Kratom The Kratom Megathread

[《Plasticity》]

Scag, you fucked up the thread! Seriously though you didn't merge the thread right and all the posts are scrambled, the thread no longer makes sense lol.

 

[cj]

Since shit got fucked up I'll ask again. What's a good dose of 50 extract for an extremely opiate tolerant person trying to get relief from a bupe kick

 

[《Plasticity》]

No way to know, you never gave your dose of your DOC. I would imagine that 10gs wouldn't last someone with an extreme tolerance very long at all, maybe start with 2gs and work up from there. It may be "50x" but 1g will NOT be the same as taking 50gs of plain leaf. I would PM Amanitadine, he's very informed on extracts...

 

[al-laddin]

Hey Captain! Ive been using Kratom daily for a few years as a safety net because I love to binge on heavy opiates here and there. I have found kratom to be a great way to step down the ladder. It eliminates any cravings for the hard stuff so I can play around safely but eventually Ill have to step down from it and get complety clean. I was wondering what medications or steps do you recommend to make withdrawal easier. I withdrew from it cold turkey once and the worst was the intense restlessness and insomnia which lasted 3-4 days. I cant lose that much sleep because it will effect work. You have any suggestions? Also my tolerance to kratom has got pretty high lately. It used to be super euphoric and now its kinda mundane and provides little buzz if any...and ofcourse Im always on the edge of dizziness, nausea, wobbles. Whats a good and easy way to bring that buzz back and lower my tolly? Thanks

OP , I do love the H but I can see why you don't like it. I use it rarely enough to where it actually stimulates and motivates me so I get a lot done when Im buzzed on it.

 

[《Plasticity》]

Okay, recently I've discovered my own personal "cure" for kratom withdrawal, whether it will work for anyone else IDK but I'm 3 days with no kratom and I feel litterally maybe 5% withdrawal, days 2 and 3 are the worst so I'm confident things will only get better from here on. I mean I've been sleeping normally and going to work with zero discomfort. What's my personal "cure"? Gabapentin, Baclofen, and etizolam....all can be ordered online (in the us at least, check your countries legality). Take the baclofen and gabapentin as needed and take 1-2mgs of etiz before bed, though I find that I don't even need the etiz to sleep, it just makes sure there will be no struggle. There are other meds that work as well like pregabalin, clonodine, MXE, and loperamide. All this stuff besides pregabalin and loperamide can be purchased online, loperamide can be bought at any drug store or even grocery store and pregabalin and clonodine are prescription only, actually you can probably find clonodine on online pharmacies.

Keep in mind though that some of these remedies are in themselves addictive so only use them for the withdrawal period which for me is only 5-7 days, ymmv.

As for bringing back the magic you either need to take a couple day break, go all day with no kratom for a couple days and eat a small 2g dose before bed so you still get your sleep, or you can skip doses... say you dose three times a day, try taking 1 or two for a week or two.

 

[cj]

No way to know, you never gave your dose of your DOC. I would imagine that 10gs wouldn't last someone with an extreme tolerance very long at all, maybe start with 2gs and work up from there. It may be "50x" but 1g will NOT be the same as taking 50gs of plain leaf. I would PM Amanitadine, he's very informed on extracts...

I take 1.5 mg of bupe a day.

 

[al-laddin]

Thanks you so much CAPTAIN! Im familiar with a lot of those....etiz actually snuck up on me ......I took it for two or three days straight (maybe 5 times in that week total) and when I stopped it shot my BP through the roof....scary stuff. I thought etizolam was supposed to be less addictive than benzos....I have no cravings for that drug class but I definatly had physical w/d hence the bp spike and I couldn't sleep for two nights

 

[《Plasticity》]

I take 1.5 mg of bupe a day.

Since I've never been on bupe, nor have I taken 50x I'm not knowledgable enough to give you an accurate dose but I would imagine 1.5-2g should hold your withdrawal. I'm sure someone will step in and help you, if not like I said amanitadine is very experienced with extracts, which I personally tend to avoid.

Thanks you so much CAPTAIN! Im familiar with a lot of those....etiz actually snuck up on me ......I took it for two or three days straight (maybe 5 times in that week total) and when I stopped it shot my BP through the roof....scary stuff. I thought etizolam was supposed to be less addictive than benzos....I have no cravings for that drug class but I definatly had physical w/d hence the bp spike and I couldn't sleep for two nights

What you experienced is rebound effects and not wd. I, like you, also find that the whole "etiz is less addictive than benzos", schpeel is simply not true...at least for me. I used to be able to use up to 4 days until I got rebound effects (typically high bp, some anxiety, and insomnia) but now I feel rebound effects after 2 days of use! No benzo has ever caused such a rapid occurence of rebound effects. Good thing is that the rebound effects last like a day and IME the etiz isn't even needed with the Gabapentin and Baclofen. The etiz just ensures a good nights rest and makes for a great anxiety remedy in between doses. Even without remedies you don't need to lose sleep during withdrawal, just go all day in withdrawal and take small doses of kratom before bed so you get sleep, this method doesn't really extend the withdrawal much, if at all IME as long as you stick to 1-3g doses, just enough to keep you out of withdrawal so you can sleep.

