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Social Justice Transgender and gender identity discussion

birdup.snaildown said:
I've also encountered a lot of guys who don't think it's gay to have sex with trans women who haven't had the downstairs surgery, which to me is a great example of cognitive dissonance. They are fucking what is essentially a man, but they can tell themselves otherwise because of the tits / hair / make-up.
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I have some personal experience in the phenomenon and I’m pretty sure it’s basically meth-lust rather than the secret reveal of my real sexual orientation which is basically straight. I know a few transsexual women who I find very feminine and very cute and have absolutely no qualms about going to bed with them and doing my best to give them the world’s best blowjob when I am very high. But I see them as not men and not women - they are some mixture that in that particular moment is very erotic. But in many year of amp fuelled sexual adventurism I’ve never had an inkling of a desire to get it on with a typically straight or gay guy (although I’ve let them blow me without reciprocating if it was what they really wanted to do). Neither do I get any interest in overblown ‘drag’-style transsexuals with lots of artificial boobs.

I don’t see it as cognitive dissonance. I just have a niche interest/enthusiasm when high. I just could not and would not do the same things when straight. But when I sober up I have no shame or regret.
 
birdup.snaildown said:
@dalpat077

To each their own. My father is so repressed, he would never even think about experimenting with drugs let alone same-sex stuff. Everybody has their limits. Some people do what their told in the bedroom. Others obey the law. At the end of the day, we only have one life. I've done every drug under the sun, more or less... and I've explored sex too. It's entirely possible I'm just an addict and a pervert, but - hey - I don't care what people think. I'm perfectly secure with who I am. At the end of the day, I've had some incredible experiences. If you'd like to say something, you don't need to hold back for fear of offending me. I can take it. It's not going to have the slightest impact at all.
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Nah nah. It's just fine. You and I get on well. I'd rather keep it that way. Besides: any comments made by me would not be directed at you personally but would be of a far more general and sweeping nature (and believe me that would be worse)! :ROFLMAO:

Carry on as you all were. I'll stick to the LESS contentious issues e.g. race, politics, religion! :ROFLMAO:

Only reason I ended up here anyway is because I saw that you'd posted in the main index while scrolling down the main index otherwise wouldn't have bothered.
 
Atelier3 said:
I have some personal experience in the phenomenon and I’m pretty sure it’s basically meth-lust rather than the secret reveal of my real sexual orientation which is basically straight. I know a few transsexual women who I find very feminine and very cute and have absolutely no qualms about going to bed with them and doing my best to give them the world’s best blowjob when I am very high. But I see them as not men and not women - they are some mixture that in that particular moment is very erotic. But in many year of amp fuelled sexual adventurism I’ve never had an inkling of a desire to get it on with a typically straight or gay guy (although I’ve let them blow me without reciprocating if it was what they really wanted to do). Neither do I get any interest in overblown ‘drag’-style transsexuals with lots of artificial boobs.

I don’t see it as cognitive dissonance. I just have a niche interest/enthusiasm when high. I just could not and would not do the same things when straight. But when I sober up I have no shame or regret.
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If you like to have a penis in your mouth sometimes and you let guys blow you, you're at least a little gay. It sounds like you allow yourself to acitvely do something gay (perform fellatio) because you can separate it from being gay. Like you said, you don't see them as men. So sucking their dick isn't gay. Hence, cognitive dissonance.

You are a classic example of what I'm talking about here.

@dalpat077

I already know you're a racist homophobic bastard. Don't worry, I'm not homophobicphobic. :D
 
birdup.snaildown said:
If you like to have a penis in your mouth sometimes and you let guys blow you, you're at least a little gay.
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No skin off my nose if people need to put me in that box. I’m good with all my sexual behaviours at this stage of my life. I reckon everyone is a little bit “gay” deep down. Socialisation into gender roles that then feed into sexual identities is a powerful force. But I’ve always been idiosyncratic about playing by the rules. I just wish people would chill about it all.
 
