better alt. for people who still need to get high but need maintenance. suboxone keeps u at baseline, altho methadone can keep someone at baseline, it has more potential for abuse and the wihtdrawals are twice as bad as bupe.

 

[Mandatory17]

yeah shes wasting the norcos. with suboxone, u should either just stick to it strictly, or get off and do opiates. because if u use them together, they cancel eachother out and u end up in precipitated withdrawl or wasting money. if they refuse to commit to the suboxone, then maybe methadone would be a better alternative. (i believe its the better alt. for people who still need to get high but need maintenance. suboxone keeps u at baseline, altho methadone can keep someone at baseline, it has more potential for abuse and the wihtdrawals are twice as bad as bupe.

That's a very good point, thank you. I just needed someone elses input about what to say to her next, she just expects that I'm going to have all the right answers since I personally got clean using sub. and succeeded. I feel like it was a bit different in my case, I looked at it like, either I go on sub and get clean OR I will die of an overdose. I was 100% ready and willing to be clean & WANTED it BADLY. I also had no idea what she could possibly be feeling from trying to use other drugs while on sub, since I've never attempted to use while on sub. Good advice though, I'll let her know that basically she's wasting her time with both, either she wants to be clean or doesn't & if sub. isn't going to work for her (or if shes not willing to try and let it work) then she may as well go find a methadone clinic instead. Thanks again.

 

[Znegative]

there is no need to use that many filters, ur gonna waste a lot doing that. ive been using my cottons lately becuz i ran out of bupe and can safely say for every unit lost to the original cotton, that is amount of bupe leftover. i filter once with a regular cotton and then cut out 10 little circles of coffee filter the same size as the circumference of the needle barrell, then i stuff these filters in another syringe and shoot the original solution thru that and it alwasy comes back clear, and u only are gonna lose about 10-20 units and it will prob be filtered way better and youl be wasting less than ur 5 seperate cottons

hm, alright, thanks for the advice man. I use 1/2 cc needles, so cutting out those circles is going to be a bitch, but I'll give it a shot at my next dose. btw, what kind of buzz do you get off your suboxone when you I.V. it? I'm still adjusting to my lower doses, but in the morning i usually get a little buzz.. do you find that this gets stronger after time?

 

[Mafila]

I'm so sick of dealing with this shit. I've been on Suboxone for the past six months (non-script) and I'm leaving for a vacation to Europe on May 22. I took anywhere from 1-2mg each day, depending on how I felt and what I had to deal with (work, school, etc.) I stopped taking suboxone on Monday and while the first few days were fine, I couldn't cope with the third day due to my final presentation in class and did .2mg of sub along with some Xanax to help me keep calm during my speech. That was yesterday, today I took nothing expecting to not feel too bad since I only did .2mg yesterday and I've been feeling worse than ever today. So like an idiot I went and obtained two 30mg oxycodone's, when I've done nothing but sub for nearly six months. I have a quarter of a sub left to try to taper down to maybe .2mg every three days until about a week and a half before I need to leave for my trip.

The anxiety of my only two options being either quitting (while working and having routine responsibilities) or trying to sneak a sub on my trip is making me feel like I'm pushing myself into a corner. I'm scared to death of going on my one-week vacation during withdrawal because if I withdraw for the whole week then my vacation is ruined (unless I could get an easy fix in Rome or Barcelona, but I try to refrain from thinking about that because chances are slim).

Last time I quit subs when taking about 1mg each day I suffered through a two and a half week withdrawal, and now I don't even have the time for that. Sorry for the semi-offtopic babble but any advice would be appreciated, especially if any of you have been in a similar situation.

 

[Mandatory17]

one more question about sub., my friend was evidently taking the extended release morphine for at least 4 months, she said that when she went to detox (previous to the 4 months, then she relapsed) she didn't feel withdrawals until about the 5th day she was there, so I'm thinking the reason why the sub. put her in precipitated withdrawal was because the morphine is still hanging onto her opiate receptors since today is only the 3rd full day without morphine? Does this sound right to anyone? I have absolutely 0 experience with morphine, but it seems to me that the extended release can have a horribly long nasty half life? Thus causing the precipitated withdrawal STILL 3 full days later? I'm just really hoping that she can wake up tomorrow morning and dose the sub. and actually have it work. I really drilled her on the subject of: are you still trying to get high, do you still have that mentality and that's why you 'thought' you felt worse after taking sub- and I honestly believe that she was definitely in precipitated withdrawal. I just feel badly that she does actually want the sub. to work, but so far it's only making things worse. I guess it's quite possible that extended release morphine has a disgustingly long half life, maybe comparable to methadone? Thanks for any help.

