Travel The MEGA Travel Thread!

[carl]

^I guess you've never met anyone trying to get into the States. The interviews, many many months, and hundreds of dollars in fees and associated tests are verifiably much tougher, considering someone needs an interview and medical tests for a transit visa.

 

[Jamshyd]

But, if I care about those students, maybe I really SHOULD go there. make sure they at least have a qualified teacher who knows what he's doing.... rather than not go and leave the place to totally non-serious teachers.

All I can say is that I wish you luck with that, since I have failed miserably at doing it - IME the Thai are the most unappreciative people I've ever dealt with, mainly because most of them are too stupid to notice the good. I know you're trying to keep a positive attitude and are excited about going, so I'll spare you my vitriol for now .

In fact, to show that I am only being fair (acidic, yes , but fair), I will let you know that there is a single westerner whom I know who lives in Thailand and thinks Thai people are awesome. He, too, has taken refuge in Thailand from those supposed horrors of Europe of which you both speak. He also is a caring teacher who is satisfied with his job there. From what he tells me, I am convinced that his Thai coworkers are taking advantage of his kindness, but he disagrees. You may want to contact him for a point of view that is almost the opposite to mine. He is in fact BL's very own Vegan.

I will remind you though, that vegan is the exception, not the rule. The rule is what I and countless others are going to tell you.... but I guess it helps if you get a positive view on things.

 

[eDDe9]

What's the attraction to Thailand anyway?
Vietnam pays better, the people are better and if you're that was inclined, the wannabe brides are in another league.

 

[Ximot]

Thanks carl. i wonder how "everyone else" is doing it in Thailand. If so many teachers are hardly qualified at all... so what would be "the right help" exactly? I have a BA and an MA, though neither in teaching. I also have a CELTA and a postgraduate certificate in education. But I don't really feel like working full-time.

Is it possible to just quit a full-time teaching job after one has had one's visa sponsored by the employer and then work freelance or whatever? This is how i did it in Japan way back when. Once I had the visa I just left and kept the visa nonetheless...

--

Vietnam pays better? Does it? Teachers with the right credentials can easily make $1000 in Thailand. Personally I would expect to be making at least $2000 if indeed i did end up working as a teacher full-time eventually. These jobs do exist for those deemed worthy I have heard.

 

[eDDe9]

2k USD a month in Vietnam if you have previous experience, otherwise its 1.6k. In Saigon.

It can be as low as 800 USD a month in Hanoi.

 

[carl]

Thanks carl. i wonder how "everyone else" is doing it in Thailand. If so many teachers are hardly qualified at all... so what would be "the right help" exactly? I have a BA and an MA, though neither in teaching. I also have a CELTA and a postgraduate certificate in education. But I don't really feel like working full-time.

I'm not sure how teachers are doing it right now. I've lived there on ED visas (when they were not such a pain) and Tourist visas along with being semi-legit for a while. The best advice is to get in touch with an attorney in Thailand, they're being the facilitators for many of the semi-legit visas right now. You may have to take a trek out to Bangkok and then be willing to turn around and go home to file your papers in your home country though. Some visas are requiring those applications these days.
You'll be better off asking a teacher about the requirements for teaching legally. Last I heard, about a year ago,was that all teachers are now required to have a "teaching certificate" from their home country. Those already in the country were offered some outrageously priced course that gave them a ticket only valid in the Kingdom. This caused experienced teachers already working in the country for a long period to leave en mass. Many ended up in Vietnam, as eDDe9 posted. I don't know if your postgrad education will suffice, but a CELTA or any type of ESL certification is not enough, you must be certified to work in a classroom in your home country.
Working illegally is possible in many cities in Thailand, but the pay is very poor, and you are putting yourself at undue legal risk. There have been immigration raids on schools where the officers actually walked into classrooms and arrested foreign teachers.

 

[Ximot]

I am certified to work in a classroom in my home country... nice to know that teachers are leaving "en masse" - this means it should be easy for me to find well-paid work if i want to. But I don't intend to work full-time anyway. I just want to find a way to get a visa that enables me to stay without having to do the run every other month or so.

http://www.thaivisa.com/279.0.html
Interesting forum... their ED-Visa info isn't exactly up to date though.

This thing about the immigration raids is freaky. A bit like their nightclub raids where unsuspecting folks hav eto do a pisstest there and then and if it's positive you're in for a very hard time...

 

[carl]

Sounds like you can work legally in the kingdom. Once you get your papers, YOU ARE NOT OFF THE HOOK. If you are terminated from your job, and your employer sponsored your visa, it will be revoked without notice, an you will be given a set number of days to leave the country before it becomes invalid. This can happen without any notification of you, the visa holder. Your employer will report your termination to immigration, because it costs them money each month that you are on their roster. Your spot will soon go to another foreign teacher. It's the same for a work permit, but a bit less complicated. Since you are only permitted to work at the address specified on the permit, you know it's invalid if you are working somewhere else (freelancing or part-time work is a no no).
The thing about paid work in Thailand.... is that's it's in Thailand. Many people want to work there, and are willing to do so illegally, and the Thai's are not know for demanding top quality. This all leads to a situation where the pay is low. Teachers get paid really poor in Thailand compared to neighboring countries.
As for ThaiVisa, it's a good site. Also check out ajarn.com, and also dave's esl cafe. Honestly, the visa situation is changing so rapidly in Thailand right now that most sites will be out of date. There have been countless changes that I can think of, and it's hard to stay up on everything. Mind you, I've been away for some time myself, though I am in touch with friends who tell me when they hear something new. Good Luck. I hope I'm not deterring you from trying Thailand, I loved it so much that I spent three years there.