The problem with the kilt, practically speaking, is that it's traditionally worn with thick high socks, which are extremely uncomfortable in warm weather, but it's also not actually that warm either, being insufficient for snowy days. Therefore, it's only suited to being worn in places with climates like Scotland. So kilts aren't catching on anytime soon, unless you live in PNW or NZ.

But the general problem affecting kilts and similar is that there are thermal norms of clothing:
theweek.com

Down with office dress codes

The thermostat wars aren't just about air temperature
theweek.com
Women's groups have asked in at least one case that office temperatures be raised to 76 F/24 C! The facts are intransigent: if some people wear more clothing than others, then the office temperature will always make some people too warm or too cold. If more revealing male clothing becomes "acceptable", that puts upward pressure on indoor air temperature, which means more men will start to wear less for comfort rather than as a countercultural style choice. (I have no comment on the men vs. women indoor temperature dispute.)

And honestly, do you want a world in which ordinary slobs are wearing tiny shirts and short shorts? Because that's how you get ants.
 
i think of it like names and nicknames.

if i meet somebody new, let's call them robert. i say "nice to meet you bob" and they tell me "i prefer to be called robert". easy, i respect that and call them robert. if i forget their name or their preference at some point, it's easily solved with a simple "hey, i'm sorry i've forgotten your name"

same applies to pronouns... "hey, i'm sorry i've forgotten your preferred pronouns".

to me, it's just simple courtesy.

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
i think of it like names and nicknames.

if i meet somebody new, let's call them robert. i say "nice to meet you bob" and they tell me "i prefer to be called robert". easy, i respect that and call them robert. if i forget their name or their preference at some point, it's easily solved with a simple "hey, i'm sorry i've forgotten your name"

same applies to pronouns... "hey, i'm sorry i've forgotten your preferred pronouns".

to me, it's just simple courtesy.

alasdair
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One issue with that though is that you have to know that someone might have a preferred pronoun at deviation from the gender they appear to be.

If you don't know or remember that you won't know to ask.
 
well, if it hasn't come up before, you'll likely use the 'wrong' pronoun and they'll correct you then you're all set from there.

i guess my point is that some people seem to feel that it's some massive imposition to try to get it right when it's no harder to navigate than a name, which most people will handle without a second thought...

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
well, if it hasn't come up before, you'll likely use the 'wrong' pronoun and they'll correct you then you're all set from there.

i guess my point is that some people seem to feel that it's some massive imposition to try to get it right when it's no harder to navigate than a name, which most people will handle without a second thought...

alasdair
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Right yeah, I agree.
 
If ur name Robert and u a man I’ll be calling u him and he and if u start bitching about it I’ll stop using those words and just call u a cunt instead
 
So in the case of Elliot Page, whom we can't ask, and who prefers "he" and "they" pronouns, what is the correct usage when referring to them? Are both acceptable in any given context?
 
Deru said:
So in the case of Elliot Page, whom we can't ask, and who prefers "he" and "they" pronouns, what is the correct usage when referring to them? Are both acceptable in any given context?
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I would say so yes.

Just don't deliberately use the wrong pronoun and you're already doing better than a lot of people here.
 
Deru said:
So in the case of Elliot Page, whom we can't ask, and who prefers "he" and "they" pronouns, what is the correct usage when referring to them? Are both acceptable in any given context?
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I always assumed "they" was a generic pronoun that could apply to anyone at any time. Like i could say "Elliot is working on a new movie and he is really excited about it." or, "Elliot Page is an actor who has played many roles. One of their first roles was Trinity in Trailer Park Boys."
 
alasdairm said:
^ i don't know but if you ever meet him, just ask him :)



lol.

i think you have, deliberately or otherwise, missed the point of my example @Soso78 but your charming-as-ever contribution is appreciated.

alasdair
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My point is what else u gonna call a man called Robert? I’ll call him him or he.
 
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