 

[al-laddin]

Thanks for your help! I will give it a shot next week! Captain!

 

[Hammilton]

I take 1.5 mg of bupe a day.

If you're taking 1.5mg of bupe / day your tolerance isn't very high, the "extreme tolerance" just isn't true- if that'll hold you, your tolerance is medium-ish.

So, to go further, I would HIGHLY suggest that you do not get the 50x. There are really only a few extracts I've tried that were really worth the money- Gold Reserve and UEI. Though I did like the Full Spectrum Red Extract. The Full Spectrum Tincture is nice, but not worth the money at all. And when I say worth the money, what I really mean is "being more enjoyable than simply being a far more potent version of plain leaf" (in fact, Gold Reserve is closer to having the effects of plain leaf in concentrated form, UEI has classical opioid effects), because compared to plain leaf, they're simply not a better value. In fact, they're an order of magnitude worse.

I would suggest that you get 500 grams of Super Sundanese, Red Vein Indo or Premium Commercial Bali, in that order. You'll need to eat about 5-8 grams every 4-6 hours, then when you're done using it to mask the effects of suboxone withdrawal (it'll be about a week or two) and you've transferred solidly to Kratom, you'll switch to taking it 3x per day. Do what what I did- take 3g in the morning, 4g in the afternoon, then 8g at bedtime. Eventually you can stop the morning dose. I work an odd shift so I found that I needed the morning dose to sleep a full night (I sleep from about 4 or 5am to 11a-1p normally) at first. Didn't take too long before I was sleeping straight through my morning time dose, though, which I took at about 7 or 8am.

 

[FlawedByDesign]

Okay, recently I've discovered my own personal "cure" for kratom withdrawal, whether it will work for anyone else IDK but I'm 3 days with no kratom and I feel litterally maybe 5% withdrawal, days 2 and 3 are the worst so I'm confident things will only get better from here on. I mean I've been sleeping normally and going to work with zero discomfort. What's my personal "cure"? Gabapentin, Baclofen, and etizolam....all can be ordered online (in the us at least, check your countries legality). Take the baclofen and gabapentin as needed and take 1-2mgs of etiz before bed, though I find that I don't even need the etiz to sleep, it just makes sure there will be no struggle. There are other meds that work as well like pregabalin, clonodine, MXE, and loperamide. All this stuff besides pregabalin and loperamide can be purchased online, loperamide can be bought at any drug store or even grocery store and pregabalin and clonodine are prescription only, actually you can probably find clonodine on online pharmacies.

Keep in mind though that some of these remedies are in themselves addictive so only use them for the withdrawal period which for me is only 5-7 days, ymmv.

As for bringing back the magic you either need to take a couple day break, go all day with no kratom for a couple days and eat a small 2g dose before bed so you still get your sleep, or you can skip doses... say you dose three times a day, try taking 1 or two for a week or two.

Be careful with the etizolam man, I know you're well informed and seem to have much more will power than I. I would just hate to see anyone else do what I did and trade a kratom habit for an etizolam dependency. The insomnia is what did me in, kratom w/d's really aren't too bad but coming off of any opiate leaves me with intense insomnia which resulted in nightly doses of etiz.

 

[f33lg00d]

I have ~20gs of kratom and a couple beers nearly every day, would this type of use have negative effects on the liver? Very interested in y'alls opinions.

 

[Hammilton]

The beer will be the bigger problem. It seems that those who develop liver issues from kratom do so very shortly after starting it, I don't know of anyone developing liver problems from chronic kratom use, it's usually in the first couple of doses, and probably the no later than two weeks.

 

[al-laddin]

What would be some early sure fire signs of liver toxicity with kratom? I mean something you could catch early before the problem gets serious. Im guessing that these rare cases may be due to a lack of quality control...I mean its "not for human consumption". Bacteria and/or industrial chemicals may taint some batches thus resulting in liver issues for some. I really doubt anything in kratom naturally causes it but if it does hopefully theres a few warning signs to look for

 

[Mycophile]

I would also want to know about whether or not Kratom can ever cause any real significant lasting liver problems, even if they only rarely occur after short term usage I would like to know what they would be?