 

[Ximot]

haha, no, you aren't deterring me. i've been going there on holiday for years and the reason why I want to live there now is a thai woman

I will do what i can to end up with an ED-visa and then learn the basics of the language. Might end up teaching part-time on the sly. People tell me there is heaps of money to be made with private lessons for wealthy Thais.

 

[eDDe9]

Anyone think women from Vietnam, Japan, China and India are in another league compared to Thai?

 

[Jamshyd]

^ You can't even compare Indian women with any east-asian women. The beauty of the former is legendary.

The others are more or less the same IMO.

But then again, who am I to speak of women? .

----

Ximot: One thing that I don't believe was mentioned by carl is the teacher certificate. Although I worked for most of a year without hearing of it, my agent eventually told me of new visa requirements that demand that you take a seminar on "Thai Culture" (whatever that is), do a test on, and get certified. I didn't do this but others who wanted to stay went ahead and did it, and paid at least the equivalent $120 for it.

Make sure you check.

 

[Ximot]

thanks jamshyd.

eDDe9, I have some issues with you just generalising about women of a particular ethnic background as if they were cattle. I am a heterosexual male and probably a chauvinist pig deep down, but I do what I can not to let it dominate my actions... anyway i think one cannot generalise.. sure, some thais aren't that beautiful, but others are. perhaps vietnamese faces are generally a bit sharper and narrower... generally... but I find that once I love someone, looks become secondary and to me they're the most beautiful person, and it's an energy thing. Like... some bargirls, for instance, are STUNNING looking.. but if I get close to them and and feel their vibe, I just feel like naaaah, no thanks. I'd have to be well off my face on stims and alcohol to enjoy the presence of most of those, that's how soulless they are.


anyway, I am writing to recommend a book to you, if you are so into Vietnam and Vietnamese women:

it's called "Fall to Grace" ... stunning reading, I couldn't put it down, and this happens to me only rarely. Touches something deep inside of me, this book, so much so that I ordered a few copies for the school library where i work to make it available to teenagers in my country.


www.falltograce.com

 

[GoddessLSD-XTC]

You can't even compare Indian women with any east-asian women. The beauty of the former is legendary.

Someone once told me Indian (not meaning Native American) women are among the ugliest on earth. Whenever I traveled I maintained the attitude that I would work with and fall into love in the country I traveled in.

I guess you've never met anyone trying to get into the States.

I meant, enforce immigration laws against those here illegally. There are between 12 & 20-million illegals in U$A and they drive down wages, fill the emergency rooms at hospitals, jails, schools, highways. The Constitution says, their children automatically become citizens and in 20 years, they can invite their illegal parents to become citizens, so many come up here to have their babies (free). I used to sneak accross the border so I did meet many people "trying to get into the U$A" . . . one of 'em almost robbed me.

A coupla my friends taught ESL in Japan and made lotsa $$$ together.

None of the Thai women attracted me. I met a young Burmese man working in a tailor's shop who told me a haunting story about immigration . . . his visa expired soon and he'd hafta go back. He wanted U$A to invade his country.

EDIT: I used to rent to female Chinese grad students . . . there was one virgin, with the cutest name (I forget it, which meant something like "rising sun") and sweetest personality.

 

[eDDe9]

thanks jamshyd.

eDDe9, I have some issues with you just generalising about women of a particular ethnic background as if they were cattle. I am a heterosexual male and probably a chauvinist pig deep down, but I do what I can not to let it dominate my actions... anyway i think one cannot generalise.. sure, some thais aren't that beautiful, but others are. perhaps vietnamese faces are generally a bit sharper and narrower... generally... but I find that once I love someone, looks become secondary and to me they're the most beautiful person, and it's an energy thing. Like... some bargirls, for instance, are STUNNING looking.. but if I get close to them and and feel their vibe, I just feel like naaaah, no thanks. I'd have to be well off my face on stims and alcohol to enjoy the presence of most of those, that's how soulless they are.


anyway, I am writing to recommend a book to you, if you are so into Vietnam and Vietnamese women:

it's called "Fall to Grace" ... stunning reading, I couldn't put it down, and this happens to me only rarely. Touches something deep inside of me, this book, so much so that I ordered a few copies for the school library where i work to make it available to teenagers in my country.


www.falltograce.com

Thanks for the recommendation, been looking for a new book

I'm already in love here in England, but I just found the Vietnamese women to not only look better, but also have that soul that so many Thais lack, thus making them seem ever so much more beautiful.