 

[needlejuice]

its not hard to cut the circles, i just rip pieces off really, and stuff em in there till it's like a quarter inch of coffee filter(up to 20-30 units). however sometimes this clogs the needle so test it with water.

im scripted suboxone, but most of my friends are on subutex so i usually buy them because i really feel a big difference iv'ing suboxone vs. subutex. it holds me the same amount of time for each medicine(plus it's clear and doesnt taste bad and one less ingredient), but the naloxone just cancels my initial rush if im on too high a dosage. but i believe if ur dosing below 1mg there is not as much difference. ive read that suboxone produces a less euphoric rush when injected. i know the naloxone is inert but it must screw the high up somehow in certain people. the best way to get high from bupe is to abstain from high doses and go long periods of time between doses due to the half life. injecting is a great way to taper because it leaves ur body faster so u have a better chance getting high ur next dose if u have trouble waiting.

 

[Mandatory17]

nevermind my above post, I've been researching and found that extended release morphine could definitely stay in your body for up to 7 days, thus the reason why my friend keeps going into precipitated withdrawal every time she tries to take sub. thanks needlejuice for responding above again, i explained to her that she was canceling the norco and sub out by taking them so close together. so she shall be waiting, and waiting for that awful morphine to get completely out of her system.

 

[Znegative]

yeah, I really need to get my hands on subutex. I believe others that the naloxone is not active, but I still wonder if it effects anything. I only inject at most .5 mg at a time, and when I go above my regular ammount for the day, I just raise my tolerance and there is no real benifit. I hope someday I will gain the strength to go a few days completely without, so then I can get back on and get some nice nods.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I might smoke. We'll see. I'm taking the 16mg sublingually but have only been doing so for less than a week. When I take it I don't feel anything. It just keeps me from being sick. If I continue to take the 16mg sublingually for another week or two you would still only recommend banging 1-2mg when I decide to go there??? I would think that I'd have a tolerance and that 1-2mg wouldn't do much.

You are right; you should ideally taper down on Suboxone sublingually first - this is important, as it lowers your tolerance. This way, 0.5mg (and less) doses IV are much better than 2mg (or more) is for anyone with a tolerance.

I'm just trying to get really faded a few times. If I were to bang 8-10mg would I get pretty faded, do you think that would be overkill, or would I need more? I've banged a variety of chems and narcotics but never brand name subutex. This is why I'm asking. Also, once crushed and added to water is it going to gum up and frustrate me or does it break down pretty well?

8 to 10mg per shot is overkill, for example, 8mg of buprenorphine can last me two weeks (taken in 0.2mg increments).

Damn the above two posts were posted while I was typing out all that ^^^. Preciate the advice Captain.

Glad to hear I could be of service! Good luck. I do sugggest micron filtering if at all possible.

Smackem, I've been alright man. Long time no see. I haven't been checking the forums as much as I used to. There was a long period of time of adjusting to this new way of life with the wheelchair and everything. The bullet severed my spinal cord at the T-4 level (basically meaning I'm paralyzed from just under the nipples down). At first it was hell. Now that I'm used to it I can do just about everything I could do before. I drive with hand controls, go kayaking every few days, go riding ATVs and Jet-skis all the time. Ive got a fine ass, open minded chick who is loyal as hell. It's not nearly as bad as I thought it would be. It just took time. The only difference now is I roll around instead of walking. If you remember (its been a long time) I did a pretty significant prison sentence just prior to the shooting. I mean of course sometimes I wish the judge would have given me another few months or hell, even another few years to prevent it..but you can only do what you can do and adapt. Maybe it was a higher power trying to give me a wake up call? I don't know. It slowed me down. Sometimes I wonder where I'd be right now had it not happened. My family and friends are convinced I'd be dead. Who knows? Overall, life's been good to me the past 2 and a half years since the shooting.

You should really post your story in The Dark Side, I think it would give a lot of people on Bluelight hope, and I certainly admire your courage with facing this.

Quick question! I just made a solution of bacteriostatic water and subxone. That's cool right? I can shoot bateriostatic water WITH suboxone, but you just can't shoot bacteriostatic water ALONE correct?

Help quick

Exactly - when you dissolve the buprenorphine into the bacteriostatic water, it is safe to IV. Bacteriostatic water for IV isn't intended to be used completely by itself though.