I've never tried it but was considering it, but if it can cause liver problems I don't think I would.

On the other hand, I drink and I'd assume that's more likely to.

 

[al-laddin]

Ive only heard of a few accounts of liver issues....very rare. I and a few others I know have been using daily for a few years and have not noticed any problems. If that helps. Then again up until recently I was drinking daily and have never noticed any acute issues

 

[Hammilton]

All of the liver issues I've seen reported have been severe but resolved themselves after discontinuation. Levels jumped through the roof, jaundice, pain they've required hospitalization, for the most part, though I've heard some reports of people who developed some signs and toughed it out at home. Early discontinuation was the key.

The likelihood of having issues is quite limited, is guess that 1 in 10,000 to 1 in 100,000 experience liver problems. Tylenol is more damaging for most people, beer is more damaging for everyone. However, however, kratom has severe effects that express themselves rapidly (and resolve quickly without lasting damage) alcohol and Tylenol cause damage slowly and quietly, until it's too late. You don't bounce back from that type of damage. By the time you know about that damage it's too late.

With kratom, you'll have problems right away if you're going to, it'll suck but you'll get better.

I don't think it's a quality control thing. All of the problems I've seen reported have involved plain leaf which is minimally processed.

It's not allowed here, unfortunately, but I'd like to start a poll of the people who've reported having liver problems from kratom use and find out who their suppliers were and what strain they were using.

 

[《Plasticity》]

^ Great post, couldn't have said it any better. The very select few who were unfortunate enough to run into liver issues ran into these problems almost instantaniously... with that said though if anyone is noticing any yellowing of the skin and eyes or dark urine it would be wise to discontinue your kratom use. FWIW around the 3 1/2 year mark I got a thorough work up, including a CT scan (which ran me 6 fucking thousand dollars!) and all was fine, I still got all the paper work.

Be careful with the etizolam man, I know you're well informed and seem to have much more will power than I. I would just hate to see anyone else do what I did and trade a kratom habit for an etizolam dependency. The insomnia is what did me in, kratom w/d's really aren't too bad but coming off of any opiate leaves me with intense insomnia which resulted in nightly doses of etiz.

I appreciate the concern but trust me, the last thing you will see me get hooked on is a benzo (or thieno...whatevs, same shit to me). I've had a constant supply of benzos and opioids for years and easily steered clear of addiction. I know better, getting dependant is a conscious decision for me, I know that probably sounds cocky but it's the truth. I just won't allow myself to get hooked on something that I feel won't bring any reward (besides cannabis, people can say what they want but when you've got access to top-shelf buds 24/7 that shit's mentally addicting and for me, doesn't bring any benefits to my life).

With all that said I'm happy to say that I'm clean from kratom :D, seriously this was probably the easiest kick EVER, 95% of the time I didn't even feel like I was in withdrawal at all... just the occasional chills.and trouble sleeping. Gabapentin/Baclofen combo ftw... It should be said though that I've never really struggled with kratom withdrawal with the help of some comfort meds which I always keep around now. Idk when I'm gonna get back on kratom (I will, I honestly don't mind being dependant on kratom whatsoever. When tolerance is at a reasonable level the benefits far outweigh the negatives, I'll stand by this plant till the end), my anxiety came back but it's not so bad... I'm in a better place in life which was probably the cause of my anxiety to begin with. I've got my own place, a sexy gf, got a good job... lifes good %)

 

[FlawedByDesign]

Glad to hear all is well. As ridiculous as it sounds I'm back on kratom, I'm using it to fight the rebound insomnia from tapering off of etizolam. I figure I'll stay on kratom until I get off the etiz and then use a non benzo to combat insomnia once I kick the kratom.

 

[lolwhatzdrugs]

^ Make a tea, problem solved.... Eating the powder makes me bloated and I imagine is quite rough on the GI, it may have even been the cause of my duodenal ulcers.

So I've decided to take a break from kratom, I've gone 2 days with no kratom now and this kick is laughable, seriously I've had ZERO discomfort and slept like a baby last night. What's my "cure"? A combination of gabapentin, baclofen, and sometimes etizolam. Seriously the combination of gabapentin and baclofen has taken away 95% of my withdrawals, the etiz is for any acute anxiety or insomnia in between doses. I'm thinking of quitting kratom for a while but I still don't know, I never feel like I accomplished anything when I succesfully quit. Either way my withdrawals have been mild at best, I think it helps that I actually WANT to quit/take a break.

Tolerance would force me to drink a tea that weighs more than I do of one of the most disgusting things I've ever tasted.

I was about to say, you've kicked H, you can do this... but then I read the second half of your name lol