 

[mr Bungle]

Mr. Bungle is absolutely right - if you actually care about your students (or care about anything or anyone, really)... then Thailand is maybe not for you.
color]

When did I say that? or are you taking my posts out of context?

Regarding Thai education: - it can seem like a joke and most of the time I feel this way. However I have had alot of postive experiences. Some of my classes hang on my every word and their effort is wonderful - however most are like animals in a cage hahahaha - if I can get through to some, thats all that counts - which is what I keep telling myself

Regarding Thai women: Not all think the westerner is just an ATM machine. My wife (Thai national) makes more money than me - which she loves to spend on me...maybe i got lucky - who knows..

But who am I to know: ''I'm just a typical idiot who is running away from the west and a typical lozer whose married a Thai women'' whose ''just after my money or because it is fashionable to marry a westerner'' - however she does like a nice handbag - she could have had her choice of any westerner who earns more than me....or even more handsome than me - though Ive been told I'm good looking and never had a problem in England to get a girl... just letting you know I'm not a fat, old expat, the type who gives this beautiful country a bad name (inside Thailand and out) in the press etc.. (I'm 27)

...but what do I know?

I strongly recommend learning the language among other things

I hope this make sense as I am using a crazy Thai laptop (notebook) with only Thai letters on the keys. My written Thai isn't very good and the translator I'm using is next to useless - also I'm lazy in having to correct my retranslated edited posts...I need to buy a new computer...which my wife is paying for..mmmm go figure..

...try to be postive when you come to Thailand relax and go with they flow. If you are ridged you will snap - like some on this forum...However the education and 'Thai way'of doing things can be a real pain - but then so can some things in any country all over the world...

Remember T.I.T

This
Is
Thailand

I takes strength of character, it's sometimes hard to stay postive.Its funny how I meet and even see friends, fellow travelors, who jump in and out of countries, dont learn the language, maybe only work for a little time in - maybe lets say - only two schools or two jobs, turn negative or even rasist...I believe its because they are ''jumping in and out'' too quickly...maybe they are running from something. They carnt stay and 'grow' in one place for too long...make their excuses and move on...


...try not to hate..Too much - when i listen to random Thai's (who think I don't understand their little group disscusion) or -Thai friends or family talking (in Thai) it is 90% of the time postive, mainly about what resturant sells good food - which I enjoy to listen too and talk about.

however when I talk to my western friends, its ''bitch this, bitch that, i hate this, i hate that, why isn't it more like this, it would be better if it was like that...'' - which i also enjoy..alot (nothing wrong with a good bitch!)

But don't forget where you come from. (I love my home country and the opportunities its gave me - shame not all countries are the same, but I believe that is more of a political debate)I'm not a Captain Thailand who loves everything Thai or a Thai 'want to be' - far from it ... but just remember that it is not all black and white and to put a whole race in a box (be it positive or negative) is racism - and when you do that it might make some people (who don't just see in black and white) a little angry or even laugh at you...

Wasting your time...with some people (who maybe are - generally - from one type of race) are being racist to you, then it's more than stupid to just be racist back, to reflect all that negative energy back - you are wasting your time..wasting your breath...you could all bunch together, find someone who believes in your negative points and then, you might not feel that you are wasting your time...but i think deep down you know... that you are... and that...two wrongs don't make a right....

peace

*this post was hopefully postive and not negatively aimmed at only one person..

Good night

Racism
noun 1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

 

[carl]

To cut through all the rhetoric, and be more clear, I just want to make sure that the tenant of what you are saying is to accept what you see in Thailand, because it is Thailand and not your own country... am i right?

 

[Jamshyd]

eDDe9, I have some issues with you just generalising about women of a particular ethnic background as if they were cattle. I am a heterosexual male and probably a chauvinist pig deep down, but I do what I can not to let it dominate my actions... anyway i think one cannot generalise..

"Haha, look at that white guy trying to enlighten us with his "progressive" ideas. Typical westerner."

 

[mr Bungle]

To cut through all the rhetoric, and be more clear, QUOTE]

Well thats just it...its not all clear, not all black and white - I supose was they general aim of that post.

just my two cents...also there was alot of negative posts before mainly about Thai women, just wanted some people to look at it from a different angle - not the boring predictable one...

...the more info' and view points on a topic the better ...no?

...even better if the view points are not all the same...no?

 

[Jamshyd]

*this post was hopefully postive and not negatively aimmed at only one person..

Your attempt to talk politic is cute, but you're talking to a semite here .

 

[carl]

OK, so if clarity is something that is not valued in Thai society, should it be OK for a lack of clarity to permeate through society, or is it better to have that attitude ony when appropriate? My whole argument throughout this thread is that is not OK, that that kind of thinking is dangerous. When airlines start becoming unclear, and have maintenance become a gray area, or when a dive boat captain finds something more sanuk, or when a teacher is lazy, these kids of things add up. And Thai society does not see a problem with this. That seems pretty clear, and any response that involves TIT is just naive. I'd love to hear a counter point based on logic and rationality, as to how this fits the country, or makes it what it is. But TIT is just a lame excuse for "I'm in love with this country so I don't care."

koh jai mai, na krhap?