So my question is, am I losing loads of the bupe, or mostly just the crappy binders?

You're filtering out some of the inactive ingredients like magnesium stearate, some of the coloring agent, etc. However, corn starch will remain and I believe needs a 0.2um micron filter to remove it all (depending on the particle size of corn starch in Suboxone and Subutex).

It's better than not filtering it out at all for sure.

My bad. The question wasn't really a drug testing question it was more a question of why does bupe stay in your system so long. Not sure how else to word it really. But thats a good point CH and like somebody else said its most likely the long half life.

It binds heavily to proteins, that has something to do with it. There's other reasons too. I'm way too tired to go into them now but would if anyone's interested.

One more thing. Can lowering your bupe dose significantly (jumping from 8 to 2mg's) cause mild-moderate pains? I don't recall hearing this as a withdrawal symptom but i strained my back a month ago and it seems worse since i lowered my dose. And i haven't experienced any of the typical withdrawal symptoms, in fact i've been feeling better not taking so much of that crap, besides the pain of course.

Aside from actual pre-existing pain, you should get better effects if you're fully covered by the dose. Congratulations on finding out what works best for you.

hm, alright, thanks for the advice man. I use 1/2 cc needles, so cutting out those circles is going to be a bitch, but I'll give it a shot at my next dose. btw, what kind of buzz do you get off your suboxone when you I.V. it? I'm still adjusting to my lower doses, but in the morning i usually get a little buzz.. do you find that this gets stronger after time?

It's gotten stronger for me over time, yes. It's also has heavy synergy with other drugs.

I use 3/10 CC or 1/2 CC typically. And I love micron filtering, in 15 minutes tops you can have 2-6 weeks worth instantly produced. Overall the buzz of buprenorphine IV'd is kind of individually unique, some people have reported they like it more than snorted heroin, others that it just kciks in quicker and isn't anything more special than taking it sublingually. Glad to hear you're getting good effects!

yeah, I really need to get my hands on subutex. I believe others that the naloxone is not active, but I still wonder if it effects anything. I only inject at most .5 mg at a time, and when I go above my regular ammount for the day, I just raise my tolerance and there is no real benifit. I hope someday I will gain the strength to go a few days completely without, so then I can get back on and get some nice nods.

Suboxone and Subutex have an identical effect for me. I like them both equally. I would "prefer" Subutex due to it micron filtering completely clear, whereas Suboxone retains an orange color.

 

[DeLee]

Thanks Captain H, will do.

I know a lot of people prefer Subutex to Suboxone.
The only difference I feel is a little more alert/energy on Subutex and a little sedated on Suboxone + i taste the lemon taste when IV oxcone... that is quite a big psychological sign i got everything IN me. No such on Subutex.

 

[Znegative]

the only times I taste that lemon flavor is if its a really concentrated shot, which usually means I'm doing more then 1 mg. I hate that shit, reminds me of a time I shot crack with koolaid.

Thanks a lot CH for your input,
I would get a micron filter, but it turns out that not only do I have no money, but I'm in debt 200 dollars, and I wont get paid until I illustrate an entire 48 page comic book.. so it looks like my veins are just going to have to rough it out a while longer, unless I can get the willpower to start sniffing it instead.

 

[Pegasus]

From what I know, shooting drugs can be more addictive than the drugs themselves.

It is definitely more addictive to inject drugs that give "rush" type effects when injected. Drugs like diazepam and buprenorphine are two drugs that don't give any rush IV, I'm pretty sure (...just rapid-onset effects...) Those drugs wouldn't seem to be any more addicting IV compared to other methods, but for the majority of the psychoactive drugs that do give rushes when used IV, they are definitely more addictive when used IV.

 

[Znegative]

I feel like for some people that might be true, but I know that as long as I can inject it, and it will give me the largest % of the drug fastest, that is the ROA that I will choose. The only drugs I dont inject are aderall and some benzo's because they're not water soluble enough. Though I.V is dangerous with subs, it is my favorite way of doing it.

 

[needlejuice]

yeah ive gotten my dose down to about 1mg at the most a day. but it takes seriously like 24 hrs without it until i notice any withdrawlsymptoms and i can go way longer if i smoke weed. this seems strange becuz a lot of my friends and others on bluelight and other sites report they need i.v. doses every 6-10 hours. im trying to taper because i hate having to wait so long between dosing. i guess im just trying to analyze how not to screw up the buzz because sometimes i wont feel it.